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2013-14 Flyers Overhaul Part II

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Old
06-13-2013, 01:28 PM
  #526
BobbyClarkeFan16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan1616 View Post
I know poor Torres lol..I do think he would be a good flyer tho
Any thoughts on Cooke or Lappy??
I don't have a problem with Gus playing all the time I just want D depth and not guys like Bruno lilja foster huskins walker every to be around again...waste of money
In fairness, Huskins played well in his short time. He played a very simple and effective game and was actually a rather calming influence on the third pairing. I'd have no problems if he were brought back. He's only going to be a part timer, but he knows his role and plays it well.

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Old
06-13-2013, 01:30 PM
  #527
RJ8812
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan1616 View Post
I know poor Torres lol..I do think he would be a good flyer tho
Any thoughts on Cooke or Lappy??
I don't have a problem with Gus playing all the time I just want D depth and not guys like Bruno lilja foster huskins walker every to be around again...waste of money
the reason they had to play was because of our injuries. You look at any team and if they have 2-3+ regular defenseman out, chance are they'll have their versions of of Gervais, Lilja, Foster, Huskins (who was actually good in his short stint here) or Walker in the line-up

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Old
06-13-2013, 01:41 PM
  #528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyersfan1616 View Post
You could move the lines around and put laughton on 3rd line

Schenn G Ryder
Harts Coots Vora
Clowe Laughton Simmer
Read Talbot Gange
Rinaldo Hall McGinn
Is moving Schenn to wing really a good idea? His natural, and presumably best, position is center. Putting him at wing takes away from his effectiveness and his development. I don't know how easy of a transition it is, either. I'm not saying that it is not an easy transition, just that I don't know if it is or not.

You also risk making Schenn unhappy about his role on the team. Once again, I don't know how much of an issue this is, but it is a possibility. These guys presumably like to play their natural and best positions. Telling him that he's getting moved to wing so Couturier and Laughton and can play center could hinder his development and turn him sour on his place within the organization. Once again, I have to stress that I am not saying that these things will happen, only that they are possibilities.

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Old
06-13-2013, 01:50 PM
  #529
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My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Michael Ryder ($3.500m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Matt Read ($0.900m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Matt Cooke ($1.800m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m) / Tye McGinn ($0.775m)
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Mark Streit ($5.000m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Douglas Murray ($2.500m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m) /
GOALTENDERS
Jonathan Bernier ($2.500m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)

any thoughts on a roster like this...also thought of a guy like Torres on the 4th line??
Re: Ryder - I like him as a player and I would welcome him in Philly, but I suspect a team desperate for offense (think Nashville, Phoenix, or NJ) will be able to offer more money and/or term.

Re: Laughton - I don't think he's ready for 3rd line duties just yet. I'd slot him in at the 4th line C position to start the season and see where things go from there. But I wouldn't be confident expecting him to play in a shutdown role from the start.

Re: Cooke & Lapierre - You can't be serious, especially in regards to Cooke. Lapierre could be a solid 4C option for us, but I'd prefer a guy like Hall or Gordon who can win faceoffs.

Re: Murray & Grossmann - that might qualify as the slowest defense pairing in the history of the world. They would get beat wide consistently and they would be hopeless trying to break the puck out of our zone. Also, the are both lefties.

Re: Bernier - how do you expect we grab Bernier without giving anything up? If you are expecting an offer sheet, don't get your hopes up. The Kings would trade Bernier well before he had the chance of signing an offer sheet if they anticipated one coming.

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Old
06-13-2013, 02:30 PM
  #530
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
Is moving Schenn to wing really a good idea? His natural, and presumably best, position is center. Putting him at wing takes away from his effectiveness and his development. I don't know how easy of a transition it is, either. I'm not saying that it is not an easy transition, just that I don't know if it is or not.

You also risk making Schenn unhappy about his role on the team. Once again, I don't know how much of an issue this is, but it is a possibility. These guys presumably like to play their natural and best positions. Telling him that he's getting moved to wing so Couturier and Laughton and can play center could hinder his development and turn him sour on his place within the organization. Once again, I have to stress that I am not saying that these things will happen, only that they are possibilities.
That's a really good question and a hard one to answer. I think someone else said it best that moving him to wing might be best for the organization and roster, but not to get the absolute best from Schenn. BobbyClarkeFan said it was a decision between molding him into a Mike Richards type player versus a Shane Doan type player and I agree. Either way, I think the coaching staff needs to make a decision so he can develop into that role instead of bouncing him all over the place.

