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MacT Conference Call For Tier 1 Fans [Transcribed by @colinpriestner]

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Old
05-28-2013, 03:03 PM
  #326
blue_n_copper
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Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
Before the last two meaningless games that Minny and Nucks mailed in he was part of the 1-9 record that unceremoniously blasted the team out of playoff contention.

If only Horcules was given top ice time in the 7 years leading up to this one we may not be in the state we are in....oh.....wait...

I am sorry but didn't that loss seriously threaten Minnesota's playoff chances? They were still fighting for a playoff spot. You can say that Minny mailed it in based on your view of the game, I only saw part of it in a restaurant with no sound, but it was definitely not a meaningless game.

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05-28-2013, 03:12 PM
  #327
Jek McPorkins
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Originally Posted by blue_n_copper View Post
I am sorry but didn't that loss seriously threaten Minnesota's playoff chances? They were still fighting for a playoff spot. You can say that Minny mailed it in based on your view of the game, I only saw part of it in a restaurant with no sound, but it was definitely not a meaningless game.
You're correct. Minny fans were panicking in the pews of St. Brodin Cathedral during that game.

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05-28-2013, 03:19 PM
  #328
Jek McPorkins
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Check out our record with Horcoff vs without Horcoff last year.

Cant wait for your draft list with all those players you never saw play. You cant find that kind of expertise just anywhere.
Not that I wish to step on your toes here, but our record without Horcoff in the last two years is more of an indictment of our horrendous center depth than it is a shining endorsement of Horcoff's competence. Horc helped the boat float a little bit as the only semi-competent veteran center, but RNH-Gagner-Belanger-(Lander/Smyth/Vandevelde) is downright embarrassing.

Heck, Potter's with/without numbers are the same thing: Rotten depth, not a sterling endorsement of the player himself.

I just hope to hell that MacT sees this as well.

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05-28-2013, 03:31 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by nally View Post
Wow, Raab would people identify you has a patient person?
I just have no respect for you are saying. Cup run this year...are you crazy? It's your opinion and you are entitled to it, I would just like to see it far far less then I am
How can anyone even debate that next year is out best chance at a cup run? RNH and Schultz will both get big long term deals kicking in, in 2014-15 the year after Yakupov will be due for a big raise. Look at how many years it took Chicago after drafting Kane, Same with Pittsburgh and Crosby. Next year we will have the space to add significant depth pieces that we may not be able to add when all the kids get their big deals. Tambo should have realized this and unloaded dead weight like Whitney, Horcoff, Belanger, etc... And replaced them with capable vets that gave us a chance to at least challenge for a playoff spot. His inability to make deals may have cost this team the chance to ever win a cup. Yes we will be able to contend but without the significant advantage of having our best players on ELC's we may not be able to put together a deep enough team to win it all. See SJ, Ott, Van, Etc...

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05-28-2013, 03:34 PM
  #330
I am the Liquor
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Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
lol, this is lame.....even for you. As usual you do not at all address the counter point, just post something ridiculous. How Horcoff has hoodwinked so many people over the years is beyond me.
Youre right. The losing streak was Horcoff's fault and nobody else's.

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05-28-2013, 03:41 PM
  #331
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So Pittsburgh wins the cup and then 4 years later with no one on ELC they add Iginla, Morrow and Murray.

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05-28-2013, 03:45 PM
  #332
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Youre right. The losing streak was Horcoff's fault and nobody else's.
LOL

1) Brings out a winning streak and games in which Horcoff played in which they won to elevate Horcoffs status.
2) Brings up the fact that the losing streak was not Horcoffs fault and others were also to blame.

Lahey! You're drunk!

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05-28-2013, 03:50 PM
  #333
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
How can anyone even debate that next year is out best chance at a cup run? RNH and Schultz will both get big long term deals kicking in, in 2014-15 the year after Yakupov will be due for a big raise. Look at how many years it took Chicago after drafting Kane, Same with Pittsburgh and Crosby. Next year we will have the space to add significant depth pieces that we may not be able to add when all the kids get their big deals. Tambo should have realized this and unloaded dead weight like Whitney, Horcoff, Belanger, etc... And replaced them with capable vets that gave us a chance to at least challenge for a playoff spot. His inability to make deals may have cost this team the chance to ever win a cup. Yes we will be able to contend but without the significant advantage of having our best players on ELC's we may not be able to put together a deep enough team to win it all. See SJ, Ott, Van, Etc...
I don't think any of the teams left in this years playoffs have a significant contribution from an entry level contract. Besides we will have Monahan for 3 years, and then whoever we get next summer after we miss the playoffs. haha

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05-28-2013, 03:52 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
1) Brings out a winning streak and games in which Horcoff played in which they won to elevate Horcoffs status.
No. I said check out the team's record last season with and without Horcoff. Did you do that? Magic 8 ball says Pfffffffft!

Quote:
2) Brings up the fact that the losing streak was not Horcoffs fault and others were also to blame.
No. You said the losing streak WAS Horcoff's fault. Strangely no fault was to be found with anyone else.

