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2012-2013 Rangers Prospects Thread (Player Stats in Post #1; Updated 7/3) *Part IV*

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06-20-2013, 04:00 PM
  #426
pdogfizzle
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
It's always a good idea to follow up one moronic statement with another. Be consistent I say. Chris Kreider has an elite shot; nothing stupid about that. And if Christian Thomas made the team out of camp you could say the same thing about him. Does CK have elite speed? Or is it too early to tell?
I think people are throwing the word "elite" around a little too much. What's your definition of elite?

Does Kreider have a top 20? 30? shot in the NHL? That's elite in my mind... and no he doesn't to me. A very good shot? Yes. But no where near elite.

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06-20-2013, 04:16 PM
  #427
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So you're saying it is a good idea for someone at a different level of clever?
I think it's clear that I'm saying that it's not a good idea for anyone and even if one is articulate and thoughtful it still does not rise to the level of a good idea.

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06-20-2013, 04:21 PM
  #428
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Originally Posted by pdogfizzle View Post
I think people are throwing the word "elite" around a little too much. What's your definition of elite?

Does Kreider have a top 20? 30? shot in the NHL? That's elite in my mind... and no he doesn't to me. A very good shot? Yes. But no where near elite.
I agree with you about using the term elite and I am saying that his shot is one of the best in the league. His straight ahead skating is also elite which is why he was a a first round. The real question is will he take those two skills, improve his stick handling, puck possession and overall awareness on the ice and become an elite player. Could happen.

His shot is pretty special. It seems to get on the goalie quicker than they are accustomed; combine that with the ability to hit the net and you have a weapon.

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06-20-2013, 04:26 PM
  #429
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
I agree with you about using the term elite and I am saying that his shot is one of the best in the league. His straight ahead skating is also elite which is why he was a a first round. The real question is will he take those two skills, improve his stick handling, puck possession and overall awareness on the ice and become an elite player. Could happen.

His shot is pretty special. It seems to get on the goalie quicker than they are accustomed; combine that with the ability to hit the net and you have a weapon.
i can agree with you that his speed is up there but I just cant say his shot is there yet. He's had some nice shots and moments but not enough consistently to say his shot is elite. maybe soon enough but I think we gotta pump the breaks on the shot

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06-20-2013, 07:21 PM
  #430
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http://blueshirtsunited.com/posts/36...s#.UcNVrxbvy8o

Adam Graves should be a candidate for a bigger role in the Rangers organization. Graves can call Steve Spott and ask about John Moore(and get an honest opinion) because he is thisclose with Spott. He knows all of the Rangers prospects from the rookie camps. He travels to watch Rangers prospects play. He meets with them. He scouts other players. This guy doesn't sit on his ass and do nothing like #11 who likes to seen sitting next to Sather at home games. Graves is part of Oshawa Generals ownership group.

Actually, I know first hand that Messier does literally the same exact things that Graves does. Messier spends a LOT of time traveling to meet with prospects and watch them and give them tips.

But I get it. "Messier does nothing" is the new flavor of the month despite the fact that it's factually false, so I'm not going to get in the way of the propaganda.

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06-20-2013, 08:15 PM
  #431
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Watching some videos of Fast and Lindberg, they both definitely look very impressive. I agree with the O'Reilly comparison for Lindberg. Also see a little Zetterberg in there, perhaps...but I don't want to jump the gun. Fast reminded me of Danny Briere.
Links?

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06-20-2013, 08:17 PM
  #432
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Originally Posted by Championship View Post
Links?
Some well put together highlight vids:





It's hard to get a true read of skills through highlight vids, but you can see the tools these two players possess.

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06-20-2013, 08:20 PM
  #433
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Halpern can skate, bro. I don't know why NHL GMs and coaches are so in the dark about this guy.
Is this sarcasm?

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06-20-2013, 08:48 PM
  #434
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Originally Posted by Bardof425 View Post
I agree with you about using the term elite and I am saying that his shot is one of the best in the league. His straight ahead skating is also elite which is why he was a a first round. The real question is will he take those two skills, improve his stick handling, puck possession and overall awareness on the ice and become an elite player. Could happen.

His shot is pretty special. It seems to get on the goalie quicker than they are accustomed; combine that with the ability to hit the net and you have a weapon.
I dont' think his stickhandling and puck possession is all that bad either. He's not going to be a "hold on to the puck forever and make plays" kind of guy but he makes small, quick moves with the puck and can move it effectively. He's just more likely to be the type that gets the puck and looks for a good play and makes it quickly (of course, it won't always be a "good" play, but htat's hockey)

I still think confidence and awareness of where to go are his biggest needs to work on. He can't float around and he can't just run around with no idea of what he's doing.

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06-21-2013, 12:06 AM
  #435
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Saying Chris Kreider has an elite anything at the NHL level is whats pretty stupid at this point -- almost as stupid as promoting Jeff Halpern.
huh?

Kreider has elite top end NHL speed.

I don't care if YOU think that's stupid, anyone who has ever watched the guy play knows it.

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06-21-2013, 12:23 AM
  #436
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Fasth doesn't seem to be a reel highlight skill guy, rather a right place at the right time type of guy. Especially in the highlight vid...only time will tell.

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06-21-2013, 12:35 AM
  #437
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i think fasth reminds me a little of Marty Straka in how he plays...lindberg reminds me of how Cody Hodgson played back in juniors.

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06-21-2013, 12:36 AM
  #438
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im just comparing style of play, not necessarily what they will become...i feel th need to make that caveat since i know several ppl loved to jump all over you just for brining up comparisons.

"he skates like bure"
"did you just compare him to bure?!.."

