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20 years ago/7305 days of failure/ We suck/ blah blah thread

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Old
06-09-2013, 12:54 AM
  #26
S Bah
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deandebean View Post
Young folks talk about the 50's and 60's as if it was too easy. Then why are the Habs the only team to have won it that often?
Our team was built from " Working Class Heroes " that's why. and the team was the 50', 60's and 70's.

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Old
06-09-2013, 01:17 AM
  #27
Et le But
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...Cup_droughts_2

We are like everyone else, not a special, unique snowflake. Welcome to the modern NHL.

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Originally Posted by S Bah View Post
Our team was built from " Working Class Heroes " that's why. and the team was the 50', 60's and 70's.
It's funny how every team claims this, and every good team was built on a mix of hard work, grit, skill and tactics. You need that blue collar element, but hard work doesn't make up for a lack of talent. The dynasties were ahead of the curve in both talent and work ethic. I heard people blame the Habs failings over the past decades on having European players just because the last cup team didn't have any. Move forward, not backward. We need innovation, not nostalgia or imitation.

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06-09-2013, 01:32 AM
  #28
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Its been 20 years of mediocrity. Not good enough to contend, and not bad enough to miss the playoffs on a regular basis.

The team just now can say that they have a legitimate superstar, something they haven't had since Patrick Roy left town in 1995.

The team has a decent base right now, complimented by a competent prospect pipeline, but I just don't see a Stanley cup in the near future. However, just like the rest of the habs fans across this country, I will always hope that I'm wrong.

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06-09-2013, 01:38 AM
  #29
Hackett
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...Cup_droughts_2

We are like everyone else, not a special, unique snowflake. Welcome to the modern NHL.



It's funny how every team claims this, and every good team was built on a mix of hard work, grit, skill and tactics. You need that blue collar element, but hard work doesn't make up for a lack of talent. The dynasties were ahead of the curve in both talent and work ethic. I heard people blame the Habs failings over the past decades on having European players just because the last cup team didn't have any. Move forward, not backward. We need innovation, not nostalgia or imitation.
That's ridiculous if true. One of the reasons that the wings went through 20 years of perennial stanley cup contention is because they were more proactive in bringing former soviet players to the NHL. In comparison, the habs were the ones lacking vision by not tapping into that talent pool.

The Wizards of Ov were instrumental in turning the wings around.

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06-09-2013, 02:42 AM
  #30
Et le But
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Originally Posted by Hackett View Post
That's ridiculous if true. One of the reasons that the wings went through 20 years of perennial stanley cup contention is because they were more proactive in bringing former soviet players to the NHL. In comparison, the habs were the ones lacking vision by not tapping into that talent pool.

The Wizards of Ov were instrumental in turning the wings around.
Exactly, the Wings took plenty of inspiration in their tactics from the 70's Habs, but innovated on top of that, pioneering European scouting and adding elements from Russian hockey. Yes, there's things every good team has, but you need to do your own thing on top of them

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06-09-2013, 03:44 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
Exactly, the Wings took plenty of inspiration in their tactics from the 70's Habs, but innovated on top of that, pioneering European scouting and adding elements from Russian hockey. Yes, there's things every good team has, but you need to do your own thing on top of them
I remember Scotty Bowman (greatest Habs coach in history for those who don't know) loved to send his 5 soviet unit with the DRW.

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Old
06-09-2013, 10:16 AM
  #32
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Failure?! really?! Are you a millionaire yet? Did you walk on the moon?! What a failure your life must be...

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06-09-2013, 10:38 AM
  #33
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20 Years...holy cow!
The longest time between cups before than was 7.

personally, I had just graduated college with an Engineering degree and was at home that night with friends. We celebrated by going out to a night club after HNIC went off the air.

