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Ryder isn't coming back (according to his agent)

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Old
05-30-2013, 04:24 PM
  #76
Talks to Goalposts
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Originally Posted by dmanfish90 View Post
Here's my thing about the cap, before July 1st, I believe we'll need to fill 2 roster spots with about 8 million in cap space.

Assuming you're a smart GM and save 2 million in cap space for the deadline to add a key player possibly if you're in the hunt sort of deal, that leaves us about 6 million in cap space.

IMO, we need another top 4 defenseman to fill in for 1-2 years before Tinordi is ready to move up the depth chart and Beaulieu is ready to replace Markov. I think that should be a bigger priority as the defense, IMO is what was one of our weaker points down the stretch. Gallagher and Galchenyuk (barring a sophmore slump) can look after Ryder's production and maybe a Top 9 RW like say, Chad LaRose would be a good plug to put in until Kristo/Collberg/whoever is ready to make the jump to the NHL. Until then, spend 4 million on Regehr as our Top 4 D acquisition on a 2 year term deal and spend 2 million on LaRose on a 2-3 year deal to fill in till the prospect(s) are ready.

Gionta i don't think he's aging out as much as he's injuring out. Had he not been injured this past year, he would still be scoring 20-25 goals a season.
There is virtually nothing worth spending real money on for top 4 defensemen though, unless we're talking trade route. I'd bet strongly on what you see now being what you get for next season on the blueline. Regehr is a great example of that, he's just not very good anymore. Same goes for the other free agent D, the are nigh universally both very old and not appreciably better than the Habs' existing top 5. If they were going to explore that option then they shouldn't have retained Boullion and got someone better to be a veteran 4-6.

And on the other hand, top nine filler players like LaRose aren't going to be worth much to the Habs either. They aren't particularly better than promoting a guy like Prust.

The Cap looks to rise considerably after next year and the Habs have a fair amount of space for next season when a lot of other top spending teams are constrained. Its a good time to look to add replacements to Gionta/Ryder on wing rather than pray that their prospects turn out.

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05-30-2013, 04:43 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Gustave View Post
I'll speak for myself: I knew what we were getting and he was who I knew he is. Look, guy can score. I see him as a useful passenger. I don't feel he's part of the solution. Doesn't mean he's hated.
This team is full of passengers. Getting rid of the one who can score may be a risky move, unless Ryder has let it be known he has no interest in returning.

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05-30-2013, 04:55 PM
  #78
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and everyone laughed at me when we got him and I said he was a lazy player that never shows up for the big game

"yes but he saved the bruins from a sure goal that one time"

yeah.

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05-30-2013, 05:27 PM
  #79
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Love it. Gives Kristo a better chance (pending any FA signings) of making our top roster.

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05-30-2013, 05:34 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Johnny Drama View Post
Love it. Gives Kristo a better chance (pending any FA signings) of making our top roster.
Pending a strong camp, don't think Kristo is ready to make the jump yet imo.

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05-30-2013, 05:52 PM
  #81
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He was excellent for us, not sure why the hate. 99% of this team dried up in the playoffs, Ryder wasn't alone. Amazing how the homers here can go from loving a guy, to hating him, in 2 games.
Damn, Ryder was wasted both times in Montreal.

Ryder will be a success wherever he goes.

The Ryder playing on the top line with Plekanec and Gionta will be very hard to replace.

The Ryder demoted to the third line can be replaced by anyone.

Could have, should have, would have.........

Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs View Post
This team is full of passengers. Getting rid of the one who can score may be a risky move, unless Ryder has let it be known he has no interest in returning.
I would be willing to bet that Ryder is the one initiating this with his lack of desire to stay in Montreal playing for Therrien.

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05-30-2013, 05:53 PM
  #82
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Glad to have the cap space back. I'm glad we made that trade as it worked out well for us, even if he did disappear in the playoffs. I have no problem with letting him walk however.

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05-30-2013, 06:01 PM
  #83
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we were never going to give him the amount and term he'd be looking for anyway. cole off the books. ryder had a decent stint with us in the season. we won the trade. next.

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05-30-2013, 06:12 PM
  #84
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It seems like in Montreal Ryder needs to play on the top 2 lines or else he doesn't put up points. He's a good player but he just doesn't fit our plans moving forward

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05-30-2013, 06:41 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by donghabs98 View Post
It seems like in Montreal Ryder needs to play on the top 2 lines or else he doesn't put up points. He's a good player but he just doesn't fit our plans moving forward
He played on the top 2 lines in the playoffs and was invisible.

