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Something brewing between Maple Leafs and Oilers?

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:20 AM
  #201
McSuper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeyg View Post
LOL @ sam > colborne + 1st. Thats a joke. Hes 3rd line on a good team....
And Colborne is a 3 liner AHL player on a team deep with prospects . 3rd liner NHL player >>>>>> 3rd liner AHL player

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:20 AM
  #202
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Maybe a deal around Hemsky? To replace MacArthur.

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06-20-2013, 11:28 AM
  #203
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Hemsky for Kulemin

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06-20-2013, 11:29 AM
  #204
Larry Hoover
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Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
Get off your high horse.
You were fast asleep for 100% of his games until he put on a blue and white jersey.
You're ignorant if you think I've never seen him play outside of Nsh vs Edm, and you're ignorant if you think western Canada isn't forcefed 90% of the Leafs regular season schedule as well.
Franson was a player that many Oilers fans have scouted high and low for a few years, before he was traded out east.

Franson scored a whopping 1 goal that wasn't on the PP this season, and he shot 20% in the playoffs and scored 3 goals in 7 games. Not to mention it was a shortened season. In other words, he's a bottom pairing guy who's great on the PP and played above his head in the post season.

Thanks for educating me though
Man, I've already "educated" you but apparently you fail to listen to the evidence I've provided. I'll list it again for you because you're severely underrating Franson.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Hoover View Post
Franson would be arguably the Oilers #1/#2 D...While I don't doubt that in the near future Schultz will be better than Franson, as it stands today, I'd say they are pretty equal. HM to Smid. Franson would be one of your top 3D.

The guy is 25 years old and was on pace for 55 points, 11 goals this year if you include his playoff stats (7 goals, 35 points in 52 total games). That would have put him 2nd in points for all D last season after Karlsson.

The only players who played >50 games with a better PPG on D that season were E. Karlsson, K. Letang, D. Byfuglien

If you combine his playoffs shooting percentage with his regular season shooting percentage than he would have 85 SOG, 7 goals meaning he would be shooting at 8.2%.

For compairson sakes, Justin Schultz shot at 9.4%.

He's finally learned how to use his 6'5 frame to throw big hits and has a fantastic point shot that is ridiculous at getting through traffic and from his stick to the net quickly. He's good off the rush on D, his biggest flaw is defensive zone positioning, this can be taught by experience and good coaching. Franson is a great defenceman and you clearly haven't watched him play if you think he's a bottom pairing D.


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Old
06-20-2013, 11:30 AM
  #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
gardiner makes the most sense. PRV might be a good fit in toronto.
Yep makes sense. Trade one of our top young players for a useless winger (that happens to be the Leafs positional strength).

Quote:
Originally Posted by beer123 View Post
What if the Oilers are targeting Phaneuf instead since they need a player like him more than someone like Gardiner?

7th overall pick for Phaneuf - which team needs to add?
Oilers fans wouldn't like what they would have to add. The Leafs are competing, not rebuilding. The 7th overall pick wouldn't be the main piece in a deal for Phaneuf. It would be an add on.

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06-20-2013, 11:30 AM
  #206
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Originally Posted by BetterCallSaul View Post
cause hes playing on the oilers. the team that finished in the bottom 10.
The leafs made the playoffs for the first time in how many years ? How come Colborne could not make the Leafs who is weaker then the Oilers at Centre ? Leaf fans are funny all their players are the best all the best players are signing with them every year . As for playing on a weak team and still putting up points you fail at you attempt to put Gagner down . The west is much tougher to play in , if he was true as bad as you say it would be easy for the defence of the western team to shut him down . It is why Kessel,s could ever make it in the west , well he may be a 20 goal guy in the west ,but no more

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06-20-2013, 11:33 AM
  #207
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To Oilers: Gardiner, #21, Colborne, Scrivens

To Leafs: Gagner, #7

Oilers giving up more value in this deal than Gardiner & #21 for #7, which was previously posted.

