HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Business of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, NHL revenues, relocation and expansion.

Relo vs Expansion - The Pros and Cons of QC and SEA

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-20-2013, 10:19 PM
  #401
Kimota
CONTROL THE BEAST
 
Kimota's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: La Vieille Capitale
Country: France
Posts: 25,860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
2/3 is the number thrown out usually, off the top of my head I cannot remember if expansion needs more or less than relocation.

But like I said in my opinion in the boardroom this will be a discussion of what is present. Quebec City is always going to have two vocal detractors in Columbus and Detroit if it isn't an Eastern team moving they will push other options in the room. That is a problem for Quebec and will continue to be because it isn't going away.

Fans might want Quebec back, but there is little there to send the Ownership groups into an overwhelming love fest. They will study their options and we will see just how many are enamored with Quebec when these situations play out.

Have a feeling if it isn't an eastern team:

Detroit & Columbus vote no and push other cities to the best of their abilities, gathering as many votes as they can.

Toronto with Rogers/Bell will be worried about their media packages in the region and probably will maintain a no on Quebec even in terms of moving an Eastern Conference team there.

Montreal attempted to block Quebec to begin with, they are in a more slippery area, but probably are a no when the doors close on that meeting, but not publicly.

That is four teams, now all they have to do is convince others they are right, or sell the other options as better. Big problem for Quebec City and one that is being ignored with the nostalgic views of many in terms of bringing the Nordiques back and the city returning. Quebec's challenge has always been more of a problem in the boardroom than the actual desire of many to see them back in the league. They have a better shot than Hartford, but if Hartford broke ground on an arena tomorrow, nobody would doubt the problems they would have returning because of clear hurdles. Just stunned that is over looked in terms of Quebec City.
If you understood the market a little bit, you would know that the NHL should fall over themselves to get a team in Quebec. There's a huge media empire waiting to use a NHL team as a platform for profit and having a team would be a license to print money basically. Quebecor has started a Magor Sport Network in the Province of Quebec market in the goal to welcome the Nords. The sky's the limit of what PKP will do once the Nords are there.

Kimota is offline  
Old
06-20-2013, 10:21 PM
  #402
Kimota
CONTROL THE BEAST
 
Kimota's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: La Vieille Capitale
Country: France
Posts: 25,860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by superdeluxe View Post
How can you buy gear of your rival? That makes no sense. I wouldn't be caught dead wearing Oregon Duck gear because I hate them
Cause they're not my enemy yet.

Kimota is offline  
Old
06-20-2013, 10:22 PM
  #403
Kimota
CONTROL THE BEAST
 
Kimota's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: La Vieille Capitale
Country: France
Posts: 25,860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
I think the novelty of Nordiques merchandise will take a big hit once they are actually a team again. They will still sell and absolute ton of them because they are starting again, but it is something trendy to own as a hockey fan, in part because of what it signifies. A lot of that goes away as soon as they exist again. To be clear they will almost certainly sell more merchandise, but the amount they enjoy in other markets should go down a little to maybe even a lot.
Seems like trollage to me, given that you have no idea what will happen.

Kimota is offline  
Old
06-20-2013, 10:39 PM
  #404
The Zetterberg Era
Moderator
Thank you Mr. I, RIP
 
The Zetterberg Era's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ft. Myers, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 28,302
vCash: 622
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
If you understood the market a little bit, you would know that the NHL should fall over themselves to get a team in Quebec. There's a huge media empire waiting to use a NHL team as a platform for profit and having a team would be a license to print money basically. Quebecor has started a Magor Sport Network in the Province of Quebec market in the goal to welcome the Nords. The sky's the limit of what PKP will do once the Nords are there.
I don't think the sky is the limit, I think they have very good studies on this. If that was the term truly worth applying what we see today would not be happening.

That term isn't being thrown around on Winnipeg and shouldn't be on Quebec City.


Last edited by The Zetterberg Era: 06-20-2013 at 10:52 PM.
The Zetterberg Era is offline  
Old
06-20-2013, 10:51 PM
  #405
The Zetterberg Era
Moderator
Thank you Mr. I, RIP
 
The Zetterberg Era's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ft. Myers, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 28,302
vCash: 622
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
Seems like trollage to me, given that you have no idea what will happen.
It's a pros and cons thread, not all hail Quebec, notice how I don't write in that one. This isn't trolling and almost everything that I have posted has come with the phrase I think or in my opinion.

