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Draft Thread Part 2: Bark to the Future

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Old
05-30-2013, 05:28 PM
  #326
Byrddog
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Yes Scott Walker

Some may remember the little worm who supported contraction of teams during the lockout. Then again I guess not....

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05-30-2013, 05:46 PM
  #327
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Yes Scott Walker

Some may remember the little worm who supported contraction of teams during the lockout. Then again I guess not....
I sure remember that.

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05-30-2013, 05:54 PM
  #328
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I don't think we need to get into Scott Walker's comments from nearly a decade ago in this thread.

Also, please don't call people trolls or state/imply someone is trolling. It is expressly prohibited by the rule against flaming.

Thanks

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05-30-2013, 06:02 PM
  #329
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As to the question who I think DP should take????? Well to be honest short of Jones nobody in this draft has me Giddy. I would prefer DP trade this pick and pick up a proven 30 goal scorer that is between 25 and 27 years old. I have watched this game longer than many here have been alive. Seen sure fire prospects fizzle and 7th rounders be gold. I also saw the Ford Pinto when it was new. Later it was found that a car hitting it in the ass caused it to explode. So yeah im skeptical very skeptical and I expect players that are paid millions partly from my pocket to produce. And to continue to read posts defending Craig Smith, Jordon Tootoo ect ect as invaluable to a team makes me want to hurl. Additionally to think a couple 17 year olds in the next couple years will turn this team into a cup contender is just as revolting to me. I have been called stupid simple minded and many just don't think I know anything about the game because I do not agree with them. I left this forum a same reason personel attacks mean nothing to me on the net frankley the vast majority that read this have no idea about my past short of 101st. But have just as much of a right to opinion then many pimplefaced "crummungions" that lable me. Im pretty sure there an ingnore button on this thing feel free to use it. But I will leave this place when I wish. I have not broken any forum rules that I know of.
Nobody is saying that whoever we pick will turn us into cup champs next year. In 3-5 years, though, having Forsberg, Barkov, and Wilson up front will turn us into contenders. No body is calling for Barkov or even Forsberg to play 20:00 a night every night next year.

I'm sorry you are skeptical about 17/18 year old draftees Byrddog but that's how the draft works, you draft 17-20 year olds and within a few years they are stars you are depending on to win big games. If we pick the right one they can most certainly turn us into a cup contender, just look at the final four in the conference finals NOW. Pittsburgh, Chicago, L.A., Boston all have top 5 picks contributing to various degrees.

Trading our very rare top 5 pick for a 25-27 year old 30 goal scorer will be a waste, as, once again we will not be in the running for the cup next year. But if we don't trade it, it's possible we can solidify our offense for once, and then we can start competing for cups yearly like teams with multiple top five picks.

The fact of the matter is that drafting has improved tremendously in just the last ten years alone. You are almost guaranteed a semi-star to franchise player in the top 5, yes there are hits and misses, but for the most part you can expect these 18 year old kids to do very well in a few short years.

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05-30-2013, 06:17 PM
  #330
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Originally Posted by Soundgarden View Post
Nobody is saying that whoever we pick will turn us into cup champs next year. In 3-5 years, though, having Forsberg, Barkov, and Wilson up front will turn us into contenders. No body is calling for Barkov or even Forsberg to play 20:00 a night every night next year.

I'm sorry you are skeptical about 17/18 year old draftees Byrddog but that's how the draft works, you draft 17-20 year olds and within a few years they are stars you are depending on to win big games. If we pick the right one they can most certainly turn us into a cup contender, just look at the final four in the conference finals NOW. Pittsburgh, Chicago, L.A., Boston all have top 5 picks contributing to various degrees.

Trading our very rare top 5 pick for a 25-27 year old 30 goal scorer will be a waste, as, once again we will not be in the running for the cup next year. But if we don't trade it, it's possible we can solidify our offense for once, and then we can start competing for cups yearly like teams with multiple top five picks.

The fact of the matter is that drafting has improved tremendously in just the last ten years alone. You are almost guaranteed a semi-star to franchise player in the top 5, yes there are hits and misses, but for the most part you can expect these 18 year old kids to do very well in a few short years.
I just came to post this exact same post. Well put sir.

