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Old
10-11-2006, 06:00 PM
  #26
suffocator
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Originally Posted by Evil Ted View Post
Well I think that for Lats developements sake hes going to need more then 10 min of icetime a game, and he is not getting that in Montreal, and I cant see him getting promoted anytime either, our lineup is set pretty much minus injuries, it would be a good idea to send him back where he can get some quality icetime.

All you guys who dont think he wont get sent down could be in for a surprise.

Remember Joe Thornton???

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:01 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Some points to consider:

1. What you and others in this thread see of Latendresse now is not what Latendresse is actually capable of playing like right now. He's unaccustomed to the pace of the game. It will take several games for him to adapt to the pace of the game.

2. While Latendresse's skating is not a strength of his, the issue Latendresse is having right now is anticipation--not speed. He's not anticipating the play well, and his reaction-time is poor. That's why he looks slow; not because of his skating speed.

3. Latendresse's learning curve from NHL practices alone will be far, far greater than anything he would learn in juniors.

4. The QMJHL is an awful place for a big-bodied skill player to develop. He will not need to use his physicality at all to score, and he'll develop bad, lazy habits, taking short-cuts offensively.

5. It's very likely that Latendresse will progress at a very rapid rate once he's become accustomed to the NHL pace. At that time, it's also very likely that Montreal will run into injury problems. Latendresse will see better quality ice time as the season progresses.


For these five reasons, Latendresse is better suited in the NHL, and will progress better at the NHL level.

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:03 PM
  #28
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Those saying "He's not getting enough icetime to learn anything" seem to be forgetting that even just practicing with actual NHL players is already a huge step above what he's used to do in the juniors.

The fourth line will be a good place for him to work on his defensive play and adjust his reflexes to the speed of the game. Lats just has to hang in there and appreciate the learning curve the coaches are giving him. It should improve all facets of his game over time and he'll get more icetime when he's ready for it.

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:04 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Evil Ted View Post
Well I think that for Lats developements sake hes going to need more then 10 min of icetime a game, and he is not getting that in Montreal, and I cant see him getting promoted anytime either, our lineup is set pretty much minus injuries, it would be a good idea to send him back where he can get some quality icetime.

All you guys who dont think he wont get sent down could be in for a surprise.
I don't think he can get quality icetime in junior. Playing against kids isn't going to do him any good at this point. He needs to adjust to a speedier game, and he needs to work on his defensive awareness, both of which he can do on the Habs 4th line.

And he's definitely not ready to get more than 10min a game. But give him half a season on the 4th, and he might be. Ryder and Higgins both started out playing sparingly on the 4th line, and they turned out fine.

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:07 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by waffledave View Post
We can't exactly put him on the top 2 lines...There's no space and so far he's looked terrible...He's really quite slow, he would bring down the speed of the scoring lines. Keep him on the energy line until he can match the speed of NHL forwards.
I think Waffle Dave hits the one on the head.....mmmmm waffles.

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:08 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by C-Saku Koivu MTL View Post
Joe Thornton, Vincent Lecavalier and many more went trough the same thing. He has to get used to the speed and get into a confidence on the ice. The Habs are doing the exact thing they should do. Trust the management and enjoy the ride.
Maybe one of the best comment!!!!

A player like Lats need some time to ajust to the fast game in the NHL......it's no in the juniors he will learn that.....

Quote:
I think we should send him back. In all seriousness, he's not NHL ready yet. Why, he didn't even get a regular shift on the national junior team last year. What makes you think he deserves a regular shift on an NHL team nine months later?
Since when the WJC is a factor for make the NHL or not!!! Bergeron, Bernier, Vlasic, Picard and maybe other example show that sometimes junior players can make a huge difference in the NHL and not be selected by Team Canada....!!!!

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:23 PM
  #32
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I didn't mean to say that he IS slow, just that he's looked very slow so far. I'm sure he CAN skate faster, he just hasn't done so yet.

His mean weakness is his skating. This has always been the case. It's not far-fetched for me to say that it's a problem right now.

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:23 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by suffocator View Post
Remember Joe Thornton???
good point

Thornton, 1997-98: 55GP, 3G, 4A

4th line, regularly healthy scratched...

he was 18 though

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:27 PM
  #34
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Playing on the 4th line will teach him how to play WITHOUT THE PUCK !
You need to be able to play in the defensive zone & neutral zone at the NHL level.

One of the goals against in the last 2 games was due to his bad defensive mistake : he was watching the puck battle behind the net instead of focusing on his assignment ( take the open man out of the play). The puck was suddenly in front of the net & the open man scored the goal. Too late to react.

I think you let the kid develop. Higgins & Ryder started out on the 4th line. Was their development hurt by this ? NO !! They worked their way up by battling in the trenches, learning from the coaches & players and seizing their opportunities.

