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I wish we missed the playoffs or lost 4-0 to Ana

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Old
06-12-2013, 08:10 PM
  #51
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Real original thread lol.... I don't like Cleary either, but I think one or two more years will be good while we wait for our young guys to keep developing. Thats what Holland is doing. Slowly building the team through the draft. We are still competitive and will be a good team next year. I'm glad we did good this year...

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06-12-2013, 08:12 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by cupforwings09 View Post
Real original thread lol.... I don't like Cleary either, but I think one or two more years will be good while we wait for our young guys to keep developing. Thats what Holland is doing. Slowly building the team through the draft. We are still competitive and will be a good team next year. I'm glad we did good this year...
Why?

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06-12-2013, 08:23 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by cupforwings09 View Post
Real original thread lol.... I don't like Cleary either, but I think one or two more years will be good while we wait for our young guys to keep developing. Thats what Holland is doing. Slowly building the team through the draft. We are still competitive and will be a good team next year. I'm glad we did good this year...
The HFboards mentality is cup or bust. No inbetween.

Wings were great in the playoffs, they were one bounce away from moving on to the WCF, and could very well be playing tonight. But apparently lucky deflections and bounces aren't real in the NHL

Wings will be great next year, probably better than last year. If they make the playoffs, they have a chance at winning the cup, plain and simple.

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06-12-2013, 08:34 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Detroit Sports View Post
For Kenny to bring back Cleary and more retreads, washed up players his excuse is we took Chicago to 7 games OT and blah blah blah. If the Blackhawks win the cup it will be worse. This is the same ol' same ol' summer from Kenny book it!
Yeah, because GMs make knee jerk reactions based on missing the playoffs by one point or getting swept in the first round.

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06-12-2013, 08:35 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by HTT3 View Post
The HFboards mentality is cup or bust. No inbetween.

Wings were great in the playoffs, they were one bounce away from moving on to the WCF, and could very well be playing tonight. But apparently lucky deflections and bounces aren't real in the NHL

Wings will be great next year, probably better than last year. If they make the playoffs, they have a chance at winning the cup, plain and simple.
Wings have been on the wrong end of lucky bounces for four years now.

How insane does that sentence sound to you?

We didn't get the lucky bounces is code for our favorite team was outplayed, but we refuse to acknowledge it.

Ken Holland did it two years ago after game seven against the Sharks. He literally made no impact moves and the Wings were slaughtered by the Preds the next season. He bought into the notion that the Wings were unlucky and he ended up being very wrong.

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06-12-2013, 08:54 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
Wings have been on the wrong end of lucky bounces for four years now.

How insane does that sentence sound to you?

We didn't get the lucky bounces is code for our favorite team was outplayed, but we refuse to acknowledge it.

Ken Holland did it two years ago after game seven against the Sharks. He literally made no impact moves and the Wings were slaughtered by the Preds the next season.
No, it's code for the #7 team took the #1 seed team to game#7 and lost in OT on a unlucky deflection off a leg, after the #7 seed team was carrying all the momentum and looked to be outplaying the #1 seed team.

Hawks are all in for a cup, Wings are rebuilding and continue to rebuild. Hawks rebuilt for 60 years and rarely made the playoffs. Red Wings are rebuilding and haven't missed the playoffs in 22 years and gave the #1 seed team all they could handle, and nearly took them out. Save the unlucky bounce, Wings could be playing tonight.. a year they are rebuilding.

All the teams playing in the WCFs and SCFs all tanked for 1st round picks. You want KH to make impact moves, but Detroit doesn't have those pesky 5th overall pick players to trade for 2nd overall pick players like Tyler Seguin. Or those 1st overall Joe Thorton players to trade, damn you Kenny!!!!11!1

Ken Holland did everything he could to sign Ryan Suter, but Parise begged him to come play with him in Minny for more money, you blame Holland for that? Suter wanted to play in Detroit, but Zach Parise talked him out of it.

Subsequently, Holland goes out and steals two great players in Danny Dekeyser and Damian Brunner, but apparently they aren't considered impact players... even though one of them led the team in scoring in the playoffs. Damn you kenny!!!1!!

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06-12-2013, 08:59 PM
  #57
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All I ask is that our brilliant head coach hold players like Cleary accountable for terrible play, turnovers and stupid penalties. Toots takes a bad penalty. He's done. Cleary takes multiple offensive zone and undisciplined penalties? Get back out there on the PP and in the last 2 minutes!

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06-12-2013, 09:09 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by HTT3 View Post
No, it's code for the #7 team took the #1 seed team to game#7 and lost in OT on a unlucky deflection off a leg, after the #7 seed team was carrying all the momentum and looked to be outplaying the #1 seed team.

