HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Buffalo Sabres
Notices

Where can Miller go?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-05-2013, 10:44 AM
  #326
stokes84
Registered User
 
stokes84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Charleston, SC
Country: United States
Posts: 6,568
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to stokes84
The Pens are really interesting with the cap going down and Letang and Malkin upcoming UFAs.

stokes84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 10:53 AM
  #327
Rob Paxon
Z E M G U S
 
Rob Paxon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: corfu, ny
Country: United States
Posts: 16,578
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Rob Paxon
Quote:
Originally Posted by NHLeitner View Post
Short answer: No. Long answer: Noooooooooooooooooo

Neither Lecavalier nor the #3 pick are going anywhere this year. Tampa is looking at this draft with an eye towards Marty's inevitable retirement.

Also, from your end, are you sure Darcy would want to trade Miller to a team that will be in your division next season?
Personally, I don't think he Darcy should care if a divisional team offers clearly the best package. Who is to say Miller has any interest resigning in Tampa Bay, for example (not a slight against TB, just that his wife lives in California and I'd think he'd want to go somewhere out there as a UFA). If that's the case, then renting him out to a divisional rival would be the best case scenario as we'd take away future assets from them while not being affected as a non-playoff team next season.

Rob Paxon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 11:33 AM
  #328
barnell
butter knife hockey
 
barnell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 1,038
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
The Pens are really interesting with the cap going down and Letang and Malkin upcoming UFAs.
If only trading Miller could net us one of them.

barnell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 12:59 PM
  #329
Rowley Birkin
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Country: England
Posts: 3,117
vCash: 500
AsI commented before, I think Pittsburgh is the only realistic destination for Miller (with NYI as an outsider, but the teams do not make good trade partners).

MAF + Maatta + 2014 1st

for

Miller (salary retained to make it work) + a sweetener ?

Rowley Birkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 01:53 PM
  #330
Sabretip
Registered User
 
Sabretip's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Country: United States
Posts: 7,925
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannonball0828 View Post
Pittsburgh gets:

Ryan Miller
2nd round pick

Buffalo gets:
MAF
Olli Maata
4th round pick
I don't see how any scenario that swaps Miller for Fleury can be viewed as an upgrade for Buffalo, regardless of the Cup win on Fleury's resume.

I also suspect the reactions to Fleury's playoff this season are more of a concern to the media and fans than they are to Shero and Bylsma.

Sabretip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 01:54 PM
  #331
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 15,612
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowley Birkin View Post
AsI commented before, I think Pittsburgh is the only realistic destination for Miller (with NYI as an outsider, but the teams do not make good trade partners).

MAF + Maatta + 2014 1st

for

Miller (salary retained to make it work) + a sweetener ?
And then flip MAF to the Avs for a '14 1st rounder.....


WhoIsJimBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 01:56 PM
  #332
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 15,612
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabretip View Post
I don't see how any scenario that swaps Miller for Fleury can be viewed as an upgrade for Buffalo, regardless of the Cup win on Fleury's resume.

I also suspect the reactions to Fleury's playoff this season are more of a concern to the media and fans than they are to Shero and Bylsma.
It's an upgrade in that MAF is under contract for one more season and his cap hit is lower.

It will be interesting to see how this whole situation plays out.

WhoIsJimBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 02:13 PM
  #333
Rowley Birkin
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Country: England
Posts: 3,117
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
And then flip MAF to the Avs for a '14 1st rounder.....

Pittsburgh would be swapping a goalie who has flat out failed for one of the best in the league, while getting more cap space, right within their 'window'. They could probably resign him to a nice deal as well.

Why wouldn't the Sabres expect them to over pay ? I am someone who doesn't think Miller has much value at all league-wide...

I should have worded my point above that when I say realistic destination, I am taking into accont who the Sabres would want to sell to.

I don't think its unrealistic to ask for a very good (but not elite) young player plus a late (likely 25-30) first, especially when we are helping them out with salary, and taking MAF in return.

Just to note - I did say that the Sabres would send something in return... perhaps dependant on Miller resigning ?

