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The Value of an enforcer on the Pens 2013-2014 team

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06-22-2013, 10:30 AM
  #126
Shady Machine
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
Yep. And Chara would have not only gotten his ass beat, he would have been taken off the ice for 5 minutes.
Or he would have not fought and skated away, leaving Big Mac in the box. Or, more likely, we wouldn't even have the puck in the Boston zone in the first place.

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06-22-2013, 10:30 AM
  #127
lastcupever75
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Originally Posted by MichiganWolverines View Post
I just told you, they are in need for a third-line winger. Tyler Kennedy has proven that he can be an effective third-line winger.
maybe i've seen too much of TKs work

but if im the rangers, im not trading rights for a guy like TK (who i can find anywhere, really) for a big young guy who skate and fight

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06-22-2013, 10:31 AM
  #128
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My point with Sid is that he should have known his jaw would get targeted in the series, so if one punch really threw him off his game, he's either really naive and stupid or he's mentally weak. I don't believe any of those things are true. Therefore, I believe you and others are making far too much out of this jaw punch incident. It's not even close to one of the reasons we lost that series.
I agree. I have much bigger issues w/ Geno taking 15 crosschecks in the back against Philly, Geno slewfooted into the boards, Sid receiving stickwork all year, etc with nary a peep from our team.

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06-22-2013, 10:31 AM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
Yep. And Chara would have not only gotten his ass beat, he would have been taken off the ice for 5 minutes.
or he would have skated to the bench and the Bruins would have had a powerplay. I mean, the pistols may have changed things I guess. But then Melnyks investigators would have shown up and we'd have had a whole big mess on our hands.

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06-22-2013, 10:35 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post


You never watched Jay Caufield play?





Yep, it was Carkner. And that incident is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Who cares what the circumstances are, what time of year it is or when stuff happens. If you take a shot at our guys, we're coming after you. Loved that move by Carkner.

.
1. or wayne van dorp or richard zemlak. god we've had some of the worst enforcers ever to lace them up

2. im with ya buddy. screw the 2 or 5 mins in the boxt taken (although we all know how some posters will cry about it). team is better off in the long run doing something like that. not only sending the other team a message, it sends your own team one as well


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06-22-2013, 10:36 AM
  #131
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Give me a Clarkson or a Neil type. Keep Mac off this team. That's basically what it comes down to.

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06-22-2013, 10:37 AM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
or he would have skated to the bench and the Bruins would have had a powerplay. I mean, the pistols may have changed things I guess. But then Melnyks investigators would have shown up and we'd have had a whole big mess on our hands.
IDK, how many instigator penalties are actually ever called, especially when a fight begins out of a scrum? Maybe they'd each get 5 and Mac would get an extra 2. Big deal. He's still off the ice for 5, and most decent teams can routinely kill a penalty.

Honestly I don't even remember Sid getting punched by Chara, so I'm not advocating a goon for that specific example. Ideally you'd want guys that can play and handle themselves. But in the regular season, I'd much rather see a Neil, Orr, or Mac as the 12th forward over Glass, Jeffrey, etc.

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06-22-2013, 10:41 AM
  #133
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Originally Posted by lastcupever75 View Post
1. or wayne van dorp or richard zemlak. god we've had some of the worst enforcers ever to lace them up

2. im with ya buddy. screw the 2 or 5 mins in the boxtkane (although we all know how some posters will cry about it). team is better off in the long run doing something like that. not only send the other team a message, it sends your own team one as well
Steve McKenna was a joke as well. If a team is going to have an enforcer, it should be an enforcer who can actually fight. Enforcers that cannot fight are completely useless.

The best enforcers to ever play in Pittsburgh were Marty McSorley, Eric Godard, Georges Laraque and Jim McKenzie.

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06-22-2013, 10:41 AM
  #134
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
Ideally you'd want guys that can play and handle themselves. .
thats how the "goon' came about

what you had was guys that could both play hockey and could kick ass. when teams cant find that combination in a player to match they have to settle for someone who can at least match up in the fighting department

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06-22-2013, 10:42 AM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
IDK, how many instigator penalties are actually ever called, especially when a fight begins out of a scrum? Maybe they'd each get 5 and Mac would get an extra 2. Big deal. He's still off the ice for 5, and most decent teams can routinely kill a penalty.

Honestly I don't even remember Sid getting punched by Chara, so I'm not advocating a goon for that specific example. Ideally you'd want guys that can play and handle themselves. But in the regular season, I'd much rather see a Neil, Orr, or Mac as the 12th forward over Glass, Jeffrey, etc.
Regular season I really don't care either way. But we will want depth guys on the roster, and signing someone like Mac takes one real hockey player away. In the playoffs, they simply aren't going to play. You can't waste spots with guys that can't play hockey in the playoffs. I'd rather dress Engo as the 7th D / 12th F than play a guy like Mac.

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06-22-2013, 10:44 AM
  #136
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Originally Posted by MichiganWolverines View Post
Steve McKenna was a joke as well. If a team is going to have an enforcer, it should be an enforcer who can actually fight. Enforcers that cannot fight are completely useless.