Hawks are all in for a cup, Wings are rebuilding and continue to rebuild. Hawks rebuilt for 60 years and rarely made the playoffs. Red Wings are rebuilding and haven't missed the playoffs in 22 years and gave the #1 seed team all they could handle, and nearly took them out. Save the unlucky bounce, Wings could be playing tonight.. a year they are rebuilding.

All the teams playing in the WCFs and SCFs all tanked for 1st round picks. You want KH to make impact moves, but Detroit doesn't have those pesky 5th overall pick players to trade for 2nd overall pick players like Tyler Seguin. Or those 1st overall Joe Thorton players to trade, damn you Kenny!!!!11!1

Ken Holland did everything he could to sign Ryan Suter, but Parise begged him to come play with him in Minny for more money, you blame Holland for that? Suter wanted to play in Detroit, but Zach Parise talked him out of it.

Subsequently, Holland goes out and steals two great players in Danny Dekeyser and Damian Brunner, but apparently they aren't considered impact players... even though one of them led the team in scoring in the playoffs. Damn you kenny!!!1!!
Boston didn't tank to get those picks, that was an awesome trade. Look at their lineup again and talk about top overall picks. Silly statement.

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06-12-2013, 09:09 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by HTT3 View Post
No, it's code for the #7 team took the #1 seed team to game#7 and lost in OT on a unlucky deflection off a leg, after the #7 seed team was carrying all the momentum and looked to be outplaying the #1 seed team.

Hawks are all in for a cup, Wings are rebuilding and continue to rebuild. Hawks rebuilt for 60 years and rarely made the playoffs. Red Wings are rebuilding and haven't missed the playoffs in 22 years and gave the #1 seed team all they could handle, and nearly took them out. Save the unlucky bounce, Wings could be playing tonight.. a year they are rebuilding.

All the teams playing in the WCFs and SCFs all tanked for 1st round picks. You want KH to make impact moves, but Detroit doesn't have those pesky 5th overall pick players to trade for 2nd overall pick players like Tyler Seguin. Or those 1st overall Joe Thorton players to trade, damn you Kenny!!!!11!1

Ken Holland did everything he could to sign Ryan Suter, but Parise begged him to come play with him in Minny for more money, you blame Holland for that? Suter wanted to play in Detroit, but Zach Parise talked him out of it.

Subsequently, Holland goes out and steals two great players in Danny Dekeyser and Damian Brunner, but apparently they aren't considered impact players... even though one of them led the team in scoring in the playoffs. Damn you kenny!!!1!!
Holland had nothing to do with bringing in Dekeyser and Brunner. His only job was to fax over the paper work. His secretary probably did that for him. Do they have fax machines on golf courses?

I want Ken Holland to make any move. He sits on his *** and makes excuses. I want him to stop signing garbage washed up veterans and bring up the prospects sooner. Instead he does the opposite. He overpays for washed up veterans and he gives them far too many years.

You keep bringing up the past and how much the Hawks sucked, but their future is very bright. A very young core that will be contending for the cup for quite some time.

We don't know if the Wings future is bright. We don't know if there is a player capable of taking over when Zetterberg declines and Datsyuk retires. We don't know because Ken Holland refuses to give the prospects any opportunity to play unless there is an injury.

You keep on talking about how unlucky the Wings have been and i will keep on saying luck has nothing to do with it. The Wings were the inferior team every year they lost.

I don't want Ryan Suter and Zach Parise. I do want them, but i don't expect those kinds of signings every year. I expect Holland to put up or shut up. He mentions how great the prospect pool is, yet he signs garbage veterans instead of promoting the kids.

You keep on comforting yourself by saying how good of a job Ken Holland has done the past 17 years.

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06-12-2013, 09:16 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
You keep bringing up the past and how much the Hawks sucked, but their future is very bright. A very young core that will be contending for the cup for quite some time.
I bring it up because we need to talk about how they became the team they are today.. they got there by losing, a lot. You want to bring it up, lets look how they became the team they are today.

1st overall, Patrick Kane
3rd overall, Jonny Toews
14th overall, Brent Seabrook

It requires no talent from any GM to tank to get the above draft positions.

Are you mad at Kenny Holland for not tanking? Or you just mad because the NHL won't give him 1st overall picks? Don't hate the player, hate the game.

