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Starting Goaltender Part II

View Poll Results: Who do you want the Isles' #1 goaltender to be?
Evgeni Nabokov 20 12.20%
Kevin Poulin 3 1.83%
Anders Nilsson 5 3.05%
Ryan Miller 31 18.90%
Jonas Hiller 17 10.37%
Jaroslav Halak 11 6.71%
Anton Khudobin 35 21.34%
Roberto Luongo 27 16.46%
Mike Smith 8 4.88%
Other 7 4.27%
Voters: 164. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-23-2013, 06:43 PM
  #51
leeroggy
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Originally Posted by JPurthe1 View Post
Money was a BIG issue in this deal. Frattin is cheap and in control for a few years.

LA also received cap relief from the Leafs, 500K, it was a BIG sticking point for them.

The CAP space will become a bigger issue going forward for teams.

That is why I do not see a buy for DP until Yashin's dollars are off the books. That would be 2 years from now.

Just my 2 cents...
if you wait two more years DP's buyout would count against the cap.

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Old
06-23-2013, 07:04 PM
  #52
goal1228
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Originally Posted by Dan-o16 View Post
This is what a missed opportunity looks like.

I have to agree. We should have been focused on getting Bernier in - its a need that has to be filled.
Snow has done a good job drafting but does not know how to trade in my opinion.

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Old
06-23-2013, 07:07 PM
  #53
Riseonfire
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I have to agree. We should have been focused on getting Bernier in - its a need that has to be filled.
Snow has done a good job drafting but does not know how to trade in my opinion.
Disagree on Snow's trading. He's shrewd but sometimes too cautious. This was a case where I think we should have been more agressive, but ive liked every other trade he's done.

Smyth for marbles

Flipping Wiz from 3rd to a 2nd

Campoli for a 1st hahahah

Visnovsky for a 2nd.

No blockbusters, but get great value.

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Old
06-23-2013, 07:10 PM
  #54
goal1228
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Originally Posted by Riseonfire View Post
Disagree on Snow's trading. He's shrewd but sometimes too cautious. This was a case where I think we should have been more agressive, but ive liked every other trade he's done.

Smyth for marbles

Flipping Wiz from 3rd to a 2nd

Campoli for a 1st hahahah

Visnovsky for a 2nd.

No blockbusters, but get great value.



He needs to make a significant trade at this point. These are nice value deals but none of them assure us a playoff spot next year. Going into next season with possibly 3-5 rookies in the lineup makes for another non playoff year in my opinion.

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06-23-2013, 07:12 PM
  #55
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Nice double standard. If we're just going to refer to Cizikas as a 4th rounder, why are we referring to Bernier as a #1 goaltender?

There are many other options in net. Cizikas and Martin are the type of players you need to win a Stanley Cup. You see it every year with the teams that make it deep into the playoffs. Just because they may be 4th liners or mid round draft picks does not mean they're dime a dozen. You can't teach character + work ethic.
Sorry i meant to say 4th liner not 4th rounder. Anyway im talking about giving up 1 away not all three. Look martin is a solid player who works his butt off, but he can be replaced. I wouldnt trade him for much, but i would rather give him up then a potential top 6 forward in nino.

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06-23-2013, 07:19 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by goal1228 View Post
He needs to make a significant trade at this point. These are nice value deals but none of them assure us a playoff spot next year. Going into next season with possibly 3-5 rookies in the lineup makes for another non playoff year in my opinion.
Tell that to Ottawa (Our rookies have a lot more going for them) and Montreal.

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06-23-2013, 07:28 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Riseonfire View Post
Tell that to Ottawa (Our rookies have a lot more going for them) and Montreal.


They have great goal tenders in Anderson and Price . Makes getting a guy like Bernier even more important no? My problem is we have seen how this plays out before. The Isles won't make a trade and won't over pay free agents to come here which means we will have to go with the rookies.

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06-23-2013, 07:51 PM
  #58
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I think if they are sold on someone, they will overpay on them. Khudobin might be one of them. Lets see where we stand 2 weeks from today. I think we might have some good signings or trades done by then. Would not be surprised if we are active during the draft.

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06-23-2013, 07:54 PM
  #59
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If you pick Nabakov you have to asume he will have a poor playoffs again based on his csreer. Otherwise my only comment is the long list of good goalies available for the taken with none signed for more then a couple years is why i never give a goslie more then four years or use a 1st rounder to draft them.