Twenty years, most of it were years of frustration

- Ronald Corey hired as team president who hired Houle and Trembly
- Trade of Patrick Roy
- Trade of John LeClair for Recchi; then watching both of them kill us for years
- 14.7 seconds left when Richards tied the game and the Lightening went on to the cup
- In control of the Hurricanes until Williams high sticked Koivu; lost our captain and the series
- most of the 80s when we sent guys like Yuha Lind over the boards; woeful lack of talent
- The Gomez deal
- many more

Am I optimistic about the future.. Well 50-50;
-Good ownership
-Bergevin has put together a solid knowledgeable team but Moen,DD, Boulion extensions have me a little skeptical.
- The cupboard is being stocked with quality prospects.

To me this draft is a watershed moment; does THIS management group really recognize that our size and team toughness needs tobe addressed and will they go after a Mantha type player(s) with all those picks this year.

As much as I hate the Bruins, they are a team with a great mix of skill, size, toughness and execute it well.

Twenty years...I would have partied a little harder if I had known!.

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06-09-2013, 10:53 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Born in 1909 View Post
Chill out.

- Carey Price
Good one!!

I remember Ken Dryden, and 6 Cups in 8 yrs...we were spoiled as kids growing up with the Habs winning...then 1 Cup in the 80's and 1 Cup in the 90's.... the past 20 yrs has been tough at times, but challenging, more than failures...keep the faith!!

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Old
06-09-2013, 11:42 AM
  #35
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I unfortunately haven't seen a cup win ever.

Life long hab fan but only started really following in 2007 or so, and even then followed even more closely when I got RDS for 2010-11. Now I watch as much as I can.


My favourite moment by default has to be one of the 4:

The trip to the conference final
Centennial Game
First Game at the Bell Centre
or My second game, when I got tickets for free

My least favourite
Not really sure, guess getting swept by Boston, or the Pacioretty chara incident, and letting go of Koivu

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Old
06-09-2013, 11:48 AM
  #36
Whitesnake
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Scary when you think that the kids that are from now on drafted, weren't born when the Habs won their last Cup. Scary that the same kids CANNOT have the Habs as their favorite team as we sucked for so long. Sad that we are almost at the point that even their father might not have a whole lot of live stories to tell them about how great this team once was.

Time to change it.

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Old
06-09-2013, 11:53 AM
  #37
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Sure, for a Habs fan, it's really disappointing to have a team who can't compete regularly with the best for so many years.

Althou, we had some pretty bad management (Houle-Gainey) which takes many years to recover from, Montreal will always go to the bat with a few strikes against:

- Unlike Detroit and the other big cities, we hardly can bring any elite UFA thanks to medias, income taxes and the fans themselves....The big stars have choices and montreal his rarely one of them.

-So, unlike big cities, we have to rely mostly on the draft and trades to improve the team, wich means it is more imperative here to make judicious trades and let Timmins operates his magic with prospects.

Some help from the government would help if they were willing to make something about the absurd tax differential between Quebec and everywhere else....

Just think about the famous Salary Cap...it should be 10% higher in Montreal to be equally competitive....

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Old
06-09-2013, 12:02 PM
  #38
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The draft is the key to all.....it's unfortunate we cannot do a proper tank so to speak...look at the Hawks/Pens and how bad they were for a couple of seasons, they then drafted well, and away they went...

MB knows the draft is the key...it's a process, and the fans have to be semi patient...

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Old
06-09-2013, 01:20 PM
  #39
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Boohoo! Some of you ate sounding like grumpy old men sitting on the porch, reminiscing about 'the good old days'

understanding and accepting that this is a new league, with parity is not 'being ok with mediocrity'. It's being a realist.

In this new nhl, you build championship through the draft. No other way. GMMB knows this, its gonna take a while. Years.

Yet, the same people that are complaining about our club's mediocre past are the first to pop up trade threads, trading away picks and prospects for midling and MEDIOCRE players that could led immidiate help.

