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2013 NHL Entry Draft Talk 10.0

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06-10-2013, 03:21 PM
  #776
ChesterNimitz
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Originally Posted by Grant McCagg View Post
Bigras is a solid prospect..wouldn't mind landing him with a second. Heatherington may go at the end of the first...early in the second.

Dauphin doesn't have the size or skating ability of Bergeron....there are some similarities though.
Yes, they both have two legs. I think Dauphin is a nice prospect, but like so many of the players in this draft, the hype is starting to blind reality. Maybe it's just me, but I don't believe that Dauphin's upside is quite as high as several other players that will be available at 25. Since my original 'wish' of Morin will almost certainly not be available, I still hold some hope that my next two wishes Bowey and Burakowsky, will. Yes, I know and acknowledge, that both have a risk element attached to them. But both have skill sets that may allow them to be difference makers in the future. This is something that I don't see in Dauphin's game. He's a 'safe' pick and will most probably play in the NHL. So what? This summer we can sign a half dozen guys who have, and can continue to play in the NHL. I stand by my original thesis that in the first round, we should be swinging for the fences. Identify the players with the highest upsides and select one of them. Let's gamble that we can pick an impact player. The type of player that becomes a core player on a team that can realistically compete for the Stanley Cup. Enough of the decades of mediocrity. We can use picks 34, 36 and 55 to select 'safer' players. To me if we can come out of this draft with 3 of Bowey, Burakowsky, Dickinson and Poirier (all exciting, high tempo players) we 'll have had our best draft since 84.

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06-10-2013, 03:22 PM
  #777
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Where would anyone here be willing to take Vincent Dunn? I see him as a Steve Ott-lite.

I think he will go somewhere in the 4th. Would you be ok with taking him in the late 3rd?

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06-10-2013, 03:22 PM
  #778
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Wow I just saw that theres a 6'5" 215lbs centre that is a pt/gm in his rookie year in the Q. He is very responsible in his own zone and can score. It seems he got tired at the end of his first season in the Q or he maybe could have put up more than a pg/gm. He looked great for Canada at the U18 and he was first amongst Q rookies in face off %. He is ranked 13th by Central Scouting, 16th by Future Considerations, 17th by the War Room and he's from Quebec to boot. He says "I know I need to use [my size] to an advantage more often, though. I use it now, but not as much. I need to use it more in battles and in one-on-one situations along the boards and with my reach -- that's another area I can improve", also about being ranked high he said this "It's always nice, but I still want to get better," he said. "I know I'll have to work hard." I can only hope that a player of this magnitude falls to the Habs at 25th and anyone other than Nostradamus or someone with a crystal ball, should run to the podium screaming his name if he is available at 25.

Theres a lot of 'paralysis by analysis' going on and probably will get worse in the next 3 weeks.

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06-10-2013, 03:26 PM
  #779
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Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
Yes, they both have two legs. I think Dauphin is a nice prospect, but like so many of the players in this draft, the hype is starting to blind reality. Maybe it's just me, but I don't believe that Dauphin's upside is quite as high as several other players that will be available at 25. Since my original 'wish' of Morin will almost certainly not be available, I still hold some hope that my next two wishes Bowey and Burakowsky, will. Yes, I know and acknowledge, that both have a risk element attached to them. But both have skill sets that may allow them to be difference makers in the future. This is something that I don't see in Dauphin's game. He's a 'safe' pick and will most probably play in the NHL. So what? This summer we can sign a half dozen guys who have, and can continue to play in the NHL. I stand by my original thesis that in the first round, we should be swinging for the fences. Identify the players with the highest upsides and select one of them. Let's gamble that we can pick an impact player. The type of player that becomes a core player on a team that can realistically compete for the Stanley Cup. Enough of the decades of mediocrity. We can use picks 34, 36 and 55 to select 'safer' players. To me if we can come out of this draft with 3 of Bowey, Burakowsky, Dickinson and Poirier (all exciting, high tempo players) we 'll have had our best draft since 84.
The Dauphin hype is bad but IMO, the Poirier hype is worse. I would be so mad if we drat him in the first and dissapointed with him in the early 2nd.