"yeah....in how he skates...that it"

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06-21-2013, 12:43 AM
  #439
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
i think fasth reminds me a little of Marty Straka in how he plays...lindberg reminds me of how Cody Hodgson played back in juniors.
OH MY GOD DID YOU JUST COMPARE FAST TO STRAKA.

HOW DARE YOU.

Cody Hodgson is a good comparison offensively, but from what I've read, Lindberg is a LOT better defensively than Hodg.

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06-21-2013, 12:52 AM
  #440
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Originally Posted by Inferno View Post
i think fasth reminds me a little of Marty Straka in how he plays...lindberg reminds me of how Cody Hodgson played back in juniors.
Straka isnt a bad comparison. I was thinking Stempniak or even Brunner

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06-21-2013, 01:01 AM
  #441
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Kreider's a freak athlete. He was a freak athlete in BC as well but it took him awhile to figure out his game there. It's taking him awhile to figure out his game in the NHL as well. Gretzky wasn't jumping out of any pools and he's the greatest offensive player of all time. Hockey's a fast game and offensive production requires split second decision making and creativity. He hasn't shown that yet.

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06-21-2013, 01:02 AM
  #442
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Originally Posted by Miz View Post
Straka isnt a bad comparison. I was thinking Stempniak or even Brunner
Loui Eriksson is who he has reminded me of since the WJC.

Lindberg looks like a Bergeron type.

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06-21-2013, 01:26 AM
  #443
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Originally Posted by stan the caddy View Post
Kreider's a freak athlete. He was a freak athlete in BC as well but it took him awhile to figure out his game there. It's taking him awhile to figure out his game in the NHL as well. Gretzky wasn't jumping out of any pools and he's the greatest offensive player of all time. Hockey's a fast game and offensive production requires split second decision making and creativity. He hasn't shown that yet.
Terrible comparison, besides the fact that Gretzky was about a half a minute ahead of everyone around him as far as knowing what was going on within the game what does that have to do with Kreider being a freak athlete?

A countless number of very athletic people don't make it in sports, reason being they don't have the brains.

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06-21-2013, 01:28 AM
  #444
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
Loui Eriksson is who he has reminded me of since the WJC.

Lindberg looks like a Bergeron type.
No pressure, kid.

Edit: If you mean in the WJC tourney only, I agree.


Last edited by Kershaw: 06-21-2013 at 01:41 AM.
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06-21-2013, 01:40 AM
  #445
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OH MY GOD DID YOU JUST COMPARE FAST TO STRAKA.

HOW DARE YOU.

Cody Hodgson is a good comparison offensively, but from what I've read, Lindberg is a LOT better defensively than Hodg.
Hodgson was one of the best CHL players defensively. He won the awards for best faceoff guy, best PK guy and hardest worker award at that level. I doubt Lindberg becomes as good as Hodgson, that's just teetering too much with high expectations imo. Marcus Kruger 20-30 pt center is decent comparision IMO for first few yrs.

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06-21-2013, 01:42 AM
  #446
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Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
Hodgson was one of the best CHL players defensively. He won the awards for best faceoff guy, best PK guy and hardest worker award at that level. I doubt Lindberg becomes as good as Hodgson, that's just teetering too much with high expectations imo. Marcus Kruger 20-30 pt center is decent comparision IMO for first few yrs.
Hodg has been very up and down at the NHL level in his own zone. Skating has been his problem.

Obviously not expecting Lindberg to be as productive as Hodg (who I expect to be a 65-70 point player), but I think he definitely has some untapped offensive upside.

A 30 point shutdown C would be awesome, though.

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06-21-2013, 01:43 AM
  #447
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Terrible comparison, besides the fact that Gretzky was about a half a minute ahead of everyone around him as far as knowing what was going on within the game what does that have to do with Kreider being a freak athlete?

A countless number of very athletic people don't make it in sports, reason being they don't have the brains.
That's my whole point. He might be there athletically but his brain isn't. People think he should be gauranteed top 6 minutes because he can skate fast and shoot hard.

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06-21-2013, 01:53 AM
  #448
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Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
Hodg has been very up and down at the NHL level in his own zone. Skating has been his problem.

Obviously not expecting Lindberg to be as productive as Hodg (who I expect to be a 65-70 point player), but I think he definitely has some untapped offensive upside.

A 30 point shutdown C would be awesome, though.
That's true, Hodgson has been up and down.

I just think expectations are going a bit too high for Lindberg's rookie season. A lot of 1st year Pros struggle and we've seen that with Miller, Kreider and MDZ before. I'd like to see a strong AHL team like the Griffins/Crunch this past season, with call ups here and there. Both Tampa and Detroit are bringing up their prospects along nice and slowly. For comparison to Lindberg, I don't think Calle Jarnkrok is going to sniff many NHL minutes with the Wings foundation of ripening their prospects. I just hope he isn't rushed and force-ably relied to play a role well above his capabilities like Kreider/Miller were.


Last edited by Kershaw: 06-21-2013 at 02:03 AM.
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06-21-2013, 01:54 AM
  #449
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That's my whole point. He might be there athletically but his brain isn't. People think he should be gauranteed top 6 minutes because he can skate fast and shoot hard.
Appolo Ono in Brock Lesnar's body would make the ultimate hockey player.

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06-21-2013, 09:27 AM
  #450
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Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
No pressure, kid.

Edit: If you mean in the WJC tourney only, I agree.
What I meant by the comparisons was more playing style. Lindberg is physical and strong on his skates but he has a high hockey IQ and is a good positional player. Similar to the way Bergeron or Stepan play.

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