SIDENOTE :
It's crazy to see that Lats is making almost double what Pleks is making.
Pleks makes about $450,000 and Lats makes $850,000...
Saw this on TSN's site :
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/feature/?fid=2710&hubname= .

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:36 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuebeCaniac View Post
good point

Thornton, 1997-98: 55GP, 3G, 4A

4th line, regularly healthy scratched...

he was 18 though
He was also drafted first overall...

Quote:
Originally Posted by guapo23 View Post
Playing on the 4th line will teach him how to play WITHOUT THE PUCK !
You need to be able to play in the defensive zone & neutral zone at the NHL level.

One of the goals against in the last 2 games was due to his bad defensive mistake : he was watching the puck battle behind the net instead of focusing on his assignment ( take the open man out of the play). The puck was suddenly in front of the net & the open man scored the goal. Too late to react.

I think you let the kid develop. Higgins & Ryder started out on the 4th line. Was their development hurt by this ? NO !! They worked their way up by battling in the trenches, learning from the coaches & players and seizing their opportunities.

SIDENOTE :
It's crazy to see that Lats is making almost double what Pleks is making.
Pleks makes about $450,000 and Lats makes $850,000...
Saw this on TSN's site :
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/feature/?fid=2710&hubname= .
Higgins and Ryder already had a few years of professional hockey experience. It was less of a jump for them. For Lats, the jump is massive. The most important thing is that his confidence isn't ruined.

You guys bring up examples of guys like Thornton and Lecavalier...Well Thornton took longer to develop than he should have, and he still is a playoff dud. Lecavalier is a terrible example, he has the potential to be one of the best players in the league but he always hovers around the 50-75 pt mark and he's horribly inconsistent. The weaknesses in their games are due to them being rushed and missing out on important stages in their development.

Fleury is another example...As talented as he is, I really don't know if he will ever pan out because the kid, who had confidence issues already, has been constantly shelled for 5 goals almost every night for the past few years.

Bad play ruins confidence for many young players. Coaching will only help that so much...The kid needs to be mentally tough and very few players have that quality.

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Old
10-11-2006, 06:37 PM
  #36
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He's in Montreal to stay and I think he's going to learn alot more from playing with guys like Begin then he would playing in the Q and dominating.

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Old
10-11-2006, 07:15 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Habsfan 32 View Post
He's in Montreal to stay and I think he's going to learn alot more from playing with guys like Begin then he would playing in the Q and dominating.
Dunno how Bégin will show Lats to score goals...

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Old
10-11-2006, 07:19 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by LeMAD View Post
Dunno how Bégin will show Lats to score goals...
There's more to hockey then goals.

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Old
10-11-2006, 07:22 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by geeman View Post
If we are going to play him on a 4th line and rot send him back down and bring up Kosty . After the 9th game do him a favour and give him ice time, then hopefully next year we play him with players can work with . Like I said before we are too scared to play a kid, mainly cups of coffee on 4th lines or a kid plays well in a few games and gets demoted later on . We didn`t have to spend 3 mil on Samsonov, when Lats and Kosty should of been on the top 3 lines from the start. We have plenty of vets to play these guys with . I don`t see how maybe 25 goals out of Samsonov justifies 3 mil a year .
Carbo said that if lats started the season with the habs, he will STAY with the Habs.

He is just 19 and will learn a lot this year on a fourth line or elsewhere in the lineup

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Old
10-11-2006, 07:23 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by LeMAD View Post
Dunno how Bégin will show Lats to score goals...
Skate fearlessly to the net like a rabid dog and slap any loose puck in the net?

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Old
10-11-2006, 07:41 PM
  #41
Evil Ted
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Originally Posted by Habber View Post
I don't think he can get quality icetime in junior. Playing against kids isn't going to do him any good at this point. He needs to adjust to a speedier game, and he needs to work on his defensive awareness, both of which he can do on the Habs 4th line.

And he's definitely not ready to get more than 10min a game. But give him half a season on the 4th, and he might be. Ryder and Higgins both started out playing sparingly on the 4th line, and they turned out fine.
Higgins played almost two full seasons in the AHL Ryder has an even more expansive minor pro career.

In both there cases they worked there ways on the habs roster by hard work and were not just given a free ticket out jr.

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Old
10-11-2006, 08:24 PM
  #42
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Latendresse has looked much better tonight. He's been anticipating the play and making a difference on every shift. His hand-eye coordination and ability to step into passing lanes is something else. That natural, fundamental ability showing itself this early is quite something and a testament to Latendresse deserving to be on the big club.


BTW, there are many, many successful players that make it to the big club earlier than projected. Just as there are many players who don't get the chance they deserve and wind up squandering their confidence (and talent).

I believe in looking at history to see what's worked and what hasn't, but one can't lose sight of the fact that these individual players are precisely that: individuals. They'll have different responses to different situations, and their learning curves will be different.