So English double-fingered salute. Suck it up, it's a brave new world *****es

ninja-edit: **** typing on iPhone

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Old
06-09-2013, 01:31 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CPrice 31 View Post
Why would they be jeered '93'? They're still the last Canadian team to win it and the talent is there for the near future to see a Cup contending Habs team. We're not a laughing stock. I can't tell if this is a serious thread.

We're closer to the next Cup than the 93 one. Give it 10 years. Let Price, Subban and Galchenyuk enter their primes.


The Canadiens fanbase is evolving. I remember it used to always be "wait two or three years and we will be competing for the Cup"

Now its up to ten.

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Old
06-09-2013, 04:24 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by JMMR View Post
Well Habs fans as of sometime tomorrow night it will have been 20 years since the Canadiens won the Stanley Cup.

240 months
over 1040 weeks
over 175,000 hours

and in hockey terms (regular season + playoffs) 1596 games played
Wins: 724
Losses: 657
Ties: 114
OTLosses: 58
SOLosses: 43
Goals for Montreal: 4417
Goals against Montreal: 4477

Some questions for everyone.
Are the Habs closer to the 93 cup or their next cup?
What was your favoutire and least favourite moment of the last 20 years?

Are the Habs now a laughing stock?
Will teams start to jeer the Canadiens with chants of NINTEY THREE?
You can't name any of the 6 other Canadian teams that has won the Cup since 1993, so their fans don't have grounds for taunting. Of course, the same could be said for American cities that have never had a Stanley Cup parade, such as Buffalo and St. Louis (in the NHL since 1970 and 1967, respectively). Nor can New Yorkers afford to boast (1994, just 1 year after the Habs' last).

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06-09-2013, 04:32 PM
  #42
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Habs are going no where with the speed and skill mentality

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06-09-2013, 04:46 PM
  #43
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It was 20 years ago today
The Habs won a cup on my birthday
They've been going in and out of style
But they're guaranteed to raise a smile.

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06-09-2013, 04:48 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by niftymove View Post
Sure, for a Habs fan, it's really disappointing to have a team who can't compete regularly with the best for so many years.

Althou, we had some pretty bad management (Houle-Gainey) which takes many years to recover from, Montreal will always go to the bat with a few strikes against:

- Unlike Detroit and the other big cities, we hardly can bring any elite UFA thanks to medias, income taxes and the fans themselves....The big stars have choices and montreal his rarely one of them.

-So, unlike big cities, we have to rely mostly on the draft and trades to improve the team, wich means it is more imperative here to make judicious trades and let Timmins operates his magic with prospects.

Some help from the government would help if they were willing to make something about the absurd tax differential between Quebec and everywhere else....

Just think about the famous Salary Cap...it should be 10% higher in Montreal to be equally competitive....
The tax differential between Quebec and everywhere else isn't absurd. A guy making $7 million will only pay about $250,000 more in taxes than a guy in New York and I don't see the Rangers struggling to sign free agents. That's not counting the greater endorsement/personal appearance/autograph signing opportunities in Montreal compared to US cities that frankly like other sports more. Even an anglo who can read French off a cue card like Gary Carter can rake in the money.

It's also worth remembering that it's been like this for a long time, and the Canadiens did not have trouble attracting people to play for them in the 80s.

I'm not saying it doesn't matter, but it doesn't matter as much as being good. The biggest problem is and always will be that the Canadiens are on average a 90-point team in the last 20 years. Guys will sign for NY, Boston, Vancouver, LA or other teams that in high-tax areas because they think they can win there. People don't feel like that about Montreal.

Edit: I've just remembered that US income taxes rose in 2013, so the gap between Montreal and the US franchises has certainly shrunk.


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Old
06-09-2013, 05:18 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by theboss View Post
Habs are going no where with the speed and skill mentality
hawks seems to be doing fine with that mentality

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Old
06-09-2013, 05:40 PM
  #46
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hawks seems to be doing fine with that mentality
That mentality is upgraded with a top 6 more talented and even bigger and stronger. And when you have a smaller guy like Kane...you are not talking just about a "skilled" guy. With a bottom bigger and stronger. With a top 2 in the back end pretty big, incredibly talented and strong.

