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Old
06-22-2013, 08:21 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
Paajarvi would not be my first option for what I imagine might be out there in return.
Accepting that none of the Oilers core (RNH/Hall/Eberle/Schultz) are being moved and the Sabres don't need another version of Hodgson/Ennis in Gagner, Paajarvi would be the first player I'd be interested in. I don't see MacTavish giving up his 7th straight up for Stafford nor do I see Regier wanting to add Stafford for a switch of 7th & 8th.

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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
If they were to move him for Paajarvi then fine but you're not necessarily any better off than you would be keeping a veteran for the top 6.
If the Sabres are really looking to the future by assembling a group of talented young players who can "grow up together" as Regier said, Paajarvi at 22 fits right in with the group of Hodgson, Ennis, Armia, Grigorenko, Girgensons, Myers, Pysyk and McNabb. His size and talent is there -like the other kids, he needs developing.

Stafford isn't going to entice another team to trade a veteran player that would improve the Sabres right now so dealing him is more about adding an asset that could be a contributor in 2-3 years.

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06-22-2013, 08:31 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Sabretip View Post
Accepting that none of the Oilers core (RNH/Hall/Eberle/Schultz) are being moved and the Sabres don't need another version of Hodgson/Ennis in Gagner, Paajarvi would be the first player I'd be interested in. I don't see MacTavish giving up his 7th straight up for Stafford nor do I see Regier wanting to add Stafford for a switch of 7th & 8th.
He'd likely be my first choice from the Oilers as well, but why's this all about the Oilers?

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Originally Posted by Sabretip View Post
If the Sabres are really looking to the future by assembling a group of talented young players who can "grow up together" as Regier said, Paajarvi at 22 fits right in with the group of Hodgson, Ennis, Armia, Grigorenko, Girgensons, Myers, Pysyk and McNabb. His size and talent is there -like the other kids, he needs developing.
Anyone they add is going to be in that age group. I don't see why that's a positive for Paajarvi specifically. Burmistrov is the same age. As you yourself implied, they won't be trading him for a veteran. It's either a young roster player, a prospect, or a pick. Those all qualify for growing together.

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Stafford isn't going to entice another team to trade a veteran player that would improve the Sabres right now so dealing him is more about adding an asset that could be a contributor in 2-3 years.
I wouldn't want them to trade Stafford for a veteran player, unless it's the perfect one. It certainly wasn't something in my mind.

Again, there are a lot of options and Paajarvi isn't standing out as an option I'd say "yea, that's the one". If it is the one, so be it. I don't hate him or anything, in fact I've rooted for him to succeed. I've just seen nothing from him that indicates he isn't fairly likely to bring a lot of the same negative qualities we lament in Stafford while likely not being any more productive in his career either. Right now I view him as likely to be an inconsistent passenger, possibly one a bit more productive than Drew.

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06-22-2013, 08:51 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post

Again, there are a lot of options and Paajarvi isn't standing out as an option I'd say "yea, that's the one". If it is the one, so be it. I don't hate him or anything, in fact I've rooted for him to succeed. I've just seen nothing from him that indicates he isn't fairly likely to bring a lot of the same negative qualities we lament in Stafford while likely not being any more productive in his career either. Right now I view him as likely to be an inconsistent passenger, possibly one a bit more productive than Drew.
I couldn't disagree more with this. I think it's the opposite. I do agree that he is an inconsistent scorer and hasn't lived up to his potential in that aspect. However, I think he is a valuable player that consistently did good things for the Oilers this season.

This article on why he deserves to be in the Oilers' lineup is a good summary:

Magnus Paajarvi is competing with Smyth, Jones, Eager, Petrell, and Hartikainen for a roster spot. Compared to his roster competitors Paajarvi:
Is superior at shot attempt differential (4th on the team)
Plays superior opponents
Has the most positive influence on the shot attempt differential of his line mates (one of the best on the Oilers actually)
Allows less shots on the PK per minute played (2nd best on the team)
Allows the least amount of shots against on the whole team, let alone his roster competitors.

http://lowetide.ca/blog/2013/03/why-...y-woodguy.html

--

I think the Oilers would be the ones taking the biggest risk in this deal.

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Old
06-22-2013, 09:21 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Revelate View Post
I couldn't disagree more with this. I think it's the opposite. I do agree that he is an inconsistent scorer and hasn't lived up to his potential in that aspect. However, I think he is a valuable player that consistently did good things for the Oilers this season.

