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International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

Which of these teams are the best?

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Old
12-29-2003, 10:41 PM
  #1
Epsilon
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Which of these teams are the best?

TSN.ca has some nice WJC archive material, including this list of all the previous WJC all-star teams:

http://www.tsn.ca/World_jrs/feature.asp?fid=1324

Which teams do you guys think are the best ones? And by this I mean have the best players (NHL and/or international competitions), not necessarily put up the most dominating performances in the WJC tournament itself. An interesting note: two Ukrainian goalies have been 1st-team all-stars, and both had the name Igor Karpenko (the performance by the later of the two, in 1995, is one of my all-time favorites).

As far as the teams go, I would say the top 5 are (in chronological order):

1978 (two of the all-time greats, and some other talents)
1980 (great forwards and a top d-man)
1988 (same here)
1993 (5 good-to-great NHL players)
1996 (4 strong NHLers)


The 2003 team has a ton of potential. I also considered the 1979, 1989, and 1990 teams.

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Old
12-29-2003, 11:33 PM
  #2
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'88 : Numminen , Mogilny , Fedorov , Fleury
or
'93 : Forsberg , Kariya , Naslund , K.Jonsson

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12-30-2003, 07:21 AM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epsilon
TSN.ca has some nice WJC archive material, including this list of all the previous WJC all-star teams:

http://www.tsn.ca/World_jrs/feature.asp?fid=1324

Which teams do you guys think are the best ones? And by this I mean have the best players (NHL and/or international competitions), not necessarily put up the most dominating performances in the WJC tournament itself. An interesting note: two Ukrainian goalies have been 1st-team all-stars, and both had the name Igor Karpenko (the performance by the later of the two, in 1995, is one of my all-time favorites).

As far as the teams go, I would say the top 5 are (in chronological order):

1978 (two of the all-time greats, and some other talents)
1980 (great forwards and a top d-man)
1988 (same here)
1993 (5 good-to-great NHL players)
1996 (4 strong NHLers)


The 2003 team has a ton of potential. I also considered the 1979, 1989, and 1990 teams.
I agree with your list, except I would move 1979 up to replace 1996.

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Old
12-30-2003, 07:30 AM
  #4
KlausJopling
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Quote:
1994 Evgeni
Riabchikov
(RUS)
If only the Bruins paid attention to any of the 5 others in the 94 allstar team.

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Old
01-02-2004, 07:59 AM
  #5
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For what i know, Alexei Yashin was born on 5th November 1973. This TSN list reports he was on the all star team selected for 1989. I guess something is wrong here.. when the 1989 U20 WJC was played he was just 15! (this year WJC is listed as 2004, so 1989 means the tourney started in December 1988.)
I don‘t think he took part in that tournament at all! That said, the 1989 all star team can‘t be judged properly.
Also, Niklas Eriksson is listed as a USSR player, but that name sounds like Swedish much more than Russian.
With these examples it‘s difficult not to think that the Igor Karpenko ( otherwise really really curious! ) coincidence it is not just another error.

Anyway, i tried but found really difficult to do a credible list.
The only thing i‘m convinced of is that the 1978 team was definitely the best ( without knowing anything about the goaltender, anyway.. help? ).
Every other team seems to be strong in just one department, the 1993 and 1988 for example are great offensively but modest defensively.

Overall, this list confirms my feeling that the U20 WJCs are given too much credit to judge the prospects.
So many players succeded in this tourney without turning out to be good ones and so many stars left little signs. For whatever reasons it seems the U20 performances are all but a reliable indicator of a prospect value.
Some reasons:
_the main one_
- This tournament lasts just a few games which are played along a few days. Only 3 or 4 games end up to be important and true contests.. The physical shape of a player along such a short period can be a big factor.
_Others_
- The players are not used to play together.
- nations prepare the tourney differently giving it more or less importance and space.
- ?
- ?

Just a curiosity to end.
I didn‘t find Mario Lemieux on any all star teams. Didn‘t he take part in the tournament before turning 18? Which were his impact and numbers?

