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Habs' off-season moves (all trades, proposals & free agent talk here) V

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Old
06-15-2013, 12:58 PM
  #576
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Originally Posted by Jabba11 View Post
What do you guys think of Tim Thomas? Could he be a good backup goalie?
We have a backup goaltender signed for the next two years. We don't need a fruitcake like Thomas and have more pressing needs.

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06-15-2013, 01:55 PM
  #577
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TSN just said that if Bryan Bickell goes to FA, Marc Bergervin will be the first GM calling. Bergervin scouted and brought Bickell into the league. Bergervin also brought in Andrew Shaw and Brandon Saad and they're doing quite well.

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06-15-2013, 02:06 PM
  #578
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TSN just said that if Bryan Bickell goes to FA, Marc Bergervin will be the first GM calling. Bergervin scouted and brought Bickell into the league. Bergervin also brought in Andrew Shaw and Brandon Saad and they're doing quite well.
at fair money

u cant have a max30- 40 point player making 4 mil

he is on a great team with stars right now skewing his value

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06-15-2013, 02:10 PM
  #579
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Originally Posted by Jabba11 View Post
What do you guys think of Tim Thomas? Could he be a good backup goalie?
Thomas is no backup . He'll be the starter so you can imagine the problems that starts . He's also a lightning rod for controversy , a right wing Christian Republican and Montreal might not fit. Talent wise I'd take him but its more complicated.

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06-15-2013, 02:16 PM
  #580
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Remember when the UFA age dropped from 31 to 27 and it promised better younger free agents entering their prime years . This year it's bottom of the barrel.

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06-15-2013, 02:19 PM
  #581
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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Thomas is no backup . He'll be the starter so you can imagine the problems that starts . He's also a lightning rod for controversy , a right wing Christian Republican and Montreal might not fit. Talent wise I'd take him but its more complicated.
LOL, like we need a guy who has inherent controversy built into him in Montreal. Canada is too left wing and secular for him anyway, hed freak.

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06-15-2013, 02:20 PM
  #582
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Originally Posted by onemorecup View Post
at fair money

u cant have a max30- 40 point player making 4 mil

he is on a great team with stars right now skewing his value
This is true, and it is also true that this ufa group is weaker thazn in years past....but.....I would rather give that $ to him than kaberle...and I see the cap going up dramatically the following year.

But, we shall see

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06-15-2013, 02:23 PM
  #583
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Bickell is the sexy choice right now. But i'm worried he turns out to be the next Fernando Pisani (flash in the pan for 1 playoff). Yes Pisani had health issues, but I'm not sold on Bickell keeping up this kind of good pace during a season, let alone another playoff. I wouldn't be opposed to taking a chance on him, but it really does boil down to how much cash it would take to land him. He can't be any worse than Moen was this season.

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06-15-2013, 02:50 PM
  #584
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There is alot of posting about Gorges. Is he a character guy? Yes. Is he a leader? Probably. Is he a top-4 defenseman? In a bubble team, probably, but not on a contender. Is he a special teams guy? Absolutely a beast at penalty killing. Is he worth his contract? Hmm, a good question. Probably not, because as a 5th/6th D he earns much, but i think we can use him in the top-4, if we carefully pick his partner, so then his salary is OK.

Ideally our defense, with Emelin healthy should look something like this:
Subban-Emelin
x player-Gorges
Markov-Tinordi
Subban takes a hard hitting partner that can log big minutes and help him clearing the net infront of Price. Gorges takes a shut down partner (Scuderi would be perfect) and take on tough match ups, and special units like penalty killing. Markov is protected while mentoring Tinordi and maybe this tandem is a difference maker in many nights. When Markov's contract is up, Beaulieu can easily be brought up at the 3rd unit. Bouillion and Drewiskie can fill the 7th/8th D role.

Probably you all have noticed that there is no Diaz in the line up. Exactly, i think that he cant be paired with Gorges, and i dont think he is a top-4 defensemen, nor a bottom line one because of his size, and physical approach of the game. I feel that he has some trade value thats why i hope we move him now, taking back something sagnificant in return.

