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06-20-2013, 10:02 AM
  #51
Axl Rhoadz*
 
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Originally Posted by Holden Caulfield View Post
Uh what? You kidding me?


Brown was hurt all playoffs.
Brown said he got hurt in game 6 vs SJ, that's a far cry from 'all playoffs.' I'd like to know what his excuse was the previous 11 games before that.

You all would be pulling your hair out if he was getting paid 6-mill and put on a performance like that....

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06-20-2013, 10:09 AM
  #52
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Brown signed for pretty cheap in 2008, wonder if maybe he will try and cash in this time.

I think 4.5 seems really really low, especially if the cap is back up next summer. Brown would be in huge demand if he ever got to the open market.

I'm thinking Brown will want similar money to Carter and Richards, and rightfully so.
Brown's no Carter or Richards (different skill sets) but given that both Carter and Richards are slightly underpaid in today's market, Brown likely deserves similar in the way of salary. Probably 5 to 5.5 will do it, depending on whether the team has cap issues or not.

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06-20-2013, 10:37 AM
  #53
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I like Brown a lot. But when players who play his style reach the upper 20's i personaly would never pay him what he's not worth. The time to pay him what he wasnt worth was the last contract where there is less risk, and hadnt peeked like he has now.
Great point and exactly what I was thinking. Guys like Brown will lose a lot of their effectiveness once they get 30+ due to the hard-hitting style.

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06-20-2013, 12:08 PM
  #54
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My guess is the AAV is closer $5m than $6m. If he gets more than 6 years, I'd guess it will be <$5m. My guess is he'll take a longer term deal and a lower AAV for security.

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06-20-2013, 12:50 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Axl Rhoadz View Post
Brown said he got hurt in game 6 vs SJ, that's a far cry from 'all playoffs.' I'd like to know what his excuse was the previous 11 games before that.

You all would be pulling your hair out if he was getting paid 6-mill and put on a performance like that....
You are basing this on 11 games? Are you pulling your hair out about Kopi? He gets paid more than 6 mill and claimed he wasn't hurt.

The team overall couldn't score often at all playoffs.

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06-20-2013, 01:39 PM
  #56
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You are basing this on 11 games? Are you pulling your hair out about Kopi? He gets paid more than 6 mill and claimed he wasn't hurt.
You bet your ass I am! That was horrible performance...ESPECIALLY for a guy who gets paid 6.8 MILLION....AND claimed to not be hurt. I was praying the guy was hurt so he had a good excuse!

But before you all start crying again, like I said several times already, I give the entire team a free-pass this year.

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06-20-2013, 02:10 PM
  #57
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Something right in between Carter and Richards is fair. So 5.5, for 7.

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06-20-2013, 02:26 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Axl Rhoadz View Post
You bet your ass I am! That was horrible performance...ESPECIALLY for a guy who gets paid 6.8 MILLION....AND claimed to not be hurt. I was praying the guy was hurt so he had a good excuse!

But before you all start crying again, like I said several times already, I give the entire team a free-pass this year.
Then don't you think your focus should be more on Kopitar than Brown?

This is just my take on it, but Kopitar is what drives Brown to be as good as he has been. When Kopi is going, so is Brown. Kopi creates the room and opportunities that Brown capitalizes on. I think if you look at the last 2 years of the playoffs it supports this opinion.

With Kopi being a non-factor (I still think he was injurned), Brown no longer had the room nor ability to create many chances on his own, resulting in most of his touches along the boards. During the regular season Kopi, while not playing great, was still running at close to a PPG average, with Brown on pace to have just as good of season as he did in the year prior.

Would I keep Brown at a price tag north of 6 million? I think we need to wait and see how he performs in the upcoming season and with a healthy Kopi (assuming he was indeed hurt).

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06-20-2013, 02:51 PM
  #59
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DB $4.5 - $5.5M for 5 years

that is my guess. he and Dean will work out a discount, so the team can continue building and control cap. DB is committed to the long term success of the franchise. i think he will eventually move into the front office in some capacity for the team when his playing days are over.

a 5-year contract will take him to around age 33. he will have had a 15-year NHL career which is a successful length of time in the league. at that point based on his style of play it is highly likely his effectiveness won't be there any longer. he either hangs them up or moves on, but it won't surprise me to him retire at that point. he is a committed family man and father. it wont surprise me to see him retire for his kids and wife.

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06-20-2013, 02:58 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Winger23 View Post
Then don't you think your focus should be more on Kopitar than Brown?