It's an opinion based website, how at all you can consider this trolling is beyond me. I don't say things like Quebec sucks or what a dump of a town. Have been there think it is nice, I understand some of the merits to the Nordiques return but remain curious to see the other bids. I just have concerns about how they fit and some of the claims being made about them. You also have no idea what will happen, so when I say I think the merchandise will drop off in other markets not sure why that upsets you so much and provide a reason why I think that, I don't think that is a low blow at all.

The Zetterberg Era is offline  
Old
06-20-2013, 11:15 PM
  #406
Revo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Quebec City
Country: Canada
Posts: 424
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
I don't think the sky is the limit, I think they have very good studies on this. If that was the term truly worth applying what we see today would not be happening.

That term isn't being thrown around on Winnipeg and shouldn't be on Quebec City.
Not really an argument considering we have no clue what's happening. Also, would imply the league can do no wrong.

Getting close to a circular argument too... why is the term not worth applying? Because of what's happening. Why is it happening? Because the term is not worth applying.

Revo is offline  
Old
06-21-2013, 12:09 AM
  #407
The Zetterberg Era
Moderator
Thank you Mr. I, RIP
 
The Zetterberg Era's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ft. Myers, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 28,302
vCash: 622
Quote:
Originally Posted by Revo View Post
Not really an argument considering we have no clue what's happening. Also, would imply the league can do no wrong.

Getting close to a circular argument too... why is the term not worth applying? Because of what's happening. Why is it happening? Because the term is not worth applying.
Sky is the limit, but we are in a holding pattern, does that scan? I guess we can call that circular, but there should probably be some sort of reasonable limit attached to this in terms of what the studies should be. Is this going to be a top 10 market in the league ever? In my opinion probably not, so I have trouble attaching that label.

The Zetterberg Era is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:26 PM
  #408
farscape1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 985
vCash: 500
"To add to this, NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly says the league has no issues with Key Arena in Seattle if the Coyotes are to move there"


Why Seattle and not Quebec? Stupid league, stupid!

farscape1 is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:32 PM
  #409
Gotaf7
Registered User
 
Gotaf7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,213
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by farscape1 View Post
"To add to this, NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly says the league has no issues with Key Arena in Seattle if the Coyotes are to move there"


Why Seattle and not Quebec? Stupid league, stupid!
What did you expect him to say, if he is using one location against the other of course he is going to say everything is rainbows and butterflies!

Gotaf7 is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:37 PM
  #410
IceAce
Strait Trippin'
 
IceAce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 5,150
vCash: 13477
Quote:
Originally Posted by farscape1 View Post
"To add to this, NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daly says the league has no issues with Key Arena in Seattle if the Coyotes are to move there"


Why Seattle and not Quebec? Stupid league, stupid!
Look up the population stats of each market and get back to me.

IceAce is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:39 PM
  #411
Donwood
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,390
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
Look up the population stats of each market and get back to me.
Look at the fan's in each city. If population guaranteed success Phoenix would be thriving.

Donwood is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:40 PM
  #412
JetsAlternate
Registered User
 
JetsAlternate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 9,102
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
Look up the population stats of each market and get back to me.
In addition, Seattle has waited over 40 years to enter the NHL. They should have joined the league a few years after the Vancouver Canucks did, and they had a second chance in the early 1990s. Barry Ackerley effectively meddled with the negotiations, preventing the prospective ownership group at the time from expansion into the NHL. In 1995, Seattle Coliseum was renovated to become the KeyArena, which was less than ideal for hockey. Some speculate Barry Ackerley planned it to be that way.

Old Seattle Coliseum:



KeyArena after the 1995 renovation:



Both times, they would have been named the Seattle Totems. They are more than due to join the NHL.

http://www.seattletotems.org/totems_and_the_nhl.html


Last edited by JetsAlternate: 06-27-2013 at 08:51 PM.
JetsAlternate is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:41 PM
  #413
JetsFlyHigh
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Country: Canada
Posts: 683
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
Look up the population stats of each market and get back to me.
If that's the case then Phoenix should be in the top 10, and not at the bottom, right?

JetsFlyHigh is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:42 PM
  #414
Material Defender
Registered User
 
Material Defender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 606
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
Look up the population stats of each market and get back to me.
Wanna talk about those comparing Winnipeg to Atlanta ?

Material Defender is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:43 PM
  #415
Donwood
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,390
vCash: 500


Notice Quebec and Seattle NHL fans stats

Donwood is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:47 PM
  #416
IceAce
Strait Trippin'
 
IceAce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 5,150
vCash: 13477
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donwood View Post
Look at the fan's in each city. If population guaranteed success Phoenix would be thriving.
It doesnt, Point is you could have 25% of the people in Seattle be fans versus 80% in QC and you'd still have more fans in Seattle, which is a decent hockey market with a history in the league. It's not even remotely analogous to Phoenix.

