HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

2013 NHL Entry Draft Talk 11.0

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-14-2013, 05:27 PM
  #476
Marc the Habs Fan
Moderator
 
Marc the Habs Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Longueuil
Country: Canada
Posts: 71,644
vCash: 723
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamp View Post
Observations:
11 out of 15 defenseman panned out for a total of 73% which is really good, especially offensive defensemans(Beaulieu)
1rst or 2nd overall overage players are all superstars(Seth Jones should mathematically be one too)
Zherdev and Pouliot were the only top5 picks to not pan out, out of 14 players.
1 of 4 goalies (Fleury, Montoya, Pickard, McCollum) panned out (yet), Pickard and McCollum are still young. Fleury was picked 1rst overall and is... mehhh
From 6 to 10: Kadri, Michalek and Burmistrov are the stand out players out of 12. Tweeners like Wilson, Bailey, Boedker are the other noticeable ones. (25% chance solid Top6 players, 58% chance tweeners and better)
Forwards in the 20-30 range: Don’t expect them to build a bigger offensive game than they had in juniors. If you wonder if their offensive abilities will translate, it probably won’t.
(Sounds exactly like Gauthier)
Good observations, something to keep in mind when discussing the late 1994's in this year's crop. It sure doesn't seem like being a late birthday is something teams should shy away from. If the guy is good, take him.

One minor quibble: I would say Colin Wilson is a better player than Burmistrov, who has completely fallen out of favor in WPG. Wilson had a strong season this year on a weak Preds offence and should be ready to be a quality top 6 guy for good starting this fall.

Marc the Habs Fan is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 05:35 PM
  #477
ChesterNimitz
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: CinCPac
Country: Midway Islands
Posts: 661
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Runner77 View Post
And we should tread carefully. Anyone born in Quebec is a "local" as far as I'm concerned. There is a world of a difference between a "French Canadian" and a "Quebecquer".

Bergevin should favor a Quebecquer (someone born in Quebec) where talent is similar or within the same value tier.

Race or ethnic origin should have nothing to do with the process.
Do you think any other team in the NHL spends so much time and effort on the issue of ethnicity? I've been a fan of Montreal for over 55 years. This issue will never die. While other teams attempt to acquire the best players we have an underlining parochial urgency or need to select the 'right' players. It is as if we are going into a fight with one hand tied behind our back. You would think with having won only two Stanley Cups since 1979, we would be more focused on getting the best player and not the right player. At one time the Montreal Canadiens were regarded as a sports franchise on a par with the New York Yankees. If our current level of ineptitude continues we will soon be regarded on a par with the Toronto Maple Leafs. How the mighty have fallen. But let's get those 'local' boys.

ChesterNimitz is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 05:49 PM
  #478
S Bah
Registered User
 
S Bah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: victoria bc
Country: Wales
Posts: 7,755
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
Do you think any other team in the NHL spends so much time and effort on the issue of ethnicity? I've been a fan of Montreal for over 55 years. This issue will never die. While other teams attempt to acquire the best players we have an underlining parochial urgency or need to select the 'right' players. It is as if we are going into a fight with one hand tied behind our back. You would think with having won only two Stanley Cups since 1979, we would be more focused on getting the best player and not the right player. At one time the Montreal Canadiens were regarded as a sports franchise on a par with the New York Yankees. If our current level of ineptitude continues we will soon be regarded on a par with the Toronto Maple Leafs. How the mighty have fallen. But let's get those 'local' boys.
I don't understand your point, do you think we should have both hands tied to make things fair, cause you can still headbutt or boot sense into them. Does anybody have any idea where Felix Girard is ranked, I didn't see him ranked at all?

S Bah is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 06:01 PM
  #479
Blind Gardien
nexus of the crisis
 
Blind Gardien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Four Winds Bar
Country: France
Posts: 20,538
vCash: 500
Anyway, if there was ever a season to break ties on Quebecoisiousness, this has to be it. Such an awesome draft year for QMJHL talent! I won't bat an eyelash if the Habs show a "lean" in this direction (4-5 picks?)... or don't. Either way. It's a nice draft class.

Blind Gardien is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 06:08 PM
  #480
S Bah
Registered User
 
S Bah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: victoria bc
Country: Wales
Posts: 7,755
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
Anyway, if there was ever a season to break ties on Quebecoisiousness, this has to be it. Such an awesome draft year for QMJHL talent! I won't bat an eyelash if the Habs show a "lean" in this direction (4-5 picks?)... or don't. Either way. It's a nice draft class.
My feelings exactly, Morin would look great in the Bleu, Blanc et Rouge. I wonder about Gauthier, how much can be attributed to fatigue? He sure can turn it on at times.

