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Rangers name Alain Vigneault head coach - Part II

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06-15-2013, 05:08 PM
  #101
ncmike
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Originally Posted by Skead View Post
Whoa okay, ummm. Let's be realistic here. AV doesn't have a cup. Bylsma does, and despite not having much playoff success he's still out performing AV in the playoffs win department and regular season win department...

Not sure how you classify him better.
Bylsma should have been fired last year after that debacle against Phily

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06-15-2013, 05:08 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
Richards probably won't even be here next year.

Any sane coach would not make Brad Richards his poster child. Even his buddy Torts had enough of his pathetic play.
Richards will not be here next year, his skills have deteriorated at an alarming rate and we know Sather had a hand in him being scratched in the playoffs. Buying him out opens up cap space that will be needed for McDonagh, Stepan, Hagelin, UFA's, and an extension for Lundqvist.

AV was the best coach left on the market, Eakins would have been my first choice, but if it came down to Tippett or AV it would be a tough choice for me. AV should be able to fix our powerplay issues, he uses all four lines correctly (something Torts never seemed to get the hang off and it killed us in the playoffs last year), is a player's coach, and he has a good track record of bringing up and fusing in young talent from the farm system. Unfortunately for him, the goalie issue in Vancouver was not dealt with properly with the Canucks, which created a difficult environment for him to succeed. He will not have such an issue here with Hank, hopefully he can make a few changes to improve this roster and we see how it goes.

We certainly dodged a bullet with both Messier and Ruff coming in, the only thing of interest is that if Messier was hired and bombed the way Trottier did, I think Dolan would have no choice but to fire Sather and Messier as hiring a first time head coach that failed twice in Sather's tenure would mean the end.

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06-15-2013, 05:08 PM
  #103
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If your opinion on a coach can be changed by reading an article or two, it's probably not a very good opinion, anyway. Rather than breaking down coaches on paper now, I'm just looking forward to hearing what Vigneault has to say and what he actually does.

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06-15-2013, 05:13 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
I thought he looked good working the point on the PP.

Absolutely, but how many more goals are scored like that? When he scored 41 goals, on the PP he was either lining up 1T's from the perimeter, or he was banging in greasy goals from rebounds on the point.

I think we'd be better suited with an offensive right handed defenseman to play with Edler if we're still planning on zone matching or maybe more like a Salo type TWD style if we're just going to play him whenever.

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06-15-2013, 05:15 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by ncmike View Post
Bylsma should have been fired last year after that debacle against Phily
Hard to defend Fleury's performance, and when it started happening again this year he made the call to put in Vokoun and ended up winning the series.

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06-15-2013, 05:18 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by MetalGodAOD View Post
Those Pros far outweight the Cons. Treatment of the Media means nothing as far as coaching goes. Every coach has favorites and questionable decisions when it comes to young players, you can find every team with similar complaints. Every team plays conservative with a lead. Honestly most of those complaints could be pegged on any team in the league.
True. I just think he sounds a lot like the guy we got rid of. Really liked what I read about Johnston philosophy.

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06-15-2013, 05:26 PM
  #107
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I doubt Clowe is going anywhere but NY.



Not if they don't sign him

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06-15-2013, 05:27 PM
  #108
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We still don't have the players to compete for a cup so who cares who we hire?

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06-15-2013, 05:29 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by ncmike View Post
I doubt Clowe is going anywhere but NY.



Not if they don't sign him
Two concussions in the playoffs... he wants between 4-5 million a year, I don't see him being resigned unless he will take a 1 year deal or pay cut.

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06-15-2013, 05:30 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by JCresty View Post
If your opinion on a coach can be changed by reading an article or two, it's probably not a very good opinion, anyway. Rather than breaking down coaches on paper now, I'm just looking forward to hearing what Vigneault has to say and what he actually does.
That's all I have to go on. If you know more on Johnston please enlighten me!!

