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"Bergevin has been sniffing around to see what he can get for Plekanec"

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06-28-2013, 05:33 PM
  #201
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
Did you miss the whole building for the future bit? Plekanec will likely be redundant in a couple years. We'd be better served having a top prospect, top-4 dman or top-6 winger added to our pool of players than having a 5mil 3rd line centre behind Galchenyuk and potentially Eller.

This won't IMPROVE our current roster, it will IMPROVE the potential impact of our roster.

This is the same blind, win-now mentality that's made us so incredibly successful for the past 20 years. We aren't competing for the Cup right now, trading Plekanec would be huge for our future team. We aren't throwing him away, we're reevaluating and determining the time that we will have the best chance at competing for the cup. Creating a core and building around it. We've got the chance to rebuild and make a cup contending team, let's hope we don't piss it away just so we can see the the team fall apart in the first round.
funny, whenever I read that I cant help but think about a team who made it to the SCF for the second time in last three season... and it all started with them going after a 30 years old UFA, and at the time they had no Rask, no TT, no McQuaid, no Seidenberg, no Boychuk, no Peverley, no Kelly, no Horton, Lucic wasnt part of the line up, Marchand wasnt part of the line up, Krug wasnt draft eligible yet, Bartowski wasnt a NHLer yet...

guess they were wrong all along...

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06-28-2013, 05:33 PM
  #202
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ok obviously everyone would rather trade DD then Pleks but Tomas actually holds good value and lots of teams would be interested in him so why shoudlnt Bergevin sniff around to see if some teams would overpay for him.It doesnt mean that he doesnt want him ne more but if a GM comes with a great offer then why not ? i love pleks but hes no Toews or Datsyuk.The organisation will also need to start thinking about giving Eller a bigger role in the team.Eller has the potentiel to be a good 2nd line center,maybe not next year but deff the year after,we cant sit here and say hes not ready when we never gaved him the chance 2 prove himself,hes not 20 years old ne more.Then we have Galchenyuk who had a great year has a 18 year old,will he not be ready for 2nd or 1st line duties in 2 years ?

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06-28-2013, 05:35 PM
  #203
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I don't understand why people are saying Lecavalier could replace Plekanec.

Lecavalier is a purely offensive centre. He is best playing easy minutes and getting points. He is PUTRID, absolutely PUTRID defensively...He plays the same role as DD right now, except Lecavalier is bigger, stronger and more talented. He can't replace Plekanec...Not even close to being able to replace what Pleks brings to the team.

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06-28-2013, 05:36 PM
  #204
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
thing is, Habs have never been built around Plekanec... only once they actually acted as it he was really their go to guy, that year he got 70 pts, his winger 80+ and Habs finished first in their conf.
Plekanec has been our #1 "go-to guy" playing in all key offensive and defensive situations for the past 4 years. I'd consider that sort of commitment being built around him. We have yet to be successful, it's time to move on while he still has value and we have a a core to build around.

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06-28-2013, 05:37 PM
  #205
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Not keen on moving Pleks, rather the inferior center in DD, even if its a lower return. If it must happen however, only guy out there that I hear about possibly available that I would do on about a one for one is Ryan. Only thing is if we don't think Pleks fits our window, Ryan is UFA in 2 years, which I don't suppose fits either.

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06-28-2013, 05:39 PM
  #206
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
08-09 We still had Koivu as our #1. Yes Plekanec had 69pts but he was not the #1.

Plekanec has been our #1 "go-to guy" playing in all key offensive and defensive situations for the past 4 years. I'd consider that sort of commitment being built around him. We have yet to be successful, it's time to move on while he still has value and we have a a core to build around.
that's why he's been asked to center guys like Geoffrion, White, Staubitz, Blunden, Moen while other were playing with Cole/Patches... and that MT refused to give him Patches last season and give him a more dynamic Gallagher over Gionta... god damn! good thing he's the go to guy!

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06-28-2013, 05:42 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
funny, whenever I read that I cant help but think about a team who made it to the SCF for the second time in last three season... and it all started with them going after a 30 years old UFA, and at the time they had no Rask, no TT, no McQuaid, no Seidenberg, no Boychuk, no Peverley, no Kelly, no Horton, Lucic wasnt part of the line up, Marchand wasnt part of the line up, Krug wasnt draft eligible yet, Bartowski wasnt a NHLer yet...

guess they were wrong all along...
And that has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.... They chose a core to build around and signed a superstar, game changing player. Plekanec is far from comparable to Zdeno Chara, get real here. They had a Vezina winner in Thomas, two elite #2s in Bergeron and Krejci, Lucic, etc. Not a comparable situation as we don't have near the same pieces in place and we aren't nearly as close as they were to competing.