This is just my take on it, but Kopitar is what drives Brown to be as good as he has been. When Kopi is going, so is Brown. Kopi creates the room and opportunities that Brown capitalizes on. I think if you look at the last 2 years of the playoffs it supports this opinion.

With Kopi being a non-factor (I still think he was injurned), Brown no longer had the room nor ability to create many chances on his own, resulting in most of his touches along the boards. During the regular season Kopi, while not playing great, was still running at close to a PPG average, with Brown on pace to have just as good of season as he did in the year prior.

Would I keep Brown at a price tag north of 6 million? I think we need to wait and see how he performs in the upcoming season and with a healthy Kopi (assuming he was indeed hurt).
If Brown is so dependent on Kopi, why would you even consider signining Brown to Kopitar numbers?

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06-20-2013, 03:01 PM
  #61
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If Brown is so dependent on Kopi, why would you even consider signining Brown to Kopitar numbers?
Exactly, he just answered his own question on why Brown would or would not be worth 6-mill.

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06-20-2013, 03:02 PM
  #62
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Anything in the low $5M/year range is a steal.

$6M cap hit would be ok, but at the very top end

I'm hoping Brown signs a 7 year, $35M deal for us all to be happy.

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06-20-2013, 03:25 PM
  #63
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If Brown is so dependent on Kopi, why would you even consider signining Brown to Kopitar numbers?
Because brown is not a player that every team has. He is a 25 to 30 goal a year freight train if paired with a talented player.

Imo this is why I would wait til after next year to decide. If the Kings don't have the kopi prior to playoffs or someone of equal or greater talent to play with him he's not going to be worth 6 million.

I'm not trying to belittle brown at all, I just think besides Kopi and carter, everyone else relies on their linemates to be more successful. Hopefully that made sense as its hard to translate thoughts into words for me.

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06-20-2013, 03:34 PM
  #64
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Who would you guys consider as players who are considerable to Dustin Brown? In the upcoming season, Brown's salary will be $3.5M.

I find the following players to be comparable in the roles that they serve for their respective clubs as physical forwards who are capable of producing goals:

Scott Hartnell, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $4.75M.

Alex Burrows, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Brooks Laich, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Tuomo Ruutu, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.75M.

Bobby Ryan, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $5.1M.

James Neal, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $5.0M.

Jamie Benn, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $5.25M.

Ryan Callahan, signed a 3-year contract with a cap hit of $4.275M.

Drew Stafford, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.0M.

R.J. Umberger, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $4.6M.

David Backes, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Shane Doan, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $5.3M.

Using those 12 players listed above as examples, the range of their contracts range from $4 million to $5.3 million.

Although Brown may not have the goal scoring prowess of some of the players listed above, I think they can be used as a ceiling for what Brown may be worth. I think the one that stands out most is Shane Doan, who signed his contract as a 35+ player who was a UFA and served as the captain of his team.

Given those examples above, I think that Brown, at most, will sign at $5M to $5.5M.

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06-20-2013, 03:41 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Who would you guys consider as players who are considerable to Dustin Brown? In the upcoming season, Brown's salary will be $3.5M.

I find the following players to be comparable in the roles that they serve for their respective clubs as physical forwards who are capable of producing goals:

Scott Hartnell, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $4.75M.

Alex Burrows, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Brooks Laich, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Tuomo Ruutu, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.75M.

Bobby Ryan, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $5.1M.

James Neal, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $5.0M.

Jamie Benn, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $5.25M.

Ryan Callahan, signed a 3-year contract with a cap hit of $4.275M.

Drew Stafford, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.0M.

R.J. Umberger, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $4.6M.

David Backes, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Shane Doan, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $5.3M.

Using those 12 players listed above as examples, the range of their contracts range from $4 million to $5.3 million.

Although Brown may not have the goal scoring prowess of some of the players listed above, I think they can be used as a ceiling for what Brown may be worth. I think the one that stands out most is Shane Doan, who signed his contract as a 35+ player who was a UFA and served as the captain of his team.

Given those examples above, I think that Brown, at most, will sign at $5M to $5.5M.
Beautiful, and thus should end any argument on whether Brown is worth anything but a 5.5-mil/year MAX.

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06-20-2013, 03:47 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Axl Rhoadz View Post
Beautiful, and thus should end any argument on whether Brown is worth anything but a 5.5-mil/year MAX.
Why? Because you say so? You also said the kings season was done last year and they went on to win the cup.

I'm not advocating he should get more than 6 million, but it cracks me up when people on here are so sure of things. He's worth whatever the Kings can afford and think he's worth.