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06-15-2013, 05:31 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Janerixon View Post
Two concussions in the playoffs... he wants between 4-5 million a year, I don't see him being resigned unless he will take a 1 year deal or pay cut.
That's my point. Save the pick and let him go

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06-15-2013, 05:33 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by ncmike View Post
That's my point. Save the pick and let him go
I'm in full agreement, I could see him following Torts to Vancouver, especially since they wanted to trade for him when we acquired him.

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06-15-2013, 05:37 PM
  #113
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the amazing thing here is that the Rangers didn't completely eff this up by hiring Messier....

that should speak to how pathetic our organization is...when we're happy we didnt completely screw this up.

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06-15-2013, 05:39 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
the amazing thing here is that the Rangers didn't completely eff this up by hiring Messier....

that should speak to how pathetic our organization is...when we're happy we didnt completely screw this up.
it's the little victories....

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06-15-2013, 05:53 PM
  #115
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I hope they hire Newell Brown as assistant coach , he seems to know what he is talking about.
Quote:
Brown knew things weren't right when he had too many left shots.

“You have to look at the pieces of the puzzle that are necessary and we had great chemistry that first year,” he explained. “Everything gelled. This year, we were forced through injury and whatnot and changes in personnel to try and build a new group.

“When you're trying to run a power play with five left shots, which we were forced to do a lot this year, you're really swimming upstream. Seventy-seven per cent of the power-play goals are scored with at least two right shots, so that tells you a lot right there. Not to say there are exceptions to the rule, but when you have five left shots, or even four, your chances of scoring are diminished.

Teams are so fast to get into the shot lanes these days,” Brown continued, “that if you can't take one-timers, if you aren't in position to take one-touch passes and move the puck quickly to shooters and shoot off the pass, you're at a big disadvantage. That was something we were dealing with this year.”

Read more: http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/C...#ixzz2WKOus8es
That last part pretty much describes the Rangers pp.

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06-15-2013, 05:56 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Janerixon View Post
I'm in full agreement, I could see him following Torts to Vancouver, especially since they wanted to trade for him when we acquired him.
Yeah...erm...not entirely sold on either tbph. Part of me wants Torts out here just to watch the press conferences, but...yeah.

------------------------------

Anyway, congrats to NYR and to AV. I knew he'd never go very long without being hired. For all the moaning and complaining we've done about him, he's still the best coach the Canucks have ever had. His message (such as it was) just got stale, and after 7 years it was clearly time for a change. He had just run out of ideas with the group he had to work with, and hey, coaches are hired to be fired in the end.

When Gillis took over GM duties here, he wanted to move away from AV's defense-first system, but AV is imho still a defensive coach at his core. He should do very well with the crop of d-men you guys have, and of course, he's got one of the best goalies on the planet in net with Lundqvist behind the d. He's also going to be a much-needed breath of fresh air with the players themselves; following Torts' screaming maniac routine with a calm, unflappable guy was a good move on Sather's part. Of course, in the opinion of a lot of people here, one of AV's problems was that he always remained unflappable in situations where he should damn well have been flapped, but anyway.

The last couple of seasons he has made some very questionable and counter-intuitive personnel choices, though. He does play his favourites (like any coach I guess) so you just have to hope his pets are the right ones for the job and his whipping boys aren't too terribly important to the team as a whole. A lot was made of his "turning the locker room over to the players" relations with the team. It was great in 2011 when the Canucks were steamrolling the NHL, but in 2013 when the special teams were in the toilet and dmen were all looking like traumatized Vietnam War vets in their own zone, something had to change. Certain players were clearly crying out for discipline they weren't getting, and one of AV's big weaknesses is making adjustments on the fly when things clearly aren't working. And his smug little grin during post-game pressers after the Canucks got killed made me want to rip my hair out in clumps. Still, the media there will love him after Torts. AV is well accustomed to the pressure of big hockey market media having been here and Montreal.

Anyhow, grats to everyone in NYC. You guys got the best coach available.

