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Fire Todd McLellan (Mod: Extended Per Dreger)

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05-29-2013, 11:19 AM
  #151
OrrNumber4
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Or...it was not really anybody's fault and they just lost to a team that, by their own admission, thought we were just as good as them.

There were a lot...A LOT...of reasons and things we can point to that could've changed the result of the series just because it was that close. Pinning it on one individual doesn't make much sense in a situation like that.

The players left it all on the ice. If they do that, I'm okay with their performance and that includes guys like Pavs and Couture who didn't produce much of anything.

Personally, my issue with the organization is their culture of veteran preference, lack of being proactive, and inability to consistently help younger players along. That was true prior to these playoffs though and that hasn't changed even though they finally recognized what their problems were this year. However, they've done this before and decided to go back to big, veteran leaders anyway.
If it makes you feel any better, it seems like Plattner has identified the "inability to consistently help younger players along" as a failing.

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05-29-2013, 11:21 AM
  #152
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Originally Posted by OrrNumber4 View Post
If it makes you feel any better, it seems like Plattner has identified the "inability to consistently help younger players along" as a failing.
How do you know?

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05-29-2013, 11:23 AM
  #153
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Originally Posted by SpinTheBlackCircle View Post
The Sharks have been WAY more physical than the Hawks, Wings or Pens so far.
You haven't been watching either series... Lots of big hits.

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05-29-2013, 11:24 AM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post

The players left it all on the ice. If they do that, I'm okay with their performance and that includes guys like Pavs and Couture who didn't produce much of anything.
For the most part, I agree.. although the entire team crapped the bed in game 5. In a series this tight, you just can't have that type of game.

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05-29-2013, 11:25 AM
  #155
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
How do you know?
See my post in the GDT thread.

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05-29-2013, 11:26 AM
  #156
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Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer View Post
Yeah, the fact that no one is willing to blame Couture for not scoring a single ****ing even strength goal is ridiculous.
He's at fault too. One of the teams leading goal scorers. He failed to. However he was injured. Just like I don't blame Marleau for the ducks upset since he played on a sprained mcl.

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05-29-2013, 11:26 AM
  #157
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Originally Posted by Eighth Fret View Post
For the most part, I agree.. although the entire team crapped the bed in game 5. In a series this tight, you just can't have that type of game.
On the other hand, they really had some bad luck. I thought that they outplayed LA the first four games.

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05-29-2013, 11:27 AM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Or...it was not really anybody's fault .
there you go.

The Sharks just aren't as good. It's really close, but they aren't.

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05-29-2013, 11:29 AM
  #159
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Originally Posted by OrrNumber4 View Post
See my post in the GDT thread.
How bout you just tell me instead of sending me to search some other long ass thread. If it the thing I think I read last night, sounded like ******** you made up.

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05-29-2013, 11:29 AM
  #160
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Originally Posted by SpinTheBlackCircle View Post
there you go.

The Sharks just aren't as good when missing Torres, Havlat and Demers. It's really close, but they aren't.
fify

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05-29-2013, 11:30 AM
  #161
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
He's at fault too. One of the teams leading goal scorers. He failed to. However he was injured. Just like I don't blame Marleau for the ducks upset since he played on a sprained mcl.
Again, everyone plays through injuries. If you are out on the ice, then you better contribute. If you are too injured to play, give your spot to somebody else. Thornton was a beast a few seasons ago with a separated shoulder. Damphousse played with some injuries; Ragnarsson played with a dislocated shoulder. I am sure that Ricci and S.Thornton played their awesome brand of hockey while banged up. Even this year, Vlasic was a rock despite a broken foot and Boyle was a weapon despite having might have played with a groin problem.

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05-29-2013, 11:30 AM
  #162
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Originally Posted by SpinTheBlackCircle View Post
there you go.

The Sharks just aren't as good. It's really close, but they aren't.
I would modifty that as:

The depleted Sharks just aren't as good.

A healthy Havlat, not-suspended Torres, and Demers instead of Irwin in the line-up and we win that series. Even if they had Stoll back.

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05-29-2013, 11:32 AM
  #163
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Originally Posted by SpinTheBlackCircle View Post
there you go.

The Sharks just aren't as good. It's really close, but they aren't.
Come on. They lost in game seven, by one goal. One goal! That kind of margin cannot be clear-cut "just aren't as good".

They were "not as good" vs. Chicago three years ago, Vancouver two years ago, and St.Louis last year.

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05-29-2013, 11:33 AM
  #164
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Originally Posted by NWShark View Post
How bout you just tell me instead of sending me to search some other long ass thread. If it the thing I think I read last night, sounded like ******** you made up.
...or you could easily just search by my post history....

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05-29-2013, 11:34 AM
  #165
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no reason to fire anyone, imo. This team is very good, kings play the same as the blues but with better goaltending and we took them to seven. thats from additions/subtractions that the staff were finally willing to make. depleted line up, etc. we did well, and im proud of them. off season should be very good to us.

