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2013 NHL Draft Talk Part V: Flyers own the 11th overall pick

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Old
06-22-2013, 12:58 PM
  #701
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Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
And Lindholm has an extra year of development on Lehkonen as he has a late birthday. You bring up size as a negative, I actually see it as a positive. Where Lindholm is just about maxed out physically, Lehkonen has some projection to him. He had a hell of a season as a 17 year old, in a men's league, at 150 pounds. Just imagine what this kid could be like when he physically matures. Look at his face. He's got a baby face still. He's going to naturally mature at some point. Most Finns are late bloomers for whatever reason.

Call me crazy, but I think Lehkonen (if he makes it) at #41 is better value than Lindholm at #11.
I was replying to he comparison insinuating that Lindholm was not 'that' special, and comparing him to Lehkonen as if they were similar numbers they had been putting up... when they are not, and Lindholm has been far more impressive as SHL is as good as the AHL while SM Liiga is inbetween AHL and ECHL level.

Yeh, i like Lehkonen, if he is at 41 he is great value, depending on who else is there.

But Lindholm should be a top 8 pick, ofc I would prefer a D man (Ristolainen or Nurse would be my top 2 realistically, though both may be gone by 11) but I would have no qualms if he fell there and we drafted him.

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06-22-2013, 01:02 PM
  #702
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Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
I'm about as big a proprietor of drafting a defenseman as anyone, but within reason. Obviously if it gets to our pick and lindholm and say a guy like nurse or Ristolainen are there as well, it makes it much more difficult to choose, but if Lindholm is there and nurse and Ristolainen are gone and you're choosing a guy like zadorov or Pulock over Lindholm, that's a BAD decision. Lindholm is a GREAT prospect and if the BPA decision is made that easy for you, it should be a no brainer to take Lindholm because be would undoubtedly be the BPA in that circumstance. However, like I previously stated, if you have the choice between nurse or Ristolainen and Lindholm, then it makes it much more dicey because either player could conceivably be the BPA depending on many different variables. I wouldn't be nearly as confused/angry if we took one of those two over Lindholm than zadorov or Pulock etc. that's reaching for a need, and you get into trouble a lot when you do that.
There is no chance in hell he makes it to 11. But for some strange reason he does and Nurse, Pulock, Zadorov and Ristolainen are still sitting there. You would think the Flyers would be in discussion over Darnell or Elias only. Very tough call there

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06-22-2013, 01:23 PM
  #703
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Originally Posted by Hockeypete49 View Post
There is no chance in hell he makes it to 11. But for some strange reason he does and Nurse, Pulock, Zadorov and Ristolainen are still sitting there. You would think the Flyers would be in discussion over Darnell or Elias only. Very tough call there
If all those players are there at 11, I think you trade back. I don't know how far back, but let's say CBJ wants Lindholm. You trade back to 14 and you still get Nurse, Pulock, Zadorov, or Ristolainen guaranteed. Move back to 19 with CBJ and you still have a shot at one of those, plus Morin or Morrissey. If CBJ is desperate enough for Lindholm you may be able to leverage two first rounders. 14 and 27 maybe? 19 and 27 more likely.

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06-22-2013, 01:27 PM
  #704
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Yup, when about 75% of the league is made up NA players the odds are stacked against us drafting a Euro. The Flyers were targeting Teuvo Teravainen with the 20th Pick before Chicago took him at 18 last year.
That was the rumor, but they couldn't have liked him that much if they let him fall that far without moving up. Probably just a smokescreen. He was a borderline top 10 guy going into the draft. Say what you want about this organization, but they usually get the guys they target. I still say Tom Wilson was their guy. Homer was pissed right before he went. I think they had a deal to move up and it fell through.

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06-22-2013, 02:44 PM
  #705
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
If all those players are there at 11, I think you trade back. I don't know how far back, but let's say CBJ wants Lindholm. You trade back to 14 and you still get Nurse, Pulock, Zadorov, or Ristolainen guaranteed. Move back to 19 with CBJ and you still have a shot at one of those, plus Morin or Morrissey. If CBJ is desperate enough for Lindholm you may be able to leverage two first rounders. 14 and 27 maybe? 19 and 27 more likely.
Id love to do 19 27 for 11. But i image teams like New Jersey, and Edmonton are trying to move back as well. The best value of this draft is picks 10- 35. If you can get a lot of picks in that area you can come out with a ton of talent.