Rowley Birkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 02:27 PM
  #334
drinking bleach irl
p trendy tbh
 
drinking bleach irl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Virginia
Country: Ras al-Khaimah
Posts: 10,928
vCash: 300
Myers, Grigorenko #16 for Malkin do it :v

drinking bleach irl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 02:59 PM
  #335
sonnEbunny
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 138
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
Myers, Grigorenko #16 for Malkin do it :v
We have people offering Myers, Grigorenko, both of our first rounders, plus other good assets for the first overall pick and that is all for an unknown NHL future. You know you get an in Malkin, an elite MVP caliber player, I would laugh at buffalo and hang up the phone if that is what they offered me.

sonnEbunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 03:05 PM
  #336
drinking bleach irl
p trendy tbh
 
drinking bleach irl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Virginia
Country: Ras al-Khaimah
Posts: 10,928
vCash: 300
What you get is one year before free agency.


One year of Malkin is worth less than seven years of Mackinnon.

drinking bleach irl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 03:05 PM
  #337
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 15,612
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowley Birkin View Post
Pittsburgh would be swapping a goalie who has flat out failed for one of the best in the league, while getting more cap space, right within their 'window'. They could probably resign him to a nice deal as well.

Why wouldn't the Sabres expect them to over pay ? I am someone who doesn't think Miller has much value at all league-wide...

I should have worded my point above that when I say realistic destination, I am taking into accont who the Sabres would want to sell to.

I don't think its unrealistic to ask for a very good (but not elite) young player plus a late (likely 25-30) first, especially when we are helping them out with salary, and taking MAF in return.

Just to note - I did say that the Sabres would send something in return... perhaps dependant on Miller resigning ?
I think calling Miller one of the best in the league is a stretch.

To me, he's been an above-average goalie for much of his career and had one elite season.

But, that's better than MAF's career to date.

I think the key to what the Sabres could get in a deal that centered around Miller for MAF would be how much of Miller's salary the Sabres would eat.

WhoIsJimBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 03:07 PM
  #338
drinking bleach irl
p trendy tbh
 
drinking bleach irl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Virginia
Country: Ras al-Khaimah
Posts: 10,928
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
I think calling Miller one of the best in the league is a stretch.

To me, he's been an above-average goalie for much of his career and had one elite season.
It's the fact that he's consistently been above-average or better for much of his career that makes him one of the best, dig?

drinking bleach irl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 03:11 PM
  #339
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 15,612
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
It's the fact that he's consistently been above-average or better for much of his career that makes him one of the best, dig?
To me, there is a difference between consistently above average and one of the best.

I would put Miller a cut below guys like Lundqvist & Brodeur for example.

WhoIsJimBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 03:17 PM
  #340
Rowley Birkin
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Country: England
Posts: 3,117
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
I think calling Miller one of the best in the league is a stretch.

To me, he's been an above-average goalie for much of his career and had one elite season.

But, that's better than MAF's career to date.

I think the key to what the Sabres could get in a deal that centered around Miller for MAF would be how much of Miller's salary the Sabres would eat.
He is not THE best (Lundqvist?) but you couldn't argue that he has been probably top5 for the past 5 years or more - and while MAF has a cup he is inferior in pretty much every aspect.

The bolded part I totally agree with... which is why in my proposal I said the Sabres would eat as much as possible (half?).

I don't think its an unrealistic proposal. And I wouldn't propose such a deal with any other team.

Rowley Birkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 03:19 PM
  #341
sonnEbunny
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 138
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
What you get is one year before free agency.


One year of Malkin is worth less than seven years of Mackinnon.
If your plan is to keep him for one contract year then there is no way I would make that trade. Buffalo and likely no other team will trade for an elite player like Malkin without a contract extension so either way that trade will not happen. Also Pittsburgh is not rebuilding they are trying to win championships trading Malkin does not help them do that in the short term.

sonnEbunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 03:33 PM
  #342
New Sabres Captain
ForFriendshipDikembe
 
New Sabres Captain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 38,030
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
Personally, I don't think he Darcy should care if a divisional team offers clearly the best package. Who is to say Miller has any interest resigning in Tampa Bay, for example (not a slight against TB, just that his wife lives in California and I'd think he'd want to go somewhere out there as a UFA). If that's the case, then renting him out to a divisional rival would be the best case scenario as we'd take away future assets from them while not being affected as a non-playoff team next season.
Not to mention if Miller wanted he could sign with any team in the division next year anyways, regardless of where he is traded.

New Sabres Captain is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 03:38 PM
  #343
Zip15
Registered User
 
Zip15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 17,030
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
To me, there is a difference between consistently above average and one of the best.

I would put Miller a cut below guys like Lundqvist & Brodeur for example.
Brodeur was great in the playoffs, and vastly overrated otherwise. Two seasons above .917 in the last 15 years, and three in his entire career.