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Lahey! You're drunk!
A guy named "Beerfish" is accusing me of being drunk?

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05-28-2013, 03:54 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
So Pittsburgh wins the cup and then 4 years later with no one on ELC they add Iginla, Morrow and Murray.
Don't forget about Jokinen.

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05-28-2013, 04:09 PM
  #336
RaabHart
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
So Pittsburgh wins the cup and then 4 years later with no one on ELC they add Iginla, Morrow and Murray.
They also had to move one of their key players to achieve it. They also got lucky with several trades and drafting. They also added a lot of there current team at the deadline(Iginla forced his trade there), which reduced the amount of cap space needed.

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05-28-2013, 04:11 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by Bank Shot View Post
I don't think any of the teams left in this years playoffs have a significant contribution from an entry level contract. Besides we will have Monahan for 3 years, and then whoever we get next summer after we miss the playoffs. haha
Yea once we add Ekblad next year we'll be really set!

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Old
05-28-2013, 05:35 PM
  #338
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
They also had to move one of their key players to achieve it. They also got lucky with several trades and drafting. They also added a lot of there current team at the deadline(Iginla forced his trade there), which reduced the amount of cap space needed.
And they got a great package in return for Staal. Not exactly the worst thing ever. If we are hypothetically forced to trade somebody in five years, say Eberle, and we get a good player and the 8th overall pick, I'll be happy.

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05-28-2013, 05:41 PM
  #339
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Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
And they got a great package in return for Staal. Not exactly the worst thing ever. If we are hypothetically forced to trade somebody in five years, say Eberle, and we get a good player and the 8th overall pick, I'll be happy.
I'd be happy winning a cup before then. If we can trade Gagner and the 7th pick for someone like Bergeron I'd do that in a heartbeat over moving RNH. I just think this team needs to make big changes this summer and don't think we'll be able to get that player using Gagner or the pick as the main piece.

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05-28-2013, 06:05 PM
  #340
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You do realize that he scores almost no important goals right? As in going about 150 games in a row with out a gwg.
Bizarre stat for "important" goals. Horcoff got a GWG in a 4-0 win against Colorado. By your definition, would you qualify that as an "important goal?"

Further, you're effectively double counting Horcoff's poor offensive output the past several seasons with it. A player that doesn't score a lot of goals isn't going to get a lot of GWG. No need to invent critiques when calling him out on poor goal scoring is already being done (and a valid criticism).

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05-28-2013, 06:10 PM
  #341
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The problem with Horcoff is that he isn't a bottom 6 forward. If you play him there you are not going to have good results.
Disagree with this. I think Horcoff is best served by being a bottom 6 player.

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05-28-2013, 06:12 PM
  #342
Tad McMikowsky
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Man people are actually harping on Horcoff for not scoring GWGs? REALLY?

Talk about grasping for ****.

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05-28-2013, 07:16 PM
  #343
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Originally Posted by Tad Mikowsky View Post
Man people are actually harping on Horcoff for not scoring GWGs? REALLY?

Talk about grasping for ****.
And some are saying we would win more with him as a top six player.

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05-28-2013, 07:50 PM
  #344
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
How can anyone even debate that next year is out best chance at a cup run? RNH and Schultz will both get big long term deals kicking in, in 2014-15 the year after Yakupov will be due for a big raise. Look at how many years it took Chicago after drafting Kane, Same with Pittsburgh and Crosby. Next year we will have the space to add significant depth pieces that we may not be able to add when all the kids get their big deals. Tambo should have realized this and unloaded dead weight like Whitney, Horcoff, Belanger, etc... And replaced them with capable vets that gave us a chance to at least challenge for a playoff spot. His inability to make deals may have cost this team the chance to ever win a cup. Yes we will be able to contend but without the significant advantage of having our best players on ELC's we may not be able to put together a deep enough team to win it all. See SJ, Ott, Van, Etc...
None of our top guys will even be in their primes yet....Look at Chicago and Pittsburgh, they are always competing for cups because their players that were younger are now fairly seasoned. Having lots of players on ELC's makes it less likely for us to win a cup, not more likely.

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05-28-2013, 08:32 PM
  #345
RaabHart
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Originally Posted by molsonmuscle360 View Post
None of our top guys will even be in their primes yet....Look at Chicago and Pittsburgh, they are always competing for cups because their players that were younger are now fairly seasoned. Having lots of players on ELC's makes it less likely for us to win a cup, not more likely.
Chicago won with both Kane and Toews on ELC's. Malkin and Crosby were off there deals by 1 year when Pittsburgh won in 09, they went to the finals on their ELC's. Hall and Eberle will both have one year off their deal, and we have RNH and Schultz to up next year. RNH will most likely get 6M and Schultz will probably want 5. We'll have 23M tied up in 6 players if my projections are on target with Yakupov to sign. That doesn't include the approx 4.5M to up Gagner this year, and whatever PRV want probably 2.5M. Then we still need to add 2 top 4 dman and a better goalie. I don't see it getting any easier from here on out.