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06-23-2013, 08:21 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Riseonfire View Post
Fratin's NHL career PPG : 0.34
Martin's NHL career PPG: 0.20

Frattin's sample size is WAY smaller, he also played on the 3rd line instead of the 4th and no where near the amount of hits that Martin lays out.

Two incomparable players.

Colin McDonald? Now he's a 3rd liner who would like up with Frattin better.


McDonald a 2nd in 2014 or 2015 and Poulin?

Yes ****ing please.
McDonald is almost 30 yrs old. Kings would decline.

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06-23-2013, 08:32 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by goal1228 View Post
He needs to make a significant trade at this point. These are nice value deals but none of them assure us a playoff spot next year. Going into next season with possibly 3-5 rookies in the lineup makes for another non playoff year in my opinion.
They have to play and grow up sometime. There is no point leaving them in the minors if they earn a spot. You don't make a trade just to make a trade. I for one like Snow's patience after Millbury traded away a Stanley Cup or two just to make trades. I am willing to wait 2-3 more years and then enjoy a decade of cup contention for the first time since the 80s.

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06-23-2013, 08:34 PM
  #62
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Fratin and a future 2nd. Really surprised.

Can't believe Snow couldn't have done better.

Makes me think he's got his sights set higher. Luongo/Miller.

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06-23-2013, 09:14 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by cjdv16 View Post
Fratin and a future 2nd. Really surprised.

Can't believe Snow couldn't have done better.

Makes me think he's got his sights set higher. Luongo/Miller.
Interesting that before your post there had been almost no mention of Luongo, arguably the best goaltender on the list, even if Bernier were on it. And yeah he's got the bad contract, but it's not like the Isles don't have a bad goalie contract that can maybe be worked into the deal.

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06-23-2013, 09:32 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by IslesRock4 View Post
Nice double standard. If we're just going to refer to Cizikas as a 4th rounder, why are we referring to Bernier as a #1 goaltender?

There are many other options in net. Cizikas and Martin are the type of players you need to win a Stanley Cup. You see it every year with the teams that make it deep into the playoffs. Just because they may be 4th liners or mid round draft picks does not mean they're dime a dozen. You can't teach character + work ethic.

I mean when someone nails it...They really nail it. God bless this post.

I know it's probably human nature for a fan of a team with 20 years of futility to want them to get involved and make a big splash with a big signing or trade - Especially when that player in question fills a big need. However as some knowledgable posters here have already pointed out...Bernier has some promise, but is far from proven and being way overrated in terms of his CURRENT value.

Others here have a personal dig with Nino and figured a Nino for Bernier swap was a natural fit. I'm quite happy that those people are not GM of the Isles.

There are many ways to skin a cat and I think we can all agree that Snow knows he has to address the goalie situation. Losing out on Bernier (if Snow was ever presenting a serious offer) means literally squat in terms of our improving our Cup chances as long as the issues is dealt with at some point..

What hurts our Cup chances is the fact that our owner wont green light REAL SPENDING on talent. That means spending closer to the cap ceiling then the cap floor. There's something we should all be upset at...Not at "losing" out on a goalie who's played about 60 games overall in the NHL and has a grand total of 9 playoff SAVES.


Last edited by periferal: 06-23-2013 at 09:37 PM.
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Old
06-23-2013, 09:34 PM
  #65
periferal
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Who really cares what a similar deal would have looked like from the Islanders perspective? At this point it's irrelevant. It's one great big guessing game as you'll never know what Lombardi's wish list looked like, so why bother playing this game, it's a useless exercise. Bernier is in Toronto and he may or may not turn out to be a #1 NHL goaltender, it remains to be seen. Let's move on from bernier for 5 minutes. He's a living legend on the Islanders HF Boards.

On a related note, I can't wait for Keith Yandle to get traded to a team other than the Islanders so we can move on from his HF Islanders page immortality. (although not before 9,000 useless posts of 'we could have had him for X, Y and Z, Why didn't we do this?!?!?!').

Sorry just sick of hearing about these two guys, who are fine hockey players in their own right but so over talked about and overrated on these boards that I can't bear reading their names anymore.

So focus on reading other threads?

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06-23-2013, 09:35 PM
  #66
periferal
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Originally Posted by goal1228 View Post
I have to agree. We should have been focused on getting Bernier in - its a need that has to be filled.