Zip15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 04:01 PM
  #344
WhoIsJimBob
Circle the Bandwagon
 
WhoIsJimBob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Rochester, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 15,612
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowley Birkin View Post
He is not THE best (Lundqvist?) but you couldn't argue that he has been probably top5 for the past 5 years or more - and while MAF has a cup he is inferior in pretty much every aspect.

The bolded part I totally agree with... which is why in my proposal I said the Sabres would eat as much as possible (half?).

I don't think its an unrealistic proposal. And I wouldn't propose such a deal with any other team.
I think you can get 5 goalies that had better seasons every year outside of his Vezina season over the past 5 years when he's been consistently outside of the top 10 in Save%.

WhoIsJimBob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 04:11 PM
  #345
tsujimoto74
Registered User
 
tsujimoto74's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Virginia
Country: United States
Posts: 8,694
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonnEbunny View Post
If your plan is to keep him for one contract year then there is no way I would make that trade. Buffalo and likely no other team will trade for an elite player like Malkin without a contract extension so either way that trade will not happen. Also Pittsburgh is not rebuilding they are trying to win championships trading Malkin does not help them do that in the short term.
Well, obviously not, but there is plenty of reason to speculate with both he and Letang needing new contracts before 14-15. They only have 5 current roster players signed through or beyond 14-15 (Crosby, Fleury, Neal, Bennet, and Martin) for a total of $24.6m against the cap. If we assume Malkin takes the same deal as Crosby (8.7) and Letang gets similar money to Karlsson (6.5), they're only left $24.5m to fill roughly 2/3 of their roster with. It'll be an interesting situation to watch.

tsujimoto74 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 04:15 PM
  #346
New Sabres Captain
ForFriendshipDikembe
 
New Sabres Captain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 38,030
vCash: 500
Pittsburgh will gut their depth before giving away one of their elite guys. Guys like Kunitz will be let go way before they think of giving away Malkin or Letang.

New Sabres Captain is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 04:23 PM
  #347
sonnEbunny
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 138
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
I think you can get 5 goalies that had better seasons every year outside of his Vezina season over the past 5 years when he's been consistently outside of the top 10 in Save%.
I'm just curious when you judge a goalie, do you just look at the S% and other stats? People have no idea how spoiled we are with Miller, he is absolutely one of the top goalies year in and year out. That is based on skill: positioning, ability to read a play, reactions and so on. Your numbers don't tell the full story of you as a player and that is especially true with goaltenders. Put Ryan Miller with the penguins for the last 5 years I guarantee you would all be drooling over him. If you're basing your arguments on s% you are also trying to argue that Chris Kunitz is one of the best forwards in the NHL...please.

sonnEbunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 04:24 PM
  #348
haseoke39
Brainfart 4 Reinhart
 
haseoke39's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,680
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegomyLeggio View Post
I think you can get 5 goalies that had better seasons every year outside of his Vezina season over the past 5 years when he's been consistently outside of the top 10 in Save%.
Looking backwards doesn't help much. Looking backwards would lead a team to rank Brodeur and Thomas ahead of Miller, when in reality both of those guys might not even be in the league next year.

Looking prospectively, I rank goalie value like this:

Quick
Lundqvist
Rask
Bobrovsky
Howard
Bernier
Rinne
Holtby
Maybe Miller here

One season as the best in the world four years ago doesn't cement his status as anything. The only reason he's ranked this highly, in fact, is because I think he's played in front of a porous defence for a while. Others might rank him lower, but it's only a true homer who thinks he has one of the top 5 trade values for a goalie in the league.

haseoke39 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 04:29 PM
  #349
sonnEbunny
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 138
vCash: 500
I definitely agree that it's an interesting situation and I think it would be a lot more interesting if they won the cup this year. I just think if they lose this year they will come back and give it at least one more go at it. Teams this talented do not come around very often. Just think if Buffalo moved Briere a year before his contract was up. To be honest that is probably less drastic than them moving Malkin. For the future I would definitely argue that it would be better for them to trade him and get a kings ransom in return but I think from their prospective it would be greatly reducing their chances at a cup which is something I don't think they will want to do.

sonnEbunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-05-2013, 04:37 PM
  #350
dotcommunism
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,327
vCash: 500
Ranking Bobrovsky as the fourth best goalie based on about a half season of being good seems rather premature

dotcommunism is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:30 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.