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:33 AM
  #208
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Originally Posted by supert View Post
The leafs made the playoffs for the first time in how many years ? How come Colborne could not make the Leafs who is weaker then the Oilers at Centre ? Leaf fans are funny all their players are the best all the best players are signing with them every year . As for playing on a weak team and still putting up points you fail at you attempt to put Gagner down . The west is much tougher to play in , if he was true as bad as you say it would be easy for the defence of the western team to shut him down . It is why Kessel,s could ever make it in the west , well he may be a 20 goal guy in the west ,but no more


Ok, pal. Its a miracle that the East ever wins a cup if that were true. The only thing more difficult about playing in the West is the travel, that is it. This whole notion that there are better players with better coaches with better systems in the West is a joke.. but whatever makes fans of the **** teams in the West feel better. Gagner is better than some fans are giving him credit though, and this is coming from someone whos been real hard on the guy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ponokanocker View Post
To Oilers: Gardiner, #21, Colborne, Scrivens

To Leafs: Gagner, #7

Oilers giving up more value in this deal than Gardiner & #21 for #7, which was previously posted.
Value is probably equal but I'd rather keep Gardiner. He'll likely be better than anyone drafted in the #7 slot.

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:33 AM
  #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slatsmsg View Post
It will be Gardiner + Toronto's first for 7th overall, book it
Overpayment from the Leafs (& I'm not even a Gardiner fanboy)

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:34 AM
  #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponokanocker View Post
To Oilers: Gardiner, #21, Colborne, Scrivens

To Leafs: Gagner, #7

Oilers giving up more value in this deal than Gardiner & #21 for #7, which was previously posted.
Brutal. Once Horcoff is moved that leaves Belanger as our #2C.

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:37 AM
  #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EscapeGoat View Post
Yep makes sense. Trade one of our top young players for a useless winger (that happens to be the Leafs positional strength).



Oilers fans wouldn't like what they would have to add. The Leafs are competing, not rebuilding. The 7th overall pick wouldn't be the main piece in a deal for Phaneuf. It would be an add on.
Great because we don't want him . How many Oiler fans do you see wanting that slow moving bonehead head case . He would have to where a slow moving vehicle sign to play in the west . Keep him and his bone headed mistakes away from the Oilers . We are trying to fix are D .

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06-20-2013, 11:38 AM
  #212
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Gardiner + Toronto's 1st and the rights to Tyler Bozak to Edmonton for Edmonton's 1st and Shawn Horcoff.

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06-20-2013, 11:39 AM
  #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Hoover View Post
Man, I've already "educated" you but apparently you fail to listen to the evidence I've provided. I'll list it again for you because you're severely underrating Franson.
For comparison sake, you brought Justin Schultz into this...

Who scored twice as much as Franson (8G, 4 on the PP) at 9.4%
Which would have put him on pace for 14 goals and 32 A's.
Franson played avg 19 mins a game and Schultz played 21. Schultz was also a rookie, and he's 3 years younger.

So not sure how Franson would be our #1/2D when we already have that guy on our team playing the exact same role... Schultz played top 4 mins for the Oilers this year but he shouldn't have had to, he would have been better suited to play bottom pairing minutes and QB the top PP unit. He still did pretty well all things considered, he played over 80 games this season between the AHL/NHL and he's never had to play more than ~50/yr.

But I didn't bring Schultz up - you did.

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06-20-2013, 11:39 AM
  #214
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Interesting how Gardiner has low value, despite Kings fans wanting him in a deal for Bernier, Avs fans in a deal for Statsny and Oilers fans too...

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06-20-2013, 11:40 AM
  #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
Gardiner + Toronto's 1st and the rights to Tyler Bozak to Edmonton for Edmonton's 1st and Shawn Horcoff.
You wish.

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06-20-2013, 11:41 AM
  #216
Neil Hamburger
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Originally Posted by Sloth Slothersons View Post
Hemsky for Kulemin
No way, Kulemin's not getting moved.

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:42 AM
  #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fogelhund View Post
Interesting how Gardiner has low value, despite Kings fans wanting him in a deal for Bernier, Avs fans in a deal for Statsny and Oilers fans too...
I think most of us are saying that HF Leafs MAY value Gardiner more than the Leafs actual brass...

IE: They can use him to get a piece they want/need back because they have a player who is ready to come in and fill the same role (Rielly)

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06-20-2013, 11:42 AM
  #218
BackhandToeyJoey
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Originally Posted by tony d View Post
Gardiner + Toronto's 1st and the rights to Tyler Bozak to Edmonton for Edmonton's 1st and Shawn Horcoff.
That is interesting. I like this one tbh.

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:43 AM
  #219
SephF
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Originally Posted by Geese_Howard View Post
Lol He's a top 4 dman on a good team and top 2 on the oilers.
Cody Franson? Are you kidding me?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BetterCallSaul View Post
i agree with the first one. but the second one...WOW.
Joe Colborne would slot in under Anton Lander on the Oilers depth chart.... Gagner is worth more then 21st overall and some plug prospect.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeyg View Post
LOL @ sam > colborne + 1st. Thats a joke. Hes 3rd line on a good team....
He'd be the leafs 1st line center.

