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Three cheers for Gary Bettman

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Old
10-13-2006, 06:43 PM
  #51
Hackett
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Quote:
Originally Posted by znk View Post
Look at what happend to the marlins after they won.
Yeah, the ownership there had a firesale. What's your point?

Like I said, both systems are flawed.

The only point I was trying to make is that if its parity that the league is going for, you can look at the past champions for baseball and say that you dont necessarily need a hard cap system to achieve parity.

The obvious advantages for the bigger markets is that they can sustain a higher level of play from year to year due to their high budgets. That is why the smaller markets have to do a better job of scouting prospects like the A's.

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10-13-2006, 06:52 PM
  #52
hendextall
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Originally Posted by Burnside_1 View Post
the sport is basically dead in the US. The second biggest market( or third?) in the league only has a handful of local games shown live on TV. I don't think any commissoner would let that happen. And same thing for the Islanders situation... Too bad because in both cases the fans suffer from this.
This is the biggest problem with Bettman, he can't figure out how to market the sport to the US. I agree he did clean up a lot of his own mess, but until he can figure out how to market the sport right he will be a failure. Especialy right now that we have to great young players in Crosby and Ovechkin. These 2 players should be used to market the new nhl, along with other great players. The nhl needs to put some faces on the game that americans can begin to recognize. Hockey is growing in the States, but they need to give it a little more of a push to put the sport over the edge.

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Old
10-13-2006, 09:01 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Hackett View Post
Well, its like picking the lesser of 2 evils. There is no perfect system that I am aware of.

the salary cap has alot of flaws too. I think it punishes good organizations. (Teams that draft well and trade well and then lose thier own developed talent a few years later strictly for cap reasons)

On the other hand, the pre lockout CBA gave a huge advantage to larger market teams.



But even under the old system, small market or large market, teams didn't have to "cheat". It was simply their choice to cheat because the refs were letting them and most teams tried to model themselves like the devils. There were exceptions, Edmonton was one of the fastest teams in the league those years and relied on their up tempo style to win games despite their budget.

And I think teams can win championships even if their budget does not compare to other markets. They just have to do a better job at developing talent.

Baseball has whacky disparity in terms of team budgets but championship wise, there has been alot of parity since 2000


2000 - New York Yankees

2001 - Arizona Diamondbacks

2002 - Anaheim Angles?

2003 - Florida Marlins ?

2004 - Boston Red Sox

2005 - Chicago White Sox

2006 - will have a new champion (mets, cards, A's or Tigers)

Case in point, I dont know which system is better
I know this argument and I've never agreed with it. You basically need to have a team full of young stars to even have a chance and then you get one or two years at the top and lose everyone to free agency and have to start over again. That's no good. That was the situation with the Expos and why everyone lost interest because we kept building up a good team and had to lose them all.

I like the cap and I think as the game continues to grow, like it's doing (I've been to games in the US since the cap was instituted and it's working very well regardless of the comments on here), then the cap will rise up to 60 mil or so where it belongs and maybe beyond that. 44 is very low.

Once Chicago FINALLY gets its act together (unless Wirtz interferes yet again), and once LA and NYR are consistently competitive, it will lift the whole league up to the stature it enjoyed in the mid-90s. Then they'll be cooking again down in the US (and this time it won't threaten the game in Canada).

I just started the thread because it's about time that somebody gave Bettman credit. This guy does not get any credit whatsoever, only grief. It's ridiculous.

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Old
10-14-2006, 02:52 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by raketheleaves View Post
I know this argument and I've never agreed with it. You basically need to have a team full of young stars to even have a chance and then you get one or two years at the top and lose everyone to free agency and have to start over again. That's no good. That was the situation with the Expos and why everyone lost interest because we kept building up a good team and had to lose them all.

I like the cap and I think as the game continues to grow, like it's doing (I've been to games in the US since the cap was instituted and it's working very well regardless of the comments on here), then the cap will rise up to 60 mil or so where it belongs and maybe beyond that. 44 is very low.

Once Chicago FINALLY gets its act together (unless Wirtz interferes yet again), and once LA and NYR are consistently competitive, it will lift the whole league up to the stature it enjoyed in the mid-90s. Then they'll be cooking again down in the US (and this time it won't threaten the game in Canada).

I just started the thread because it's about time that somebody gave Bettman credit. This guy does not get any credit whatsoever, only grief. It's ridiculous.
and punishing a team like ottawa for making shrewd trades and good draft picks is wrong too. They lost havlat for a lesser player. Simply because of the cap.

We've replaced one flawed system with another flawed system. After we get past that, its a matter of opinion for which system you believe is the lesser of two evils.