I dont know if Scuderi is available or willing to play here, and i think that it will cost us an above 4M figure to land him. Actually he is the only one that interests me in the UFA pool (for the Gorges partner role) and the only backup plan is the trade route. Obviously we cant expect to trade Diaz for that kind of player, but maybe a package of Diaz+Desharnais (<5M) can have some value in landing the perfect partner for Gorges. Some suggestions:

Desharnais+Diaz for Bieksa (VAN)
Desharnais+Diaz for Johnson (CBJ)
Desharnais+Diaz for Hjalmarsson (CHI)
Desharnais+Diaz for Coburn (PHI)
Desharnais+Diaz for Alzner (WSH)

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06-15-2013, 02:53 PM
  #585
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GRECOHAB View Post
There is alot of posting about Gorges. Is he a character guy? Yes. Is he a leader? Probably. Is he a top-4 defenseman? In a bubble team, probably, but not on a contender. Is he a special teams guy? Absolutely a beast at penalty killing. Is he worth his contract? Hmm, a good question. Probably not, because as a 5th/6th D he earns much, but i think we can use him in the top-4, if we carefully pick his partner, so then his salary is OK.

Ideally our defense, with Emelin healthy should look something like this:
Subban-Emelin
x player-Gorges
Markov-Tinordi
Subban takes a hard hitting partner that can log big minutes and help him clearing the net infront of Price. Gorges takes a shut down partner (Scuderi would be perfect) and take on tough match ups, and special units like penalty killing. Markov is protected while mentoring Tinordi and maybe this tandem is a difference maker in many nights. When Markov's contract is up, Beaulieu can easily be brought up at the 3rd unit. Bouillion and Drewiskie can fill the 7th/8th D role.

Probably you all have noticed that there is no Diaz in the line up. Exactly, i think that he cant be paired with Gorges, and i dont think he is a top-4 defensemen, nor a bottom line one because of his size, and physical approach of the game. I feel that he has some trade value thats why i hope we move him now, taking back something sagnificant in return.

I dont know if Scuderi is available or willing to play here, and i think that it will cost us an above 4M figure to land him. Actually he is the only one that interests me in the UFA pool (for the Gorges partner role) and the only backup plan is the trade route. Obviously we cant expect to trade Diaz for that kind of player, but maybe a package of Diaz+Desharnais (<5M) can have some value in landing the perfect partner for Gorges. Some suggestions:

Desharnais+Diaz for Bieksa (VAN)
Desharnais+Diaz for Johnson (CBJ)
Desharnais+Diaz for Hjalmarsson (CHI)

Desharnais+Diaz for Coburn (PHI)
Desharnais+Diaz for Alzner (WSH)


No chance of happening. They are WAY too good for the package we're giving up.

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Old
06-15-2013, 02:57 PM
  #586
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Even the trade with Vancouver makes no sense, they have a log jam of defenseman and they're really really soft down the middle (if they re-sign Derek Roy). Adding Desharnais to that group would make them one of the easiest team to play against.

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06-15-2013, 03:43 PM
  #587
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Bergevin to Pursue Bryan Bickell bigtime!!

Just seen a video on tsn.ca. It had pierre lebrun basically saying that the chicago blackhawks were going to have their work cut out for them trying to re-sign bickell and mentioned to watche for bergy to pursue him....bot drastically over pay him, but definitely go hard after him....i for one am super jacked about this

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06-15-2013, 04:07 PM
  #588
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Gorges is a top4 dman on any team in the league, to say otherwise is only to exhibit how little you understand the mechanics of the game of hockey.

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Old
06-15-2013, 04:08 PM
  #589
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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Remember when the UFA age dropped from 31 to 27 and it promised better younger free agents entering their prime years . This year it's bottom of the barrel.
Those stupid 10+ year contract killed any chance of that happening.

But with a lot of dumb GM's giving a lot of their good young players 5-6 year deals after their ELC instead of bridge contracts, guys like, Ryan, Eberle,Hall, E.Kane, Stamkos, Taveras, Benn, and I think Kane and Toews also, all their contracts are up at 26-28 and will be UFA's.

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06-15-2013, 04:09 PM
  #590
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Originally Posted by GRECOHAB View Post
There is alot of posting about Gorges. Is he a character guy? Yes. Is he a leader? Probably. Is he a top-4 defenseman? In a bubble team, probably, but not on a contender. Is he a special teams guy? Absolutely a beast at penalty killing. Is he worth his contract? Hmm, a good question. Probably not, because as a 5th/6th D he earns much, but i think we can use him in the top-4, if we carefully pick his partner, so then his salary is OK.

