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Old
06-11-2013, 09:50 AM
  #26
Ziggy66
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The only thing that is too big..........is Buff's heart for the game, the team and our city.


Signed,

Ultimate homer

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06-11-2013, 09:55 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SensibleGuy View Post
Whatever your feelings about Lawless and his "sources" may be, Buff did sorta look heavier (and played like he was heavier) by the end of the season...of course there were rumours about him playing injured (again - didn't that happen near the end of last season too?) which may have kept him from training properly and so forth between games.
OR not training properly has caused him to become injury-prone. Either one is just as likely as the other, I think.

God this is frustrating. I'm not saying I believe the 300 lbs thing, because I don't, but cheering for a guy like Buff, who has ALL the physical gifts a hockey player could dream of, and seeing him simply not want to take full advantage of them SUCKS. If this guy dedicated himself to being in peak condition, he could easily be a top 5 player in the game. The skills he has are out of this world.

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06-11-2013, 10:09 AM
  #28
Grind
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Originally Posted by Potrzebie View Post
He's not just reporting it as a rumor. He is trying really hard to convince the reader by implying that the blogger somehow writes in some sort of official capacity. Accredited blogger?
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Originally Posted by Gump Hasek View Post
No offense intended, but he most certainly is reporting it as a rumour when he credits the report to someone else and follows with...
Gotta agree with Gump here. I read the board here before reading it and the article i found was not what i expected based off some of the vitrol here.

I'm by no means a lawless supporting and i get frustrated with his lack of credible reporting a lot of the time as well (he really doesn't do a good job of separating his reports from his opinions) but the general tone of this article, to me, was very soft on the accusation- I didn't get that he was trying to pass it off as fact.

yes he did mention Pete was 'accredited" and did try to make him look at least a little more official then a random hockey blogger, but he never really referenced the "situation" as fact within the article and prefaced it everytime with "soft" language.

I'm not really a fan of lawless's writing either, but i'm thinking some of us are "looking" for things to take issue with him at this point.


And in general he's right. if Buff is 300+ it'll be hard to trade him.


So.... once this gets syndicated, get ready for the lowball offers for fatty mc fatlyn from other fanbases.

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06-11-2013, 10:09 AM
  #29
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To me the most frustrating aspect of this is it will become gospel in the hockey world very quickly. I'm still waiting for confirmation that Burmi wants out of Winnipeg, which is entirely a different scenario than Winnipeg having lost patience with Burmistrov's development and as such are considering moving him. Yet a TSN review of Winnipeg goes on with the rumour about Burmistrov based on Lawless' previous article and now it's entirely TRUTH that he wants out. So next we'll see all sorts of people linking Lawless' largely unfounded claims that Buff is 300+ at the end of the season.

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Originally Posted by Grind View Post
So.... once this gets syndicated, get ready for the lowball offers for fatty mc fatlyn from other fanbases.
That's a more eloquent way of phrasing it.

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06-11-2013, 10:16 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by buggs View Post
To me the most frustrating aspect of this is it will become gospel in the hockey world very quickly. I'm still waiting for confirmation that Burmi wants out of Winnipeg, which is entirely a different scenario than Winnipeg having lost patience with Burmistrov's development and as such are considering moving him. Yet a TSN review of Winnipeg goes on with the rumour about Burmistrov based on Lawless' previous article and now it's entirely TRUTH that he wants out. So next we'll see all sorts of people linking Lawless' largely unfounded claims that Buff is 300+ at the end of the season.



That's a more eloquent way of phrasing it.
This is a fair reason to be mad at the article, and the only thing i really take issue with. By proxy what an "accredited" hockey blogger posted is now going to become near fact throughout MSM.

That's my only issue. Even though Lawless has clearly NOT stated it as fact, that is not how it's going to get syndicated and picked up by other outlets.

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06-11-2013, 10:17 AM
  #31
Aries56
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Don't believe it for a second. 303 is BIG, there's no way Buff looked THAT big by the end of the year. Didn't he also start the season in pretty good shape? somewhere around 240?

What kind of journalist relies on a guy like Tessier as the source for their story? How desperate is that? Lawless is gaining a reputation for making an issue where there is no issue. How many articles has Lawless written now that have turned out to be completely untrue.

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06-11-2013, 10:19 AM
  #32
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I'm sorry but there is no way that Buff got up to that size with playing three games a week + practises. No way.

If he did, then he probably has a thyroid problem.

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06-11-2013, 10:20 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grind View Post
Gotta agree with Gump here. I read the board here before reading it and the article i found was not what i expected based off some of the vitrol here.

I'm by no means a lawless supporting and i get frustrated with his lack of credible reporting a lot of the time as well (he really doesn't do a good job of separating his reports from his opinions) but the general tone of this article, to me, was very soft on the accusation- I didn't get that he was trying to pass it off as fact.

yes he did mention Pete was 'accredited" and did try to make him look at least a little more official then a random hockey blogger, but he never really referenced the "situation" as fact within the article and prefaced it everytime with "soft" language.

I'm not really a fan of lawless's writing either, but i'm thinking some of us are "looking" for things to take issue with him at this point.