Unfortunately, all Lavi seems to do is change the lines when things get slightly stale instead of the play style. I've said it before and its been mentioned a lot, Lavi is terrible for our young guys' development. Lavi is a great motivational coach if you have a team that's ready to contend for the Cup, but our team isn't and Lavi is a poor fit. I really think he needs to go, I wish we had tried to get Eakins but it seems he's going to the Oilers.

But back to Schenn. While he might be a better fit at center in a vacuum, on this team I think he needs to move to the wing. Assuming we keep Giroux (given), Coots (hopefully) and Laughton (most expendable IMO), Schenn is the one who would be most suited to wing unless we move Giroux back to RW (which could be a great idea but that's a whole other discussion). Schenn probably prefers to play center since he's been their most of his career, but I really doubt he's gonna be sour moving to Giroux's wing (hard to complain about being put on one of the best playmaker's lines).

Either way, with Laughton likely making the jump I think one of Giroux or Schenn needs to move to the wing, and since Schenn and Couturier both aren't good enough at this point to center the first line I think it needs to be Schenn. Moving Couturier to the wing would nullify his best asset (his defense) and keeping him on the third line is likely going to delay (if not stunt) his offensive development. Ideally I think our roster next year should be Giroux, Couts and Laughton down the middle with Schenn on left wing of either of the top two lines. Putting Schenn and Couturier together could be a great idea so that while they continue to develop together they develop better chemistry, but this is something that could cause Schenn to grow a little sour if he doesn't like being moved to wing if he's being moved there to make way for the younger Couturier.

Whatever they do, they should make a decision and stick to it. Changing it up whenever someone goes on a cold streak isn't helping the players' develop or helping lines develop any chemistry.

IMO our best lineup with what we have now would look like:

Schenn - Giroux - Simmonds
Hartnell - Couts - Voracek
Gagne - Laughton - Read
Talbot - Hall - Rinaldo

But who knows what Lavi will do. The only problem I could see with that line-up is under-utilizing Giroux by sticking him with a couple of young streaky players. However, having Hartnell and Simmonds on a line with Giroux would put too much pressure on G as the only one who would be capable of carrying the puck. We saw it this year, Giroux needs someone else on his wing who can also carry the puck because he's too small to create space on his own and gets smothered. Jagr and Voracek were good in this regard, and Schenn could be as well.

Sorry for the long rambling post.


Last edited by blinds: 06-13-2013 at 02:41 PM.
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Old
06-13-2013, 03:41 PM
  #531
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Originally Posted by 96 View Post
Re: Cooke & Lapierre - You can't be serious, especially in regards to Cooke. Lapierre could be a solid 4C option for us, but I'd prefer a guy like Hall or Gordon who can win faceoffs.
Sign Cooke-Lapierre-Torres. Call them the 'Shanny's Speed-Dial' line

SSD!

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Old
06-13-2013, 04:06 PM
  #532
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I couldn't justify having Matt Cooke on this team.

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Old
06-13-2013, 04:13 PM
  #533
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I would actively cheer against Cooke and Torres. I would hope they would get lit up, but that they would get lit up in such a way that the puck would always drift to another Flyer (you know, one who doesn't play to injure people), or constantly to each other so they can get thoroughly crushed over and over. And then the puck could drift into the net for a goal.

Everyone wins.

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Old
06-13-2013, 05:09 PM
  #534
Flyersfan1616
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Resign Gagne Hall Gus
Sign Streit 5m and Ryder 4m
Buyout Bryz and Briere
If you trade Mez we will have 8m to find a goalie and extra Dman


My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Michael Ryder ($4.000m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Simon Gagne ($2.500m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Adam Hall ($0.800m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m)
Tye McGinn ($0.775m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Mark Streit ($5.000m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Erik Gustafsson ($1.000m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
GOALTENDERS
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $58,991,667; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $8,108,333

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Old
06-13-2013, 05:11 PM
  #535
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Someone seriously suggested to get Cooke??? No way in hell...

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Old
06-13-2013, 05:58 PM
  #536
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Rinaldo will be in the line-up. Whether that's still in his under 10 minutes a game pest role or if he'll get some additional playing time and see some time on the PK (think Matt Martin) remains to be seen. Laviolette alluded to wishing he could've given Rinaldo extra playing time down the stretch when he was injured.