Ideally our defense, with Emelin healthy should look something like this:
Subban-Emelin
x player-Gorges
Markov-Tinordi
Subban takes a hard hitting partner that can log big minutes and help him clearing the net infront of Price. Gorges takes a shut down partner (Scuderi would be perfect) and take on tough match ups, and special units like penalty killing. Markov is protected while mentoring Tinordi and maybe this tandem is a difference maker in many nights. When Markov's contract is up, Beaulieu can easily be brought up at the 3rd unit. Bouillion and Drewiskie can fill the 7th/8th D role.

Probably you all have noticed that there is no Diaz in the line up. Exactly, i think that he cant be paired with Gorges, and i dont think he is a top-4 defensemen, nor a bottom line one because of his size, and physical approach of the game. I feel that he has some trade value thats why i hope we move him now, taking back something sagnificant in return.

I dont know if Scuderi is available or willing to play here, and i think that it will cost us an above 4M figure to land him. Actually he is the only one that interests me in the UFA pool (for the Gorges partner role) and the only backup plan is the trade route. Obviously we cant expect to trade Diaz for that kind of player, but maybe a package of Diaz+Desharnais (<5M) can have some value in landing the perfect partner for Gorges. Some suggestions:

Desharnais+Diaz for Bieksa (VAN)
Desharnais+Diaz for Johnson (CBJ)
Desharnais+Diaz for Hjalmarsson (CHI)
Desharnais+Diaz for Coburn (PHI)
Desharnais+Diaz for Alzner (WSH)
guys wake uo u cant trade chicken **** and get back chicken salad

Dias and DD are 2 players that have no value to a good team looking at getting better

they are not built for the playoffs , and never will be

thats why MB better not resign Dias and team him up with the rest of the inept defenders on our team

DD I have said enough what he worth ..a bag of doritos

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06-15-2013, 04:12 PM
  #591
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
Gorges is a top4 dman on any team in the league, to say otherwise is only to exhibit how little you understand the mechanics of the game of hockey.
not a chance on Boston ,Chicago, Rangers , and many others

he was completely exposed in the playoffs , overated

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06-15-2013, 04:19 PM
  #592
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Originally Posted by onemorecup View Post
not a chance on Boston ,Chicago, Rangers , and many others

he was completely exposed in the playoffs , overated
This debate has been beaten to death but Gorges would be a top 4 defenseman on 3/4 of the teams in the NHL. Boston's top 4 is Seidenberg, Chara, Boychuk and Ference. Gorges is better than Ference.

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06-15-2013, 04:22 PM
  #593
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Bickell is the sexy choice right now. But i'm worried he turns out to be the next Fernando Pisani (flash in the pan for 1 playoff). Yes Pisani had health issues, but I'm not sold on Bickell keeping up this kind of good pace during a season, let alone another playoff. I wouldn't be opposed to taking a chance on him, but it really does boil down to how much cash it would take to land him. He can't be any worse than Moen was this season.
great point , not saying Pisani but look at this way

some middle of the pack team will overate him on their roster thinking if he can do it in Chicago he can do it for me , but those team arent the Hawks

so he gets his 35 points , team barley gets by round 1 and you have a third liner making 17 over 4 and a GM clueless

they dont realize Bickell is on a great team with tremendous depth leetching off great players and found the genie in the bottle at the right time

same goes for Horton , his fit is Boston or Pittsburgh nowhere else

he is a 50 point player in a full season , barely plays 60 games a year and then gets hot on the right sheltered line in the playoffs

if he wants to keep winnining and accept a fair deal he will resign in Boston

he will not break the bank with Chaiarelli , in the 7-8 year 5-6 mil range given the structure of his team , not a chance

he goes to a decent team for the money it will be one of the worst contracts in hockey and he will disapoint when they realize we arent the Bruins and we dont have Krejci , Lucic , Chara , etc....

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06-15-2013, 04:26 PM
  #594
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Originally Posted by onemorecup View Post
not a chance on Boston ,Chicago, Rangers , and many others

he was completely exposed in the playoffs , overated
If you knew anything at all about hockey you'd understand that our entire defensive scheme was whack from game 1 and we were grossly exposed and exploited for the 12 or so games leading into the playoffs. Pinning it all on Gorges is classic blame-game behaviour when in reality the blame falls majorly on that illiterate hick behind the bench who refused to adjust a thing, the arrogant GM who thought Drewiskie and Bouillon would make a good third pairing for a cup run and yes, the individual players themselves.

Gorges is better than Ference, he's better than Odyua (who was brutal in ATL/WPG). The Rags had the most balanced d-corps in the league under Torts so who knows where he'd fit in -- point is Gorges is good.