While I'm usually a big proponent for slow development, I'm a strong believer in this being the right time for Latendresse being in the NHL. He would have regressed in the QMJHL, and he'll have a great, productive learning curve in Montreal.

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10-11-2006, 08:50 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by geeman View Post
If we are going to play him on a 4th line and rot send him back down and bring up Kosty . After the 9th game do him a favour and give him ice time, then hopefully next year we play him with players can work with . Like I said before we are too scared to play a kid, mainly cups of coffee on 4th lines or a kid plays well in a few games and gets demoted later on . We didn`t have to spend 3 mil on Samsonov, when Lats and Kosty should of been on the top 3 lines from the start. We have plenty of vets to play these guys with . I don`t see how maybe 25 goals out of Samsonov justifies 3 mil a year .
Go take a look at what Joe Thornton, Chris Pronger, Mike Komisarek did in their rookie year. That's the typical learning curve for big boy like Tender.
RELAX!

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Old
10-11-2006, 09:01 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Shabutie View Post
There's more to hockey then goals.
Depends if the Habs want Latendresse to be a power foward or a grinder...

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10-12-2006, 12:10 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by waffledave View Post
Actually that's something I wanted to bring up but I didn't want to start a thread just for that...About Lats, people hail him as a power-forward but that's never been his game...The guy who skates around and hits everything like in training camp is not Latendresse...It could be, with the proper development but that's not his game in juniors. Who's to say he will be a power foward?

Anyways I think he needs to work on his speed. That's his weak point and if he works on that he has great potential.
I agree, but part of his slowness has to do with the fact that he can't keep up yet with the speed of the NHL. He will get used to it. What I found out tonight that makes me like him even more is that he seems to have ok ice vision and is able to make decent passes. He will be a good player if he can get used to the speed and if he learns how to properly position himself in the offencive zone. Also, I would like him to do more of what Carter did tonight : stay in front of the net. I just hope that the learning curve is not too long...

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Old
10-12-2006, 01:54 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by guapo23 View Post
Playing on the 4th line will teach him how to play WITHOUT THE PUCK !
You need to be able to play in the defensive zone & neutral zone at the NHL level.

One of the goals against in the last 2 games was due to his bad defensive mistake : he was watching the puck battle behind the net instead of focusing on his assignment ( take the open man out of the play). The puck was suddenly in front of the net & the open man scored the goal. Too late to react.

I think you let the kid develop. Higgins & Ryder started out on the 4th line. Was their development hurt by this ? NO !! They worked their way up by battling in the trenches, learning from the coaches & players and seizing their opportunities.

SIDENOTE :
It's crazy to see that Lats is making almost double what Pleks is making.
Pleks makes about $450,000 and Lats makes $850,000...
Saw this on TSN's site :
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/feature/?fid=2710&hubname= .
you seem to forget that higgins and ryder paid their dues and DEVELOPED in the AHL , they were not teenagers when they made the team and their jobs were not handed to them on a silver platter they earned it the old fashioned way HARD WORK , so i say that they should have let latendresse develop in a similar fashion after he finished his junior career . would this have hurt his development ? BTW can you name another player on the current roster , drafted by montreal that made the team straight out of junior hockey ? hmmmmmmm.........didnt think so . i think there was more than ability that was taken into consideration when the decision was made to keep him on the team .

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Old
10-12-2006, 02:18 AM
  #47
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Of course he'll be on the 4th line for now...it's his first year. Give him some time and you never know....maybe he'll earn a spot on the 2nd line or something by the end of the season

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Old
10-12-2006, 12:43 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
That natural, fundamental ability showing itself this early is quite something and a testament to Latendresse deserving to be on the big club.
I remember one occasion where Downey fumbled a potential 3-on-1 with a weak dump and Lats turned it into a pass that salvaged a good shot from Begin. He also initiated the play that almost led to the Dandenault goal. Just two highlights in an overall very solid game.

He has good vision. This is something you can't teach easily and it can go a long, long way.

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Old
10-12-2006, 12:48 PM
  #49
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Only problem but that doesn't deserve a demotion is his defensive play when the puck is down low. He doesn't seem to know where to go, is often in front of the net, when he should check the d-man. Cause in other situations when the puck is close to the blue line, he showed great hockey sense, intercepting pucks and all was great to see mostly yesterday. This nice little deflection that translated into a pass while he had some pressure from a d-man was nice to see, just handled himself like a pro on that occasion.

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Old
10-12-2006, 12:51 PM
  #50
Evil Ted
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Of course he'll be on the 4th line for now...it's his first year. Give him some time and you never know....maybe he'll earn a spot on the 2nd line or something by the end of the season
He could earn a spot on the 2nd by playing some minor pro hockey like every other young player that is on the habs roster.

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