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2013 NHL Draft (draft day chat link in Post 887)

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Old
06-10-2013, 02:17 PM
  #626
IPreferPi
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Two of the new NHL.com mock drafts have us taking Mantha, the other Zadorov. http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=673460

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06-10-2013, 03:57 PM
  #627
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Ray Whitney sure as hell fit the "team identity" pretty damn well. To the point that losing him proved absolutely devastating. Ray Whitney isn't very much like Gauthier at all. Just saying there is no point in taking a guy specifically because he seems similar to what you've already got.

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06-10-2013, 04:03 PM
  #628
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
Ray Whitney sure as hell fit the "team identity" pretty damn well. To the point that losing him proved absolutely devastating. Ray Whitney isn't very much like Gauthier at all. Just saying there is no point in taking a guy specifically because he seems similar to what you've already got.
Another good point.

To that end, "team identity" is more descriptive than prescriptive, and the prescriptive elements are dictated as much or more by budgetary constraints than philosophical ones. Regardless of coach, the Coyotes would still be icing guys like Kyle Chipchura, Rob Klinkhammer and Nick Johnson right now. Which is why the draft is hugely important, especially when it comes to offensive players. A player can score as much when he's 20 as when he's 30, but he'll be a lot cheaper. Conversely, almost every player will be much better defensively when he's 30 than when he's 20, and if he's a primarily defensive player, he won't cost all that much even in his prime.

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06-10-2013, 05:17 PM
  #629
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I should mention, though, that I've never seen Gauthier play a game. I have no opinion on the player.

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06-10-2013, 07:18 PM
  #630
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhoPhan View Post
A player can score as much when he's 20 as when he's 30, but he'll be a lot cheaper. Conversely, almost every player will be much better defensively when he's 30 than when he's 20, and if he's a primarily defensive player, he won't cost all that much even in his prime.
This is an excellent point!

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06-11-2013, 04:43 AM
  #631
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I seen Gauthier 1 full game and dont want him at 12. Good frame, good face-off, good skater but zero impact in offensive zone. He moves puck to nowhere, avarage shot. Yeah, it's only one game, but that's it.

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06-13-2013, 08:08 PM
  #632
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I would like to contribute a bit of incite about the Draft's prospects.

Alexander Wennberg:
C/W -Djurgardens IF
6'2 186
Djurgården Allsvenskan 46 14 18 32 14 10

Pros: Solid all around player who has a sense for the game. Plays a full 200 ft game, very strong defensive game which translates well to a team like Phoenix who lacks a elite scorer. Very good in front of the net, im not a huge fan of him being in the high traffic areas as he gets banged up but plays through it. Strong Passer and high hockey IQ.

Cons- Plays in the Second Tier Elite league. Not a huge knock but the talent is lesser. He is a great passer but i would like to see him shoot more. Needs to get a bit bigger in order to maintain the style of hockey he plays.

Comparison: A faster Mika Zibanejad

Outlook: He looks to be playing for Frolunda in the SEL next year so he is making the jump to the top league. Should be a top 6 forward in 2-3 years with the right development, which he seems to be on.

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06-16-2013, 07:15 PM
  #633
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I know we have enough D in our cupboard but if we ever felt the need to drop down to pickup an extra late first or early 2nd I wouldn't mind taking a flier on Morin. Just watching him play at the Under 18's (pvr) and he reminds me so much of Tyler Myers. I actually think he's further ahead in his development than Myers was at the same age.

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06-17-2013, 01:05 AM
  #634
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So of the forwards in our range, here're my top five for the first round.

1. Shinkaruk
2. Domi
3. Horvat
4. Lazar
5. Wennberg

That sound about right to you guys? rt? Pho?

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06-17-2013, 01:11 AM
  #635
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OOEEL View Post
So of the forwards in our range, here're my top five for the first round.

1. Shinkaruk
2. Domi
3. Horvat
4. Lazar
5. Wennberg

That sound about right to you guys? rt? Pho?
You won't find a consensus on this. We all disagree.

For me...

