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Downey taken to hospital

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Old
10-18-2006, 11:20 AM
  #76
HookedOnTheHabs
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Clean hit? Garbage!

Downey did not have control of the puck - It was reminiscent of the Kyle McLaren hit on Zednik a few years ago.

Was it a shoulder or elbow? From looking at it over and over it was DEFINETLY an elbow - No doubt

Will Regher be suspended? Probably not but he should.

He hit a player who did not have the puck with a premedidated vicious elbow

Hopefully Gainey will get the league involved

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10-18-2006, 11:22 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by oli500 View Post
They were pretty much Identical hits. Both players did not see the body coming and both players just got rid of the puck,both players were in the same position so if Regehr hit was clean than latendresse hit was clean.

I hope downey is allright.
They weren't the same at all. Dimaio was standing still along the boards when Latendresse hit him. Downey was at full speed, and the puck had just left his stick. Someone mentioned that Regehr came from the other side of the ice. The reason it wasn't charging, is because they were both in motion. The reason it wasn't interference is because Downey had JUST got rid of the puck. For those that think that Regehr can tell, at full speed, if Downey is going to lower his head by 4 inches at the moment of impact, your giving him too much credit. This was a bang bang play, and just one of those very unfortunate incidents that are part of the game.

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10-18-2006, 11:22 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Istvan View Post
If a "clean" hit, "within the rules" can result in a concussion then "the rules" need to be reviewed and altered. I personally think Regher showed a lack of sportsmanship and a lack of regard for a fellow player.
I think height's a big issue in a case like this. Regeher gathered steam with laeral strides the way our old #19 used to. Robinson may have gone more hip first than shoulder if the same open ice hit was there, but the fact that the shouler caught the chin,imo, did the damage. I don't know if Regehr wears the space age Stevens shoulder pads, if so, then I have an issue with the eqmt. allowed, but purely on the hit, I don't think he was looking for head.

I remember Robinson hits on Goulet and Anton Stastny that may have been made with more velocity but less result.

If it was Bonk,not Downey, on the play, it was an old fashioned snot shaker as shoulder hit chest.

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10-18-2006, 11:24 AM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HookedOnTheHabs View Post
Clean hit? Garbage!

Downey did not have control of the puck - It was reminiscent of the Kyle McLaren hit on Zednik a few years ago.

Was it a shoulder or elbow? From looking at it over and over it was DEFINETLY an elbow - No doubt

Will Regher be suspended? Probably not but he should.

He hit a player who did not have the puck with a premedidated vicious elbow

Hopefully Gainey will get the league involved

You are just wrong. You say you watched it over and over and saw an elbow? It was definately a shoulder.

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10-18-2006, 11:34 AM
  #80
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Way to win a spot Garth Murray.

ok, who do we recall? Andrei Kostitsyn imo

Why?

Beside the job on the 4th line, witch can be done by Murray, there is 3 players on this team that needs to be kept under pressure.

1) Sergei Samsonov
2) Perezhogin
3) Pleckanec

The arrival of Kostitsyn around the team would be a signal to those players that they need to do more, asap.

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Old
10-18-2006, 11:49 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by SOLR View Post
Way to win a spot Garth Murray.

ok, who do we recall? Andrei Kostitsyn imo

Why?

Beside the job on the 4th line, witch can be done by Murray, there is 3 players on this team that needs to be kept under pressure.

1) Sergei Samsonov
2) Perezhogin
3) Pleckanec

The arrival of Kostitsyn around the team would be a signal to those players that they need to do more, asap.
Yeah because all of a sudden Kostitsyn can play center and threaten Plekanec's spot. Hell, he has enough trouble making a name for himself at his natural position. Why didn't you add that if Ryder continues to be a liability on our top line that Kostitsyn and his monster showing so far in the AHL this year will take over?


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10-18-2006, 12:44 PM
  #82
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Best wishes to Downey. Seems like a class act. Always gives 100% and sticks up for his teammates.
We'll miss him for sure.

As for the interference: Downey had gotten rid of the puck a second earlier. Regehr finished his check, perhaps a little late, but definitely not a clear cut interference call.

For the charging: Regehr didn't jump or take 15 strides to get to Downey. He was moving laterally and checked him with his skates still on the ground.

For the elbow: There was no elbow there. You can clearly see that.

For the shoulder to head: Like McPhee said, it was more a matter of Downey being shorter and slightly bent over that made the shoulder hit the chin. I do think that they should be trying to crack down on shoulder to head hits, but in this case, I highly doubt the hit to the head was intentional, and I don't blame the refs for not seeing that it was the head that was hit.

I agree that the refs were brutal last night, but I don't think that that play clearly deserved a penalty.

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Old
10-18-2006, 12:45 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by gohabs73 View Post
well, if he did indeed take 15 steps to get there (which I think he did, but I'd like to see the replay again), it's called charging and it is not clean by the rule.

I think he did as well....from what I saw he came from the other side of the ice with IMO the intention to hurt Downey. There was already a Flame on him....there was no need for Regehr to skate over.