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05-30-2013, 06:23 PM
  #331
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Yes the Oilers are doing really well.

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05-30-2013, 06:30 PM
  #332
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Yes the Oilers are doing really well.
Chicago seems to be doing ok.

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Old
05-30-2013, 06:35 PM
  #333
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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
As to the question who I think DP should take????? Well to be honest short of Jones nobody in this draft has me Giddy. I would prefer DP trade this pick and pick up a proven 30 goal scorer that is between 25 and 27 years old. I have watched this game longer than many here have been alive. Seen sure fire prospects fizzle and 7th rounders be gold. I also saw the Ford Pinto when it was new. Later it was found that a car hitting it in the ass caused it to explode. So yeah im skeptical very skeptical and I expect players that are paid millions partly from my pocket to produce. And to continue to read posts defending Craig Smith, Jordon Tootoo ect ect as invaluable to a team makes me want to hurl. Additionally to think a couple 17 year olds in the next couple years will turn this team into a cup contender is just as revolting to me. I have been called stupid simple minded and many just don't think I know anything about the game because I do not agree with them. I left this forum a same reason personel attacks mean nothing to me on the net frankley the vast majority that read this have no idea about my past short of 101st. But have just as much of a right to opinion then many pimplefaced "crummungions" that lable me. Im pretty sure there an ingnore button on this thing feel free to use it. But I will leave this place when I wish. I have not broken any forum rules that I know of.

As to the Barkov primidona statment it was a news article from Finland that I read it in. I have no idea if he is really but I reserve my opinion to question it. Just as I did with Radulov, Scott Walker, and others.
Name the consistent 30 goal scorers in the league .... then which of them are in any way available ... then narrow those players to your specified age range.

Now that we're at nobody .... let's look at the draft.

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Old
05-30-2013, 06:45 PM
  #334
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Draft draft draft. But you do have to understand the perspective whe. Our top picks other than suter have failed to turn into stars. Finley upshall even legwand hartnell hambuis ellis don't make you dream of hall of fame inductions.

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05-30-2013, 06:46 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
Yes the Oilers are doing really well.
Taylor Hall: 50 pts. 45 gms. 1st ov.
Sam Gagner: 38 pts 48 gms. 6th ov.
Nail Yakupov: 31 Pts. 48 gms. 1st ov, rookie year.
RNH: 24 pts: 40 gms.

And that's not including Schultz(2nd rounder) and Eberle(17th ov, I think).

Of those four only Ryan Nugent-Hopkins would not be our leading scorer. Just because they don't have any defense, have average to almost above average goaltending and UFA's don't want to sign there doesn't mean they won't be doing really well in the very near future.

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05-30-2013, 06:47 PM
  #336
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Even if we did trade for a 27 year old. That's only helps us short term, plus less cap space because this guy won't be on an entry level deal for three years.

Trading him for a 27 year old is pointless IMO. We need someone to groom with Wilson and forsberg, and beck for that matter.

Drafting top five in a draft rated more highly than any in ten years, yeah, it's nice to have a shot at such an offensive powerhouse.

Do you think we should have traded sixth overall in weaker draft a few years back which was Colin Wilson for a 27 year old?? Who would now be well over thirty and not Colin Wilson?!

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Old
05-30-2013, 08:13 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by braindead View Post
Draft draft draft. But you do have to understand the perspective whe. Our top picks other than suter have failed to turn into stars. Finley upshall even legwand hartnell hambuis ellis don't make you dream of hall of fame inductions.
out of all our top ten draft picks we have selected:

Legwand 2nd overall
Finley 6th overall
Hartnell 6th overall
Upshall 6th overall
Suter 7th overall
Wilson 7th overall

Pretty good track record for only having a pick higher than 6th once...

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Old
05-30-2013, 08:15 PM
  #338
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Originally Posted by CantbeatzPekka View Post
out of all our top ten draft picks we have selected:

Legwand 2nd overall
Finley 6th overall
Hartnell 6th overall
Upshall 6th overall
Suter 7th overall
Wilson 7th overall

Pretty good track record for only having a pick higher than 6th once...
Man, what happened to Upshall? I can't believe he's still playing. Only 29.