1. Domi
2. Shinkaruk
3. Lazar
4. Wennberg
5. Horvat

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06-17-2013, 01:16 AM
  #636
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I have to admit I have not paid attention to the draft at all this year, all I know is that it is supposed to be deep.

The 5 or so guys that are in range of our pick, would anybody be willling to let me know a little bit about each of them? Such as strength, speed, puck handling, size, and/or player you would compare them to. You don't have to go crazy, it just seems that every professional scouting report seems to sound the same. It's like they are afraid to be wrong so they say all the basics.

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06-17-2013, 01:38 AM
  #637
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbit3119 View Post
I have to admit I have not paid attention to the draft at all this year, all I know is that it is supposed to be deep.

The 5 or so guys that are in range of our pick, would anybody be willling to let me know a little bit about each of them? Such as strength, speed, puck handling, size, and/or player you would compare them to. You don't have to go crazy, it just seems that every professional scouting report seems to sound the same. It's like they are afraid to be wrong so they say all the basics.
Pho made some good posts on the subject, maybe a bit more than you are looking for but good reading
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...=#post66240253
http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...=#post67180323

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06-17-2013, 09:38 AM
  #638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OOEEL View Post
So of the forwards in our range, here're my top five for the first round.

1. Shinkaruk
2. Domi
3. Horvat
4. Lazar
5. Wennberg

That sound about right to you guys? rt? Pho?
1) Horvat - complete player. Perfect for our system and will play C in the pros. Clutch player who scores big goals.
2) Domi - most skilled of players on this list. Likely shifted to wing at pro level.
3) Shinkaruk - first line player that compares to Jeff Skinner from Carolina.
4) Wennberg
5) Lazar - inconsistent this year. Had a very good second half.

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06-17-2013, 11:00 AM
  #639
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Some relevant quotes from Elliotte Friedman today:

Quote:
It is no secret that the Hurricanes were disappointed by their lockout-shortened season. They expected to be better than 19-25-4. There will be a very good player available in the No. 5 spot, but would a Top 4 defenceman with experience and term remaining be better for Carolina?

If you have one and a first-round pick, there is a belief you can get to that spot
. Edmonton, selecting seventh overall, had discussions with the Hurricanes, but it sounds like those talks cooled.
If this is the indeed the case, Michalek + the 12th could be enough for Maloney to move up.


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06-17-2013, 11:25 AM
  #640
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Doubtful. Michalek's trade value was shown to be very low when we re-acquired him.

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06-17-2013, 11:28 AM
  #641
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Originally Posted by lanky View Post
Doubtful. Michalek's trade value was shown to be very low when we re-acquired him.
Two things: A) Pittsburgh was trying to free up cap space to jump into the Parise/Suter sweepstakes and B) Shero had his hands tied by Z's no-trade clause, which he'd only waive for two teams: Ottawa and Phoenix. Ottawa wanted Pittsburgh to retain salary - obviously that was a no-go. So basically, Shero had to take whatever he could get from Maloney.

TL;DR - last year's trade is not very representative of Michalek's true value as a top-pairing shutdown defenseman.

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06-17-2013, 11:32 AM
  #642
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I tend to think this draft is stronger than average, but here are the last twenty 12th overall picks, just for reference:

2012: Mikhail Grigorenko
2011: Ryan Murphy
2010: Cam Fowler
2009: Calvin de Haan
2008: Tyler Myers
2007: Ryan McDonagh
2006: Bryan Little
2005: Marc Staal
2004: AJ Thelen
2003: Hugh Jessiman
2002: Steve Eminger
2001: Dan Hamhuis
2000: Alexei Smirnov
1999: Denis Shvidki
1998: Alex Tanguay
1997: Marian Hossa
1996: Josh Holden
1995: Teemu Riihijarvi
1994: Wade Belak
1993: Kenny Jonsson

Certainly more busts than superstars, but the last three years have seen big fallers end their slide at #12 (Grigorenko was talked about as a top three pick, Fowler as a top five, and Murphy as a top ten), while there was a run before that of teams going a little off the board (and looking smart for it after the fact). Generally, the last eight years have yielded a high quality player at #12, though that was preceded by a weak six-year run with only Dan Hamhuis to show for it. All in all, it's way too small a sample size to draw any real conclusions from (not too mention loads of other mitigating factors), but historically, #12 isn't a bad spot to pick from.