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06-10-2013, 03:27 PM
  #780
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Now I agree with you. I wonder what would be the totals of Santini if he played in the CHL, he sure is a defensive defenseman, but he projects to be a dominant one, with good mobility and physical game, and he's already of good size. I've seen his ranking from 20th to 50th... damn this draft is deep, we'll have a lot of surprise picks.
Before commenting on Santini, Gauthier and Dauphin...please watch the U-18 gold medal game between Canada and the US. You will see why I am so high with regards to these three players. Trust...we wouldn't be disappointed by these picks.

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06-10-2013, 03:31 PM
  #781
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Originally Posted by LeHabsMan View Post
The Dauphin hype is bad but IMO, the Poirier hype is worse. I would be so mad if we drat him in the first and dissapointed with him in the early 2nd.
I would be great to choose both Dauphin and Poirier 34th and 36th overall. This is a good year for players from the Q. I am certain the Habs are interested since both were at the team's mini-camp in Brossard last week.

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06-10-2013, 03:34 PM
  #782
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In my opinion, from watching both a couple of times throughout the year and Dauphin specifically at the WJC, Dauphin and Poirier belong at about 40-50. It's all pretty close in that range but I would be okay with "reaching" for them at #36, probably not earlier.

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06-10-2013, 03:36 PM
  #783
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I would be great to choose both Dauphin and Poirier 34th and 36th overall. This is a good year for players from the Q. I am certain the Habs are interested since both were at the team's mini-camp in Brossard last week.
I wouldnt mind Dauphin at #36. I take him over Poirier. But I hope we take one of Santini, Klimchuk, De La Rose or Bowey at #34. Maybe even Petan.

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06-10-2013, 03:36 PM
  #784
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Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
Yes, they both have two legs. I think Dauphin is a nice prospect, but like so many of the players in this draft, the hype is starting to blind reality. Maybe it's just me, but I don't believe that Dauphin's upside is quite as high as several other players that will be available at 25. Since my original 'wish' of Morin will almost certainly not be available, I still hold some hope that my next two wishes Bowey and Burakowsky, will. Yes, I know and acknowledge, that both have a risk element attached to them. But both have skill sets that may allow them to be difference makers in the future. This is something that I don't see in Dauphin's game. He's a 'safe' pick and will most probably play in the NHL. So what? This summer we can sign a half dozen guys who have, and can continue to play in the NHL. I stand by my original thesis that in the first round, we should be swinging for the fences. Identify the players with the highest upsides and select one of them. Let's gamble that we can pick an impact player. The type of player that becomes a core player on a team that can realistically compete for the Stanley Cup. Enough of the decades of mediocrity. We can use picks 34, 36 and 55 to select 'safer' players. To me if we can come out of this draft with 3 of Bowey, Burakowsky, Dickinson and Poirier (all exciting, high tempo players) we 'll have had our best draft since 84.
I am not suggesting that we should pick Dauphin inthe first round. But yes, he would be a great pick at number 34 overall. I prefer MacCoshen and Morissey over Bowey.

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06-10-2013, 03:39 PM
  #785
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Originally Posted by LeHabsMan View Post
I wouldnt mind Dauphin at #36. I take him over Poirier. But I hope we take one of Santini, Klimchuk, De La Rose or Bowey at #34. Maybe even Petan.
I don't understand your problem with Poirier at 34 or 36th overall...great breakaway speed and puck handling skills. SPEED should be the underlining strength of the Habs organization.

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06-10-2013, 03:43 PM
  #786
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
In my opinion, from watching both a couple of times throughout the year and Dauphin specifically at the WJC, Dauphin and Poirier belong at about 40-50. It's all pretty close in that range but I would be okay with "reaching" for them at #36, probably not earlier.
Dauphin was considerably better than Klimchuk and Baptiste at the U-18 tournament.
Dauphin and Poirier will both picked between 28th and 39th overall. As they would say...you snooze... you lose!!!