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06-15-2013, 04:27 PM
  #595
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
If you knew anything at all about hockey you'd understand that our entire defensive scheme was whack from game 1 and we were grossly exposed and exploited for the 12 or so games leading into the playoffs. Pinning it all on Gorges is classic blame-game behaviour when in reality the blame falls majorly on that illiterate hick behind the bench who refused to adjust a thing, the arrogant GM who thought Drewiskie and Bouillon would make a good third pairing for a cup run and yes, the individual players themselves.

Gorges is better than Ference, he's better than Odyua (who was brutal in ATL/WPG). The Rags had the most balanced d-corps in the league under Torts so who knows where he'd fit in -- point is Gorges is good.
Exactly the fact that Gorges and Diaz are the only reason we lost according to some people is mind blowing.

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06-15-2013, 04:29 PM
  #596
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This debate has been beaten to death but Gorges would be a top 4 defenseman on 3/4 of the teams in the NHL. Boston's top 4 is Seidenberg, Chara, Boychuk and Ference. Gorges is better than Ference.
Knock yourself out and take the 4 mil player over the 2.35 mil Ferrence who is more phyical and skates better

no matter he will leave , Dougie steps in , and McQuaid becomes a solid cheap # 5

Chiarelli is the best in the Biz along with Holland knowing what needs to get done

we sign washed up Cubes and DD`s and pray that maybe resigning Colby will get us closer to the Bruins

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06-15-2013, 04:32 PM
  #597
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Originally Posted by onemorecup View Post
at fair money

u cant have a max30- 40 point player making 4 mil

he is on a great team with stars right now skewing his value
Exactly.

Only caveat is if the cap keeps going up at the same rhythm as before the lockout. Then Bickell "might" be worth it, maybe.

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06-15-2013, 04:34 PM
  #598
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Originally Posted by onemorecup View Post
Knock yourself out and take the 4 mil player over the 2.35 mil Ferrence who is more phyical and skates better

no matter he will leave , Dougie steps in , and McQuaid becomes a solid cheap # 5

Chiarelli is the best in the Biz along with Holland knowing what needs to get done

we sign washed up Cubes and DD`s and pray that maybe resigning Colby will get us closer to the Bruins
We don't play the same style as the Bruins does, and probably never will.

Give Bergevin a few years to set up what he wants...or cheer for the Bruins.

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06-15-2013, 04:35 PM
  #599
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Originally Posted by onemorecup View Post
Knock yourself out and take the 4 mil player over the 2.35 mil Ferrence who is more phyical and skates better

no matter he will leave , Dougie steps in , and McQuaid becomes a solid cheap # 5

Chiarelli is the best in the Biz along with Holland knowing what needs to get done

we sign washed up Cubes and DD`s and pray that maybe resigning Colby will get us closer to the Bruins
Wait till he re-signs a new contract before bringing up the salary... And I hope he's faster, he's 2 inches smaller than Gorges (who's already undersized in the first place for a defenseman). If you've been paying attention to the playoffs you'd realize that Ference has been the worst defenseman for the Bruins considering his status of being a veteran, brutal giveaways and sub par defense. I guess he's also ''getting exposed'' these playoffs.

As for Holland, maybe you should pay a visit to the Red Wings board. I don't think you'll see a whole lot of people praising him after re-signing washed up players and making the talent rot in the minors.

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06-15-2013, 04:45 PM
  #600
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Exactly the fact that Gorges and Diaz are the only reason we lost according to some people is mind blowing.
this isnt blaming our loss on anyone , these are the facts

1) our D in our own zone was brutal in the playoffs and other than PK the rest played like crap including Gorges , Markov , Dias and Cube
dont even try to defend them that they played well , they didnt

2) we lack overall team size , toughness , grit , and warriors come playoff to last 4 rounds and win those ugly 2-1 games that champions do
and this is top down from the D to our forwards

3) Price needs to play better no question but our issuse is our overall team
makeup and identity

3) we are not close to competing with the best like the Bruins and Hawks , its obvious no debate here

so if we have many holes , dont fill those holes with the same problem when you have the chance to start fixing them this summer patiently

if you keep Dias he and Markov both cant play on your top 4 as they are defensive liabilities .

the gods arent going to turn them into Sidenberg or Seabrook next year

I would rather lose with Tinordi and Nathan at some point than watching Dias for the next 4 years losing battles and getting beat down low every third shift

start somewhere but dont waste dumb cap money patching holes with the wrong players like we did 4 yeasr ago in the summer .

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