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Old
01-02-2004, 09:51 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by helicecopter
For what i know, Alexei Yashin was born on 5th November 1973. This TSN list reports he was on the all star team selected for 1989. I guess something is wrong here.. when the 1989 U20 WJC was played he was just 15! (this year WJC is listed as 2004, so 1989 means the tourney started in December 1988.)
I don‘t think he took part in that tournament at all! That said, the 1989 all star team can‘t be judged properly.
Also, Niklas Eriksson is listed as a USSR player, but that name sounds like Swedish much more than Russian.
With these examples it‘s difficult not to think that the Igor Karpenko ( otherwise really really curious! ) coincidence it is not just another error.

Anyway, i tried but found really difficult to do a credible list.
The only thing i‘m convinced of is that the 1978 team was definitely the best ( without knowing anything about the goaltender, anyway.. help? ).
Every other team seems to be strong in just one department, the 1993 and 1988 for example are great offensively but modest defensively.

Overall, this list confirms my feeling that the U20 WJCs are given too much credit to judge the prospects.
So many players succeded in this tourney without turning out to be good ones and so many stars left little signs. For whatever reasons it seems the U20 performances are all but a reliable indicator of a prospect value.
Some reasons:
_the main one_
- This tournament lasts just a few games which are played along a few days. Only 3 or 4 games end up to be important and true contests.. The physical shape of a player along such a short period can be a big factor.
_Others_
- The players are not used to play together.
- nations prepare the tourney differently giving it more or less importance and space.
- ?
- ?

Just a curiosity to end.
I didn‘t find Mario Lemieux on any all star teams. Didn‘t he take part in the tournament before turning 18? Which were his impact and numbers?
You're right, that 1989 team is wrong. Hockey Canada has the teams on their website, and the real team was
Goaltender Aleksey Ivashkin (USSR)
Defensemen Ricard Persson (SWE) Milav Tichu (TCH)
Forwards Pavel Bure (USSR) Jeremy Roenick (USA) Niklas Eriksson (USSR)

As for Lemieux, he played for the 1983 squad and put up 5-5-10 in 7 games, which was 6th in tournament scoring and second for Team Canada behind Dave Andreychuk. He opted not to play in 1984 because of some problem he had with the coaching I believe.

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Old
01-02-2004, 10:13 AM
  #7
Vincent Vega
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The 2003 team could be awesome...

Upshall, Grigorenko, Pitkanen, Colaiacovo and Fleury.

Right now I'll say 1993 - Legace, Jonsson, Forsberg, Kariya, Naslund

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Old
01-02-2004, 12:39 PM
  #8
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Talk about a sloppy job. A lot of player's names were spelled incorrectly (except Canadians, of course) and nationalities were also a hit miss. Never heard of this Patrick Sundstrum (1981) here in Finland or Art Lahteenmanki (=Ari Lähteenmäki, assistant coach in Wickenheiser's former team in Finland). Someone should reprimand the person responsible for that effort.

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Old
01-05-2004, 02:05 AM
  #9
helicecopter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doomsday Device
You're right, that 1989 team is wrong. Hockey Canada has the teams on their website, and the real team was
Goaltender Aleksey Ivashkin (USSR)
Defensemen Ricard Persson (SWE) Milav Tichu (TCH)
Forwards Pavel Bure (USSR) Jeremy Roenick (USA) Niklas Eriksson (USSR)

As for Lemieux, he played for the 1983 squad and put up 5-5-10 in 7 games, which was 6th in tournament scoring and second for Team Canada behind Dave Andreychuk. He opted not to play in 1984 because of some problem he had with the coaching I believe.
Thanks for the info.
So, 10 points in 7 games for Mario as a 17yrs old.
For what it matters, was Niklas Eriksson really a Russian??

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Old
01-05-2004, 10:14 AM
  #10
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This year team :

Goalie : Montoya (USA)

D-mens : Phaneuf (CAN)
Lepisto ( FIN )

Fowards :
Carter (CAN )
Parise ( USA )
Filppula ( FIN )

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