This article on why he deserves to be in the Oilers' lineup is a good summary:

Magnus Paajarvi is competing with Smyth, Jones, Eager, Petrell, and Hartikainen for a roster spot. Compared to his roster competitors Paajarvi:
Is superior at shot attempt differential (4th on the team)
Plays superior opponents
Has the most positive influence on the shot attempt differential of his line mates (one of the best on the Oilers actually)
Allows less shots on the PK per minute played (2nd best on the team)
Allows the least amount of shots against on the whole team, let alone his roster competitors.

http://lowetide.ca/blog/2013/03/why-...y-woodguy.html

--

I think the Oilers would be the ones taking the biggest risk in this deal.
The majority of the advanced stats where he ranks above players, he ranks above pretty crappy bottom 6 players + Gagner and Yakupov. Then again, that's basically the majority of the team, but the majority of the team is pretty poor at forward. As I said, he's become pretty solid defensively. Perhaps what you bolded in my comment was a bit harsh, but I see him likely to be an inconsistent non-factor as a top 6 player. I consider it more likely he becomes a decent bottom 6 player than a positive top 6 player.

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06-23-2013, 02:30 PM
  #55
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After sleeping on it I'd like to take a step back to where I was originally trying to come from. I've always liked and rooted for Paajarvi but I've become fairly pessimistic about him becoming what it once seemed like he would (though he bounced back a bit last season), so despite the fact I like him I doubt it's the best move the Buffalo Sabres can make. Burmistrov, which is a deal we know actually was being discussed, is someone I might prefer over Paajarvi, but it's pretty even. Burmistrov has had pretty much the same career as Paajarvi, though they're very different players.

I'd be content bringing either in but there's serious question if either will even eventually become as good as Drew, which is obviously not good when Drew's hardly great himself. Ideally they could also get a pick or pick flip so that through the draft there's a second chance at getting a good contributor down the line.

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06-23-2013, 10:15 PM
  #56
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This team needs to decide what is happening with Vanek before they can decide whats happening with stafford. They cant lose both and have ennis and ott be their first line wingers.

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06-23-2013, 10:19 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
After sleeping on it I'd like to take a step back to where I was originally trying to come from. I've always liked and rooted for Paajarvi but I've become fairly pessimistic about him becoming what it once seemed like he would (though he bounced back a bit last season), so despite the fact I like him I doubt it's the best move the Buffalo Sabres can make. Burmistrov, which is a deal we know actually was being discussed, is someone I might prefer over Paajarvi, but it's pretty even. Burmistrov has had pretty much the same career as Paajarvi, though they're very different players.

I'd be content bringing either in but there's serious question if either will even eventually become as good as Drew, which is obviously not good when Drew's hardly great himself. Ideally they could also get a pick or pick flip so that through the draft there's a second chance at getting a good contributor down the line.
I like Burmistrov much better due to his 2-way abilities. Granted Burmi needs to improve his FO% but he can easily replace the "toughness" we'd lose in stafford as he hits at a similar/better rate.

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06-24-2013, 01:43 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by gallagt01 View Post
I can't see any teams adding Miller at the deadline.

I'm especially interested in Read if a Vanek trade is indeed imminent. While Read will come nowhere near replicating the offense Vanek provides, he'll, at the very worst, be a nice stopgap while the kids develop (20 goals, quality two-way play).

Nothing wrong with adding a player whose hard-working demeanor and own zone commitment may set an example for younger players.

Miller, 16 for Read, 11?
Based on what Bernier netted - a roster player, a prospect and a 2nd round pick - one has to think that Regier will be able to extract more for Miller - especially when two teams that seemed like possible destinations Miller would accept a trade to (Philly and Minnesota) were rumored to be interested in Bernier. Of the goalies on the market, I can't see Holmgren being interested in Luongo or Backstrom nor going back to Emery. It also seems he won't stick with Bryzgalov. Miller to Philly suddenly sounds more plausible - and Regier may try to net Couturier.

Miller + 8th for Couturier + 11th?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Layne Staley View Post
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=419753

I could have sworn in one of the articles Chevy was more direct mentioning Burmistrov and the pick situation by word of mouth. Still, TSN is a prime source so there is no doubt at all that Regier turned down Burmi for Staff.
Other than the one TSN report that specifically mentioned Stafford's and Burmistrov's names, I didn't see any other media reports about the trade nor quotes from the GMs and principals involved.

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Originally Posted by Revelate View Post
I think the Oilers would be the ones taking the biggest risk in this deal.
They would - but given MacTavish's pledges to make some changes beyond just shedding Horcoff and Hemsky, he'll have to give up something to get some replacements. With their young core in place, the Oilers seem able to part with Paajarvi. The question is really how interested their management is in Stafford vs. how interested the Edmonton media is in Stafford. His name seems to have been connected to the Oilers for years now and it can't be just because of his uncle being an equipment manager.

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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
Burmistrov, which is a deal we know actually was being discussed, is someone I might prefer over Paajarvi, but it's pretty even. Burmistrov has had pretty much the same career as Paajarvi, though they're very different players.