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06-10-2013, 03:44 PM
  #787
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I believe some posters voice some extra goodwill towards a player like Dauphin because he plays close to home. But that comes also with some added negative scrutiny. For example, regarding his skating (I know, because I'm one of those that brought up that issue here)... However, players in the same bracket sometimes don't get the positive nor negative feedback here. For example Klimchuck... I'm not enamored at all with his skating stride. But you're most likely going to hear about his upsides and downsides on western teams' boards...

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06-10-2013, 03:45 PM
  #788
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Originally Posted by phillytennis View Post
Dauphin was considerably better than Klimchuk and Baptiste at the U-18 tournament.
Dauphin and Poirier will both picked between 28th and 39th overall. As they would say...you snooze... you lose!!!
You also won't hear on this board all the knocks on Baptiste's skating.


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06-10-2013, 03:46 PM
  #789
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Originally Posted by Mercury10 View Post
Wow I just saw that theres a 6'5" 215lbs centre that is a pt/gm in his rookie year in the Q. He is very responsible in his own zone and can score. It seems he got tired at the end of his first season in the Q or he maybe could have put up more than a pg/gm. He looked great for Canada at the U18 and he was first amongst Q rookies in face off %. He is ranked 13th by Central Scouting, 16th by Future Considerations, 17th by the War Room and he's from Quebec to boot. He says "I know I need to use [my size] to an advantage more often, though. I use it now, but not as much. I need to use it more in battles and in one-on-one situations along the boards and with my reach -- that's another area I can improve", also about being ranked high he said this "It's always nice, but I still want to get better," he said. "I know I'll have to work hard." I can only hope that a player of this magnitude falls to the Habs at 25th and anyone other than Nostradamus or someone with a crystal ball, should run to the podium screaming his name if he is available at 25.

Theres a lot of 'paralysis by analysis' going on and probably will get worse in the next 3 weeks.
I agree totally with your analysis...Gauthier is a can't miss at 25. If I am TT, I would pick Gauthier without hesitating.

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06-10-2013, 03:47 PM
  #790
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Why is it so important to go for the boom or bust player?

I would be extremely happy with McCoshen, De La Rose and Dauphin with our 3 first picks. None are extremely high potential guys but they are all players that if all goes well, teams would love to have on their roster. Its not like were drafting in the top 10 and are expecting a potential superstar with the pick. McCoshen can be a McDonagh best case scenario. If not he is a servicable top 4 defenseman with puck moving ability and good size. De La Rose has good hands, grit, size and good skating. He may be the safest player in this draft. At worst, i see him being an elite 3rd liner. Maybe a gritty 2nd liner. I dont need to convince anyone here about Dauphin but i take him over Poirier anyday.

McCoshen and De La Rose over high potential-high risk players for me. The risks can be taken in the late 2nd and 3rd on guys like Tambellini, Lekhonen, Baptiste, Fasching, Sanford, Moutrey and Hayden.

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06-10-2013, 03:48 PM
  #791
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Where would anyone here be willing to take Vincent Dunn? I see him as a Steve Ott-lite.

I think he will go somewhere in the 4th. Would you be ok with taking him in the late 3rd?
I really liked Dunn when I watched him at the beginning of the year. Apparently his play tailed off in the second half and down the stretch, but I don't know. I do know he got suspended for using a racial slur which, while not the end of times, is not really something you like to hear.

I don't know about 3rd round though...I think he's a 4th rounder at best, but of course we don't have one this year, so that makes snagging him there difficult.

As always, it depends who's off the board in the 3rd...but I think quite a few guys would need to be picked before I start to look at Dunn there, as much as I might have liked him.

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06-10-2013, 03:50 PM
  #792
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Originally Posted by phillytennis View Post
Before commenting on Santini, Gauthier and Dauphin...please watch the U-18 gold medal game between Canada and the US. You will see why I am so high with regards to these three players. Trust...we wouldn't be disappointed by these picks.
Did you watch any other games?

Gauthier was invisible in the other games.