Snow has done a good job drafting but does not know how to trade in my opinion.

Great. Now we know your opinion. Now can you state the facts you used to form it?

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06-23-2013, 10:02 PM
  #67
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Great. Now we know your opinion. Now can you state the facts you used to form it?
Afraid ot legitimate opinions. Not surprised.

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06-23-2013, 10:24 PM
  #68
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we better address the goalie situation before this season.....that is all...

i wanted bernier, and for this price, we should have made a legitimate offer

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06-23-2013, 10:30 PM
  #69
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I don't know if it would of been accepted but I Nino and a 2nd for Bernier to me would be a trade that's worth it because Nino doesn't look like a NHL regular/year in/year out NHL30 goal scorer. anything less I don't want him on my team because of the headaches from him spoiling other players, getting in the ear of Tavares on how the Islanders are ruining his career and he cant do anyting about it but will run first free agency he hits as payback.

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06-23-2013, 10:47 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by lacunacoil777 View Post
I don't know if it would of been accepted but I Nino and a 2nd for Bernier to me would be a trade that's worth it because Nino doesn't look like a NHL regular/year in/year out NHL30 goal scorer. anything less I don't want him on my team because of the headaches from him spoiling other players, getting in the ear of Tavares on how the Islanders are ruining his career and he cant do anyting about it but will run first free agency he hits as payback.
You're the type of guy that sees some chick on the other end of the bar, and before you talk to her, you've got your whole life together planned out already.... aren't you? Down to the design on the matching tombstones.

Nino is 20 years old, has one AHL season under his belt.... and you gleaned all that information out of that? I'm impressed

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06-23-2013, 10:49 PM
  #71
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I find it funny that LAK fans (and others) gush over Tyler Toffoli and look down on Nino. If you've watched the two play, objectively.... you would understand what I'm saying.

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06-23-2013, 11:38 PM
  #72
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I don't see why Khudobin is the "new Bernier" all of a sudden. Is this guy really the guy HF wants?
Wat the heck has he shown, on one of the best teams in the NHL as a backup, never been a starter, lit up in the KHL to boot. I don't see it. I don't even see how this guy is a better option than Nabby, let alone Poulin and Nilsson.

Best options are probably:

Mike Smith - as a UFA

Jonas Hiller OR Jaroslav Halak - last year of deal, cost should be reasonable

The best goalie: Luongo, and I'd insist DP goes the other way and deal with the cap hit later. He's outstanding and I like the idea of the Isles being contenders, immediately and for the foreseeable future.

Ryan Miller, awesome goalie who's had a rough time of late, but. Suspect he's more trouble than he's worth. Something about his attitude makes me think he'd be trouble in the room. And he makes a ton!

Sleeper: James Reimer - who is a very good young goalie, a bit ahead of Poulin/Nilsson in his development thus far. Probably available for a good price.

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06-24-2013, 12:59 AM
  #73
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Ridiculous that we could not beat that offer. A second round pick, a third string goalie and a 20-goal scorer...Are you kidding me?

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06-24-2013, 01:20 AM
  #74
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There is no marginal difference between Khudobin and Poulin.

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06-24-2013, 05:19 AM
  #75
Chapin Landvogt
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Originally Posted by Riseonfire View Post
Two incomparable players.

Colin McDonald? Now he's a 3rd liner who would like up with Frattin better.


McDonald a 2nd in 2014 or 2015 and Poulin?

Yes ****ing please.
Agree that Frattin and Martin aren't the best comparables.

Can tell you however that Frattin, as a prospect, is considered by the scouting community to have enough upside and value to 'warrant' being a legitimate target in a deal of this nature. It is widely believed that he's going to be a regular 15-20 goal scorer with potential for a higher output than that for a few seasons along the way. One shouldn't forget that his cup-of-coffee in the NHL this past season, if you will, was quite successful. He showed some 'clutch' ability.

McDonald - God bless him - is a man who was thought to have only established himself as an AHL player. Snow 'n co. felt he might have more to give. He is one of the feel-good stories around the NHL and has made real good on the chance he was given. He's a yeoman, but one who looks like he can be part of the depth puzzle every winning team needs.

However, you're not likely to find any GM who would have rather had him in a deal of this nature than Frattin. He has next to no market value. He's a player who you'd have to say is a dime a dozen in the North American hockey world.


Last edited by Chapin Landvogt: 06-24-2013 at 05:33 AM.
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