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Sabres Attempting To Acquire The First Overall Pick

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Old
06-12-2013, 02:10 PM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoemAvs View Post
Avs will lose this trade for sure if they don't get atleast Myers.
There is a big dropoff in talent after Jones/Mac/Drouin/Barkov/Nichushkin/Lindholm/Monahan (I am not a fan of Nurse).

I want Myers + 8th ++ or tell them to shove it.

8th + 16th + decent prospect would come to haunt us really really bad.
MacKinnon for McNabb + Shinkaruk/Nurse + Horvat.
Odds are that it won't look pretty in a few years if Mac becomes a #1 C and those other guys top out as second liners / second pairing Ds....
I think the most you can get is either Myers and the 8th pick or the 8th, 16th and a prospect. It's unrealistic to think that you would get a kings ransom for it. MacKinnon and Jones have done nothing to prove that they are worth a #8 pick, a #16 pick, a young top-4 TWD, and a top prospect from last years draft. Personally, I don't view draft picks with that high of value.

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06-12-2013, 02:11 PM
  #27
Pierce Hawthorne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoofSlashFoig View Post
That is way overpayment.

Well, we had Sabres fans themselves a month ago that were ADDING the #38 + Pysyk to that deal.


So obviously they don't think its an overpayment.



The Avs wont trade the pick unless someone comes with an offer they simply cant refuse.


The #8 + #16 + Myers is probably fair value. But the Avs aren't going to move the pick simply for fair value. Someone like Grigorenko, Girgensons, Hodgson, etc. is the type of player it would take added to this deal in order for the Avs to pull the trigger.



I could also see the Avs swapping 2nd's with Buffalo in a deal like that as well, the 38 from BUF for the 32 of COL.


But if the Sabres are trading for 1st overall. Most of there fan base is going to hate the deal. Because it would take pieces they don't want to move, for the Avs to move a piece we don't want to move.

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06-12-2013, 02:11 PM
  #28
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From the full interview and comments made by Regier and out of Colorado, it seems more likely that Buffalo would have to get up to the #2-4 range and then flip up to the #1 to make the deal happen. However it happens, it's going to cost them bigtime.

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06-12-2013, 02:13 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chardo View Post
Has the #1 pick ever been traded before the draft?
Rick Nash and Patrick Stefan come to mind

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06-12-2013, 02:14 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Rainbow Crash View Post
I think the most you can get is either Myers and the 8th pick or the 8th, 16th and a prospect. It's unrealistic to think that you would get a kings ransom for it. MacKinnon and Jones have done nothing to prove that they are worth a #8 pick, a #16 pick, a young top-4 TWD, and a top prospect from last years draft. Personally, I don't view draft picks with that high of value.
Its a good thing you're not a GM then....


Its quite obvious NHL GM's value draft picks very highly. ESPECIALLY the 1st overall pick in the strongest draft in years.


And you're being quite hypocritical in your post. You claim you don't value picks highly, then say that 2 later draft picks and a prospect is worth a much higher draft pick and the much better player in Mackinnon.

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06-12-2013, 02:14 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
From the full interview and comments made by Regier and out of Colorado, it seems more likely that Buffalo would have to get up to the #2-4 range and then flip up to the #1 to make the deal happen. However it happens, it's going to cost them bigtime.
Do the Sabres want Mackinnon or Jones?

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06-12-2013, 02:15 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sens Mile View Post
Do the Sabres want Mackinnon or Jones?
Probably Mac, although it obviously gets dicier depending on what Buffalo has to move.

I think I'd blow a gasket if they traded Myers++ for Jones though.

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06-12-2013, 02:15 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
From the full interview and comments made by Regier and out of Colorado, it seems more likely that Buffalo would have to get up to the #2-4 range and then flip up to the #1 to make the deal happen. However it happens, it's going to cost them bigtime.
This. Devine said they were trying to determine how far back they would be willing to move first. It wasn't likely going to be 8.

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06-12-2013, 02:15 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierce Hawthorne View Post
Its a good thing you're not a GM then....