Another point is the guy is 2 inches taller than Downey.....If you have no intentions of hurting someone and want just the body shot...you bend your legs and hit with your body....NOT stand up straight with your shoulders and elbows up and out.

It was a cheap shot IMO.....I think it greatly deserved a penalty....not us ending up shorthanded!


Downey we love you and hope you get better soon!

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10-18-2006, 12:45 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTimer View Post
Yeah because all of a sudden Kostitsyn can play center and threaten Plekanec's spot. Hell, he has enough trouble making a name for himself at his natural position. Why didn't you add that if Ryder continues to be a liability on our top line that Kostitsyn and his monster showing so far in the AHL this year will take over?

Yes, I doubt Plekanec is in any danger of losing his spot. The kid works hard every shift, plays very well defensively and creates offensive chances. (plus he's center)

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10-18-2006, 12:50 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PERPETUALSMILEZ View Post
I think he did as well....from what I saw he came from the other side of the ice with IMO the intention to hurt Downey. There was already a Flame on him....there was no need for Regehr to skate over.

Another point is the guy is 2 inches taller than Downey.....If you have no intentions of hurting someone and want just the body shot...you bend your legs and hit with your body....NOT stand up straight with your shoulders and elbows up and out.

It was a cheap shot IMO.....I think it greatly deserved a penalty....not us ending up shorthanded!


Downey we love you and hope you get better soon!
Once again, I disagree completely. As for the Habs ending up shorthanded, it had nothing to do with the hit. So I failt to see the relevance.

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10-18-2006, 01:36 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOLR View Post
Way to win a spot Garth Murray.

ok, who do we recall? Andrei Kostitsyn imo

Why?

Beside the job on the 4th line, witch can be done by Murray, there is 3 players on this team that needs to be kept under pressure.

1) Sergei Samsonov
2) Perezhogin
3) Pleckanec

The arrival of Kostitsyn around the team would be a signal to those players that they need to do more, asap.
No need for Kost now, especially if you let him in the press box. Ferland is the perfect #13 forward for the time being. They have to recall a D-man too, Traverse will get the call for the #7 spot.

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Old
10-18-2006, 01:43 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HookedOnTheHabs View Post
Clean hit? Garbage!

Downey did not have control of the puck - It was reminiscent of the Kyle McLaren hit on Zednik a few years ago.

Was it a shoulder or elbow? From looking at it over and over it was DEFINETLY an elbow - No doubt

Will Regher be suspended? Probably not but he should.

He hit a player who did not have the puck with a premedidated vicious elbow

Hopefully Gainey will get the league involved
umm....what replays were u watching?????
there was NO elbow involved...it was pure shoulder to face...it was a clean hit...but unfortunately Downey was caught with his head down while at full speed...all we can do is wish him a quick and successful recovery!

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10-18-2006, 01:50 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by BigTimer View Post
Yeah because all of a sudden Kostitsyn can play center and threaten Plekanec's spot. Hell, he has enough trouble making a name for himself at his natural position. Why didn't you add that if Ryder continues to be a liability on our top line that Kostitsyn and his monster showing so far in the AHL this year will take over?

Dont be shortsighted, Pleckanec can loose his spot as an offensive center to Kovalev, thats where Kostitsyn enters the pictures as Kovy's RW(or perez). Samsonov-Kovy-Kost(or perez) is a legitimate 2nd line. Atm the 2nd line didnt do much in 5 games, dont think it will remain unchanged if this continues. Pleckanec was dangerous a lot of time, but he needs to finish. Anyway hes a keeper as a 3rd line center. The arrival of Kost with the team would pressure him in the sense that kost is a top 9 forward.

Kost-Perezhogin-Samsonov is where the fight is, more so between the 2 youngsters.

Ryder is a changed man this year, gotta agree. I'll reinstate that I never liked 2005-2006 Ryder at all and still dont think Ryder is a clever forward. Just look at the 3rd period summaries since the beginning of the year(stupid penalties). Being much faster however boost my evaluation of the guy a lot, since he brings something he wasnt.

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10-18-2006, 01:58 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by habitué View Post
No need for Kost now, especially if you let him in the press box. Ferland is the perfect #13 forward for the time being. They have to recall a D-man too, Traverse will get the call for the #7 spot.
Imo, Ferland would be more useless than Kost in the press box atm. Ferland isnt threatening to some underacheivers on the team, Kost is.

We have a good start of the season, competitive every game basically because of the 1st line and 3rd line. But they cant play like this 82 games, the 2nd line is supposed to be the main secondary scoring, its not atm. I dont want a good team, I want a great team. A great team fires from 3 lines.

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Old
10-18-2006, 04:02 PM
  #90
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Michel Villeneuve said on CKAC that Downey's career is probably over. Sad news.

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10-18-2006, 04:06 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Clumsyhab View Post
Michel Villeneuve said on CKAC that Downey's career is probably over. Sad news.
That's terrible news (though Villeneuve isn't necessarily a fantastic source of information).

Hopefully some good will come out of it, and the NHL will look at cracking down on hits like that. The injury could have been avoided, noone can argue against that.