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06-22-2013, 03:24 PM
  #706
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Id love to do 19 27 for 11. But i image teams like New Jersey, and Edmonton are trying to move back as well. The best value of this draft is picks 10- 35. If you can get a lot of picks in that area you can come out with a ton of talent.
It all depends on who is available. If the draft goes the way a lot of experts are suggesting, trades may not be all that abundant. But if Lindholm slips to 11 or Jones slips out of the top three, things could get interesting.

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06-22-2013, 05:20 PM
  #707
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
It all depends on who is available. If the draft goes the way a lot of experts are suggesting, trades may not be all that abundant. But if Lindholm slips to 11 or Jones slips out of the top three, things could get interesting.
I actually see a lot of trades this draft for numerous reasons.

1. cap goes down
2. many teams have multiple picks in teh draft - These create natural trade partners
3. Homer

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06-22-2013, 05:33 PM
  #708
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Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
I actually see a lot of trades this draft for numerous reasons.

1. cap goes down
2. many teams have multiple picks in teh draft - These create natural trade partners
3. Homer
We'll see. I think more trades will happen with the picks higher than the Flyers if guys fall. If Jones falls out of the top 3 you know 20 teams are going to be calling Nashville to get that pick. Teams typically don't trade picks just to get a higher pick. When teams trade up on draft day it is to get a particular player.

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06-22-2013, 06:12 PM
  #709
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
We'll see. I think more trades will happen with the picks higher than the Flyers if guys fall. If Jones falls out of the top 3 you know 20 teams are going to be calling Nashville to get that pick. Teams typically don't trade picks just to get a higher pick. When teams trade up on draft day it is to get a particular player.
If jones falls to 4. Hurricanes will do everything in their power to get him.

If that Happens I could see Nashville keep making 1 move deals until they get monahan or LIndolm.

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06-22-2013, 09:03 PM
  #710
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I've posted a lot about my thoughts on Nikita Zadorov and now I have a video that shows his skills. He really does have a unique skill set and for everyone that said his offensive game will never develop (for whatever reason) this will show you his potential.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4OsR...e_gdata_player

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06-22-2013, 09:32 PM
  #711
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Originally Posted by NHLAlert View Post
I've posted a lot about my thoughts on Nikita Zadorov and now I have a video that shows his skills. He really does have a unique skill set and for everyone that said his offensive game will never develop (for whatever reason) this will show you his potential.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4OsR...e_gdata_player
The dude is a serious talent. Amazing what he can do for such a big guy. I trust the Flyers to pick a good player if we still have that pick when it comes around.

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06-22-2013, 09:47 PM
  #712
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His moves and hands for such a huge dude is pretty amazing. *******.

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06-22-2013, 09:54 PM
  #713
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Z might be gone in the top 8. I don't see him falling to the 11th.

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06-22-2013, 09:56 PM
  #714
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Highlight videos can be very deceiving as you likely saw all of the best moves he had for a season. No doubting the talent however.... if you saw what you saw in that video on a a reasonably consistent basis, you have the potential to get the best player in the draft.

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06-22-2013, 10:00 PM
  #715
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Highlight videos can be very deceiving as you likely saw all of the best moves he had for a season. No doubting the talent however.... if you saw what you saw in that video on a a reasonably consistent basis, you have the potential to get the best player in the draft.
There's no doubting that, but I've posted before that I have seen zadorov play on many occasions this year and he does play like this on a consistent basis. He really does play hard and hustles out there. My only concern was to why Russia didn't take him to the WJC and no one really seems to know. London is a great program and I think he's progressing very nicely

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06-22-2013, 10:04 PM
  #716
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Originally Posted by NHLAlert View Post
I've posted a lot about my thoughts on Nikita Zadorov and now I have a video that shows his skills. He really does have a unique skill set and for everyone that said his offensive game will never develop (for whatever reason) this will show you his potential.

http://www.youtube.com/watchv=U4OsRq...e_gdata_player
I noticed something very alarming in this video. This video perfectly illustrates the shortcomings in Zadorov's biomechanics when he skates. Notice i didin't say skating mechanics. Zad does not get full hip extension on his strides. IN fact his inability to extend his hips is apparent almost everytime he skates. This is and always has been the problem with large players in the nhl. The inability to activate their glutes and create hip extension during a stride.

http://bretcontreras.com/wp-content/...e-Lemaitre.jpg

this picture shows an athlete that is capable of hip extension....this is found in the most elite athletes.