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05-29-2013, 11:47 AM
  #166
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Any firings should start with the sacred cow. That man is the person most directly responsible for the makeup of this team, its coaches, Mike Potenza, etc.

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05-29-2013, 11:48 AM
  #167
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Originally Posted by SpinTheBlackCircle View Post
there you go.

The Sharks just aren't as good. It's really close, but they aren't.
But just to be clear, when I discuss changes that I feel need to be made, it's not because of how they lost this series. Or when I talk this series, it's not looking to blame anyone in particular.

There are personnel in the front office and on the ice that I've had issues with before this season even occurred. I don't feel any of them did enough to warrant changing from that position. However, I do acknowledge that some of them made right moves. In some instances, it just wasn't enough or it was too little, too late.

My take with DW is allowing guys like Murray, Clowe, and Handzus this year to stay in the lineup as long as they did and provide what they did when guys like Demers or Tennyson on the blue line were sitting or guys like Galiardi or Sheppard were sitting up front. And this isn't the first year that this has happened. Last year it happened with Handzus and Colin White. The year before Niclas Wallin was the guy. I just don't like the repeating of the mistakes and waiting for the deadline to make the moves that genuinely improve the team. I just want to know why that isn't done before the season starts instead.

With McLellan, he shares some of that blame. However, the part that's mostly on him is the reactive nature with his adjustments. There were certain playoff instances where being proactive was the way to go and he didn't do it. The lack of line adjustments going into game 7 was just the latest one. Last year against the Blues he waited too long to try different things even though they didn't play any different when they were dominating the Sharks. I don't necessarily blame the loss against St. Louis on McLellan but to be outplayed to that degree has an element of coaching involved and he got worked by Hitchcock.

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05-29-2013, 11:48 AM
  #168
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Originally Posted by OrrNumber4 View Post
On the other hand, they really had some bad luck. I thought that they outplayed LA the first four games.
I don't even want to talk about game 2, but we didn't outplay them in game 4 (second and third period were all Kings).

I'm just saying.. after the bad luck in games 1 and 2, game 5 needed a level of urgency that we just didn't bring. Aside from game 5, I am proud of what the Sharks were able to do.

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05-29-2013, 11:49 AM
  #169
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Originally Posted by OrrNumber4 View Post
Come on. They lost in game seven, by one goal. One goal! That kind of margin cannot be clear-cut "just aren't as good".

They were "not as good" vs. Chicago three years ago, Vancouver two years ago, and St.Louis last year.
I think they were as good as the Canucks and as the Blues, but not the Hawks or Kings.

I think the Kings win it all again this year, I think they are the best team.

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05-29-2013, 11:49 AM
  #170
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McLellan will not and should not be fired.

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05-29-2013, 11:51 AM
  #171
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Handzus and Murray are still playing. Todd was not incorrect in playing them. They were the best he had. It was good getting rid of them and changing the team dynamics and what Todd had available to him. It served this team well.

Once he got the players he changed the teams game. I don't see how you blame him for that.

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05-29-2013, 11:59 AM
  #172
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I don't think TMac should be fired. We were pretty good in the LA series too. It's not his fault Quick was just awesome all series.

Remember in March everyone was calling for TMac's head? How times have changed after putting Burns at forward and shipping off Murray, Handzus and Clowe.

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05-29-2013, 12:09 PM
  #173
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Tortorella just got fired. heh

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05-29-2013, 12:11 PM
  #174
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Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
Handzus and Murray are still playing. Todd was not incorrect in playing them. They were the best he had. It was good getting rid of them and changing the team dynamics and what Todd had available to him. It served this team well.

Once he got the players he changed the teams game. I don't see how you blame him for that.
Yes, he was incorrect playing them as the team's performance improved with them all gone. It's not as if he didn't have most of the personnel that he ran with after those moves already. The only guy he got was Torres. Hannan didn't play til much later and wasn't really a guy that was going to be impacted by the style change.

I'm not saying those guys should've been out of the NHL but they should've been out of this team's lineup when they had guys that would've been better if they put them in the right position to succeed which they eventually did. This team just couldn't compliment those guys well enough to get the best out of them for the team. They weren't good fits and they fought that for a long time.

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05-29-2013, 12:15 PM
  #175
Led Zappa
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Yes, he was incorrect playing them as the team's performance improved with them all gone. It's not as if he didn't have most of the personnel that he ran with after those moves already. The only guy he got was Torres. Hannan didn't play til much later and wasn't really a guy that was going to be impacted by the style change.

I'm not saying those guys should've been out of the NHL but they should've been out of this team's lineup when they had guys that would've been better if they put them in the right position to succeed which they eventually did. This team just couldn't compliment those guys well enough to get the best out of them for the team. They weren't good fits and they fought that for a long time.
You don't do that to NHL worthy veterans. And they are NHL worthy players as two teams still left are playing them.

It sets a bad tone for the whole org. We also would likely not have gotten what we did for them had they been riding the pine. DW played it perfectly. As ON4 pointed out, Murray was being shopped for quite a while. We also got more for them by waiting for the deadline IMO.

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