S Bah is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 06:14 PM
  #481
Laboeuf
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 138
vCash: 500
If you like Jake Gardener then Nathan Beaulieu is pretty much the same player.

Laboeuf is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 06:20 PM
  #482
ChoseLa
Registered User
 
ChoseLa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Country: Martinique
Posts: 5,850
vCash: 500
Sure we should draft any Quebecois english or french, but don't tell me that Toews or Giroux wouldn't have made a better story than Getzlaf or Jason Spezza. So French-Canadians from outside Quebec are a great option too or even maritimers who have played in the Q.

Having said that, i'm mighty proud to be a Quebecer - i'm a huge fan of french players throughout the league - but seriously they should never choose a french player over anyone who's better and i don't believe they will do it. I could easily live with a team that hasn't any french players on it.

ChoseLa is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 06:27 PM
  #483
Blind Gardien
nexus of the crisis
 
Blind Gardien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Four Winds Bar
Country: France
Posts: 20,538
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChoseLa View Post
Sure we should draft any Quebecois english or french, but don't tell me that Toews or Giroux wouldn't have made a better story than Getzlaf or Jason Spezza. So French-Canadians from outside Quebec are a great option too or even maritimers who have played in the Q.

Having said that, i'm mighty proud to be a Quebecer - i'm a huge fan of french players throughout the league - but seriously they should never choose a french player over anyone who's better and i don't believe they will do it. I could easily live with a team that hasn't any french players on it.
Thing is, you seldom "know" or even really have a strong case to "suspect" that a given player at a given draft position is really better than a few other candidates or not. This year, there are Q'ers at a number of positions who fit into those blurred lines. Obviously nobody takes a knowingly inferior player for dumb reasons. But when it becomes a tossup... which the uncertainties in the NHL entry draft virtually assure at most draft positions... why not take the Q'er. Hopefully there is no reignition of age-old debates there. Just in the sense that "if all else is equal"... why de heck not? I really like this year's Q draft class, anyway. I don't even watch the Q. Just like what I hear, basically.

Blind Gardien is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 06:29 PM
  #484
phillytennis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 290
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChoseLa View Post
Sure we should draft any Quebecois english or french, but don't tell me that Toews or Giroux wouldn't have made a better story than Getzlaf or Jason Spezza. So French-Canadians from outside Quebec are a great option too or even maritimers who have played in the Q.

Having said that, i'm mighty proud to be a Quebecer - i'm a huge fan of french players throughout the league - but seriously they should never choose a french player over anyone who's better and i don't believe they will do it. I could easily live with a team that hasn't any french players on it.
Agreed...though the Canadiens should have the BEST knowledge of the players being developed in their own backyard...in the Q!!!

phillytennis is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 06:45 PM
  #485
BrimStone64
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,965
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChesterNimitz View Post
Do you think any other team in the NHL spends so much time and effort on the issue of ethnicity? I've been a fan of Montreal for over 55 years. This issue will never die. While other teams attempt to acquire the best players we have an underlining parochial urgency or need to select the 'right' players. It is as if we are going into a fight with one hand tied behind our back. You would think with having won only two Stanley Cups since 1979, we would be more focused on getting the best player and not the right player. At one time the Montreal Canadiens were regarded as a sports franchise on a par with the New York Yankees. If our current level of ineptitude continues we will soon be regarded on a par with the Toronto Maple Leafs. How the mighty have fallen. But let's get those 'local' boys.
I disagree...I feel Quebec players have a better awareness about playing in Montreal hockey mad enivorment. We enjoyed our best success since '79 drafting Q players later. Carbonneau, Lemieux, Roy, Desjardins, etc... These were not top picks but fit in well here

BrimStone64 is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 06:59 PM
  #486
S Bah
Registered User
 
S Bah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: victoria bc
Country: Wales
Posts: 7,755
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillytennis View Post
Agreed...though the Canadiens should have the BEST knowledge of the players being developed in their own backyard...in the Q!!!
Bergevin has made Quebec a priority since taking the GM post for the Habs. They have more scouts in the Quebec hockey scene than ever in the past. If there is a player that is the BPA when the Habs choose, from Quebec, they will know about him and draft that player.

Given that knowledge, I'm quite content feeling the Bruins won't be drafting the next Bergeron while Bergevin is running the show in Montreal. Which is why I'm looking forward to his 2nd Entry Draft since becoming the Habs GM.

S Bah is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:02 PM
  #487
WeThreeKings
DJ Salem
 
WeThreeKings's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Halifax
Country: Canada
Posts: 53,313
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to WeThreeKings
1 out of 6 picks for Bergevin produces a QMJHL player.