Its quite obvious NHL GM's value draft picks very highly. ESPECIALLY the 1st overall pick in the strongest draft in years.


And you're being quite hypocritical in your post. You claim you don't value picks highly, then say that 2 later draft picks and a prospect is worth a much higher draft pick and the much better player in Mackinnon.
Hmmp, how good is top-3 compared to other drafts? How great of prospects MacKinnon and Jones are compared to last 5 years? Any idea?

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06-12-2013, 02:15 PM
  #35
Joe Sakic
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Buffalo fans what about:

#8 + #16 + Myers

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06-12-2013, 02:19 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoemAvs View Post
MacKinnon for McNabb + Shinkaruk/Nurse + Horvat.
Odds are that it won't look pretty in a few years if Mac becomes a #1 C and those other guys top out as second liners / second pairing Ds....
To add to that, McNabb on the Avs wouldn't be pretty.

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06-12-2013, 02:20 PM
  #37
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It's nothing serious, obviously the Sabres have talked about acquiring the first overall. I'm sure there are a lot of teams that have done it.

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06-12-2013, 02:21 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by cramdizzl View Post
Wouldn't be surprised if Grigorenko is part of the proposal from Darcy. Let him continue his development under Roy and fill some other holes at the same time. I don't think Colorado is far off from contending and if they got Vanek or Miller back in a deal, they could be one or two steps closer.

I know Avs fans are going to say "We don't want/need Miller, we have Varly", but the truth is that Miller is an enormous upgrade over Varly and would help Colorado a lot. I think there are a lot of intriguing options for Colorado if they deal with Buffalo. Myers (hopefully not involved), Sekera, Vanek, Miller, Grigorenko, Pysyk. Lots of options....
The reason this Avs fan doesn't want Miller is because his attitude sucks

Realistically from Buffalo: Vanek and Myers are the 2 roster players that fix our 2 biggest needs, but they both have huge price tags attached to them. We would need some salary going back and obviously the #8 would have to be involved somehow. I think if it's something like Myers + Vanek + 8th overall that would be too hard to turn down.. but it's really hard to determine fair value for #1 overall because they will likely always be the best player in the deal, that's why it would take an overpayment.

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06-12-2013, 02:21 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierce Hawthorne View Post
Because when you're talking about the 1st overall pick, in a draft as strong as this one. Its not "just a prospect".


The last time a 1st overall pick comepletely busted was all the way back in 2000 with Dipietro, or 1999 in Stefan.


Every single 1st overall pick since then is now playing a very important role with there team.

Every forward taken 1st overall is a 1st line, Top 40 player in the league(Excluding the last 2 drafts, as those players are still very young).


There is very little risk in the 1st overall pick, especially when it comes to forwards. You're not trading simply for a prospect. You're trading for a young, elite player who will likely be a Top 30 player in the league for many, many years.
WILL LIKELY BE

That doesn't mean they are definitely going to be. You can't demand a return on a player because of what they potentially can become. It doesn't work that way. MacKinnon and Jones have not proven to be worth what you proposed. That's a higher return than some people are proposing for MALKIN, who is A TOP-3 PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE! It's completely asinine to think that the Sabres would do that. Your trading for a player who has the potential to be elite, not an elite player. Potential does not equal trade value.

Buffalo is the team with all the risk in this deal, they could trade an established top-4 D, 2 1sts and another prospect for a bust. No chance in hell does Buffalo demolishes their future for a prospect.

If either Jones or MacKinnon had the skills of someone like Crosby or Ovechkin when they were drafted, it would be fair to ask for that. But neither MacKinnon nor Jones are even close to their levels. I think that return wouldn't be bad for McDavid in 2015, but it would be horrendous for either top pick this year.

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06-12-2013, 02:21 PM
  #40
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MacKinnon on the Sabres would be cool. Can't really see them picking Jones.

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06-12-2013, 02:21 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AvsFan20 View Post
Buffalo fans what about:

#8 + #16 + Myers
There's reason why Buffalo fans keep offering Myers. He's got huge contract, he's big, but soft and apparently he might not have toolbox.