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10-14-2006, 04:59 AM
  #55
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Unfortunetly the dreaded Trap(or left-wing lock and other forms of stopping plays and players) still exist. As long as it's still there we will never have the wide-open exciting hockey that we crave and deserve. They wonder why it's not doing better in the US? Let the talented players breath! Let them have space. It's not by having a hundred penalities in a game that it's going to give us better hockey.

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10-14-2006, 11:55 AM
  #56
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What I dont like that he's ushered in are refs blowing whistles for every damn time a player falls to the ice or gets touched. This aint basketball.

I wanna see an increase in fighting, and I want to see bloodshed on the ice when rivalry games take place. Every time you're about to see the intensity on the ice rise up, the refs try cooling it down by calling a frikkin penalty!
It's almost as if the higher-ups are afraid of what the NHl once was back in the 80's, when scoring was very high, and still managed to incoroporate tough guys as well. I guess there are too many softies now so the scoring is high, but toughness levels off. Due to the invasion of so many euros.

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10-14-2006, 01:41 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hendextall View Post
This is the biggest problem with Bettman, he can't figure out how to market the sport to the US. I agree he did clean up a lot of his own mess, but until he can figure out how to market the sport right he will be a failure. Especialy right now that we have to great young players in Crosby and Ovechkin. These 2 players should be used to market the new nhl, along with other great players. The nhl needs to put some faces on the game that americans can begin to recognize. Hockey is growing in the States, but they need to give it a little more of a push to put the sport over the edge.
Try being a hockey fan in San Diego. No love from the media. But, there are fans here. The Gulls (ECHL) just folded, but they would pull 10,000 fans in for a Sat night game.

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Old
10-14-2006, 02:03 PM
  #58
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I went to California some years ago, when the Ducks' arena was still called the Arrowhead Pond, I went there to catch a game, didn't bother to secure tickets since I knew they never packed the place... and once I got there, some guy working there told me, as improbable as it may seem, that the game was sold out. I was told, minutes after, that they always closed many sections behind the television cameras, and packed the lower sections in front of them, so that the arena seemed full night in and night out.

Hockey just doesn't belong there...

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Old
10-28-2006, 06:53 PM
  #59
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LOL 10,000 fans and you fold? How about this! Try welfare fights for baby food the rest of us will have to pay for. At least I'll get something for my tax money.

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10-28-2006, 07:00 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by znk View Post
He got a salary cap...and that's good enough for me.
Exactly... It may not be a golden age, but it is the end of the crappy era of Detroit, Colorado, New York, Toronto and the like all buying teams while the smaller markets get the crap kicked out of them year after year.

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10-28-2006, 09:09 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hackett View Post
and punishing a team like ottawa for making shrewd trades and good draft picks is wrong too. They lost havlat for a lesser player. Simply because of the cap.

We've replaced one flawed system with another flawed system. After we get past that, its a matter of opinion for which system you believe is the lesser of two evils.
I'd agree that every system is flawed, but I don't think I agree that under this system, good teams are punished.

I haven't seen NJ, or Detroit punished. Both are excellent organizations that were the cream of the crop before and after the cap was implemented. Both have a plethora of young players and players who have broken out since the cap was implemented.

Carolina won the Cup and managed to sign the majority of its players. And the ones that walked, didn't walk away with huge contracts from other clubs. Carolina could've afforded them.


I think Ottawa's a unique case here. I don't think they lost Havlat because of the salary cap. Rather, I think they lost him because he wanted to be the go-to-guy, and he was relegated largely to third-line duty in Ottawa.

Added to that (or, a part of that), Ottawa's being terribly mismanaged (IMO).

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Old
10-28-2006, 09:15 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montrealer View Post
You know what? I think the people who ***** and moan about the new game being boring should put up or shut up. Either stop watching the game or admit that you're still entertained.

I couldn't watch large stretches of hockey back in the dark ages. If you want clutching/grabbing/0-40-5 records after being down by 1 after 2 periods, well, sorry. This isn't your game anymore.

If I have to choose between a bunch of Tie Domis and a bunch of Saku Koivus, I know which one I'll pick.
I'll add to that: There's no way the Habs were back in this game tonight under the old rules.

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Old
10-28-2006, 09:18 PM
  #63
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Salary Cap = Equal level of playing field throughout teams. Brings in more revenue, more money to the city and the team.

Which hopefully can ensure Canadian teams don't worry about bankruptcy as muc anymore.

Yeah, I'm happy with the change.

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Old
10-29-2006, 10:33 AM
  #64
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F Bettman

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