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05-30-2013, 08:03 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
With Gio out indefinitely and Ryder not returning, we absolutely need to get a couple of established NHL wingers.

What are the options?
Kristo starts

Bickell or Stallberg as ufa`s

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Originally Posted by Capitaine Gionta View Post
Good riddance.
one down ....and many more to go

DD, Colbly , Weber , Kabby , Cube , Gio all at some point

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarlemsFinest View Post
we were never going to give him the amount and term he'd be looking for anyway. cole off the books. ryder had a decent stint with us in the season. we won the trade. next.
we won it hnads down ....STEAL CITY


Last edited by Habsfan18: 05-30-2013 at 08:13 PM. Reason: merge
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05-30-2013, 08:17 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
Bergevin has to look to the future. He won't have to spend anything on Ryder (or Cole) and it's time to try inexpensive prospects in the hope that one of them will click.
Exactly my friend

have we not learned our lesson from Spacek , Cammy, Gio , Cole in free agency

when you overpay the wrong guy at the wrong time you get burned and lucky for us we were able to dump some of them

spend when the player fits your system , and can work with you him throughout his contract and you are near contender status

what good is a beat up Clowe , if you give him 4 years at 4 , in 2 years he is done
so why not give a one year deal to a midlevel player til some of your own prospects are ready , there are a ton of players in August crying for a contract

the only glaring error MB made was the DD signing but these people that wanted Ryder inked long term MB woke up and did the right thing

dont make a wrong with another wrong , he will flush out many more players .

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05-30-2013, 08:21 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Dumont is terrible......

He is a depth player who should only be in the lineup when injuries create an opening. If he was 30+ years old everyone hear would agree that he is awful but people like to see him as a prospect with upside which simply is not the case. He will be a career minor leaguer with the odd cup of coffee at the NHL level.

White proved to be far more valuable than Dumont in the playoffs and comparing him to a bigger, faster version of himself in Moen is laughable.
agreed my friend Dumont is simply an AHL call up for injuries , White is fine on the 4th line as long as he clams down

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05-30-2013, 08:23 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
Gionta's recovery(if it goes as planned) should have him ready to start the season so it's a non issue.



That's a hard group to disect, primarily because some will re-sign and be wiped off the list causing others to end up overpaid.

The point of letting Ryder walk was to keep cap flexibility going forward as he was going to requre 2, probably 3 and maybe even a 4 year deal. Even a "reclamation project" type signing at 1 year 2-3 mil would be better than 3 years at 4.5 mil for Ryder, he risks declining and being immoveable at that age, plus his career path(hot and cold).
excellent post , sign the one year player not Ryder to long term

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05-30-2013, 08:29 PM
  #90
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Bergevin knows good teams integrate 2 rookies per year nowadays (As a cap-control tactic) That's why he insisted on a bridge to PK, he wants the rookies to play 5 years for cheap. (All of them.)

Last year was Chuckie and Gallagher started. Next year will be Kristo(If I was to bet today, however don't count out Leblanc too quick) / Tinordi. He just need to find one top 6 winger. (I don't think Gionta will be back, we should trade him when he comes back.)
The year after Collberg / Beaulieu with hopefully Leblanc knocking on the door. Then the year after Hudon / Bozon / Dietz / 2013 choices + etc. Hudon was a major steal.

All of this will allow us to get (1) major UFA at some point. Looking at this from our current point of view, I think we may be in a situation to trade 2013 draftees for major talent around 2015(our current talent pool is filled enough to sustain a couple of years). Let's make the right choices.

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05-30-2013, 08:50 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Damn, Ryder was wasted both times in Montreal.

Ryder will be a success wherever he goes.

The Ryder playing on the top line with Plekanec and Gionta will be very hard to replace.

The Ryder demoted to the third line can be replaced by anyone.

Could have, should have, would have.........



I would be willing to bet that Ryder is the one initiating this with his lack of desire to stay in Montreal playing for Therrien.
We've already had this convo. Ryder was demoted because he stopped producing. A Ryder that isn't producing is worthless.

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05-30-2013, 09:13 PM
  #92
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Most agreed Ryder is a one dimensional player. If he isn't scoring, he ain't doing anything else.

I thought he would stay before he hit the slump, guy was on fire for that little while.
Closing the door on signing, doesn't really piss me off.. I mean, the idea with the trade in principle was to free up some cap space... and we just did that.

We won the trade the day it happened.
We still won the trade today.

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05-30-2013, 09:15 PM
  #93
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Bergevin has long-stated that he's into character guys. Does Ryder strike anyone as a character guy?