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Old
06-15-2013, 06:08 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by HockeyBasedNYC View Post
Yay, what kind of camp does AV run?
Don't expect to have your regular season roster players playing in lots of exhibition games. He likes to I think feel out what he has to work with for quite some time before trying to create an identity for a team. He won't always make the subtle moves, but a lot of his hunches are right more often than wrong. He doesn't like defenseman who like to move up the rink with the puck themselves (see: Ballard) but I think he will be relying on McD and Girardi to be his #1 shut-down pair (as any sane coach would be). He likes to run a dump and chase, cycle game that crashes the net I think so I think he will let Nash, Brassard, and Callahan be more creative in the offensive zone too.

Overall, great move here by the Rangers. Really excited what he can do for this team.

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06-15-2013, 06:12 PM
  #118
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Not overly thrilled with the choice, but I hope this works out. Like every coach, he has pluses and minuses. Some of the minuses concern me; but he was probably the best available guy out there.

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06-15-2013, 06:14 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Reverend Mayhem View Post
Don't expect to have your regular season roster players playing in lots of exhibition games. He likes to I think feel out what he has to work with for quite some time before trying to create an identity for a team.
That's fine with the eight first year pros and six second year pros. Some will be fighting for spots.

Let him get comfortable with the organization and see what he has.

Another question or more like questions; For minor leaguers, does he call up who is playing the best and put them in the needed spot, or will he callup someone who fits a role (eg. grinder for fourth line winger spot, etc.)?

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06-15-2013, 06:17 PM
  #120
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Happy with the move. didnt hate Torts but it was time for a change. I expect the PP to be better, the offense to finally be free, and for out young guys like miller kreider and eventually lindberg/fast to play to their strengths without the fear of demotion

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06-15-2013, 06:19 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Skead View Post
Absolutely, but how many more goals are scored like that? When he scored 41 goals, on the PP he was either lining up 1T's from the perimeter, or he was banging in greasy goals from rebounds on the point.

I think we'd be better suited with an offensive right handed defenseman to play with Edler if we're still planning on zone matching or maybe more like a Salo type TWD style if we're just going to play him whenever.
Like Ehrhoff was? People seem to forget how good Kes was on the point for the PP in 2009-10. His great shot made him a threat, but his desire to shoot eventually made him redundant with Edler. Lots of people hated AV for putting him on the first PP unit in 2010-11 (myself included) but that turned out really well for us. As alluded to before, AV's biggest weakness IMO was the make adjustments to gameplans during a series. He did go 9-3 in game ones during his tenure here. I can see Hagelin being one of his 'pets' on the Rangers.

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06-15-2013, 06:21 PM
  #122
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Expect to have slow starts to the season, Rangers fans. The Canucks under AV loved to come out of the gate slowly.

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06-15-2013, 06:22 PM
  #123
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Expect to have slow starts to the season, Rangers fans. The Canucks under AV loved to come out of the gates slowly.
just because it happened there doesnt mean anything

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06-15-2013, 06:22 PM
  #124
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Does this benefit Richards at all? Or will he be bought out regardless?
How can you not buy out Richards? It would be a horrendous decision to let him stay.

He's 33, coming off the least productive season of his career (in PPG average), and has been on a 4 year downswing (91 pts - 70 pts - 66 pts - 34 pts/60pts over 82 games).

And he's signed through 2019.

I do not want to keep paying this guy to be a 50 point center for the next 7 years. We can use that money so much better on other players. His $7m a year needs to be spent on Rick Nash's and Henrik Lundqvists, not a 50-60 point guy who struggles with consistency.

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06-15-2013, 06:23 PM
  #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by White Plains Batman View Post
That's fine with the eight first year pros and six second year pros. Some will be fighting for spots.

Let him get comfortable with the organization and see what he has.

Another question or more like questions; For minor leaguers, does he call up who is playing the best and put them in the needed spot, or will he callup someone who fits a role (eg. grinder for fourth line winger spot, etc.)?
Oh AV is definitely someone who will call up a certain role player. If Desbiens, Gordon, Bliznak, etc. have taught me anything. However, if there is a certain player that is standing out a lot, I think he'd give them his due.

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