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Bryz buyout - Miller to Flyers?

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06-25-2013, 06:44 PM
  #126
Sabresfansince1980
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Any of this Buf-Phi trade talk should be contingent on who Buffalo is able to select at #8. It may not determine the details of a trade, but it could so I highly doubt anything happens until Buffalo is on the clock.

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06-25-2013, 06:51 PM
  #127
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People are aware that Couturier was significantly better as a prospect coming out, than Sean Monahan right?

and yes, I'd trade Miller and #8 for Couturier...

(I'd draft Couturier 2nd overall in this draft behind Mackinnon)

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06-25-2013, 06:53 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
People are aware that Couturier was significantly better as a prospect coming out, than Sean Monahan right?

and yes, I'd trade Miller and #8 for Couturier...

(I'd draft Couturier 2nd overall in this draft behind Mackinnon)
I'm not sure I'd take Couturier 1st overall in his own draft.

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06-25-2013, 06:57 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
I'm not sure I'd take Couturier 1st overall in his own draft.
I was back and forth with Couturier and Landeskog, huberdeau was 3rd for me... final deciding factor was position/center.... followed by larsson and then finally RNH (too perimeter, too connolly for my liking)

the fact that strome, schiefelle, and z went ahead of couturier is just laughable for those organizations...

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06-25-2013, 06:59 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
Don't sell Hanzal short. He's scored 15 more points in 20 fewer games over the past two years. And that's on a team that scores 30 fewer goals per year!

I really like Hanzal.
I meant that as a compliment, Hanzal is fantastic.

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06-25-2013, 06:59 PM
  #131
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I was back and forth with Couturier and Landeskog, huberdeau was 3rd for me... final deciding factor was position/center.... followed by larsson and then finally RNH (too perimeter, too connolly for my liking)

the fact that strome, schiefelle, and z went ahead of couturier is just laughable for those organizations...
Absolutely. Landeskog is just so dreamy though...

What was Winnipeg's reasoning at the time?

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06-25-2013, 06:59 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
I'm not sure I'd take Couturier 1st overall in his own draft.
I'd probably take him 4th that year.

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06-25-2013, 07:00 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
Absolutely. Landeskog is just so dreamy though...

What was Winnipeg's reasoning at the time?
drugs?

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06-25-2013, 07:01 PM
  #134
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assuming the BEST case scenario is Monahan at #8... then Miller and #8 for Couturier is a no brainer

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06-25-2013, 07:02 PM
  #135
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I'd rather have Nich at 8 and a tradeable Miller than Couturier but that's because I'm very optimistic on him. Nich straight up appeals to me.

Then again that's assuming

Mac
Drouin
Jones
Barkov
Nurse
Lindholm
Monahan
X

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06-25-2013, 07:07 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
I'd rather have Nich at 8 and a tradeable Miller than Couturier but that's because I'm very optimistic on him. Nich straight up appeals to me.

Then again that's assuming

Mac
Drouin
Jones
Barkov
Nurse
Lindholm
Monahan
X
even if nichu becomes everything you hope... he's still not a franchise building piece... if couturier becomes everything he could be... he is

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06-25-2013, 07:10 PM
  #137
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even if nichu becomes everything you hope... he's still not a franchise building piece... if couturier becomes everything he could be... he is
That's vague enough that I can comfortably disagree

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06-25-2013, 07:15 PM
  #138
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even if nichu becomes everything you hope... he's still not a franchise building piece... if couturier becomes everything he could be... he is
There is no way you could possibly know that. Plenty of players that go in the 2nd round become franchise building pieces. Saying that a high rated player that hasn't played a second of pro hockey, who is going to go top ten can't be a franchise building piece is ludicrous.

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06-25-2013, 07:22 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by nEaLB4ZoD View Post
There is no way you could possibly know that. Plenty of players that go in the 2nd round become franchise building pieces. Saying that a high rated player that hasn't played a second of pro hockey, who is going to go top ten can't be a franchise building piece is ludicrous.
i dont think wingers are franchise building pieces...
center/defensemen

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06-25-2013, 07:23 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Bucky Gleason View Post
That's vague enough that I can comfortably disagree
lets also acknowledge that Couturier is already "on his way" to being that piece, while Nichu hasn't even left the station in his development

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06-25-2013, 07:28 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
i have no words
Buffalo's at the point of development where they need to stockpile young talent.

I think the potential return of Miller (I have it around a good NHLer+ 2nd round pick) + the 16th overall >> Couturier. It takes lots of pieces we don't have to make a championship team. If Couturier is as special as you make him out to be....Philly isn't trading him. And if HE IS as good as you claim he is AND they are trading him, the question is WHY? It's like someone is offering you their 2013 BMW M3 for your 2002 Camry straight up. Something isn't passing the smell test.

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06-25-2013, 07:38 PM
  #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
i dont think wingers are franchise building pieces...
center/defensemen
That's way too absolute. Yes, centers and defensemen are generally more important. A winger can be one of your most important core pieces. Hell, Kane's not physical or exceptional defensively yet I'd say he's very much part of Chicago's 2 cup-winning core.

Whether or not something qualifies as a "franchise player" I won't get into it because it's vague and kind of a meaningless thing really, but wingers are important core pieces on most successful and unsuccessful teams. For a team in Buffalo that, if Vanek is traded as we both support, has precisely 2 dynamic wingers in its entire system (Ennis on the roster and Armia as a completely unproven prospect), adding another dynamic winger will become necessary in all likelihood.

As you possibly recall I'm not high on picking Nichushkin, but if he pans out he'd be an important part of a team.