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06-20-2013, 05:16 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Winger23 View Post
Why? Because you say so? You also said the kings season was done last year and they went on to win the cup.

I'm not advocating he should get more than 6 million, but it cracks me up when people on here are so sure of things. He's worth whatever the Kings can afford and think he's worth.
You know, I was seriously going to reply to this.....but then common sense kicked in.

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06-20-2013, 06:31 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Axl Rhoadz View Post
You know, I was seriously going to reply to this.....but then common sense kicked in.
Ok..

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06-20-2013, 06:34 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
Who would you guys consider as players who are considerable to Dustin Brown? In the upcoming season, Brown's salary will be $3.5M.

I find the following players to be comparable in the roles that they serve for their respective clubs as physical forwards who are capable of producing goals:

Scott Hartnell, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $4.75M.

Alex Burrows, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Brooks Laich, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Tuomo Ruutu, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.75M.

Bobby Ryan, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $5.1M.

James Neal, signed a 6-year contract with a cap hit of $5.0M.

Jamie Benn, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $5.25M.

Ryan Callahan, signed a 3-year contract with a cap hit of $4.275M.

Drew Stafford, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $4.0M.

R.J. Umberger, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $4.6M.

David Backes, signed a 5-year contract with a cap hit of $4.5M.

Shane Doan, signed a 4-year contract with a cap hit of $5.3M.

Using those 12 players listed above as examples, the range of their contracts range from $4 million to $5.3 million.

Although Brown may not have the goal scoring prowess of some of the players listed above, I think they can be used as a ceiling for what Brown may be worth. I think the one that stands out most is Shane Doan, who signed his contract as a 35+ player who was a UFA and served as the captain of his team.

Given those examples above, I think that Brown, at most, will sign at $5M to $5.5M.


I think there's a few things at play that will help keep that number even lower. We're not quite sure at this point what the max cap is going to be at in a year or more so with that in mind Dean basically asks Brown to do the team another solid by keeping that number low, in turn he gets max years at 8 which I think leaves him at about 37 so if he's still playing he has room for a retirement contract. As well give Brown some form of NTC/NMC.

So... 6/5.5/5.5/5/5/4/3/3. 37 over 8 = 4.625 per year. I'm not up to date on the current CBA but I think that works. I think that 4.625 is a fair cap hit and I think Brown has earned a NTC/NMC.

I think if we know for sure the cap is going up, Brown is worth a number closer to 6 per year. But until then working with 64 mill as next years potential cap, Dean has to try to keep Browns number around 5. So Brown signs now for near 5 or waits until next spring and sees where the cap is at then. I'd prefer he signs as soon as possible with a number below 5.

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06-20-2013, 07:01 PM
  #70
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So which of the listed players would you take over Dustin Brown?

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06-20-2013, 07:04 PM
  #71
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So which of the listed players would you take over Dustin Brown?
Honestly, none of them. While adding a Bobby Ryan or James Neal would look great on paper (and I'd welcome them onto this roster with open arms), adding them at the cost of Brown would take out the edge the Kings have in having a penalty drawing, hard hitting pest in Dustin Brown. What he did in the playoffs was astounding in how many penalties he drew and completely threw the opposition off of their game. The last guy I recall doing that in a playoff run was Claude Lemieux.

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06-20-2013, 07:08 PM
  #72
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Exactly. Which is why I'd argue he could easily get paid more than any of them. Most of them are either old, signed away mostly RFA years or simply aren't anywhere near as good as Brown.

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06-20-2013, 07:13 PM
  #73
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Well, the thing that helps Brown is that he's such a unique player with how he plays, thus making him more valuable to the Kings. We saw how the team performed when Brown was out of the lineup serving his suspension, and it was not pretty.

Although I would say most of us wish he was more consistent in the scoring department, he's a rare player to find in this league and as a result is an irreplaceable component on the roster.

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06-20-2013, 07:59 PM
  #74
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I thought the argument was suppose to be over.

In all seriousness the closest player on that list is probably doan and he is obviously part is prime. I don't think brown will ask for it but I do think he's worth more than those listed.

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06-20-2013, 09:01 PM
  #75
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After looking at all those, the highest I think he deserves is in the low 5s.

On a side note, if Phoenix moves I wonder if Doan retires since he seems to tied to his ranch in Arizona. If he does, they are stuck with a pretty hefty cap hit for a few more years since he's over 35. 3 more years at $5.3 million? Yikes!

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