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05-28-2013, 08:39 PM
  #346
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Chicago won with both Kane and Toews on ELC's. Malkin and Crosby were off there deals by 1 year when Pittsburgh won in 09, they went to the finals on their ELC's. Hall and Eberle will both have one year off their deal, and we have RNH and Schultz to up next year. RNH will most likely get 6M and Schultz will probably want 5. We'll have 23M tied up in 6 players if my projections are on target with Yakupov to sign. That doesn't include the approx 4.5M to up Gagner this year, and whatever PRV want probably 2.5M. Then we still need to add 2 top 4 dman and a better goalie. I don't see it getting any easier from here on out.
Think about what you just said. Pittsburgh, the team with Sidney Crosby who is arguably the best player in hockey, and possibly could have a top 5-10 all-time type career if he doesn't get injured constantly the whole way, didn't win until they were out of their ELC's. And if you want to get really specific, they were basically 3 years further along in their "rebuild" then the Oilers are right now, when you count the early picks before Crosby, plus the lockout.

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05-28-2013, 08:58 PM
  #347
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Originally Posted by molsonmuscle360 View Post
Think about what you just said. Pittsburgh, the team with Sidney Crosby who is arguably the best player in hockey, and possibly could have a top 5-10 all-time type career if he doesn't get injured constantly the whole way, didn't win until they were out of their ELC's. And if you want to get really specific, they were basically 3 years further along in their "rebuild" then the Oilers are right now, when you count the early picks before Crosby, plus the lockout.
and Pittsburgh was back in the playoffs in Crosby's second season. Edmonton has been bottom 3 in the league for the last 3 years and finally crawled to 7th overall in a shortened season. Which I'm sure if it wasn't shortened we would have been bottom 5 again. We absolutely need playoffs next year at minimum, hopefully we can go on a run. Tambo has all but guaranteed that were screwed out of a cup after 3 years of absolute **** hockey.

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05-28-2013, 09:16 PM
  #348
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Originally Posted by Tad Mikowsky View Post
Man people are actually harping on Horcoff for not scoring GWGs? REALLY?

Talk about grasping for ****.
Would you prefer they harp on the easy stuff like points, hits, leadership, contract, effort, and insightful interviews?

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05-28-2013, 09:25 PM
  #349
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
and Pittsburgh was back in the playoffs in Crosby's second season. Edmonton has been bottom 3 in the league for the last 3 years and finally crawled to 7th overall in a shortened season. Which I'm sure if it wasn't shortened we would have been bottom 5 again. We absolutely need playoffs next year at minimum, hopefully we can go on a run. Tambo has all but guaranteed that were screwed out of a cup after 3 years of absolute **** hockey.
Making the playoffs in the Eastern conference is like hitting water after falling out of a boat.

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05-28-2013, 09:44 PM
  #350
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Chicago won with both Kane and Toews on ELC's. Malkin and Crosby were off there deals by 1 year when Pittsburgh won in 09, they went to the finals on their ELC's. Hall and Eberle will both have one year off their deal, and we have RNH and Schultz to up next year. RNH will most likely get 6M and Schultz will probably want 5. We'll have 23M tied up in 6 players if my projections are on target with Yakupov to sign. That doesn't include the approx 4.5M to up Gagner this year, and whatever PRV want probably 2.5M. Then we still need to add 2 top 4 dman and a better goalie. I don't see it getting any easier from here on out.
Chicago drafted their defense years before they got Kane/Toews, spent a ton of money of UFAs to get that one shot at the cup(Hossa, Heut, Campbell), and promptly had to dismantle and retool because they over-extended themselves so badly.

Crosby/Malkin are among the very best players in the league and reached that level of play very quickly, something none of the Oiler drafted players can even hope to claim.

Those teams won cups due massive levels of drafting luck, and years of painstaking talent acquisitions, the fact that some of there top tier players were on or close to their ELCs is merely incidental, and a product of the fact they were drafted later in their respect team's rebuilds. The Oilers will never be a UFA destination, nor does it have a ready to break out defense core, nor has it drafted multiple generational talent level players. They'll get their shot at the cup, but it will be later on when Hall/Yak/RNH mature.

Also, 6 million for RNH? 2.5 for Paajarvi? I know the Oilers back themselves into a corner with Hall by making him the franchise savior, and Eberle had a career year in his contract year, but RNH hasn't done anything to earn a contract like that(and will be coming off injury this year), and Paajarvi most definitely hasn't done anything to earn any kind of raise. At some point the Oilers will have to start actually negotiating fair contracts instead of just offering their own players contracts they can't refuse.

Not that 23 million for 4 - 6 front line players is all that much anyways. Most of the cup contenders have upwards of 30 million tied up in their 4 - 6 best players.

Chicago - 35 million on 6 players
Pittsburg - 32 million on 5 players
SJ - 31.3 on 5 players
Boston - 25.2 on 5 players
LA - 25 million on 4 players
etc

it's all about paying the talent, and finding cheap but effective role players to play behind them.

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