So basically expect 1 and a half Quebecers this year.

WeThreeKings is online now  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:12 PM
  #488
yianik
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,630
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
1 out of 6 picks for Bergevin produces a QMJHL player.

So basically expect 1 and a half Quebecers this year.
My hope is it will be Morin, he is about 1.5 Quebecers.

yianik is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:12 PM
  #489
Estimated_Prophet
Registered User
 
Estimated_Prophet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,498
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laboeuf View Post
If you like Jake Gardener then Nathan Beaulieu is pretty much the same player.
Gardiner is as soft as a wet tissue..........Beaulieu has a nasty streak.

Estimated_Prophet is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:30 PM
  #490
Grant McCagg
@grantmccagg
 
Grant McCagg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,930
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
Anyway, if there was ever a season to break ties on Quebecoisiousness, this has to be it. Such an awesome draft year for QMJHL talent! I won't bat an eyelash if the Habs show a "lean" in this direction (4-5 picks?)... or don't. Either way. It's a nice draft class.
Very true.

I think it may be the best Q draft class ever, certainly depth-wise. There are no Marios, but Drouin may be the best Quebecois draft prospect (in his draft year) since Mario, and there could be a dozen or more Q players picked in the top 50 alone.

I didn't like Daigle or Turgeon more than Drouin.....Lecavalier would be the largest argument I think, but I'm not sure even he has the offensive upside that Drouin has. I think Drouin has the best chance of anyone to be the next NHLer to have 100 assists in a season (it's a select group), particularly if he gets drafted by Tampa Bay and plays beside Stamkos.

We'll be seeing "Drouin to Stamkos" way too much over the next few years folks..gonna be in the Habs' division, and may well be the deadliest duo in the league, supported by some third wheel named St. Louis.

And I haven't even mentioned MacKinnon.....

Grant McCagg is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:30 PM
  #491
CHarlie
They feed me CHicken
 
CHarlie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,936
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Gardiner is as soft as a wet tissue..........Beaulieu has a nasty streak.
Bubbas going to take care of that.

CHarlie is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:34 PM
  #492
phillytennis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 290
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by yianik View Post
My hope is it will be Morin, he is about 1.5 Quebecers.
I am really hoping The Habs pick Dauphin at 34 and Poirier at 36. Hopefully, they can add a pick in the 40--50 range and pick Bailey or Dickinson...Diaby or Subban at ...55
Hashing at 71...Desrosiers at 85.

phillytennis is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:34 PM
  #493
WeThreeKings
DJ Salem
 
WeThreeKings's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Halifax
Country: Canada
Posts: 53,313
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to WeThreeKings
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grant McCagg View Post
Very true.

I think it may be the best Q draft class ever, certainly depth-wise. There are no Marios, but Drouin may be the best Quebecois draft prospect (in his draft year) since Mario, and there could be a dozen or more Q players picked in the top 50 alone.

I didn't like Daigle or Turgeon more than Drouin.....Lecavalier would be the largest argument I think, but I'm not sure even he has the offensive upside that Drouin has. I think Drouin has the best chance of anyone to be the next NHLer to have 100 assists in a season (it's a select group), particularly if he gets drafted by Tampa Bay and plays beside Stamkos.

We'll be seeing "Drouin to Stamkos" way too much over the next few years folks..gonna be in the Habs' division, and may well be the deadliest duo in the league, supported by some third wheel named St. Louis.

And I haven't even mentioned MacKinnon.....
One thing about Drouin though, as great of a playmaker as he is, he's going to have to make sure he uses his shot more. He has a nice wrist shot, deadly and accurate, but he doesn't use it as much as he should. I don't want him to develop Thornton-itis. If he learns to keep goalies honest with his shot, he'll be that more dynamic.

Love the kid though. His hockey sense and compete level is off the charts. He's so damn elusive too.

WeThreeKings is online now  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:53 PM
  #494
Nitehowl
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: BC Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 982
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillytennis View Post
I am really hoping The Habs pick Dauphin at 34 and Poirier at 36. Hopefully, they can add a pick in the 40--50 range and pick Bailey or Dickinson...Diaby or Subban at ...55
Hashing at 71...Desrosiers at 85.

Spent the last couple hours researching this guy....haven't found him yet,anyone help

Nitehowl is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 07:58 PM
  #495
FisherKing
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: New Brunswick
Posts: 1,549
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Seems I'm the only Carrier fan around here....Big fan that is. Not 1st round, but DEFINITE 2nd round. And not 55 as he should be gone.
Not true WS. I'm completely in agreement with you on Carrier.