The best enforcers to ever play in Pittsburgh were Marty McSorely, Eric Godard, Georges Laraque and Jim McKenzie.

yep. forgot about him. mckenna was a fool


and although he dates me as a pens fan, battleship kelly is up there as well.

letting mcsorely go the 1st time he broke into the league was a huge mistake. could have been mario's bodyguard for years

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06-22-2013, 10:48 AM
  #137
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yep. forgot about him. mckenna was a fool


and although he dates me as a pens fan, battleship kelly is up there as well.

letting mcsorely go the 1st time he broke into the league was a huge mistake. could have been mario's bodyguard for years
McKenna was like Bob Probert compared to Alex Stoyanov and Kristof Oliwa!

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06-22-2013, 10:56 AM
  #138
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McKenna was like Bob Probert compared to Alex Stoyanov and Kristof Oliwa!
Do you remember when Kelly Buchberger joined the penguins before he retired? I felt sorry for him, lol.

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06-22-2013, 10:58 AM
  #139
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yep. forgot about him. mckenna was a fool
And team captain for a game!

I had a pretty intense love/hate relationship with Kelly Buchberger. On one hand... absolutely worthless in every facet of the game. Including fighting. On the other hand... you couldn't help but love a guy who took an absolute beating every single night for his team.

I honestly don't know if he won one fight while playing for the Penguins.

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06-22-2013, 11:04 AM
  #140
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Just turn Cooke loose in the playoffs. He gets penalties regardless of playing clean, he might as well actually earn them.

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06-22-2013, 12:41 PM
  #141
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I do think this club should carry an enforcer, but one that can play. Guys like Chris Neil, Shawn Thornton, etc. would be perfect on the Pens. Lucic would be a dream come true.

Engelland actually fits the mold of an enforcer than can play, but his problem is his position. It's a lot more taxing on the defense if one of their guys is in the box for 5 minutes every game, leaving only 5 guys to spread that ice time around. It's a lot easier to carry a forward enforcer, since a]the 4th line only gets 6 to 10 minutes per night anyway (as opposed to a bottom pairing who still get around 13 to 15 minutes that has to be replaced) and b]it's easier to spread around those minutes to 11 other forwards as opposed to 5 other defensemen.

But I do believe the Pens should go into next season with an enforcer they can dress every night. Even the previous season with "middleweights" like Rupp and Asham are better than what we had this season. When Tanner Glass is dressed for his "toughness and physicality", you know you're lacking in the enforcing department.

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06-22-2013, 12:50 PM
  #142
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Dress 7 D. Boom, Engo is now capable of doing it.

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06-22-2013, 01:07 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by BlindWillyMcHurt View Post
And team captain for a game!

I had a pretty intense love/hate relationship with Kelly Buchberger. On one hand... absolutely worthless in every facet of the game. Including fighting. On the other hand... you couldn't help but love a guy who took an absolute beating every single night for his team.

I honestly don't know if he won one fight while playing for the Penguins.
What gets me is that the Pens had Reid Simpson sitting in the minors that year, Buchberger was getting mauled night in and night out and you've got a capable heavy weight down in WBS who could've stepped in.

People debate the value of enforcers, but that team was horrible, it's not like Simpson would've made them any worse.

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06-22-2013, 01:11 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by MichiganWolverines View Post
Steve McKenna was a joke as well. If a team is going to have an enforcer, it should be an enforcer who can actually fight. Enforcers that cannot fight are completely useless.

The best enforcers to ever play in Pittsburgh were Marty McSorley, Eric Godard, Georges Laraque and Jim McKenzie.
Oh how quickly we forget Bob" Battleship" Kelly whose only damage from numerous skirmishes were abraded and bruised ... knuckles. It was genuinely a privilege to witness The Battleship erase the opposition.

The man made fighting an art form!

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06-22-2013, 01:29 PM
  #145
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Oh how quickly we forget Bob" Battleship" Kelly whose only damage from numerous skirmishes were abraded and bruised ... knuckles. It was genuinely a privilege to witness The Battleship erase the opposition.

The man made fighting an art form!
I'm 29, so I never got a chance to see Battleship Kelly play live, but man I've heard stories. My grandfather was a huge hockey fan and he used to wave his hand when two guys were fighting and say "Bob Kelly would've wiped the floor with both of em!"

Kelly and Bryan Watson were his favorite players. "Bugsy Watson wasn't afraid of takin' a punch, his face looked like a goddamned halloween mask."

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06-22-2013, 06:31 PM
  #146
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Oh how quickly we forget Bob" Battleship" Kelly whose only damage from numerous skirmishes were abraded and bruised ... knuckles. It was genuinely a privilege to witness The Battleship erase the opposition.

The man made fighting an art form!
I completely forgot about J.-Bob "Battleship" Kelly.

Terry Ruskowski was a very good middleweight fighter when he was on the penguins.

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06-22-2013, 07:03 PM
  #147
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I wonder how Engelland would look on the 4th line.

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06-22-2013, 07:08 PM
  #148
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I wonder how Engelland would look on the 4th line.
They tried him there briefly in 2010-11, and he looked pretty lost.

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06-22-2013, 08:01 PM
  #149
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I would prefer to see Engelland stay as a defenseman. Hopefully he can play like he did during the 2011-2012 season.

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06-22-2013, 09:10 PM
  #150
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Penguin Biznasty 2.0?

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