What I'm waiting on is to see whether or not Nashville's 2nd rounder is worth what we gave up in Kostitsyn, because he is exactly what fits our need right now, and it probably wouldn't take much to convince him to play here since it's familiar territory. Again though, not a character guy, so no chance.

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05-30-2013, 10:52 PM
  #94
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No real surprise...was totally invisible in playoffs....

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05-30-2013, 11:26 PM
  #95
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Hard to replace his production however, I hope we make a play for Clarkson.

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05-30-2013, 11:45 PM
  #96
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i have no problem letting Ryder walk but his 30 goals need to be replaced.Cole had 35 2 year ago an Ryder was on a 30 pace. Louis Leblanc is not the answer. I hope MB has a plan to bring in someone who can produce on the top 2 lines. I know Ryder disappeared in the playoffs but his regular season goals helped them get there

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05-30-2013, 11:49 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Analyzer View Post
We've already had this convo. Ryder was demoted because he stopped producing. A Ryder that isn't producing is worthless.
I know we had this conversation already. You were wrong then and you are wrong now.

It doesnt really matter since he is probably leaving but here is the a short timeline leading up to Ryder's "demotion".

3-27 vs Boston

2 Goals. 1st Star.

3-30 vs NY Rangers

1 Goal. Game Winning goal.

4-1 vs Carolina

Zero Goals

4-3 vs Philadelphia

Zero Goals

4-4 vs Winnipeg

2 Goals, 1 Assist. GW goal. 1st Star

4-6 vs Boston

1 Goal. GW goal. 3rd Star

4-9 vs Washington

Zero Goals.

In this game against the Caps, Bourque returned to the Habs lineup after his concussion and played on the line with Halpern and Moen. He had 4 shots and 6 hits on the 4th line.

4-11 vs Buffalo

Bourque starts and plays entire game on Pleks line. Ryder moved down to 3rd line with Eller and Chuckie.

If you want to call that "stopped producing", feel free to. It is not even close to accurate though.

Therrien ****ed up big time by demoting his top goal scorer Ryder down to the 3rd line. Ryder eventually lost interest in playing for the Habs, including in the playoffs. Good luck elsewhere Michael Ryder.

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05-31-2013, 12:02 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
I know we had this conversation already. You were wrong then and you are wrong now.

It doesnt really matter since he is probably leaving but here is the a short timeline leading up to Ryder's "demotion".

3-27 vs Boston

2 Goals. 1st Star.

3-30 vs NY Rangers

1 Goal. Game Winning goal.

4-1 vs Carolina

Zero Goals

4-3 vs Philadelphia

Zero Goals

4-4 vs Winnipeg

2 Goals, 1 Assist. GW goal. 1st Star

4-6 vs Boston

1 Goal. GW goal. 3rd Star

4-9 vs Washington

Zero Goals.

In this game against the Caps, Bourque returned to the Habs lineup after his concussion and played on the line with Halpern and Moen. He had 4 shots and 6 hits on the 4th line.

4-11 vs Buffalo

Bourque starts and plays entire game on Pleks line. Ryder moved down to 3rd line with Eller and Chuckie.

If you want to call that "stopped producing", feel free to. It is not even close to accurate though.

Therrien ****ed up big time by demoting his top goal scorer Ryder down to the 3rd line. Ryder eventually lost interest in playing for the Habs, including in the playoffs. Good luck elsewhere Michael Ryder.
simple math really

Player who "loses interest" = Player that lacks "character" = Player not on a Bergevin team

Ryder.... Not a loss ... Give me a player who can score 20 goals to Ryder's 30 but will actually hit Karlesson instead of doing a fly bye because he doesn't listen to the game plan and doesn't like the physical aspect of the game.

Good Riddance!

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05-31-2013, 12:05 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Richiebottles View Post
Hard to replace his production however, I hope we make a play for Clarkson.
Agree... my hope

In... Clarkson,Clowe, Stalburg
out... White, Moen, Armstrong

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05-31-2013, 12:07 AM
  #100
SouthernHab
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Originally Posted by nyhabsfan View Post
simple math really

Player who "loses interest" = Player that lacks "character" = Player not on a Bergevin team

Ryder.... Not a loss ... Give me a player who can score 20 goals to Ryder's 30 but will actually hit Karlesson instead of doing a fly bye because he doesn't listen to the game plan and doesn't like the physical aspect of the game.

Good Riddance!
True.

But look at it for a moment and picture Therrien not mind ****ing Ryder and leaving him with Pleks and Gionta for the rest of the season and the playoffs and how his point production would have helped this team.

Ryder is who he is. Put in the right position, he will do nothing but score goals.

But as you said, on to the next team to score his 30+ goals.

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