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06-10-2013, 03:50 PM
  #793
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I don't understand your problem with Poirier at 34 or 36th overall...great breakaway speed and puck handling skills. SPEED should be the underlining strength of the Habs organization.
There are players that bring more intangibles and are safer picks. Its not like his numbers are out of this world or anything. He has good speed and decent defensively.

I swear if this guy was not from the Q there wouldnt be so much buzz about him. Other fan boards have him around #45. We are using a higher pick on him because he is a hometown boy.

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06-10-2013, 03:51 PM
  #794
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Bigras is a solid prospect..wouldn't mind landing him with a second. Heatherington may go at the end of the first...early in the second.

Dauphin doesn't have the size or skating ability of Bergeron....there are some similarities though.
He's still very raw physically, I think the skating will pick up.

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06-10-2013, 03:53 PM
  #795
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There are players that bring more intangibles and are safer picks. Its not like his numbers are out of this world or anything. He has good speed and decent defensively.

I swear if this guy was not from the Q there wouldnt be so much buzz about him. Other fan boards have him around #45. We are using a higher pick on him because he is a hometown boy.
FC & Central Scouting have him at 39, HP has him at 27...is that really worlds away from 34/36? We're not talking about Diaby, here...

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06-10-2013, 03:53 PM
  #796
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Now I agree with you. I wonder what would be the totals of Santini if he played in the CHL, he sure is a defensive defenseman, but he projects to be a dominant one, with good mobility and physical game, and he's already of good size. I've seen his ranking from 20th to 50th... damn this draft is deep, we'll have a lot of surprise picks.
Tinordi-Santini pairing could be a dominant shutdown duo.

People love Gorges, imagine a Gorges that can hit and skate.

Maybe I do want the Habs to draft Santini now

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06-10-2013, 03:53 PM
  #797
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Did you watch any other games?

Gauthier was invisible in the other games.

Gauthier was player of the game in the semi-final match between Canada and Finland. Don Cherry was most impressed by Gauthier in the prospects game in Toronto.

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06-10-2013, 03:53 PM
  #798
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The Dauphin hype is bad but IMO, the Poirier hype is worse. I would be so mad if we drat him in the first and dissapointed with him in the early 2nd.
Your point is well taken. To me, based on the films that I watched, Poirier has a level of skating ability that gives him a reasonable chance of being an effective offensive player in the NHL. My post was based on what I think the methodology the team should adopt with respect to their first draft choice. We should ignore a risk aversion approach. We should target those players that we think will reasonably be available at 25 and select the player who has the highest potential regardless of any specific concerns attached to that player: i.e. size, Petan; foot speed, Gauthier; hockey IQ Bowey; etc. All players that will be available at 25 will come with flaws, that's why they will be available at the bottom of the first round. I'm just suggesting a bold approach which just may allow us to pick a player that in 4 years will cause all other teams to be saying: why didn't we pick him? It happened with Subban. I would suggest that you read the pre-draft analyses in his draft year and review what the experts were saying about this now Norris trophy quality defenceman's potential. They talked about his lack of defensive awareness and some even called him the softest player in the OHL. Despite everyone's assessment of his enormous offensive potential, people became blinded by his supposed weaknesses and let him fall to the middle of the second round. Let's find another Subban. An exciting, dynamic player. And damn the supposed risks.


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06-10-2013, 03:55 PM
  #799
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Originally Posted by LeHabsMan View Post
The Dauphin hype is bad but IMO, the Poirier hype is worse. I would be so mad if we drat him in the first and dissapointed with him in the early 2nd.
You won't be for long.
I'm notorious for under-valuing players from the Q. Most times I hope we don't pick any only because this board gets humorous when that happens and RDS is gold.

But, even I am on the Poirier bandwagon. Guys very good and will only get better.

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06-10-2013, 03:56 PM
  #800
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Tinordi-Santini pairing could be a dominant shutdown duo.

People love Gorges, imagine a Gorges that can hit and skate.

Maybe I do want the Habs to draft Santini now
Agree...we have plenty of offensive defencemen on he Habs...Subban, Diaz, Beaulieu and Nygren. They would match-up well with defensive defencemen like Emelin, Dietz, Tinordi and Santini.

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