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2013 Offseason Thread Part IV: SCF, end. Trades, begin.

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Old
06-25-2013, 03:40 PM
  #526
Barbara Underhill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
You thought Arron Asham was more likely to score than Boyle, so what do you know about goalscoring?

Pyatt has scored a goal every 7 games over the past two seasons.
He scored first if I recall so neener neener.

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06-25-2013, 03:41 PM
  #527
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Originally Posted by billyhauntswizards View Post
None of that matters if he plans on bolting to CAR after his contracts done. Move him now, I just don't see a situation where he doesn't go there.
Based on what, exactly? Will Carolina even be a playoff team outside of the SE in the new division? If they struggle, will they still have support to spend near the cap? Jordan and Eric have their Cups. They can take that risk. If Marc cares about winning it may not be so cut and dry.

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Old
06-25-2013, 03:42 PM
  #528
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
Screams Staal to me.
I figured they'd want a defenseman with 2 working eyes to be implied.

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06-25-2013, 03:44 PM
  #529
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The problem is that you have tweeners and 3rd line players occupying top 6 spots. Not a sustainable way of winning.
The Rangers dont need a juggernaut offense. They have the best goalie in the world, and a top notch defense when healthy. If we coul even average .5 to a 1G more per game, they would be a championship contender simply because of Lundqvist.

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06-25-2013, 03:44 PM
  #530
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
I figured they'd want a defenseman with 2 working eyes to be implied.
Ya get what ya pay for

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06-25-2013, 03:46 PM
  #531
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
The Rangers dont need a juggernaut offense. They have the best goalie in the world, and a top notch defense when healthy. If we coul even average .5 to a 1G more per game, they would be a championship contender simply because of Lundqvist.
.5 GPG more last year would've placed them 2nd in the NHL

1 goal more per game would've placed them in 1st, by a wide margin.

Id consider that juggernaut

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06-25-2013, 03:48 PM
  #532
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
.5 GPG more last year would've placed them 2nd in the NHL

1 goal more per game would've placed them in 1st, by a wide margin.

Id consider that juggernaut
They also had that one stretch where they scored a ton of goals which inflated that quite a bit. I was also more or less talking about the playoffs. The Rangers averaged under 2 goals a game in the playoffs under Torts.

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06-25-2013, 03:52 PM
  #533
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Letang's cap hit and salary are $3.5M. Staal's cap hit is $3.975M and is due $3.875M in 13-14 and $5.45M in 14-15. Would Carolina be willing to take that on considering how much they're paying Eric, Jordan, Semin, Skinner, and Ward? Ruutu is also due $5M per for the next 3 years.

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06-25-2013, 03:53 PM
  #534
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I cant agree on Paajarvi.

He is a good hockey player. Still very young. He got so much more in him than many kids arounds us that most "drools" over.

But he has just not been given a shot. He is not bumping a first overall player, and those kids needs vets too to bring them along.

He is doing alright. Nobody is going to score more on a young team and sheitty minutes/z starts etc.

Burmistrov and Paajarvi are diffrent players. Burmistrov got more upside, not because Paajarvi plays with his head under his arm (if Paajarvi does that, what does Kreider do lol???), but because Burmi is the type who always wants and should have the puck. Burmi skates well and can pickpocket, but he has clearly been rushed and has yet to put things together.

Both are great pickups for sure. Worth MDZ? Well that can certainly be debated. But both are very good. In the same neighborhood as Kreider for sure.
I think we agree on Paajarvi, we're just putting it in two different ways. There's high boom potential with both MPS and Burmistrov, but I'm in the camp that thinks Burmistrov is more likely to reach his ceiling. I see a bit of Datsyuk lite in Burmistrov. I wonder if Detroit will make a play for him if they don't bring Filppula back. Datsyuk would be the perfect mentor for Burmistrov, they're cut from the same mold.