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06-25-2013, 07:52 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
That's way to absolute. Yes, centers and defensemen are generally more important. A winger can be one of your most important core pieces. Hell, Kane's not physical or exceptional defensively yet I'd say he's very much part of Chicago's 2 cup-winning core.

Whether or not something qualifies as a "franchise player" I won't get into it because it's vague and kind of a meaningless thing really, but wingers are important core pieces on most successful and unsuccessful teams. For a team in Buffalo that, if Vanek is traded as we both support, has precisely 2 dynamic wingers in its entire system (Ennis on the roster and Armia as a completely unproven prospect), adding another dynamic winger will become necessary in all likelihood.

As you possibly recall I'm not high on picking Nichushkin, but if he pans out he'd be an important part of a team.
I'm not saying elite wingers don't have value... they just aren't the building blocks (toews, keith, seabrook)

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06-25-2013, 07:53 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by TehDoak View Post
Buffalo's at the point of development where they need to stockpile young talent.

I think the potential return of Miller (I have it around a good NHLer+ 2nd round pick) + the 16th overall >> Couturier. It takes lots of pieces we don't have to make a championship team. If Couturier is as special as you make him out to be....Philly isn't trading him. And if HE IS as good as you claim he is AND they are trading him, the question is WHY? It's like someone is offering you their 2013 BMW M3 for your 2002 Camry straight up. Something isn't passing the smell test.
the only reason couturier is possibly available is because its holmgren...

the belief is quantity over quality is misguided

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06-25-2013, 07:57 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I'm not saying elite wingers don't have value... they just aren't the building blocks (toews, keith, seabrook)
Kane, Sharp and Hossa are not building blocks? Zetterberg is not a building block? What about Corey Perry? Dustin Brown? Zach Parise?

You need to build around multiple players and positions if you want to be a contender. You could say that a #1 center is more important than a #1 winger which I like most will agree with, but a winger can still be a building block.

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06-25-2013, 08:00 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
Kane, Sharp and Hossa are not building blocks? Zetterberg is not a building block? What about Corey Perry? Dustin Brown? Zach Parise?
correct (excluding zetterberg)

thomas vanek can go on the list too...

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06-25-2013, 08:02 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
I'm not saying elite wingers don't have value... they just aren't the building blocks (toews, keith, seabrook)
I don't necessarily disagree with what you mean but these concepts to me are highly variable. E.g. what constitutes a building block or a successful one is highly dependent on what the other blocks are and there are varying degrees of what constitutes a building block, imo. To only list 3 building blocks on a team that has more like 6 key players doesn't ring true. I think you're giving Kane and Hossa the short end of the stick.

Yes, I would trade Nichushkin and Miller for Couturier. I also am not as certain in Couturier's offensive potential as you are, but I'm more comfortable with what he's certain to bring than what Nichushkin is certain to bring, while it's easier to pick up some 20 goal scorer type wingers in free agency if you need a bit of scoring help in a given year.

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06-25-2013, 08:06 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by Rob Paxon View Post
I don't necessarily disagree with what you mean but these concepts to me are highly variable. E.g. what constitutes a building block or a successful one is highly dependent on what the other blocks are and there are varying degrees of what constitutes a building block, imo. To only list 3 building blocks on a team that has more like 6 key players doesn't ring true. I think you're giving Kane and Hossa the short end of the stick.

Yes, I would trade Nichushkin and Miller for Couturier. I also am not as certain in Couturier's offensive potential as you are, but I'm more comfortable with what he's certain to bring than what Nichushkin is certain to bring, while it's easier to pick up some 20 goal scorer type wingers in free agency if you need a bit of scoring help in a given year.
i dont mean to take away from hossa/kane... chicago doesn't dominate and win a cup without them.... but without keith/seabrook/toews chicago isn't even relevant. they are the sabres with pominville and vanek... whoppitydoda

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06-25-2013, 08:07 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by Jame View Post
correct (excluding zetterberg)

thomas vanek can go on the list too...
Your telling me 2007 first overall pick with 2 cups a Stanley Cup winning goal, and a Cons Smyth while putting up nearly PPG over his career in PO and Regular season is not a building block ?

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06-25-2013, 08:08 PM
  #150
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Doak....Philly already has an elite center in Girioux, and B Schenn as an up and coming elite center. Philly has failed year after year bc of goaltending, year after year.

Whatever any of our thoughts are of Miller, he would instantly stabilize Philly's goaltending situation, instantly. He would finally be their guy that they could count on. Please, there is no where else out West that needs a goalie this year or next, he'd be perfect in Philly for the next 3-5 years. Giving up solid young pieces (Carter, Richards) to fill needs is something Holgram does.....lets hope and pray that Darcy is beating these two principles to death!

How about a line of Girgs -Coots - Larson for the next 5-10 years????

Spread them out keeping two of them together and putting the other with Ennis n Grigs to bang the boards for their skill????

***** - Hodgson - Armia
Ennis - Grigs - Girgs
Foligno - Coots - Larson

2016

Add two more draft picks, Vanek haul (or keep), Stafford, Leino, Ott....or think about the Defense these guys could bring in???

Again, I've been pitching this for a long time so I love the idea of Couturier as a Sabre but that's a lineup of size and skill. Why did Philly buy out Bryz???? You think they are going for an aged goalie to hedge their future on???? (Nabokov, Thomas, Khabulin, Emery) or cap hell with Lou? He'll no....they did this bc there is a deal in place with Miller!!!!!! Philly has been ogling about Miller at the end of our season knowing his days were over in Buffalo.....I'd bet a lot he's being traded to Philly, just the return is the question.

As for the comments on the Flyers defense now, there will be a couple out/traded this summer and Sekera would be welcomed with open arms, especially with his cap hit.......


Just do it Darcy!!!!!!!!

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