And in general he's right. if Buff is 300+ it'll be hard to trade him.


So.... once this gets syndicated, get ready for the lowball offers for fatty mc fatlyn from other fanbases.
At 300ish pounds (where he has likely been for years) Buff has been one of the most effective offensive weapons in the league. He is big, but he can still log big minutes and more importantly he can score. He is also on a relatively budget friendly deal with the perfect amount of term remaining.

GMs aren't completely stupid, they will know how to operate a scale and would have learned his weight come time for his physical. Nothing has changed in regards to his trade value.

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06-11-2013, 10:27 AM
  #34
SensibleGuy
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Originally Posted by Aries56 View Post
Don't believe it for a second. 303 is BIG, there's no way Buff looked THAT big by the end of the year. Didn't he also start the season in pretty good shape? somewhere around 240?

What kind of journalist relies on a guy like Tessier as the source for their story? How desperate is that? Lawless is gaining a reputation for making an issue where there is no issue. How many articles has Lawless written now that have turned out to be completely untrue.
I doubt Buffs been 240 since his 18th birthday.

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06-11-2013, 10:30 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aries56 View Post
Don't believe it for a second. 303 is BIG, there's no way Buff looked THAT big by the end of the year. Didn't he also start the season in pretty good shape? somewhere around 240?

What kind of journalist relies on a hockeybuzz writer as the source for their story? Lawless is gaining a reputation for making an issue where there is no issue. How many articles has Lawless written now that have turned out to be completely untrue.
As has been mentioned he is a Columnist so his job isn't to write "true" articles.

he doesn't do a good job of highlighting which is which (opinion/reporting) so i try to just take it all with a grain of salt.

That being said, it's unfortunate that there doesn't seem to really be a "breaking point" where we all stop paying attention - this will continue on forever.Case and Point: Damien Cox.


The one thing I do kind of like about lawless is that i've definitely heard him on radio actually state that the stuff he writes/etc isn't what he believes or wants to happen or anything, it's all just kicking the bee hive for the sake of it.

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06-11-2013, 10:32 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aries56 View Post
Don't believe it for a second. 303 is BIG, there's no way Buff looked THAT big by the end of the year. Didn't he also start the season in pretty good shape? somewhere around 240?

What kind of journalist relies on a guy like Tessier as the source for their story? How desperate is that? Lawless is gaining a reputation for making an issue where there is no issue. How many articles has Lawless written now that have turned out to be completely untrue.
Buff's "ideal" playing weight has been said to be in the 265-270 lbs range, if memory serves. But I don't remember any reports of him being in good shape in the past year (in fact I thought I heard the opposite before the season started), so it's very possible he started the year in the 280's. Who knows?

But I can't believe some of you are getting on Lawless for this article. He reported a rumour, sure, but he VERY clearly labelled it as such. There were no grand statements of hyperbole, just some speculation based on a rumour. And if you think Buff's conditioning is 'no issue', I'd hate to see what you would have issue with...

Buff's weight is an issue, and it's fair game (and relevant) to report on.

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06-11-2013, 10:35 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by truck View Post
At 300ish pounds (where he has likely been for years) Buff has been one of the most effective offensive weapons in the league. He is big, but he can still log big minutes and more importantly he can score. He is also on a relatively budget friendly deal with the perfect amount of term remaining.

GMs aren't completely stupid, they will know how to operate a scale and would have learned his weight come time for his physical. Nothing has changed in regards to his trade value.

He totally is effective at whatever weight he's been and is worth a ransom IMO, no argument there. Sorry, my line of thinking might not have actually been in line with what the article stating- I was thinking:

if buff is considerably heavier then he has been up until this point of his career, then his trade value would likely be lower.

that's all i meant by that.

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06-11-2013, 10:41 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by sipowicz View Post
Like writing articles that were lifted word for word from other sources and calling them your own a'la Scott Taylor.
I will take Lawless over Taylor any day. I was thinking a little further back to journalists like Don Whitman and Jack Matheson.

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06-11-2013, 11:07 AM
  #39
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Whether the article or rumour is true or not, you have to question Buff's dedication to the game. It's evident that this is lacking in his play. You can see it in his back checking and his defensive play.

It's easy to play hard for a good team that is on a Stanley Cup run, like the Blackhawks were a few years ago. Playing hard for a poor team, like the Jets currently are, is a lot more difficult.

I love having Buff on my team, but there is one blatant hole in his game and it's not his on ice play. It's not even his weight. It's his dedication to the game. If he was dedicated to the game, his weight and conditioning would take care of themselves.

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06-11-2013, 11:08 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by sipowicz View Post
And Enstrom played what, 20 games, Bogo missed the first ?, so even after Buff what did you really have on D, lot of guys who would be hard pressed to even play as a #6 on a good team.
That's true, playing the most minutes on the Jets last year should be taken with a grain of salt.

But being tied for 9th in D scoring and 3rd in even strength D scoring stands on its own.

I think Buff suffers from unrealistic expectations sometimes. We see this big, smooth skating D man, and all wonder how great he would be if he consistently played a physical game, and lockdown defense as well.