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06-22-2013, 10:25 PM
  #717
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I noticed something very alarming in this video. This video perfectly illustrates the shortcomings in Zadorov's biomechanics when he skates. Notice i didin't say skating mechanics. Zad does not get full hip extension on his strides. IN fact his inability to extend his hips is apparent almost everytime he skates. This is and always has been the problem with large players in the nhl. The inability to activate their glutes and create hip extension during a stride.

http://bretcontreras.com/wp-content/...e-Lemaitre.jpg

this picture shows an athlete that is capable of hip extension....this is found in the most elite athletes.
But that's not a big problem considering he's one of the best skating defensemen in the draft.

With that said the only two d-men in this draft I take over Genral Zad is Jones and Nurse.

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06-22-2013, 10:31 PM
  #718
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But that's not a big problem considering he's one of the best skating defensemen in the draft.

With that said the only two d-men in this draft I take over Genral Zad is Jones and Nurse.
I agree, his is something can be taught. He is already a great skating player though.

I agree with you though flyerfan61290; granted I'm not a pro scout nor have I seen other players as much as I've seen Zadorov but from what I have seen, he would be either the second or third defenseman that I would pick.

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06-22-2013, 11:04 PM
  #719
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But that's not a big problem considering he's one of the best skating defensemen in the draft.

With that said the only two d-men in this draft I take over Genral Zad is Jones and Nurse.
Thats like saying size wont be an issue for Gaudreau because he dominated in college.


His inability to separate his hips is a bio mechanical flaw that has serious limitations on his ability to skate linearly or laterally.

I feel that one of the reasons why he is able to appear as a good skater is becuase of his stride length and his athleticism, quick strides. However quick strides are not going to translate well in the nhl. What translates well to the nhl are powerful strides and getting maximum power output from that stride i.e. full range of motion.

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06-22-2013, 11:08 PM
  #720
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My only concern was to why Russia didn't take him to the WJC and no one really seems to know. London is a great program and I think he's progressing very nicely
The Russians generally go with a veteran team. There has also been a bit of a CHL bias in the past, although it has been less evident recently. Yakupov didn't get picked in his age 17 season with Sarnia and everyone knows how good he was that year.

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06-22-2013, 11:22 PM
  #721
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Thats like saying size wont be an issue for Gaudreau because he dominated in college.


His inability to separate his hips is a bio mechanical flaw that has serious limitations on his ability to skate linearly or laterally.

I feel that one of the reasons why he is able to appear as a good skater is becuase of his stride length and his athleticism, quick strides. However quick strides are not going to translate well in the nhl. What translates well to the nhl are powerful strides and getting maximum power output from that stride i.e. full range of motion.
That's all well and good but scouting reports say he's a plus skater and I'm sure they take all the stuff your talking about into consideration when projecting his game to the NHL. Furthermore, I'm sure teams employ kinesiologists for reasons just like this. Regardless Its something they can work on for sure but from what I've read about him this really isn't an issue, like at all.

And it's completely different than Gaudreau's situation. He's incredibly small even at lower levels but he overcame that with other tool. Zadorov didn't overcome poor skating at a lower level by compensating with other tools, infanct he's one of the best skating defensemen in the draft. He might need to change some stuff long term but I don't see how that's the same as Gaudreau. Gaudreau can't work on his height and he wasn't a big guy at any level. It's really not the same.


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06-22-2013, 11:22 PM
  #722
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The Russians generally go with a veteran team. There has also been a bit of a CHL bias in the past, although it has been less evident recently. Yakupov didn't get picked in his age 17 season with Sarnia and everyone knows how good he was that year.
Now that you mention it, it does make a lot of sense and sounds 100% right. Thanks for clearing that up

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06-22-2013, 11:54 PM
  #723
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Some on Zad:

http://www.coppernblue.com/2013/6/12...ft-comparables

There are other players at the bottom of the read.

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06-23-2013, 12:12 AM
  #724
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Highlight videos can be very deceiving as you likely saw all of the best moves he had for a season. No doubting the talent however.... if you saw what you saw in that video on a a reasonably consistent basis, you have the potential to get the best player in the draft.
This is kind of why I like him for our pick. I really think he will end up being better than Jones. Plus he hits to hurt.

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06-23-2013, 09:05 AM
  #725
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Some on Zad:

http://www.coppernblue.com/2013/6/12...ft-comparables

There are other players at the bottom of the read.
Do not want.

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