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06-28-2013, 05:47 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
And that has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.... They chose a core to build around and signed a superstar, game changing player. Plekanec is far from comparable to Zdeno Chara, get real here. They had a Vezina winner in Thomas, two elite #2s in Bergeron and Krejci, Lucic, etc. Not a comparable situation as we don't have near the same pieces in place and we aren't nearly as close as they were to competing.
that's the part you're missing, they had NONE of these players when they acquired Chara (yes I know Chara is a better player), well... they had Bergeron, and I think Krejci as a rookie, that's it...

it went pretty much like this
step 1 : acquire a 30 years old player
step 2 : acquire all the other players

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06-28-2013, 05:48 PM
  #209
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Originally Posted by Coldplay View Post
There are few realistic scenarios where I can envision our team becoming better by trading away a premier 2-way, all-situations C like Tomas Plekanec.

Help me out here.
He's no Johnny Toews. We need to sack up.

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06-28-2013, 05:48 PM
  #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Draft View Post
And that has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.... They chose a core to build around and signed a superstar, game changing player. Plekanec is far from comparable to Zdeno Chara, get real here. They had a Vezina winner in Thomas, two elite #2s in Bergeron and Krejci, Lucic, etc. Not a comparable situation as we don't have near the same pieces in place and we aren't nearly as close as they were to competing.
They had none of those players in 2006 when they signed Chara.

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06-28-2013, 05:51 PM
  #211
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
And that has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.... They chose a core to build around and signed a superstar, game changing player. Plekanec is far from comparable to Zdeno Chara, get real here. They had a Vezina winner in Thomas, two elite #2s in Bergeron and Krejci, Lucic, etc. Not a comparable situation as we don't have near the same pieces in place and we aren't nearly as close as they were to competing.
Boston's core has never been that great. They are built around Chara and Bergeron and size with strong third line scoring. They are more than the sum of their parts.

Our core is deeper than theirs but we don't have the right mix. We've played puck possession with midgets for years. This year, we were unlucky with injuries or we could have knocked off Boston.

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06-28-2013, 05:52 PM
  #212
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
that's why he's been asked to center guys like Geoffrion, White, Staubitz, Blunden, Moen while other were playing with Cole/Patches... and that MT refused to give him Patches last season and give him a more dynamic Gallagher over Gionta... god damn! good thing he's the go to guy!
So move him for a good winger so Galchenyuk doesn't have to experience the same fate? We won't have a competitive team in the next three years. We don't have the depth or elite players to compete. Put Desharnais with Staubitz, Blunden etc. and Plekanec with Pacioretty etc. and we won't have any better of a team. We have too many holes and not enough strengths.

I'm not sure what the point you're trying to make is. Plekanec's chance to succeed with the team is done, we don't have the assets (other than Plek) to acquire better players, we don't have rookies coming up like Gallyx2 and there are no Free Agents that will put us over the top.

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06-28-2013, 05:54 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
that's the part you're missing, they had NONE of these players when they acquired Chara (yes I know Chara is a better player), well... they had Bergeron, and I think Krejci as a rookie, that's it...

it went pretty much like this
step 1 : acquire a 30 years old player
step 2 : acquire all the other players
My mistake That was dumb of me.

Still don't see your point. We can't build around a #2C.

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06-28-2013, 05:58 PM
  #214
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My mistake That was dumb of me.

Still don't see your point. We can't build around a #2C.
simple : it is very possible to keep a GOOD 30 years old player and turn your team into a contender. Trading your better players cause they have more value also means you keep the lesser players - and these lesser players will be the ones our newly acquired players will be stuck with...

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06-28-2013, 05:58 PM
  #215
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So move him for a good winger so Galchenyuk doesn't have to experience the same fate? We won't have a competitive team in the next three years. We don't have the depth or elite players to compete. Put Desharnais with Staubitz, Blunden etc. and Plekanec with Pacioretty etc. and we won't have any better of a team. We have too many holes and not enough strengths.

I'm not sure what the point you're trying to make is. Plekanec's chance to succeed with the team is done, we don't have the assets (other than Plek) to acquire better players, we don't have rookies coming up like Gallyx2 and there are no Free Agents that will put us over the top.
With your logic we should trade Pleks, Markov, Bourque, Gorges, Moen, Boullion and rebuild. It sure works for Edmonton. Maybe then we could entice some high end UFA's to play with our rebuilding team....not!

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06-28-2013, 05:59 PM
  #216
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i would pull the trigger if i could get b.ryan or nichushkin for plekanec, other than that i would probably keep him... i feel like thats such a waste tho =/, he has really good value

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06-28-2013, 06:01 PM
  #217
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i would pull the trigger if i could get b.ryan or nichushkin for plekanec, other than that i would probably keep him... i feel like thats such a waste tho =/, he has really good value
you're OK with trading Plekanec for a guy we'll lose in two years (UFA) ?