Well, a guy who is top 3 or 5 in D scoring that plays physical and plays lockdown defense would be a perennial Norris nominee / winner, and probably a future hall of famer.

If Buff was a 6 foot, 200 lbs, smooth skating offensive D with average defensive abilities, but was consistently in the top 3 or 5 of defensive scoring and winning back to back all-star awards, would people be complaining as much that he wasn't also adding lockdown defense on top of that?

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06-11-2013, 11:14 AM
  #41
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Yeah I don't know where I got the 240 number, but I did remember reading an article when the season started in January. It was by Ken Wiebe, it didn't actually give numbers but they did say he was in good shape.

Quote:
It wasn't the first time questions have been asked about Byfuglien's fitness and conditioning level.

And sadly, it won't likely be the last.

For the time being though, we're here to tell you they belong on the back-burner.

A day earlier, Jets captain Andrew Ladd said he wasn't worried about what type of shape Byfuglien was in and now we know why, as it was clear that the two-time All-star spent plenty of time in the gym during the lockout.

Byfuglien made his first appearance at the MTS Iceplex on Wednesday morning and contrary to some speculation, he didn't resemble an overweight offensive lineman.

In fact, after travelling down to Minneapolis for a sit-down interview with Byfuglien near the end of September, I thought he was in pretty good shape at the time and several months later, he still looks fit.
We heard rumors last year that he was overweight and it all worked out in the end. IF Byfuglien is out of shape right now, I believe it will be addressed this off season.

Too early to be a concern IMO, but leave it to Lawless to make a big deal out of it.

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06-11-2013, 11:15 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by koth View Post
It's easy to play hard for a good team that is on a Stanley Cup run, like the Blackhawks were a few years ago. Playing hard for a poor team, like the Jets currently are, is a lot more difficult.
Also when you're playing for that first big contract.

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Originally Posted by Huffer View Post
That's true, playing the most minutes on the Jets last year should be taken with a grain of salt.

But being tied for 9th in D scoring and 3rd in even strength D scoring stands on its own.

I think Buff suffers from unrealistic expectations sometimes. We see this big, smooth skating D man, and all wonder how great he would be if he consistently played a physical game, and lockdown defense as well.

Well, a guy who is top 3 or 5 in D scoring that plays physical and plays lockdown defense would be a perennial Norris nominee / winner, and probably a future hall of famer.

If Buff was a 6 foot, 200 lbs, smooth skating offensive D with average defensive abilities, but was consistently in the top 3 or 5 of defensive scoring and winning back to back all-star awards, would people be complaining as much that he wasn't also adding lockdown defense on top of that?
If you could so clearly see the ability to do it, if he just dedicated himself to the game? Yes. Yes absolutely people would still complain.

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06-11-2013, 11:16 AM
  #43
Gil Fisher
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Hard to believe any NHL player could gain 40 pounds during a season. On that fact alone, I might have questioned the credibility of Tessier's source and not gone with the article if I were Gary. He might have done himself some harm with the organization if it is blatantly false.

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06-11-2013, 11:20 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Gil Fisher View Post
Hard to believe any NHL player could gain 40 pounds during a season. On that fact alone, I might have questioned the credibility of Tessier's source and not gone with the article if I were Gary. He might have done himself some harm with the organization if it is blatantly false.
Personally, I would be shocked if Buff started the season in the 260's.

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06-11-2013, 11:22 AM
  #45
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Probably something closer to 25 lbs. I doubt he was ever down around 260 last season...

There's no doubt the guy is huge and has a certain "less-defined" body type. Whether he hit 300 by the end of the season or not, I think if he even gained 10 lbs, there's a bit of a problem. This Lawless article is hardly the first suggestion that Buff might have some issues with motivation and dedication to a training regimen...

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06-11-2013, 11:32 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by koth View Post
Whether the article or rumour is true or not, you have to question Buff's dedication to the game. It's evident that this is lacking in his play. You can see it in his back checking and his defensive play.
^This.^

Buff seems like a good guy and is highly skilled. That said, am unsure if this is a guy (at least in his current form) that we necessarily want setting an example of how a professional behaves for kids like Trouba, etc. Winning takes commitment, from one and all. Have said it before; I view Ladd as a consummate pro that garners near every ounce out of his abilities via his dedication to conditioning and diet. Buff comparatively seems to be just scratching the surface of his potential a lot of the time and it is frustrating to watch.

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06-11-2013, 11:36 AM
  #47
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Some of that apparent lack of effort on ice is quite possibly due to his size/conditioning too. I mean it might be pretty tough to hustle that 270-290lb body back on the back check if you are totally gassed from that run up the ice you just attempted...

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06-11-2013, 11:37 AM
  #48
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See what Lawless does? Gets threads like this going. Hack of a journalist.

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06-11-2013, 11:39 AM
  #49
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Whats wrong with this thread? Aren't we supposed to have discussions about stuff like this on a hockey forum?

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06-11-2013, 11:41 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by supahdupah View Post
See what Lawless does? Gets threads like this going. Hack of a journalist.
Starting a conversation about something that is very clearly an issue that the organization needs to address in the near future...

You're right, what a meatball.

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