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Originally Posted by BetterCallSaul View Post
i wouldnt even trade the 21st straight up for gagner. not worth it. stop overvaluing him. hes a third line center at best.
Good thing you aren't a GM, Gagner was in the top-20 for offensive production from centers this year, he produced offense at a 1st line pace but is a "third liner at best" in your eyes? Wow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BetterCallSaul View Post
look, sam gagner is a good third line center on a good team. but he's an average second line centre.

but to say he's worth more than the 21st pick and colborne is ridiculous.
I really don't think it is. Colbourne is worthless to the Oilers and Edmonton drafted Gagner 6th overall...

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06-20-2013, 11:44 AM
  #220
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Originally Posted by SDig14 View Post
Problem is no one has any idea how Mac T value a guy like Gardiner.

I'm sure he's seen him play in the AHL when he was coaching down there, but more likely they add a player and move back than trade the pick outright.

If they want one young player they might just stay at 7 and hope for Monahan. If not, all options available if their guys are off the board.
you're forgetting Dallas Eakins is the new coach who's probably dropping some pointers. He loved Jake Gardiner


I really hope he's not traded, I see him and Rielly really rocking the NHL up together in a few years, I was watching Keith and Seabrook play, and was really hoping we had 2 players that would turn up like them :'(

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06-20-2013, 11:46 AM
  #221
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LOL at Franson as a top pairing D-man on any team. I'd love to see him match up against the other teams top skaters. It would be a train wreck.

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06-20-2013, 11:49 AM
  #222
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It is going to be a long 13 days around here waiting for these trades to happen

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Old
06-20-2013, 11:49 AM
  #223
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Lets face it . We do not make good trading partners . Toronto just made the Playoffs for the first time in years . The Oilers are trying to finish off a complete rebuild . The leafs probably should not make many changes as the gave Boston all the could handle . Gardiner is a very good young D man , he could still bust or he could break out . His concussion should worry any GM and in before you say he over it . I had a concussion . Doctors said it was mild , the 2nd one was much easier to get after the second one i started taking seizures took me a few years and doctors to get them under control . Point is a head injury is never fully gone . So if the Leafs fan think he worth more then the 7th OA , a shot at a very good centre man your dreaming .

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06-20-2013, 11:51 AM
  #224
Larry Hoover
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
For comparison sake, you brought Justin Schultz into this...

Who scored twice as much as Franson (8G, 4 on the PP) at 9.4%
Which would have put him on pace for 14 goals and 32 A's.
Franson played avg 19 mins a game and Schultz played 21. Schultz was also a rookie, and he's 3 years younger.

So not sure how Franson would be our #1/2D when we already have that guy on our team playing the exact same role... Schultz played top 4 mins for the Oilers this year but he shouldn't have had to, he would have been better suited to play bottom pairing minutes and QB the top PP unit. He still did pretty well all things considered, he played over 80 games this season between the AHL/NHL and he's never had to play more than ~50/yr.

But I didn't bring Schultz up - you did.
I made it clear that there is no question that Schultz will be a better player than Franson. All I'm saying is for the 2013-14 season Franson would be either your best or second best D. Why are you so adamant on the idea that only goals are valuable from D? A lot of Franson's assist aren't just phantom 10 foot passes to Kessel, he creates offence with his vision.

Franson has a unique ability to take a half slap shot that has the velocity of a normal slap shot but is extremely accurate. Because of this he is able to get shots through traffic and on net very frequently. Franson often shoots low and at goalies pads to create rebounds. This is another reason why he doesn't score many goals but gets a lot of points.


Look at this pass.


He's also turned into a very good open ice hitter learning when to pick his spots but not being reckless.



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Old
06-20-2013, 11:51 AM
  #225
SephF
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
I think most of us are saying that HF Leafs MAY value Gardiner more than the Leafs actual brass...

IE: They can use him to get a piece they want/need back because they have a player who is ready to come in and fill the same role (Rielly)
Go onto HF Leafs and look at their trade proposal thread, there are people in there that are saying stuff like "call me crazy but I see Gardiner as another Karlsson"

then someones like

"nah not Karlsson, maybe more of a Letang or a Pietroangelo".

It's pretty obvious that Leafs fans value Gardiner EXTREMELY highly.

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