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06-28-2013, 06:02 PM
  #218
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you're OK with trading Plekanec for a guy we'll lose in two years (UFA) ?
obviously for an extended ryan, im not gonna trade plekanec for a 2 year rental

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06-28-2013, 06:06 PM
  #219
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Plekanec has been our #1 "go-to guy" playing in all key offensive and defensive situations for the past 4 years. I'd consider that sort of commitment being built around him. We have yet to be successful, it's time to move on while he still has value and we have a a core to build around.
Us not being successful has nothing to do with Plekanec. The last time Plekanec had proper linemates was with Cammy and AK, they formed a great trio. Before that, it was Kovalev and AK, and they were also amazing.

Give him some good linemates dammit. Don't expect him to create some miracles with the likes of Moen, Blunden or Darche on his wings. You also shouldn't put a declining Gionta next to him, simply not a good fit.

The only reason management should move Plekanec is if they think both Gally and Eller are ready to take the reigns of #1-2 centers. I don't think they are, I'd wait another year.
Plekanec is a great mentor to have. Just look at Eller and how his defensive game has improved over the years. His D game resembles the one of Plekanec. I'm hoping he rubs off on Galchenyuk as well.

Nothing wrong in throwing his name out just to see what return you could possibly get.

Unless we sign Lecavalier, he won't be moved. Even with Vinny, having Plekanec would be amazing.
Vinny-Plek-Eller with Gally on the wings would be amazing.

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06-28-2013, 06:06 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
simple : it is very possible to keep a GOOD 30 years old player and turn your team into a contender. Trading your better players cause they have more value also means you keep the lesser players - and these lesser players will be the ones our newly acquired players will be stuck with...
Well that's fine, I'm just not sure that's the best way to do this. It's also possible to build around a core of players and create an elite, cup-window team that has a good chance at competing for the Cup. I think that's how we build an elite, balanced team. By looking to the future and creating the best mix of players possible. We have our #1 and #2 centres (Galchenyuk, Eller/DD), we've got a lot of other holes we need to fill, holes that could be filled by moving Plekanec.

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06-28-2013, 06:07 PM
  #221
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obviously for an extended ryan, im not gonna trade plekanec for a 2 year rental
You can't extend a player until his last contract year. So we'd have to wait a full season first.

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06-28-2013, 06:08 PM
  #222
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Plekanec is so underrated by some fans it's unbelievable, I swear every off-seasons people bash him saying that he's not good offensively or too soft and then when the season starts his detractors magically go away. I remember how last year some people were saying that Desharnais was better than him (although Plek played with the likes of Darche, White and a lazy Bourque while DD played soft minutes with Cole and Max Pac) and that he was now expandable. Good thing those people are not our GM...This board is so bipolar sometimes it's crazy, if I had the time I would bump the post when people were regretting picking Galchenyuk and pumping Grigorenko's tires.

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06-28-2013, 06:09 PM
  #223
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
funny, whenever I read that I cant help but think about a team who made it to the SCF for the second time in last three season... and it all started with them going after a 30 years old UFA, and at the time they had no Rask, no TT, no McQuaid, no Seidenberg, no Boychuk, no Peverley, no Kelly, no Horton, Lucic wasnt part of the line up, Marchand wasnt part of the line up, Krug wasnt draft eligible yet, Bartowski wasnt a NHLer yet...

guess they were wrong all along...
I guess you're drawing a comparison between Chara and Plekanec, but I don't see it at all. Chara is a one-of-a-kind defenceman. Plekanec is a good two-way centre who would be 2nd (or even 3rd in some cases) on the depth chart of about half the teams in the NHL.

Chara is a franchise player. Plekanec is not. You build winning teams around franchise players in their prime, usually with shrewd moves that separate great GMs from the merely competent ones. As in, you perfect close-to-contention teams by adding good players at key positions without subtracting anything critical. Maybe I'm missing your point, but I don't get the comparison at all.

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06-28-2013, 06:11 PM
  #224
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Well that's fine, I'm just not sure that's the best way to do this. It's also possible to build around a core of players and create an elite, cup-window team that has a good chance at competing for the Cup. I think that's how we build an elite, balanced team. By looking to the future and creating the best mix of players possible. We have our #1 and #2 centres (Galchenyuk, Eller/DD), we've got a lot of other holes we need to fill, holes that could be filled by moving Plekanec.
None of these players have proven capable of handling top opponents and dealing with tough match ups.
Gally played half of a NHL season. His potential is great, the sky seems to be the limit, but that's all it is at this point, potential.
Eller is one of my favorite players, and he should have been the 2nd line center last year, but that didn't happen. He still hasn't put it all together.

We are not ready to rely on these guys yet.

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06-28-2013, 06:11 PM
  #225
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Originally Posted by 1993 View Post
With your logic we should trade Pleks, Markov, Bourque, Gorges, Moen, Boullion and rebuild. It sure works for Edmonton. Maybe then we could entice some high end UFA's to play with our rebuilding team....not!
I think you bring this up every time and you're told (every time) that we are not in a similar position to Edmonton.

That is not the logic I'm using and that's not the path I'm saying the team should go in. You are the only person to say we should do this (sarcastically or not). I'm not sure why you continue to struggle to understand even the simple concept of what we're talking about.

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