I'd definitely inquire about the #5 from Carolina. They'd overpay to get all 4 Staal brothers on their team. They might even cough Faulk up if we toss them Skjei, Lindberg, or Miller. Though I'm now realizing that would be very counterproductive if the idea of trading the #5 is to get a top 4 D on a good contract.

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06-25-2013, 03:54 PM
  #535
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
Ya get what ya pay for
I guess Ill just sit back in the offseason and watch the pendulum swing to another extreme -- where we need offense, offense, offense. Fire the coach to get it, revamp the system to get it, trade your defensemen to get it.

Out of all of it, trading either Staal or Del Zotto is what bothers me most. The defense is a house of cards right now. If a great deal comes along for those 2, great.

Some of the trades Im seeing, especially the ones that center on draft picks coming back this way, make me want to tear my eyes out.

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06-25-2013, 03:59 PM
  #536
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Originally Posted by BB v2 0 View Post
Complaining about Pyatt but advocating for Tootoo.

This forum makes me scratch my head sometimes.
Dale Weise is a AV type of player. Vancouver searched the league and came knocking on our door for him. Not a suprise if you look at how AVs team in Vancouver played. Dale Weise was fairly unique. I am on the phone, but I've written several times on Weise when we had him and pointed out that this kid was a bit special. He is a stron player who is really good at challenging a D with speed. Under AV, the wingers ends up in a ton of "2 on 2" situations going across the offensive blueline.

We need to realize that AV is coaching this team now. Our players need to be able to make plays with the puck. Prust was a dream player for Torts, not for AV to be honest. Prust is a "CHIP & GO" type of player. Fight for a puck, chip it behind the Ds, and go after it. He does NOT even want a pass from West to East when skating up ice, he would tell the passer on the bench to just put it behind the Ds instead.

AV is a 'great guy' and so is Pyatt. Who wouldn't feel for Pyatt? Pyatt is not a prototypical AV guy. Pyatt is decent with the puck and big, in the right environment he can function in certain roles for anyone. But that's about it.

The ship it behind the Ds type of players are not AV type of player. An AV type of player is someone who A) can fetche a pass along the board and move against (not behind) a collected D or B) from deep in his own end make plays with the puck, by skating or passing it, up ice.

I like Tootoo, but he is no AV type.

There will of course be room for non-AV type of players under AV -- but believe me we have a ton of those already on our roster and can't be picking up more...

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06-25-2013, 04:04 PM
  #537
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Originally Posted by I Eat Crow View Post
I think we agree on Paajarvi, we're just putting it in two different ways. There's high boom potential with both MPS and Burmistrov, but I'm in the camp that thinks Burmistrov is more likely to reach his ceiling. I see a bit of Datsyuk lite in Burmistrov. I wonder if Detroit will make a play for him if they don't bring Filppula back. Datsyuk would be the perfect mentor for Burmistrov, they're cut from the same mold.

I'd definitely inquire about the #5 from Carolina. They'd overpay to get all 4 Staal brothers on their team. They might even cough Faulk up if we toss them Skjei, Lindberg, or Miller. Though I'm now realizing that would be very counterproductive if the idea of trading the #5 is to get a top 4 D on a good contract.
I agree on Burmi. Winnipeg has not done a great job with him, but the potential is there. He could just too, but the top end potential is definitely there.

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06-25-2013, 04:07 PM
  #538
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He scored first if I recall so neener neener.
http://www.nhl.com/scores/htmlreport...3/GS030133.HTM


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Old
06-25-2013, 04:16 PM
  #539
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So, Poile said this morning that he's attempting to trade the rights to Jon Blum, who will not be qualified. I've been a fan of his for a while, but he's definitely regressed. I'd hope the Rangers would consider giving him a 1 year deal to see if he can rekindle his game. At the very least he'd be a good option to bolster the D in Hartford.

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06-25-2013, 04:21 PM
  #540
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If Carolina wants Marc, the Jordan trade is the measuring stick of their offer as far as I'm concerned.