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05-30-2013, 08:19 PM
  #339
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Man, what happened to Upshall? I can't believe he's still playing. Only 29.
I think he has had an injury filled career since leaving Nashville. Hes a solid player for sure

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Old
05-30-2013, 08:45 PM
  #340
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Originally Posted by Byrddog View Post
Yes the Oilers are doing really well.
...And notice how they just basically cleaned house in the front office because no team had been built around those prospects. Drafting alone is not enough-- you have to put all the pieces together. Drafting scoring forwards has been the weakness of this organization, plus their draft position. Traded for one good prospect, about to draft another to fill that void. We shall see if the Oilers way or the Predator way is best...

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Old
05-30-2013, 09:11 PM
  #341
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That's all we need is a 27yo average forward. Let's change it up and pick up what could be elite young talent to go with the two super stars that are signed for many many years.

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05-30-2013, 09:37 PM
  #342
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Originally Posted by CantbeatzPekka View Post
out of all our top ten draft picks we have selected:

Legwand 2nd overall
Finley 6th overall
Hartnell 6th overall
Upshall 6th overall
Suter 7th overall
Wilson 7th overall

Pretty good track record for only having a pick higher than 6th once...
My mangled post was trying to just point out that you could look at that group as a long time preds fan and have a hard time imagining the Preds actually drafting a superstar offensive threat. I believe we can and should get one in this draft but I can understand the doubt expressed in other posts, particularly if you ignore the spots we drafted and the talent available at those spots in those years.

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Old
05-30-2013, 09:59 PM
  #343
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That's all we need is a 27yo average forward. Let's change it up and pick up what could be elite young talent to go with the two super stars that are signed for many many years.
Let's be fair. A 25-27 year old consistent 30 goal scorer is not an average forward. It's a rarity in this league.

Of course, goal scoring is but one of many attributes that is essential in a forward this team needs. Yes, we need someone who can provide that, but we do not need a one-dimensional player. For instance, having a one-dimensional 30 goal scoring winger is not what we need, and it would do us little good to simply scoff at the ability to draft a potential top line center in an effort to gain that. While it is certainly enticing to put together a package centered around our #4 pick to bring a young, 30 goal scoring forward aboard, it obviously brings up the question, "why does a team give that up for our pick plus whatever it is we package along with it?" After all, what do we offer another team to sweeten the deal that does not create another hole in our roster? SK? Blum? Ellis? I don't think so.

Our needs are simple, in my opinion. We need a top line center, which is nothing new, and we need a second pairing defenseman. One of those things is attainable, while not necessarily easily attainable, through free agency or trade. The other is not.

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05-30-2013, 10:15 PM
  #344
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Avs fan here... With the talk of trading down around the Avs, just curious what would Nashville give up to go to #1?

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05-30-2013, 10:33 PM
  #345
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I've watched as many videos of Barkov in game play, not just highlight reels, as possible and think the skating concerns are very overblown.

As has been said, he is growing into his body and you can see from his junior days to his SM-liiga performance a difference in the smoothness of his stride as he has adjusted to his size.

Barkov is not going to blow past you from standing still in open space, however, he does have enough speed to put the puck around you or use his teammates to execute a give and go as he accelerates and blow right past you in that fashion. He has a powerful first step allowing him to jump into battles for loose pucks and position himself to come out of the battle with the puck using a combination of his size, stick length, and smarts.

Barkov has been playing against MEN for two seasons now as a 16 and 17 year-old. Common concerns about bigger guys that we've all seen dominate competition with their size as juniors only to underwhelm as adults should not be the concern here. Barkov isn't dominating the CHL against his peers (16-20 yo's), he's doing it in a league filled with players with an average age range from 19-28 and higher.

One thing that shows through even in battles away from the puck (there are three cool videos of him in an SM-liiga game from last season broken down to only see his shifts on YouTube) is that his compete level is very high and his situational knowledge is through the roof. Like every top player, Barkov sees the game a couple steps ahead of his opponents and that gives him a mental edge to go along with his physical skills.

See Barkov developing as a definite top-six center, most likely as a first line center, but see potential for him to rise his game during his development path into the franchise/elite category when all is said and done. Barkov is my pick at No. 4...