I'd be content bringing either in but there's serious question if either will even eventually become as good as Drew, which is obviously not good when Drew's hardly great himself.
While I think Paajarvi has the higher untapped potential, landing either Paajarvi or Burmistrov for Stafford would represent an improvement to the roster IMO. Stafford has flat-lined and seems destined to be what he's shown the past 2 seasons.

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Originally Posted by DJN21 View Post
This team needs to decide what is happening with Vanek before they can decide whats happening with stafford. They cant lose both and have ennis and ott be their first line wingers.
I think Stafford is far more expendable than Vanek and hardly the kind of insurance the Sabres should keep if they do trade Vanek.

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Old
06-24-2013, 07:24 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Sabretip View Post
Based on what Bernier netted - a roster player, a prospect and a 2nd round pick - one has to think that Regier will be able to extract more for Miller - especially when two teams that seemed like possible destinations Miller would accept a trade to (Philly and Minnesota) were rumored to be interested in Bernier. Of the goalies on the market, I can't see Holmgren being interested in Luongo or Backstrom nor going back to Emery. It also seems he won't stick with Bryzgalov. Miller to Philly suddenly sounds more plausible - and Regier may try to net Couturier.

Miller + 8th for Couturier + 11th?


why would Holmgren want to trade super high end assets for Miller... but NOT want to sign Backstrom and give up no assets? that statement makes literally zero sense

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06-24-2013, 07:47 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by DJN21 View Post
I like Burmistrov much better due to his 2-way abilities. Granted Burmi needs to improve his FO% but he can easily replace the "toughness" we'd lose in stafford as he hits at a similar/better rate.
Not sure if I trust Winnipeg's hit numbers as I imagine they have one of the arenas with loose scoring in that regard (haven't checked the normalizations since before Atlanta relocated IIRC), but yea, Burmi throws some hits. I'd prefer him as well but at the end of the day if I'd take a deal for Burmistrov, I'd take the same deal for Paajarvi if the Burmi deal doesn't exist.

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06-24-2013, 07:49 AM
  #61
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why would Holmgren want to trade super high end assets for Miller... but NOT want to sign Backstrom and give up no assets? that statement makes literally zero sense
Perhaps he feels a strong urge to Holmgren this whole situation

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06-24-2013, 08:50 AM
  #62
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Any interest for Kaberle cheap? It's reported that he will be bought out.

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06-24-2013, 08:55 AM
  #63
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Any interest for Kaberle cheap? It's reported that he will be bought out.
Nope. Not the type of veteran I'd like to see added to the mix.

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06-24-2013, 09:18 AM
  #64
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Any interest for Kaberle cheap? It's reported that he will be bought out.
Didn't they just deal Le_p_l_ ? Kaberle is a ghost of his former self, still not good defensively but now with little to no offensive output. He's Soft-zer with name recognition. No thanks.

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06-24-2013, 09:20 AM
  #65
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Yeah Kaberle isn't a desirable addition, doesn't have a lot in the tank and seems more like a liability and red flag.

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06-24-2013, 09:53 AM
  #66
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So Bernier fans:

Would you like the trade if the Sabres had traded:

Flynn, Enroth, 3rd and $500k for Jonathan Bernier?

(backed off the 2nd, feeling that Enroth has more value than Scrivens)

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06-24-2013, 10:34 AM
  #67
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So Bernier fans:

Would you like the trade if the Sabres had traded:

Flynn, Enroth, 3rd and $500k for Jonathan Bernier?

(backed off the 2nd, feeling that Enroth has more value than Scrivens)
Why? The only significant difference between Bernier and Enroth is draft position. Both are undersized for what Buffalo (and most of the NHL) wants in a goalie; they have very similar NHL save percentages, though Enroth's obviously spent his career behind the lesser defensive team. That would just be a waste of assets until we figure out what we really have in Enroth.

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06-27-2013, 10:49 AM
  #68
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Heard from another team that the Blackhawks are shopping center Dave Bolland...
27, signed for one more year at $3.375M.

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06-28-2013, 12:06 AM
  #69
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I haven't seen any mentions of Lecavalier being a Sabres' target - while it doesn't fit into a "rebuild" mode that Black and Regier said was underway, I think there's some merit to what the WGR crew discussed this morning in saying that Pegula - if he does want to keep Miller and Vanek as he said - may think they should try to sign Lecavalier as incentive for those two to stay and show they still want to win ASAP. There are so many interpretations of what "rebuilding" is - but I think the ambiguity that we've heard from all 3 men (Black, Regier and Pegula) on what their real focus with the roster is certainly leads me to think they are talking about making a pitch from Lecavalier. Hradek and Jaffe on NHLN also theorized the Sabres as a possible suitor.

Then again, if Regier is jaded on the recruiting problem and fearful of losing out, despite big money being offered, on a marquee name to other teams, maybe they don't even consider it.