Jordan Staal (with 1 year remaining on his contract prior to UFA) returned the 8th overall pick in the 2012 draft, Brandon Sutter (youngish 3rd/2nd line center), Brian Dumoulin (7.5c prospect according to HF at the time).

In return for Marc I'd be looking for something along the lines of the 5th overall pick in the 2013 draft + Jamie McBain (youngish 3rd/2nd pairing defenseman who struggled a bit this year) + Victor Rask or equivalent prospect (~7.5c prospect according to HF).

Without the eye issue, Marc is a more valuable piece than Jordan. However, the difference due to the eye concerns is made up in the fact that Marc is under contract for two years with a great cap hit rather than one year. The 5th overall pick this year is definitely more valuable than the 8th last year, but Brandon Sutter is also definitely more valuable than McBain.

Our defense is undoubtedly worse this year after such a move, but we would be picking up two valuable pieces for the future in the 5th overall and Rask. However, the following is nothing to sneeze at:

McDonagh - Girardi
Del Zotto - Stralman
Moore - McBain
Eminger/other 7th dman

If Carolina doesn't want to pay that price, I'm more than happy to have Marc on our roster. In fact, I hope he stays on it long-term.

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06-25-2013, 04:27 PM
  #541
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If Colorado picks Mac, they'd have him, Duchene, Stastny, and O'Reilly as pivots. They can probably get an ok return for Stastny. but not the same now that guys like Weiss, Bozak, Briere, Vinny L might be on the market for no assets.

Stastny is probably out of our range. Not much point dealing for him if he'd leave us for UFA next summer.

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06-25-2013, 04:42 PM
  #542
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A few thoughts:

*We need to fix our PP. Getting a right handed PPQB would help us a great deal. Getting a left handed playmaker would help us a great deal.

Please understand this, we have Girardi at RD and Stralman is playing well for us and will be better under AV. We do NOT need some avg RD like McBain or someone like that who is Stralman II giver or take a little. We need a PPQB. A world class offensive talent. Nothing else will do. It's not easy to PP in the NHL. Nobody would suggest that we get Jacob Josefsson from NJ to be our 1st line center. A ton of people are suggesting that we get the equivalent of Josefsson to be our PPQB. We need an elite offensive talent on the blueline. We can probably not get someone who is established, but if we get a kid it must be someone who got offensive tools and then some...

*We need more AV type of players, see above.

*AV is great at using a heavy O-Zone start first line that is good at eh staining pressure in the O-Zone.

*We have a log jam at LD in Staal, McD, MDZ and Moore.

*Lets not forget that Staal is a great hockey player. He has a great contract. Under a coach who lets him pass the puck, he could develop even more (the raw ability is there). He could have his ten best years infront of him.

*We are really short on PMDs. MDZ is our only PMD.

*I love skill. But we play in the Atlantic and the POs is the POs (it could cost you pretty much to do something stupid in the SCFs...). CHI and DET can win it while being "soft". I don't think it's a good idea to be too soft in the Atlantic.

*A draft pick is always a gamble and you can't count on them having an impact sooner than 3-4 years down the road. Hank and Nash is around 30 y/o.

*I am old enough to know the downside by not having a farm. How it infects kids coming into the system without peers. How it hurts your continuity.

Some conclusions that I draw.

-Sure, trade one LD but make sure a RD that can QB the PP comes to us one way or another.

-If we are to trade Marc or MDZ now, we should get alot back.

-Picks is not what we should be looking for. But it's not a bad thing to get 2nd and 3rd rounders.

-We can add skill, but we can't become too soft.

-I am not sold on just a RD PPQB fixing our PP, we could need another left handed PP playmaker besides BR. If BR is bought out, we could need 2...

Scenarios I would look into (I am counting on BR to be kept just because it might sound like it now).

A MDZ scenario:
1. MDZ to EDM for Paajarvi and two 2nd round picks.
2. Hagelin to PHX for Rundblad and a 2nd round pick. //We get one of few RH PPQB out there...
3. Resign Ryane Clowe.

