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Rangers Officially Introduce Alain Vigneault As Coach

View Poll Results: What do you think of the hire?
Good hire 142 66.67%
Bad hire 7 3.29%
Neutral; will wait and see... 64 30.05%
Voters: 213. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-22-2013, 09:37 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Just watched the press conference. Saying all the right things, clearly more media friendly.

Still have to wait to watch the on-ice product. AV was my third choice to coach this team, so I'm staying hesitant.
It's easy to be media-friendly in mid-June. Not saying he won't be media-friendly, but what happens today is irrelevant.

Personally, I could not care less whether or not a coach gets along with the media. It is of zero importance to a team's success.

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06-22-2013, 09:39 AM
  #52
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13 candidates, 4 phones calls, 2 interviews. Wow, Glen Sather really left no stone unturned in this search. What a tireless worker. Something that could be done in about an hour.

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06-22-2013, 09:43 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
13 candidates, 4 phones calls, 2 interviews. Wow, Glen Sather really left no stone unturned in this search. What a tireless worker. Something that could be done in about an hour.
Lets just be happy we didn't get Messier.

This could have set us back a decade.

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06-22-2013, 09:51 AM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
13 candidates, 4 phones calls, 2 interviews. Wow, Glen Sather really left no stone unturned in this search. What a tireless worker. Something that could be done in about an hour.
Not to make excuses, but this was clearly a rushed process. Wanting a coach by the draft was a smart decision that made the process terrible. Surely they could have gone more indepth, but they didn't really have the time considering their gameplan.

Sather interviewed 4 coaches on the phone? AV, Mess, Ruff, Eakins. Two in person; AV, Messier.

I think there obviously could have been some more potential guys out there that deserved a longer look; Horachek, Robinson, Boucher, a few others. To me, the four that Sather took the time to talk to were the best options for the Franchise. Messier borderline.

Oh well. Like I said, not going to have too much time to conduct a coaching search if you want your guy in place before the draft, and you fire your coach a week after your season ends in the second round of the playoffs.

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06-22-2013, 09:54 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
13 candidates, 4 phones calls, 2 interviews. Wow, Glen Sather really left no stone unturned in this search. What a tireless worker. Something that could be done in about an hour.
BRB, I agree with you about the extensive search that was promised, but didn't really happen...from what we've been told.

However, I think Sather wanted AV all along, and he had to fast track the process or risk losing him to Dallas. I believe Sather wanted AV 7-8 years ago, so why waste ime when you could be eating ice cream or smkoking a cigar...BTW, I like AV and think he will do a great job.

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06-22-2013, 10:04 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
I think any way you cut it, and even if you're not a fan of firing Torts, this isn't a BAD hiring. I could understand being excited or on the fence, but thinking it's a bad signing makes no sense IMO.
I put wait and see. Mostly because there are too many questions at this point...

Will he need a complete re-vamp of the the roster?
Will he be able to fix the PP?
Will he get the most out of the roster he is given?
Will his new system expose our young D?
Will Hank be able to hold up to more odd man rushes, better chances, etc IF that new system is implimented and one of the unfortunate results are those things?

I think he ws the best hire (probably) that we could have made, but I'm not as yet convinced it'll make a huge difference... I am VERY hopeful it will.

So, I (we) wait and see.

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06-22-2013, 10:10 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Graves94 View Post
BRB, I agree with you about the extensive search that was promised, but didn't really happen...from what we've been told.

However, I think Sather wanted AV all along, and he had to fast track the process or risk losing him to Dallas. I believe Sather wanted AV 7-8 years ago, so why waste ime when you could be eating ice cream or smkoking a cigar...BTW, I like AV and think he will do a great job.
All along? What does that mean? For the last 3 weeks? Sather is flying by the seat of his pants. He has been since hes gotten here.

I really think some fans just like the constant change and drama. It lends plenty of time frames where hope and optimism reign supreme. Its sort of like the draft. Ultimately, more and more prospects flood into the system and cause us to forget about the busts.

Unfortunately, operations are rarely successful when they are run in this way.

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06-22-2013, 10:11 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Riche16 View Post
I put wait and see. Mostly because there are too many questions at this point...

Will he need a complete re-vamp of the the roster?
Will he be able to fix the PP?
Will he get the most out of the roster he is given?
Will his new system expose our young D?
Will Hank be able to hold up to more odd man rushes, better chances, etc IF that new system is implimented and one of the unfortunate results are those things?

I think he ws the best hire (probably) that we could have made, but I'm not as yet convinced it'll make a huge difference... I am VERY hopeful it will.