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06-12-2013, 09:17 PM
  #61
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i hear rebuild on the fly all the time.
bringing in samuelsson and bertuzzi and cleary from the ir list and sell them as fa signings is a rebuild to you guys?
and what has the playoff streak of detroit to do with our future?
nothing!!!!!!!! cant wait the red wings to fail the playoffs just because of ending this nonsense.
cant wait ken holland to retire as well.
i am so sick of all the clearys, bertuzzis, samuelssons, quinceys, tootoos and abdelkaders.
its time to refill the talent on this team and not the roster space.
otherwise you can ice the guys who is taping the stick or washing hte towels. as long dats and zetta are playing on high level nothing will change in hollands mind.
dont even wanna imagine this team without dats and zetta. first two centers would be flip and helm.
cant belive we would contend for the cup anymore.
thats the time detroit is tanking because they dont have no quality anymore.

i can hear holland already in 4 years. "we lost dats and zetta but we love our team. we aquired lebda and lilja and expect them to step up their game."

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06-12-2013, 09:19 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
Holland had nothing to do with bringing in Dekeyser and Brunner. His only job was to fax over the paper work. His secretary probably did that for him. Do they have fax machines on golf courses?

I want Ken Holland to make any move. He sits on his *** and makes excuses. I want him to stop signing garbage washed up veterans and bring up the prospects sooner. Instead he does the opposite. He overpays for washed up veterans and he gives them far too many years.
I didn't respond to this section of your post in my last comment because it's utter ********. Your hate for Holland is so thick you can't stand to see him do good things for the team. There's no GM in the NHL nearly as good as Ken Holland, nobody.

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06-12-2013, 09:20 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by HTT3 View Post
I bring it up because we need to talk about how they became the team they are today.. they got there by losing, a lot. You want to bring it up, lets look how they became the team they are today.

1st overall, Patrick Kane
3rd overall, Jonny Toews
14th overall, Brent Seabrook

It requires no talent from any GM to tank to get the above draft positions.

Are you mad at Kenny Holland for not tanking? Or you just mad because the NHL won't give him 1st overall picks? Don't hate the player, hate the game.
How the Hawks got there is irrelevant. The question that matters is, "Is Ken Holland doing a good job building a team?"

The Hawks play their prospects and they have a younger core. They give their prospects plenty of ice time and are in the Cup Finals.

Ken Holland is doing the opposite and it has resulted in multiple second round exits and stunted the development of some prospects. (See Brendan Smith)

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06-12-2013, 09:21 PM
  #64
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I didn't respond to this section of your post in my last comment because it's utter ********. Your hate for Holland is so thick you can't stand to see him do good things for the team. There's no GM in the NHL nearly as good as Ken Holland, nobody.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

You keep on believing that.

You worship the ground Holland walks on. He can do no wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He won a cup in 2002. Best GM in hockey!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

At least i acknowledge Ken Holland was a great GM.

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06-12-2013, 09:24 PM
  #65
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Boston didn't tank to get those picks, that was an awesome trade. Look at their lineup again and talk about top overall picks. Silly statement.
Wait, so Boston didn't acquire assets from the Joe Thornton trade? They picked Thornton 1st overall by the way. They also selected Sequin 2nd overall. Phil Kessel was 5th overall.

When was the last time Detroit had a 1st overall, 2nd overall, and a 5th overall respectively the past 15 years?

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06-12-2013, 09:30 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
How the Hawks got there is irrelevant
Haha, the words of defeat -



Quote:
Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

You keep on believing that.

You worship the ground Holland walks on. He can do no wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He won a cup in 2002. Best GM in hockey!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

At least i acknowledge Ken Holland was a great GM.
Um, you know Holland and the DRWs won the cup in 2008, too , right? They made the WCFs, Cup, SCFs, and have not missed the playoffs in 22 years, but no, Holland deserves no credit. LOL!!!!!1!!1

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06-12-2013, 09:33 PM
  #67
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Haha, the words of defeat -





Um, you know Holland and the DRWs won the cup in 2008, too , right? They made the WCFs, Cup, SCFs, and have not missed the playoffs in 22 years, but no, Holland deserves no credit. LOL!!!!!1!!1
The joke was that you use the extreme past to reinforce the notion that Ken Holland is the best GM in hockey today. I picked 2002 out on purpose. How you can say Ken Holland is the best GM in hockey after four years of failure is astounding.

Hawks have all those high draft picks and yet they still find a way to play their prospects.

Wings haven't had any high draft picks and they struggle to get any of their prospects ice time.

That is all that matters.

Who cares if they made the playoffs for 22 straight years? Last year they got destroyed by the Preds. Wooo hooooo!!!!!!!!!!!! That 21st straight year was soooooo special.