Still, I can see Pegula wanting to try....

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06-28-2013, 12:13 AM
  #70
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I haven't seen any mentions of Lecavalier being a Sabres' target - while it doesn't fit into a "rebuild" mode that Black and Regier said was underway, I think there's some merit to what the WGR crew discussed this morning in saying that Pegula - if he does want to keep Miller and Vanek as he said - may think they should try to sign Lecavalier as incentive for those two to stay and show they still want to win ASAP. There are so many interpretations of what "rebuilding" is - but I think the ambiguity that we've heard from all 3 men (Black, Regier and Pegula) on what their real focus with the roster is certainly leads me to think they are talking about making a pitch from Lecavalier. Hradek and Jaffe on NHLN also theorized the Sabres as a possible suitor.

Then again, if Regier is jaded on the recruiting problem and fearful of losing out, despite big money being offered, on a marquee name to other teams, maybe they don't even consider it.

Still, I can see Pegula wanting to try....
I say this all of the time, but if Pegula has any say in these matters it's a very serious problem.

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06-28-2013, 12:15 AM
  #71
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I could see the Sabres trying for Lecavalier. No chance he signs with them, though, given that he'll have plenty of options. Why choose Buffalo if you're in his shoes?

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06-28-2013, 12:32 AM
  #72
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I say this all of the time, but if Pegula has any say in these matters it's a very serious problem.
As much as Pegula repeatedly says he has faith in Regier and gives him full authority to him on personnel, he has also said often (echoed by Regier) how they talk nearly every day, sometimes more than once a day. Maybe that's Regier just being deferential and polite but it also suggests that Pegula wants to be updated and informed on matters without pause.

And, as was evidenced during the Golisano/Quinn regime, Regier was always obedient and mindful of the directives made from Ownership. I don't think he's prone to rejecting or overruling Pegula if Pegula expresses a desire to make something happen. There were several reports with the Ehrhoff and Leino signings - and Regehr trade - that Pegula favored all 3 players as targets.

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Originally Posted by Better Call Saul View Post
I could see the Sabres trying for Lecavalier. No chance he signs with them, though, given that he'll have plenty of options. Why choose Buffalo if you're in his shoes?
I think you're right - especially if Lecavalier isn't just seeking a 1 year bridge deal before going back to Tampa. If he wants a longer term as the media reports, committing to Buffalo could be a hard sell........unless Pegula and Regier try to downplay the "rebuild" motto and bring Vanek/Miller back. Suddenly, the Sabres roster wouldn't look too worse off than what Lecavalier had in Tampa.

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06-28-2013, 12:35 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Sabretip View Post
As much as Pegula repeatedly says he has faith in Regier and gives him full authority to him on personnel, he has also said often (echoed by Regier) how they talk nearly every day, sometimes more than once a day. Maybe that's Regier just being deferential and polite but it also suggests that Pegula wants to be updated and informed on matters without pause.

And, as was evidenced during the Golisano/Quinn regime, Regier was always obedient and mindful of the directives made from Ownership. I don't think he's prone to rejecting or overruling Pegula if Pegula expresses a desire to make something happen. There were several reports with the Ehrhoff and Leino signings - and Regehr trade - that Pegula favored all 3 players as targets.
I think it's good he keeps informed and engaged, and even brings things up. But if Pegula says "Lecavalier... he can help us make the playoffs" and Regier says that it's better if they just go with who they have, develop players, and see where they're at (while picking up a better pick if they're bad), then re-evaluate in the offseason re: veteran additions, then it's a problem if Regier doesn't win out. Not saying we shouldn't sign Lecavalier, just ... I want Regier to feel that's the way to go.

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06-28-2013, 08:20 AM
  #74
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Rumor has it coming from the NYI press that the Islanders and Sabres are talking trade for miller. Any interest?

http://www.power-ofthe-puck.com/17/p...an-miller.html

http://podcast.wgr550.com/wgr2/4053587.mp3

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06-28-2013, 08:30 AM
  #75
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Rumor has it coming from the NYI press that the Islanders and Sabres are talking trade for miller. Any interest?

http://www.power-ofthe-puck.com/17/p...an-miller.html

http://podcast.wgr550.com/wgr2/4053587.mp3
Carver didn't report anything.

He RT'd someone else on the topic:

https://twitter.com/MikeCarverWFAN/s...58371456663552

Quote:
Mike Carver
‏@MikeCarverWFAN
bout time RT @ALLsportsINTEL NY Islanders have reportedly entered Ryan Miller sweepstakes, source reports the 2 sides still engaged in talks
The source has stuff like this:

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Rich Smith ‏@ALLsportsINTEL 26 Jun
NHL UPDATE - Source reports if Flyers are able to make the trade with Sabres for Miller and Myers the Sabres would want B. Schenn in deal.

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