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10-18-2006, 04:10 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by 5 man unit View Post
Once again, I disagree completely. As for the Habs ending up shorthanded, it had nothing to do with the hit. So I failt to see the relevance.

Well that's the beauty of opinions....you don't have to agree

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Old
10-18-2006, 07:16 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by mcphee View Post
I think height's a big issue in a case like this. Regeher gathered steam with laeral strides the way our old #19 used to. Robinson may have gone more hip first than shoulder if the same open ice hit was there, but the fact that the shouler caught the chin,imo, did the damage. I don't know if Regehr wears the space age Stevens shoulder pads, if so, then I have an issue with the eqmt. allowed, but purely on the hit, I don't think he was looking for head.

I remember Robinson hits on Goulet and Anton Stastny that may have been made with more velocity but less result.

If it was Bonk,not Downey, on the play, it was an old fashioned snot shaker as shoulder hit chest.
McPhee I respect your opinion but i'm not sure height was much of an issue since there's probably only 2 to 3 inches difference between the two. I believe Downey had reached for the puck to bang it off the boards and the reach caused his low head and shoulder stance. I believe that Regher was aware of the vulnerable position Downey was in and chose to blindside him rather than mitigate the hit by leading with the hip al la Robinson. I also believe that Downey was no longer a factor in the play having dumped the puck ahead and the "need" to stop him was absent. I think Regher took advantage of the situation recklessly and if not actively head hunting did nothing to avoid the shoulder to head contact. In fact I blieve he raised his shoulder just prior to impact for maximum effect. Classless in my opinion.

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10-18-2006, 07:22 PM
  #94
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Dont know if this has been posted but its a fight video collection of Downey
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b98P5dgoUbg

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10-18-2006, 08:11 PM
  #95
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Dont know if this has been posted but its a fight video collection of Downey
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b98P5dgoUbg
That was great, thanks. That tilt against Worrell at the end was immense, he must give away a fair amount of weight as well as height to Worrell but he was giving as good as he got.

Also loved the choice of band for the music. Seems very fitting considering the way Downey played the game.

"Well I just got back from a break in the fight, I was weighing in heavy but still feeling alright
All I hear in the distance - mines and shells, here come the sirens wailing another attack to be repelled

Do you think we're gonna make it? I don't know unless we try
you could sit here scared to move, or we could take them by surprise
it's submission that they want, it's surrender that they need
when we're doing it their way, their aims will be achieved

They're gonna come when you're not ready, when you're not too well-prepared
they're gonna prey upon your weakness, no man's soul is ever spared
you've got to stand up, yeah, and fight them, show them what it's all about
this man is not for sale, there will be no backing down.

[Chorus:]
Stand up and fight and I'll stand up with you
We shall succeed,
Stand up and fight and I'll stand up with you
"

Hopefully he won't have to retire, be a shame for him to go in that manner but if thats what happens, hopefully he will be able to live without the side-effects.

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Old
10-19-2006, 07:39 AM
  #96
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As the saying goes .........

Live by the sword ,die by the sword

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10-19-2006, 08:06 AM
  #97
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It was charging and it was a head hit. From the refs on the ice, it deserved a five-minute penalty and a game misconduct. The league then looks at the tape and decides if a suspension is warranted. If you look closely at the replay (frame by frame) you'll notice that at one point the two helmets collide with great force and Downey's head gets quite a jolt. That head to head collision is probably what caused the severity of the concussion. In the NFL, if a player connects helmet to helmet with that force on a quarterbeck it's a 25 yard penalty and an ejection from the game. The NHL doesn't seem to be interested in protecting its players' most importants assets, their heads.

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10-19-2006, 08:52 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Istvan View Post
McPhee I respect your opinion but i'm not sure height was much of an issue since there's probably only 2 to 3 inches difference between the two. I believe Downey had reached for the puck to bang it off the boards and the reach caused his low head and shoulder stance. I believe that Regher was aware of the vulnerable position Downey was in and chose to blindside him rather than mitigate the hit by leading with the hip al la Robinson. I also believe that Downey was no longer a factor in the play having dumped the puck ahead and the "need" to stop him was absent. I think Regher took advantage of the situation recklessly and if not actively head hunting did nothing to avoid the shoulder to head contact. In fact I blieve he raised his shoulder just prior to impact for maximum effect. Classless in my opinion.
I don't know. One thing in the mix was that a player passed in between both of them, probably affecting the path a bit. The style of the big hit right now is straight up, shoulder out. It's supposed to be shoulder to shoulder or to chest. I don't believe he was trying for a head shot. It could have just as easily been shoulder to Downey's side. I'm not sure a player can aim in that situation.

I get Rocketlives' point ,though, a shot to the head has to be considered differently, and with the speed of the game,along with the type of eqmt. used, the rules need to be reviewed. By existing rules, I don't think the ref needed to adress the shot to Downey's chin, though they should. Charging and interference, well, I'd like to hear Walkom explain why or how the rule applies and then compare it to Koivu's penalty in the 3rd. They were wrong somewhere,but in which instance ?

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