So, I (we) wait and see.
Bolded is something I'm particularly interested in. On the other hand, it will also be worth noting how Lundqvist performs considering he's going to see more shots. Both in the sense that he will literally SEE more (as in vision wise) as Rangers players won't be diving in front of him all the time, and that with less shot blocking, more shots will be hitting the net. This past season the Rangers gave up 28.2 shots a game, which was 11th lowest in the league. The year before, it was 27.8, 6th fewest.

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06-22-2013, 10:13 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Not to make excuses, but this was clearly a rushed process. Wanting a coach by the draft was a smart decision that made the process terrible. Surely they could have gone more indepth, but they didn't really have the time considering their gameplan.

Sather interviewed 4 coaches on the phone? AV, Mess, Ruff, Eakins. Two in person; AV, Messier.

I think there obviously could have been some more potential guys out there that deserved a longer look; Horachek, Robinson, Boucher, a few others. To me, the four that Sather took the time to talk to were the best options for the Franchise. Messier borderline.

Oh well. Like I said, not going to have too much time to conduct a coaching search if you want your guy in place before the draft, and you fire your coach a week after your season ends in the second round of the playoffs.
I never really understood putting a timeframe on the whole thing. Its not like Sather's draft philosophy is tailored to the coach.

Perhaps more importantly, given Sather's track record of roster management failure and scapegoating, Vigneault is very likely to be gone before the players they draft next week are ready to make consistent contributions to the big club.

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06-22-2013, 10:18 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I never really understood putting a timeframe on the whole thing. Its not like Sather's draft philosophy is tailored to the coach.

Perhaps more importantly, given Sather's track record of roster management failure and scapegoating, Vigneault is very likely to be gone before the players they draft next week are ready to make consistent contributions to the big club.
Hm, I don't know, I disagree. I think it's good to know what kind of coach you have when you enter the draft. If the Rangers do end up dealing into the first round, there's a good chance that player sees the NHL under this coach. It's a good idea to have the right mindset of what player your coaches want, and tailor the system.

Many would argue the Rangers got the best, or at least second best HC on the market this year. I'd disagree with that (again, I had AV third).

Also, you don't really hire a coach and say "Well, I don't suspect you're going to be here when these kids come to fruition, so we won't be needing you at the draft"

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06-22-2013, 10:22 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Bolded is something I'm particularly interested in. On the other hand, it will also be worth noting how Lundqvist performs considering he's going to see more shots. Both in the sense that he will literally SEE more (as in vision wise) as Rangers players won't be diving in front of him all the time, and that with less shot blocking, more shots will be hitting the net. This past season the Rangers gave up 28.2 shots a game, which was 11th lowest in the league. The year before, it was 27.8, 6th fewest.
Absolutely. Hank will tell you he can stop it if he can see it. I love Hank but that's just flat out false. If we go back to taking the pass away and letting Hank take the shooter on 2 on 1s I think he'll stop most of 'em but to think he'll not get beat high glove once in a while is insane.

Less screens, less defelections will certainly be a helpful thing, if that's where this goes.

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06-22-2013, 10:40 AM
  #62
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Absolutely. Hank will tell you he can stop it if he can see it. I love Hank but that's just flat out false. If we go back to taking the pass away and letting Hank take the shooter on 2 on 1s I think he'll stop most of 'em but to think he'll not get beat high glove once in a while is insane.

Less screens, less defelections will certainly be a helpful thing, if that's where this goes.
I think a safe wager would say that Hank should win at least 45 with 15 shutouts next season

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06-22-2013, 10:40 AM
  #63
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Hm, I don't know, I disagree. I think it's good to know what kind of coach you have when you enter the draft. If the Rangers do end up dealing into the first round, there's a good chance that player sees the NHL under this coach. It's a good idea to have the right mindset of what player your coaches want, and tailor the system.

Many would argue the Rangers got the best, or at least second best HC on the market this year. I'd disagree with that (again, I had AV third).

Also, you don't really hire a coach and say "Well, I don't suspect you're going to be here when these kids come to fruition, so we won't be needing you at the draft"
Yea, makes sense - in theory. I just dont think the Rangers do it. In fact, I think the whole organization is disjointed when it comes to that sort of thing.

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06-22-2013, 10:47 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
13 candidates, 4 phones calls, 2 interviews. Wow, Glen Sather really left no stone unturned in this search. What a tireless worker. Something that could be done in about an hour.
Not to be too much of an arm chair QB (but ok, I will). This was a pretty easy decision once AV reciprocated interest.

The curious thing to me is Mark Messier's mind set. I have no idea what goes on behind close doors with him, Sather & Dolan, but where did he even get the idea that he could coach the Rangers with out ANY coaching experience? Just curious.