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06-12-2013, 02:22 PM
  #42
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Grigorenko to the Oilers for the 7th overall
Myers 7th 8th to Avalance for 1st Buffalo get their franchise centerman Colorado gets their dman plus 2 good picks ,Oilers get their big Centerman.

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06-12-2013, 02:24 PM
  #43
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Or because he's one of Buffalo's most valuable trade assets? The only season he didn't get his ass in gear eventually was this one, and that's because it was ended by injury.

Sakic/Roy just have to improve whatever the **** Ruff had him doing in the offseason and not start him playing top pairing shutdown minutes with AHL fodder and guys on their last legs.

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06-12-2013, 02:24 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Colorado Avalanche View Post
There's reason why Buffalo fans keep offering Myers. He's got huge contract, he's big, but soft and apparently he might not have toolbox.
Lol? We're offering Myers because we're talking about the first overall. Or are you talking about the 500 Myers threads that have been popping up on the Trade Rumors board from other teams fans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freaky Styley View Post
The reason this Avs fan doesn't want Miller is because his attitude sucks

Realistically from Buffalo: Vanek and Myers are the 2 roster players that fix our 2 biggest needs, but they both have huge price tags attached to them. We would need some salary going back and obviously the #8 would have to be involved somehow. I think if it's something like Myers + Vanek + 8th overall that would be too hard to turn down.. but it's really hard to determine fair value for #1 overall because they will likely always be the best player in the deal, that's why it would take an overpayment.
How does Miller's attitude suck? He is outspoken and Buffalo fans have never questioned his passion and competitiveness. When he calls out his teammates, the teammates often deserve it(except for the Kaleta thing, which got blown up for no reason really). Do you guys hate Giguere because he called your team out about pretty much everything?

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06-12-2013, 02:26 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chainshot View Post
From the full interview and comments made by Regier and out of Colorado, it seems more likely that Buffalo would have to get up to the #2-4 range and then flip up to the #1 to make the deal happen. However it happens, it's going to cost them bigtime.
That's the impression that I got as well.

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06-12-2013, 02:26 PM
  #46
Alexei Yashin
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**** my life.
Agreed.

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06-12-2013, 02:27 PM
  #47
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We go through this song and dance every single year and no one ever gives up the #1 pick.

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06-12-2013, 02:27 PM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oiltankjob 4 93 64 View Post
Grigorenko to the Oilers for the 7th overall
Myers 7th 8th to Avalance for 1st Buffalo get their franchise centerman Colorado gets their dman plus 2 good picks ,Oilers get their big Centerman.
Horrible.

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06-12-2013, 02:27 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierce Hawthorne View Post
Its a good thing you're not a GM then....


Its quite obvious NHL GM's value draft picks very highly. ESPECIALLY the 1st overall pick in the strongest draft in years.


And you're being quite hypocritical in your post. You claim you don't value picks highly, then say that 2 later draft picks and a prospect is worth a much higher draft pick and the much better player in Mackinnon.
How is it hypocritical? Do you even know what that means? It would be hypocritical if I would have said that, then demanded Crosby and Malkin for it.

And drop it with the "strongest draft in years" crap. We hear it every single year. It's no different this year than it was last.

If GMs value picks so highly, why wasn't Staal traded straight for the 8th overall pick? In fact, why wasn't the 8th overall pick even the biggest piece in the package? A draft pick is nothing more than a draft pick, a player doesn't have value for something he never did.

And how is MacKinnon better than any other prospect in this draft? There is no player that is head and shoulders above anyone else this year. If there was, he would be the consensus #1 pick.

The 8th pick and Myers is more than fair value. Take off your Avs glasses and realize that. They aren't trading for a superstar, they are trading for someone who can become a superstar. Is it fair for me to demand a return of a top-2 D for Derrick Pouliot (8.0 C)? No, because he isn't a top-2 D yet.

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06-12-2013, 02:27 PM
  #50
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From a neutral perspective,

Grigorenko+ 8th + Myers

for 1st + 32nd

is somewhat fair-ish. Colorado would have to add though

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