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06-17-2013, 12:09 PM
  #643
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPreferPi View Post
Two things: A) Pittsburgh was trying to free up cap space to jump into the Parise/Suter sweepstakes and B) Shero had his hands tied by Z's no-trade clause, which he'd only waive for two teams: Ottawa and Phoenix. Ottawa wanted Pittsburgh to retain salary - obviously that was a no-go. So basically, Shero had to take whatever he could get from Maloney.

TL;DR - last year's trade is not very representative of Michalek's true value as a top-pairing shutdown defenseman.
I would think that they would want more of an offensive PMD, an upgrade for MA Bergeron.

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06-17-2013, 12:11 PM
  #644
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I would think that they would want more of an offensive PMD, an upgrade for MA Bergeron.
But they already have Justin Faulk, Jodi Pitkanen and Ryan Murphy.


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06-17-2013, 12:27 PM
  #645
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Originally Posted by IPreferPi View Post
But they already have Justin Faulk, Jodi Pitkanen and Ryan Murphy.
I would guess that the 'Canes prefer to have Murphy in Charlotte a little longer. Pitkanen has regressed and been hurt.

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06-17-2013, 12:57 PM
  #646
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I would guess that the 'Canes prefer to have Murphy in Charlotte a little longer. Pitkanen has regressed and been hurt.
Perhaps. But right now this is probably the basis of their d-corps next season.

Gleason - Faulk
Pitkanen - ?????
Harrison - ?????

Unless they move Pitkanen - Yandle doesn't really fit. But Michalek certainly does.


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06-17-2013, 02:12 PM
  #647
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Doubtful. Michalek's trade value was shown to be very low when we re-acquired him.
NMC where Michalek only wanted to go to Phoenix; or at least a very strong preference (Pitts trying to do him a favor not try to extract a premium for Michalek - essentially doing right on a guy they signed as a UFA)

As for the Carolina stuff. I posted about a month ago a Skinner + 5th for Yandle and 12th type deal.

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06-17-2013, 04:05 PM
  #648
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Looks like Canes HFers are coming around to Gormley + 12th for 5th, and are also receptive to throwing in Zac Dalpe and Justin Peters our way too.

Gormley + 12th for Lindholm (or Barkov), Dalpe, and Peters. A franchise center, a decent prospect who has the skills to play in the Top 6, and an young-ish inconsistent goalie whose skillset reminds me of Smith. That's probably the most we'll be able to get to mitigate the loss of Gormley and the 12th.

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06-17-2013, 05:57 PM
  #649
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Originally Posted by IPreferPi View Post
Looks like Canes HFers are coming around to Gormley + 12th for 5th, and are also receptive to throwing in Zac Dalpe and Justin Peters our way too.

Gormley + 12th for Lindholm (or Barkov), Dalpe, and Peters. A franchise center, a decent prospect who has the skills to play in the Top 6, and an young-ish inconsistent goalie whose skillset reminds me of Smith. That's probably the most we'll be able to get to mitigate the loss of Gormley and the 12th.
I wouldn't do it. I'd consider Gormley and the 42nd for Lindholm. There is no way in hell I'd offer Gormley and the 12th for him. I'd take Dalpe or Peters on a PTO for free, but I don't feel they have any trade value of any kind.

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06-17-2013, 06:07 PM
  #650
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I wouldn't do it. I'd consider Gormley and the 42nd for Lindholm. There is no way in hell I'd offer Gormley and the 12th for him. I'd take Dalpe or Peters on a PTO for free, but I don't feel they have any trade value of any kind.
I know, we've been on contrary positions on this subject. :-/ But what if we can get Carolina to take Michalek instead of Gormley? Friedman did say they are looking for Top 4 D with term and experience. And Daple and Peters may not have much trade value right now, but those kind of low-risk throw ins can easily surprise and overperform.


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