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06-22-2013, 10:54 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
All along? What does that mean? For the last 3 weeks? Sather is flying by the seat of his pants. He has been since hes gotten here.

I really think some fans just like the constant change and drama. It lends plenty of time frames where hope and optimism reign supreme. Its sort of like the draft. Ultimately, more and more prospects flood into the system and cause us to forget about the busts.

Unfortunately, operations are rarely successful when they are run in this way.
All along means that once he knew AV was available, he was at the top of his list.

You're naive to think that Sather is the "only" person that decides things for the entire organization. He's not head of scouting, player development, capologist, etc...Yes, he makes the final deceision on things, but gets input from the rest of his team. I don't understand what you're saying or referring to when you say "some fans like the constant change"...Torts was let go because the team, including the players, were tired of playing that system for so long and felt they needed to go another direction to win the SC. Simple as that, really, so as a fan, I comment on what I see and not on what is speculated.

I think the Rangers are headed in the right direction, and whether its Sather's doing or others within the organization, let's just be happy we're not in a situation that we were 5-15 yrs ago.

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06-22-2013, 11:27 AM
  #66
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Rangers hire arguably the top coach on the market, and it's a "rush job". I preferred Eakins, Oh well. Clearly he's the guy the Rangers wanted when this process started. Pretty sure RangerBoy posted all of the information from all corners of the earth since the start of the process. And it looked like Vigneault was the guy from day one.

Cherepanov, Del Zotto, Kreider, McIlrath, Miller.

Three of the last 5 first round picks are on the NHL roster. "Busts"? Cherepanov DIED. "Bust?" McIlrath will most likely compete for a spot in camp and get a recall at some point during the season. "Bust"? That's 4 of the last 5. Only two of them in the top half of the first round.

Someone sure has strong opinions on scouting, drafting, and player development, yet never posts in any of the player development threads. Except when it's to continue a crusade about how unworthy of the NHL Chris Kreider is. What a polarizing player. And he's got a whopping one season of Pro hockey under his belt. "I like the draft, it's fun...ho hum". Really? How much CHL, NCAA, USHL, so on and so forth do you watch? Pales in comparison to a lot of folks around here. Guaranteed. They're wrong, but you're right? HIGHLY unlikely.

Gorton and Clark mostly run the Rangers draft.

Callahan, Stepan, Hagelin, Girardi, Dubinsky, Anisimov, Sauer...the Rangers haven't found talent in later rounds or undrafted free agents since 2004?

McDonagh, Moore, Brassard.

Rangers haven't found good young talent through trades?

Some people will ****ing ***** about anything.

One year removed from a Conference Finals appearance.

Let's see who Vigneault's staff is, how the draft plays out, how free agency plays out, how camp plays out, before condemning things.

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06-22-2013, 11:32 AM
  #67
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Over the last 10 days or so I've spent a lot of car time listening to NHL radio on XM. Almost every guest (GMs, writers, players, front office people, etc) was asked about AV and how he would fit with the Rangers. Without exception they all used the adjectives to describe him: professional, accomplished, competent, able. Those were the qualities that came across during yesterday's conference.

If you look at the top coaches in the league today particularly the two guys in the Cup finals, you can use the same words to describe them. Every coach in the league is a good tactician or would not have reached this level. Some or a bit better than others, but all are pretty much the same. All handle the bench and in game adjustments well: again some better than others.

My point is this: sometimes I feel that it is the off ice stuff, the group dynamics that a coach creates, that is utmost importance: the stuff that we don't see but can only intuit from watching, listening, and thinking.

At the end, this is what did Torts in. Yes, his strategy and tactics drove us crazy but his strategy and tactics can win in this league. Even his hard ass personality can win in this league: every coaching philosophy and personality can both win and lose. Coaching is very much an art form and in many ways success cannot be quantified. Every tactic and strategy and personality can succeed or fail.

Tort's problem was that he became bigger than the team. Everything revolved around him rather than the players. He became the story. He was like a dictator run amok. Unchecked, he ended up undermining and negatively impacting his own team.

We can complain about our lousy power play, our shot-blocking to a fault, our shackling of our best offensive talent and so on all we want. No matter what Sather says (at times during the presser I thought he was incoherent) about us becoming more offensive minded (something I agree with), I do not believe it was this that did Torts in. Torts saw a team with its strength being in goal and in a young D corps and he ran with it, certainly to a fault.

But it wasn't strategy, philosophy, or tactics that did him in. It was personality.

I don't think we will have this problem with AV. Whether we become an elite team and seriously challenge for the Cup over the next few years cannot be predicted and depends on so many factors (injuries, growth of young players, the rise and fall of other teams, etc), but I don't think that AV's personality and philosophy will be an issue.