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Old
06-13-2013, 07:02 PM
  #537
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I'd like to see:

Schenn/Giroux/Simmonds
Hartnell/Couturier/Voracek
Gagne/Laughton/(McGinn-Read)
Talbot/Hall/Rinaldo

Timonen/Schenn
Streit/Coburn
Gustafsson/Grossman
Lauridsen (or other 7th D)

Bryz/Mason or Mason/Bernier

One of G, Schenn, or Scooter's going to have to leave the center position. Couturier should stay there for his defensive abilities, Giroux's better than either of them at faceoffs, so aiming Schenn to wing could prove a setback, but I still think he'd do well enough with Simmonds and G.

Couturier's had issues developing his offensive game, but Voracek might be able to carry the line and hopefully get Couturier moving offensively.

I can see Laughton handling the 3rd line. At worst, he's on the 4th.

I'd really like to see Hall back--great for the PK and his faceoff ability really helps the 4th line.

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Old
06-13-2013, 07:29 PM
  #538
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I honestly think that Schenn would be a 30 goal scorer every year if he played full time with Giroux. Maybe not this year but the year after for sure IMO

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Old
06-13-2013, 08:09 PM
  #539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
I would actively cheer against Cooke and Torres. I would hope they would get lit up, but that they would get lit up in such a way that the puck would always drift to another Flyer (you know, one who doesn't play to injure people), or constantly to each other so they can get thoroughly crushed over and over. And then the puck could drift into the net for a goal.

Everyone wins.
Pretty much exactly this.

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Old
06-14-2013, 07:50 AM
  #540
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 96 View Post
Re: Ryder - I like him as a player and I would welcome him in Philly, but I suspect a team desperate for offense (think Nashville, Phoenix, or NJ) will be able to offer more money and/or term.

Re: Laughton - I don't think he's ready for 3rd line duties just yet. I'd slot him in at the 4th line C position to start the season and see where things go from there. But I wouldn't be confident expecting him to play in a shutdown role from the start.

Re: Cooke & Lapierre - You can't be serious, especially in regards to Cooke. Lapierre could be a solid 4C option for us, but I'd prefer a guy like Hall or Gordon who can win faceoffs.

Re: Murray & Grossmann - that might qualify as the slowest defense pairing in the history of the world. They would get beat wide consistently and they would be hopeless trying to break the puck out of our zone. Also, the are both lefties.

Re: Bernier - how do you expect we grab Bernier without giving anything up? If you are expecting an offer sheet, don't get your hopes up. The Kings would trade Bernier well before he had the chance of signing an offer sheet if they anticipated one coming.

How often is Grossmann beaten wide? Rarely. I've seen him play extensively both in Dallas and Philly, and I will maintain that his skating doesn't hold him back. He's smart positionally and that's more important than raw speed (or lack thereof).

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Old
06-14-2013, 08:00 AM
  #541
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
I couldn't justify having Matt Cooke on this team.
The team would actually deserve the reputation for ****** baggery they apparently have with other fans. I agree, no thanks.

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Old
06-17-2013, 11:59 PM
  #542
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I'll have another go with the recent signing of Striet.
Read for Bernier.
Could trade MEZ for something as well....


My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Michael Ryder ($3.500m)
Jakub Voracek ($4.250m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Tye McGinn ($0.775m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Chad Larose ($1.700m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Boyd Gordon ($1.500m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) /

DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Mark Streit ($5.250m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m)
Erik Gustafsson ($0.851m) /

GOALTENDERS
Jonathan Bernier ($2.500m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)

OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Buyout: Chris Pronger LTIR
Buyout: Ilya Bryzgalov ($0.000m)
Buyout: Danny Briere ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,767,167; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,332,833


Last edited by dingbathero: 06-18-2013 at 12:10 AM.
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Old
06-18-2013, 12:14 AM
  #543
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CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Simon Gagne ($2.000m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Jason Akeson ($0.900m)
Tye McGinn ($0.775m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Luke Schenn ($3.600m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Bruno Gervais ($0.825m) /
GOALTENDERS
Jaroslav Halak ($3.750m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Buyout: Ilya Bryzgalov ($0.000m)
Buyout: Danny Briere ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,191,667; BONUSES: $2,960,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $5,068,333


Trade Read for Halak

Maybe move a d-man for a forward

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Old
06-18-2013, 12:32 AM
  #544
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilaFlyers View Post
CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Simon Gagne ($2.000m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Jason Akeson ($0.900m)
Tye McGinn ($0.775m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Mark Streit ($5.250m)
Luke Schenn ($3.600m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m) / Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m)
Bruno Gervais ($0.825m) /
GOALTENDERS
Jaroslav Halak ($3.750m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Buyout: Ilya Bryzgalov ($0.000m)
Buyout: Danny Briere ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,191,667; BONUSES: $2,960,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $5,068,333


Trade Read for Halak

Maybe move a d-man for a forward
That's really what our forwards would look like if we traded Read? Ouch.