IceAce is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:48 PM
  #417
danishh
Registered User
 
danishh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: YOW
Country: Canada
Posts: 33,690
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donwood View Post


Notice Quebec and Seattle NHL fans stats
the 'avid fan' stat was made by looking at number of google searches for the term NHL.

hardly scientific. Silver was just trying an easy metric for something we cant really quantify accurately.

danishh is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:51 PM
  #418
IceAce
Strait Trippin'
 
IceAce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 5,150
vCash: 13477
Quote:
Originally Posted by Material Defender View Post
Wanna talk about those comparing Winnipeg to Atlanta ?
Sure once Atlanta becomes a hockey market with Stanley Cups to its credit and major junior hockey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donwood View Post


Notice Quebec and Seattle NHL fans stats
And what you think that number will stay at 5% if Seattle gets a team? Versus Quebec who's pretty much hockey saturated at this point? It's amazing how that's almost willfully ignored by some of you. Canadian cities aren't really growth markets for the league from a fandom perspective. Not to mention that chart is based on google searches, not exactly verifiable statistics there.

IceAce is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:54 PM
  #419
Material Defender
Registered User
 
Material Defender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 606
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
Sure once Atlanta becomes a hockey market with Stanley Cups to its credit and major junior hockey.



And what you think that number will stay at 5% if Seattle gets a team? Versus Quebec who's pretty much hockey saturated at this point? It's amazing how that's almost willfully ignored by some of you.
16 years in Phoenix/Glendale didn't help much...

Just sayin'...

Material Defender is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:55 PM
  #420
GF
Registered User
 
GF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 547
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post

And what you think that number will stay at 5% if Seattle gets a team? Versus Quebec who's pretty much hockey saturated at this point? It's amazing how that's almost willfully ignored by some of you.
Almost as amazing as Seattle supporters willfully ignoring that the temporary arena can't generate enough revenues to support a NHL team and that no future arena is in the works.

GF is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 08:59 PM
  #421
IceAce
Strait Trippin'
 
IceAce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 5,150
vCash: 13477
Quote:
Originally Posted by Material Defender View Post
16 years in Phoenix/Glendale didn't help much...

Just sayin'...
You keep repeating this but yet your point of reference is a strawman who's market isn't anything analogous to Seattle for myriad reasons cited on here before.

IceAce is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 09:01 PM
  #422
IceAce
Strait Trippin'
 
IceAce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 5,150
vCash: 13477
Quote:
Originally Posted by GF View Post
Almost as amazing as Seattle supporters willfully ignoring that the temporary arena can't generate enough revenues to support a NHL team and that no future arena is in the works.
I think it's pretty much a given at his point that this team doesn't go to Seattle without some assurance of a new arena in 3 years. I don't think anyone's disputed that one?

IceAce is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 09:04 PM
  #423
gstommylee
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 6,849
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
I think it's pretty much a given at his point that this team doesn't go to Seattle without some assurance of a new arena in 3 years. I don't think anyone's disputed that one?
That's the question if seattle is plan B as reported then there had to been some assurances that the arena will get built.

Plus L&B would never agree to pay 220m for team and move to seattle, nor would agree in principal for a lease and agree to take on the costs for key arena upgrades unless it was 100% assured the sodo arena will happen. What we do not know is what discussions were behind closed doors regarding the sodo arena with the league that would give that 100% assurance.

gstommylee is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 09:04 PM
  #424
Material Defender
Registered User
 
Material Defender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 606
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceAce View Post
You keep repeating this but yet your point of reference is a strawman who's market isn't anything analogous to Seattle for myriad reasons cited on here before.
I still think Québec > Seattle for now.

Enough of those promised lands for a while. The league needs stability. Like they say: A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush...

Just my 2 cents.

Material Defender is offline  
Old
06-27-2013, 09:06 PM
  #425
gstommylee
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 6,849
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Material Defender View Post
I still think Québec > Seattle for now.

Enough of those promised lands for a while. The league needs stability. Like they say: A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush...

Just my 2 cents.
Reporters happen to disagree. Like i said we do not know what was said behind closed doors that would give NHL assurances that the sodo arena will happen.

Plan b coyotes are relocating to seattle unless otherwise noted.

gstommylee is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:21 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2017 All Rights Reserved.