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05-31-2013, 01:51 AM
  #346
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Avs fan here... With the talk of trading down around the Avs, just curious what would Nashville give up to go to #1?
I'll be honest, the Preds probably want to keep Weber, Rinne, Wilson, Josi, Klein, Forsberg, and Hornqvist. Probably Fisher and possibly Legwand too. If you are interested in anyone other than those guys, then I would jump at it without hesitation.

Players probably available that could interest you: Ellis, Blum, SK, Bourque (one of my faves, but worth it if we could move to #1), Craig Smith (lit it up on a line with Stastny in the WC) Austin Watson (big young center with defensive upside), Magnus Hellberg (very talented young goalie prospect)


Last edited by oreilly22: 05-31-2013 at 02:00 AM. Reason: forgot Smith
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Old
05-31-2013, 01:56 AM
  #347
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I've watched as many videos of Barkov in game play, not just highlight reels, as possible and think the skating concerns are very overblown.

As has been said, he is growing into his body and you can see from his junior days to his SM-liiga performance a difference in the smoothness of his stride as he has adjusted to his size.

Barkov is not going to blow past you from standing still in open space, however, he does have enough speed to put the puck around you or use his teammates to execute a give and go as he accelerates and blow right past you in that fashion. He has a powerful first step allowing him to jump into battles for loose pucks and position himself to come out of the battle with the puck using a combination of his size, stick length, and smarts.

Barkov has been playing against MEN for two seasons now as a 16 and 17 year-old. Common concerns about bigger guys that we've all seen dominate competition with their size as juniors only to underwhelm as adults should not be the concern here. Barkov isn't dominating the CHL against his peers (16-20 yo's), he's doing it in a league filled with players with an average age range from 19-28 and higher.

One thing that shows through even in battles away from the puck (there are three cool videos of him in an SM-liiga game from last season broken down to only see his shifts on YouTube) is that his compete level is very high and his situational knowledge is through the roof. Like every top player, Barkov sees the game a couple steps ahead of his opponents and that gives him a mental edge to go along with his physical skills.

See Barkov developing as a definite top-six center, most likely as a first line center, but see potential for him to rise his game during his development path into the franchise/elite category when all is said and done. Barkov is my pick at No. 4...
This

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Old
05-31-2013, 06:23 AM
  #348
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Avs fan here... With the talk of trading down around the Avs, just curious what would Nashville give up to go to #1?
I had previously suggested one of Ellis or Blum plus Taylor Beck. I agree with Oreilly that if it had to be Bourque instead of Beck i'd hate it but I'd probably do it.

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05-31-2013, 07:30 AM
  #349
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If we want to move up to number 1 I would hate to give up Bourque or Beck as they are good pieces for us moving forward. Not saying I want to give away our garbage but we need to move pieces that don't fit in our future and SK, Smith and Blum definitely fit the bill. To move up to get Mack and lose a good piece seems silly, I'd rather keep Bourque and Beck and add Barkov to that mix. To me, we still gain a player that looks like he's the real deal and we keep one of our younger gems. What happens if the guys we trade end up blossoming along with the 4th pick we've swapped AND Mack doesn't pan out? Granted, Mack could pan out and Barkov could be a bust too.

They're all crap shoots but I don't think it's worth giving up a good young roster player for an unsure thing at this point, all things considered.

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05-31-2013, 07:53 AM
  #350
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If we want to move up to number 1 I would hate to give up Bourque or Beck as they are good pieces for us moving forward. Not saying I want to give away our garbage but we need to move pieces that don't fit in our future and SK, Smith and Blum definitely fit the bill. To move up to get Mack and lose a good piece seems silly, I'd rather keep Bourque and Beck and add Barkov to that mix. To me, we still gain a player that looks like he's the real deal and we keep one of our younger gems. What happens if the guys we trade end up blossoming along with the 4th pick we've swapped AND Mack doesn't pan out? Granted, Mack could pan out and Barkov could be a bust too.

They're all crap shoots but I don't think it's worth giving up a good young roster player for an unsure thing at this point, all things considered.
I see where you're coming from, and I agree to an extent, but our garbage IS what you're offering. From Colorado or Florida's position, why on earth move out of the big 3 (or really 2 in this case) for players not panning out (though with potential). Blum and/or SK to lose out on Mac? They would want a real good reason to not draft where they are and those guys are not it.

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