I do not get the chance to watch and analyse these guys like you and others, so I don't presume to give "learned opinions" on these guys, but rather just "impressions" I get from what little I see of them as well as the reading I do and opinions of those on here who I feel are much more "in the know" than I am.

That said, my "impressions" are often pretty accurate. Case in point was Zach Parise. I only got to see him play one period of hockey before he was drafted, but it was all I needed to see to explain his outrageous stats (over 200 pts as recall) his draft year. After seeing him, I had him ranked in the Top 5 for that draft and personally would have taken him 1st if I had been making the selection. I was shocked when he didn't go top 5. The rest, as they say, is history.

So, back to Carrier. I haven't seen him play a lot but what little I did see reminded me so much of a young Todd Bertuzzi that it was scary. Now if Grant's opinion of Carrier is shared by Timmins, then I think you are right; he won't be chosen by the Habs, and personally, I think that would be a grave mistake. As I've said on here before, I don't live and die by stats on these guys. Stats can be very "telling" - they can also be misleading. Still, I find Carrier's stats interesting to say the least. He only played 34 games due to a high ankle sprain and collected 42 points in those 34 games. Pretty good numbers and consistent with what little I saw of him. The stats on Carrier, however, get a bit more interesting though when you take a closer look. He only got 2 points his last 10 games when it seems his game (along with his entire team's)"went south" so to speak. I do wonder if this fall in production contributed to the concerns Grant expressed. I guess only Grant could answer that.

Anyway, I suck at math, but when I "do the math" on Carrier, and subtract his last 10 games and the 2 points he got during those games, it turns out that Carrier collected 40 points in his first 24 games. Those aren't "pretty good" stats, they're VERY VERY GOOD stats.

I guess my feeling on Carrier is that if the Habs are going to make a mistake on him, I'd rather they make the mistake of taking him at 34 or 36 if he's there than make the mistake of not taking him. Getting him at 55 would be fantastic but I don't see him lasting until then. I'm pretty sure you and I aren't the only ones impressed by Carrier. I suspect there's a few GMs and Head Scouts that will take a flier on him well before 55.

Anyway, just my 2 cents.


Last edited by FisherKing: 06-14-2013 at 08:05 PM.
FisherKing is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 08:09 PM
  #496
phillytennis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 290
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitehowl View Post
Spent the last couple hours researching this guy....haven't found him yet,anyone help

Sorry...I mean't Hudson Fasching...an American...U-18.

phillytennis is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 08:11 PM
  #497
Top Corner2
Registered User
 
Top Corner2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,935
vCash: 500
Anyone have a take on Sanford? I haven't seen him play...

Top Corner2 is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 08:18 PM
  #498
Top Corner2
Registered User
 
Top Corner2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,935
vCash: 500
I hope we take some Q players, but I'm also confident that Bergevin & Timmins will do the right thing & draft the guys they know & like best!


Of the Q guys that I know I really like Dauphin & Morin!

Top Corner2 is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 08:35 PM
  #499
S Bah
Registered User
 
S Bah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: victoria bc
Country: Wales
Posts: 7,755
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grant McCagg View Post
Very true.

I think it may be the best Q draft class ever, certainly depth-wise. There are no Marios, but Drouin may be the best Quebecois draft prospect (in his draft year) since Mario, and there could be a dozen or more Q players picked in the top 50 alone.

I didn't like Daigle or Turgeon more than Drouin.....Lecavalier would be the largest argument I think, but I'm not sure even he has the offensive upside that Drouin has. I think Drouin has the best chance of anyone to be the next NHLer to have 100 assists in a season (it's a select group), particularly if he gets drafted by Tampa Bay and plays beside Stamkos.

We'll be seeing "Drouin to Stamkos" way too much over the next few years folks..gonna be in the Habs' division, and may well be the deadliest duo in the league, supported by some third wheel named St. Louis.

And I haven't even mentioned MacKinnon.....
I know Bergevin is already becoming the Best Exec in the NHL, but he would instantly be past that level if he could manage drafting Drouin.

S Bah is offline  
Old
06-14-2013, 08:59 PM
  #500
phillytennis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 290
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Top Corner2 View Post
I hope we take some Q players, but I'm also confident that Bergevin & Timmins will do the right thing & draft the guys they know & like best!


Of the Q guys that I know I really like Dauphin & Morin!
Gauthier is grittier than he is given credit for. He and Dauphin were the two best Canadian players in the gold medal game in the U-18 game against the US.
Also like...Emile Poirier...great player!!!

phillytennis is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:57 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2017 All Rights Reserved.