You lump every good achievement and it's been quite a while since they have had any actual playoff success to offset the last four years of futility. The last five years is far more important than the last 22 years.

Hawks have a core. Hawks use prospects and are now in the Cup Finals. Brendan Saad was a Calder nominee. Remind me again when was he drafted? 1st overall? Nope...........................

Wings have a core. (a old core that is still elite) and the Wings bring in washed up veterans instead of playing their prospects.


Last edited by WingedWheel1987: 06-12-2013 at 09:43 PM.
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06-12-2013, 09:42 PM
  #68
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The joke was that you use the extreme past to reinforce the notion that Ken Holland is the best GM in hockey today. I picked 2002 out on purpose. How you can say Ken Holland is the best GM in hockey after four years of failure is astounding.

Hawks have all those high draft picks and yet they still find a way to play their prospects.

Wings haven't had any high draft picks and they struggle to get any of their prospects ice time.

That is all that matters.

Who cares if they made the playoffs for 22 straight years. Last year they got destroyed by the Preds. Wooo hooooo!!!!!!!!!!!! That 21st straight year was soooooo special.

You lump every good achievement and it's been quite a while since they have had any actual playoff success to offset the last four years of futility. The last five years is far more important than the last 22 years.

Hawks have a core. Hawks use prospects and are now in the Cup Finals. Brendan Saad was a Calder nominee. Remind me again when was he drafted? 1st overall? Nope...........................

Wings have a core. (a old core that is still elite) and the Wings bring in washed up veterans instead of playing their prospects.
Wasn't Brandan Saad a healthy scratch in the Detroit and LA series? I didn't notice him. Oh wait, is he the guy that was demoted to the 4th line in favor of Brian Bickell?

You hate the DRWs, we get it. Find a new team to cheer for. Penguins might need some new fans after getting swept, maybe you'd enjoy being a fan of that team. They have a realgood GM too, he just re-upped the losing coach for 2 more years after getting an all-star team to ice. They also have a ton of 1st overall players, you should really like them

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06-12-2013, 09:44 PM
  #69
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Wasn't Brandan Saad a healthy scratch in the Detroit and LA series? I didn't notice him. Oh wait, is he the guy that was demoted to the 4th line in favor of Brian Bickell?

You hate the DRWs, we get it. Find a new team to cheer for. Penguins might need some new fans after getting swept, maybe you'd enjoy being a fan of that team. They have a realgood GM too, he just re-upped the losing coach for 2 more years after getting an all-star team to ice. They also have a ton of 1st overall players, you should really like them
That's how you lose an argument.

Well done.

I will address the Saad question since that was before you decided to jump off the deep end. Experience is experience. How can the Hawks find room on their roster with all their high draft picks and yet the Wings struggle to find room for their prospects? Why didn't Nyquist play an entire season? Why was Tatar sent down when he was playing great?

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06-12-2013, 09:50 PM
  #70
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Wait, so Boston didn't acquire assets from the Joe Thornton trade? They picked Thornton 1st overall by the way. They also selected Sequin 2nd overall. Phil Kessel was 5th overall.

When was the last time Detroit had a 1st overall, 2nd overall, and a 5th overall respectively the past 15 years?
Looking at their roster and pretending it was made through anything but really good trades, signings and drafting is a mistake. The Bruins have built without attempting to tank.

The return on Thornton was paltry. This current team is an exercise in strong building.

Of course they have had better picks than the Wings, every team has. If that is the only thing you're using to feel better about your argument fine. But the Bruins were not built from tanking, they don't fit your narrative and to lump them in really hurts your argument.

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06-12-2013, 09:54 PM
  #71
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I will address the Saad question since that was before you decided to jump off the deep end. Experience is experience. How can the Hawks find room on their roster with all their high draft picks and yet the Wings struggle to find room for their prospects? Why didn't Nyquist play an entire season? Why was Tatar sent down when he was playing great?
1st overall picks are usually ready for the NHL, while 3rd rounders need development and time to mature physically.

Jarkrok was 160ibs when he was drafted I believe. He looked like string for a kite when he stood up to accept his new Red Wings jersey. He was tiny...

On the flip side, players like Sidney Crosby were more in a man size body and had off the chart skillset. If Jarnkrok and Nyquist were 6"2 and 220ibs and played like they do today, they would have been top 5 picks. Nyquist is still small and weak, but he is getting better. Still has a way to go, though.

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06-12-2013, 10:00 PM
  #72
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Vague thread to begin with, beating the dead horse indeed. Our prospects and other draft related topics can be discussed in various other threads. Closed.

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