Kreider-Richards-Nash//Heavy O-Zone start unit.
Clowe-Brass-Zucc//Clowe makes up for Zucc lack of size.
Paajarvi-Stepan-Callahan//Good at getting the puck up ice.
Miller-Boyle-Dorsett
Staal-Stralman
McD-Girardi
Moore-Rundblad//Rundblad QBs the PP.

Staal scenario:
1. Staal for Skinner and Ryan Murphy.
2. Skinner and Stralman for Bobby Ryan and a 2nd rounder.

Ryan-Richards-Nash //Heavy O-zone start line.
Kreider-Brass-Zucc
Hagelin-Step-Callahan//Goto line to get the puck up ice.
Miller-Boyle-Dorsett
Staal-Murphy
McD-Girardi
Moore-McIlrath

Overall, few changes. We get a right handed PPQB. Depth speed and skill (Paajarvi)/heavier top line (Ryan).

Something like that.


Last edited by Ola: 06-25-2013 at 06:02 PM.
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06-25-2013, 04:48 PM
  #543
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*Lets not forget that Staal is a great hockey player. He has a great contract. Under a coach who lets him pass the puck, he could develop even more (the raw ability is there). He could have his ten best years infront of him.
I'm pretty sure Staal was allowed to pass the puck under Torts.

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06-25-2013, 04:54 PM
  #544
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Would grabbing Vanek for a year be a reasonable move? I can find much of anything regarding whether Buffalo would make him available. UFA after this year.

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06-25-2013, 04:56 PM
  #545
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Would grabbing Vanek for a year be a reasonable move? I can find much of anything regarding whether Buffalo would make him available. UFA after this year.
Depending on cost.. That might be a big time move. He also plays LW

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06-25-2013, 04:56 PM
  #546
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http://www.thefourthperiod.com/news/tbl130625.html


Quote:
The Tampa Bay Lightning seems to be contemplating buying out one or two of its current players, as the buyout period is set to begin Wednesday at 11pm ET.

Lightning captain Vincent Lecavalier and left wing Ryan Malone both could be bought out to create much needed salary cap space for next season and beyond.

Kent Hughes, the agent for both players, told the Tampa Bay Times that he's yet to hear from the Lightning, but knows buyouts are possible.

"We understand it's something they might be contemplating," Hughes said. "It would be natural to do so."
If the Rangers insist on signing a powerforward whose body is going to be mush by the end of their contract, hold on to the 2nd round pick and sign Malone over Clowe.

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06-25-2013, 04:59 PM
  #547
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Would honestly look into signing VL4. Still has a lot left in the tank, and he wouldn't need to play top minutes here. Big bodied center with experienced that would really help the PP.

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06-25-2013, 05:00 PM
  #548
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Yeah, but you can bet the Leafs AND Habs will be all over Vinny L with a big contract.

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06-25-2013, 05:03 PM
  #549
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Depending on cost.. That might be a big time move. He also plays LW
I'm guessing they would want something centered around Del Zotto or Kreider. If AV is serious about having two scoring lines, one featuring Stepan-Nash and another featuring Brassard-Vanek would be pretty impressive. Then again, we said that about Nash-Gaborik... although I think Gaborik's ineffectiveness was a perfect storm combination of a shoulder injury, constantly being juggled, moving to LW, and Torts misusing him.

Does anyone else think a healthy Gaborik would've thrived with Brassard as his center? Oh the irony!

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06-25-2013, 05:06 PM
  #550
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Would honestly look into signing VL4. Still has a lot left in the tank, and he wouldn't need to play top minutes here. Big bodied center with experienced that would really help the PP.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE stay away from LaCavalier! How long have some of you guys been Ranger fans? That doesn't have Ranger disaster written all over it to you?

I don't care if he goes to Montreal and puts up 90 pts. These are the New York Rangers and he would not have done it here.

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