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Old
06-18-2013, 01:39 AM
  #545
orange is better
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Originally Posted by Bill_Meltzer View Post
How often is Grossmann beaten wide? Rarely. I've seen him play extensively both in Dallas and Philly, and I will maintain that his skating doesn't hold him back. He's smart positionally and that's more important than raw speed (or lack thereof).
This. He and Timonen are the best positional defensemen on the team, and you often won't see players go wide on Grossmann because they know they'll likely end up plastered to the boards.

Id like to see Gus paired with Grossmann for an extended period of time. Fellow countrymen, and Grossmann can cover up for Gus's lack of positional awareness and strength on the boards. If Gus could learn a thing or two from Grossmann and Timonen in regards to positioning, he'd easily be a top 4 defenseman in the NHL.

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Old
06-18-2013, 10:52 AM
  #546
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Hopefully there are a decent amount of buy outs this off season and Homer will have a decent amount of options to go after. Hopefully some at the cheaper level with a higher reward.

If Richards is bought out you know Homer will be going after him. You should also re-sign Gagne to play on that shut down third line. Leino if they want him should come really cheap.

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06-18-2013, 10:54 AM
  #547
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill_Meltzer View Post
How often is Grossmann beaten wide? Rarely. I've seen him play extensively both in Dallas and Philly, and I will maintain that his skating doesn't hold him back. He's smart positionally and that's more important than raw speed (or lack thereof).
You don't have to have a lot of speed to play D. Look at Pronger, the guy was slow, but he was one of the best ever at the position. Positional play is one of if not the most important aspect of playing D.

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Old
06-18-2013, 04:14 PM
  #548
Four Boilermakers
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I was just toying around on Capgeek and came up with a roster for next year that I think would be fun to watch and reasonably affordable. Let me know what you guys think!

Buyouts
1. Ilya Bryzgalov
2. Daniel Briere

Trades
1. Andrej Meszaros for draft picks/prospects (2nd round pick or a middling prospect would be fine)
2. Matt Read for Jonathan Bernier (RFA)

UFA Signings
1. Valtteri Filppula - $4.500m for 4-5 years (versatile C/LW to provide skill and offense, would look terrific alongside Schenn and Simmonds)
2. Simon Gagne - $2.500m for 2 years (great leader/mentor, showed some remaining skill last season, apparently willing to take discount)
3. Chad Larose - $2.500m for 3 years (would help replace the loss of Matt Read, Carolina reportedly letting him walk)

RFA Signings
1. Erik Gustafsson
2. Oliver Lauridsen
3. Jonathan Bernier - $3.00m for 3-4 years

------
Forwards
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Valtteri Filppula ($4.500m) / Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Simon Gagne ($2.500m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Chad Larose ($2.500m)
Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m)

Defensemen
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Mark Streit ($5.250m) / Braydon Coburn ($4.500m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.851m)
Oliver Lauridsen ($0.644m) / Bruno Gervais ($0.825m)

Goaltenders
Jonathan Bernier ($3.000m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)

Buyouts
Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Danny Briere ($0.000m)
Ilya Bryzgalov ($0.000m)
------
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,760,667; BONUSES: $2,800,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,339,333

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06-18-2013, 04:41 PM
  #549
litflyersfan
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Anyone besides me want to give Ray Emery another chance? I really liked the guy when he was here. 1A/1B combo with Mason, really would like to give Mason a chance to rebound. Give Emery a one year deal and go after Lundqvist, Miller, Hiller or Halak next off-season. Not a fan of the Bernier-Read idea. I wouldn't give LA anything more than we got for Bob or what Tampa gave for Lindback.

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Old
06-18-2013, 04:42 PM
  #550
MRxBLACK
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No way I trade Read for Bernier.

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