He seem like the consummate professional.
This sir, was a great point of view! Good post.

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06-22-2013, 11:56 AM
  #68
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Damn you Sather, you didn't interview every minor league coach in the NY area!!!!

When there are only 3-4 real options for an opening it doesn't matter how many people you put on the list does it? Just another reason to *****?

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06-22-2013, 11:59 AM
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Damn you Sather, you didn't interview every minor league coach in the NY area!!!!

When there are only 3-4 real options for an opening it doesn't matter how many people you put on the list does it? Just another reason to *****?
At least its not the NFL where you literally have to go through the motions and interview guys you don't want

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06-22-2013, 12:07 PM
  #70
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At least its not the NFL where you literally have to go through the motions and interview guys you don't want
Exactly, people were worried he'd hire the first available guy, some people thought he'd drag it out until the very end. He basically split it down the middle and part of that is because Dallas wanted AV. But still no one is happy lol.

I dislike some of what Sather does just as much as anyone else, but not everything he does is terrible. I like the hiring, I understand it was the safe move to an extent and that is ok with me. Knowing Sather we could have just as easily ended up with a good ole boy.

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06-22-2013, 12:13 PM
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Exactly, people were worried he'd hire the first available guy, some people thought he'd drag it out until the very end. He basically split it down the middle and part of that is because Dallas wanted AV. But still no one is happy lol.

I dislike some of what Sather does just as much as anyone else, but not everything he does is terrible. I like the hiring, I understand it was the safe move to an extent and that is ok with me. Knowing Sather we could have just as easily ended up with a good ole boy.
He signed the best available coach. I disagreed with firing Torts.. but we did the best we can to replace.

And yeah.. despite my nick, I've been pleased with Sather basically since the lockout.. minus the Redden signing of course.

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06-22-2013, 12:35 PM
  #72
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Didn't take too long for people to start *****ing about Sather hiring AV, just because it is Sather.

AV is a safe hire and ,while I have my doubts about him, he is one of the better options out there.
If Gorton was GM and chose AV people would be saying what a great hire it was.

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06-22-2013, 12:39 PM
  #73
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He signed the best available coach. I disagreed with firing Torts.. but we did the best we can to replace.

And yeah.. despite my nick, I've been pleased with Sather basically since the lockout.. minus the Redden signing of course.
Agreed. He seems to have been putting together some better teams. The rangers are not, and haven't been for quite some time, cellar dwellers... And that is a beautiful thing. We're not the florida panthers, and praise jesus for that one.

Of course, there is Redden... oh well. i guess the guy can make one major mistake over the course of several years

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06-22-2013, 12:44 PM
  #74
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Didn't take too long for people to start *****ing about Sather hiring AV, just because it is Sather.

AV is a safe hire and ,while I have my doubts about him, he is one of the better options out there.
If Gorton was GM and chose AV people would be saying what a great hire it was.
Pretty much...

AV is fine with me... and to people *****ing about only meeting 2 people in person and 4 on the phone... Do you really think he's looking over applications like he's some office manager. You know who your options are going into something like this, you know who the top guys are. Dallas Eakins got scooped up by Edmonton and that probably narrowed it down further and really unless tippet was suddenly available this was the best option. I think Lindy is a good head coach.. but his last days in Buffalo and the past couple years he just looked tired. hes been doing it forever.

Torts was and is a good head coach but his type of coaching as a life span of maybe 4-5 years befor the players start ignoring him. Its not as though Sather didn't have him here for the longest period of any coac hhe has hired and with a goalie in his prime do you really want to waste half a season figuring out that he lost the room for sure.

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06-22-2013, 12:47 PM
  #75
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Didn't take too long for people to start *****ing about Sather hiring AV, just because it is Sather.

AV is a safe hire and ,while I have my doubts about him, he is one of the better options out there.
If Gorton was GM and chose AV people would be saying what a great hire it was.
Pretty much sums it up.

Every coach can be nitpicked. But AV is a fine coach, zero question about that. We'll get to see how far he can take things.

And speaking of Gorton, people need to realize or come to terms that Gorton is being groomed as Sather's heir apparent.

Sather is unpredictable yes, and I can't say I know the inner workings of the Rangers. But all observations point to Sather either leaning on Gorton's opinions or that Gorton's voice matters significantly. I have little doubt that Gorton helped to target AV from the start of this search, which is why I was never really worried about the Messier rumors.

I may very well eat crow on this when the time comes, but I can't wait for Gorton to take over as the full-time GM. For now, I'm comforted in the belief that anything that Sather does, Gorton is counseling him with in some manner.

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