We're not talking about skills as far as the Hawks are concerned. That is SUPER skills. And tougher. And bigger. And grittier. Speed and skills aren't exactly the only thing here for them.

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06-09-2013, 06:21 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Scary when you think that the kids that are from now on drafted, weren't born when the Habs won their last Cup. Scary that the same kids CANNOT have the Habs as their favorite team as we sucked for so long. Sad that we are almost at the point that even their father might not have a whole lot of live stories to tell them about how great this team once was.

Time to change it.
Lol what a load of BS. Then how do the Leafs still have fans?

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Old
06-09-2013, 06:27 PM
  #48
Whitesnake
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Lol what a load of BS. Then how do the Leafs still have fans?
You do know that I'm talking about DRAFTED kids here. That not that long ago, when you asked a QMJHL kid who was their favorite team, that most if not all would answer the Habs. Now, you'll still have the guy who will say Hab from time to time, though will pretty much add "Well I am from here so it would be great to play for my hometown...BUT I also like the Wings and so on...". As far as Leafs are concerned, well I would also think that most Ontarian drafted kids do not have the Leafs as their favorite team. Probably a little more as there are more kids drafted from the OHL than the Q. But you would ALSO have Swedish, Finnish or even Americans who not that long ago would have Habs as one of their favorite teams for all sorts of reasons. Pretty sure that this will also be reduced by quite a lot, just like for the Leafs for quite some time now....

So favorite team has not being obligated to take for that team 'cause you actually come from Montreal but because you like how that team plays and you model your game over a star player. So yeah....I would think that neither the Habs nor the Leafs have the greatest fanbase amongst the drafted players.


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06-09-2013, 06:36 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
You do know that I'm talking about DRAFTED kids here. That not that long ago, when you asked a QMJHL kid who was their favorite team, that most if not all would answer the Habs. Now, you'll still have the guy who will say Hab from time to time, though will pretty much add "Well I am from here so it would be great to play for my hometown...BUT I also like the Wings and so on...". As far as Leafs are concerned, well I would also think that most Ontarian drafted kids do not have the Leafs as their favorite team. Probably a little more as there are more kids drafted from the OHL than the Q.

But you would ALSO have Swedish, Finnish or even Americans who not that long ago would have Habs as one of their favorite teams for all sorts of reasons. Pretty sure that this will also be reduced by quite a lot, just like for the Leafs for quite some time now....
And drafted kids somehow have different preferences than normal kids? Lots of people still like the Habs, we sellout every game for a reason. The Leafs also have a ton of fans. With no way to measure it you're just making stuff up to suit your pessimism.

Besides, favourite teams don't matter at all. It's that delusion that makes Leafs fans think they're going to sign every big name FA just because they cheered for them when they were younger.

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06-09-2013, 06:41 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
You do know that I'm talking about DRAFTED kids here. That not that long ago, when you asked a QMJHL kid who was their favorite team, that most if not all would answer the Habs. Now, you'll still have the guy who will say Hab from time to time, though will pretty much add "Well I am from here so it would be great to play for my hometown...BUT I also like the Wings and so on...". As far as Leafs are concerned, well I would also think that most Ontarian drafted kids do not have the Leafs as their favorite team. Probably a little more as there are more kids drafted from the OHL than the Q. But you would ALSO have Swedish, Finnish or even Americans who not that long ago would have Habs as one of their favorite teams for all sorts of reasons. Pretty sure that this will also be reduced by quite a lot, just like for the Leafs for quite some time now....

So favorite team has not being obligated to take for that team 'cause you actually come from Montreal but because you like how that team plays and you model your game over a star player. So yeah....I would think that neither the Habs nor the Leafs have the greatest fanbase amongst the drafted players.
Kids must be different where you come from, because most kids where I am still have the Habs as their fave.

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