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With the 26th selection in the 2013 entry draft, the Ducks select Shea Theodore

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07-01-2013, 02:09 AM
  #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KEEROLE Vatanen View Post
Sounds like Theodore was drafted to replace Schultz
I think he was drafted because he's a valuable asset. He's a 6'2 offensive d-man. We've traded for and traded away offensive d-men plenty of times. Ozolinsh, Pronger, Whitney, and Lubo come to mind. We over paid for Souray's offense with one too many years on his contract.

Offensive d-men are like left handed pitcher is baseball, they'll always be around and be paid more because they're a rarity. Ozolinsh and his lack of defense still made him a part of the all-star games for a total of seven times! Think asset for the future and not immediate dividends.

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07-01-2013, 02:10 AM
  #77
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I think he's more than 2-3 years away. I think we're looking at probably 4 years away from the NHL, but you never know.

Btw, in 4 years he'll only be 21 so that sounds about right.

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07-01-2013, 04:03 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by AngelDuck View Post
I think he's more than 2-3 years away. I think we're looking at probably 4 years away from the NHL, but you never know.

Btw, in 4 years he'll only be 21 so that sounds about right.
Yeah, he`s a bit younger than the rest of the draftees (or most of them). So no need to rush him.
Looks like he needs to bulk up a little. Then he needs to grow into that body and learn new things he can do while being bigger (advantages defensively, physicallyt etc) and only then he should get a longer look in the NHL.

Hey, and does anyone knows when he`ll be AHL eligible? After 2 or 3 years after the draft? I ask this because he`s a bit younger and maybe he doesn`t fit some AHL criteria or some stuff

And i think his numbers are pretty respectable. 19 goals for a defenseman


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07-01-2013, 04:15 AM
  #79
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He could still grow also... I had ate growth spurt at 17...

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07-01-2013, 04:25 AM
  #80
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Last year the Ducks seemed to have a theme they drafted by, getting all kinds of defencemen, most with good size. This year they went with boom or bust - type of players IMO.

I'm especially happy with drafting Aaltonen. About the time they got another Finn in the system. He should come to AHL starting next season because he's old enough and he should learn the North American hockey style.

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07-01-2013, 04:25 AM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalvinators View Post
Yeah, he`s a bit younger than the rest of the draftees (or most of them). So no need to rush him.
Looks like he needs to bulk up a little. Then he needs to grow into that body and learn new things he can do while being bigger (advantages defensively, physicallyt etc) and only then he should get a longer look in the NHL.

Hey, and does anyone knows when he`ll be AHL eligible? After 2 or 3 years after the draft? I ask this because he`s a bit younger and maybe he doesn`t fit some AHL criteria or some stuff

And i think his numbers are pretty respectable. 19 goals for a defenseman
You have to be 20 to play in the AHL. He'll be playing in the CHL for at least 2 more years.

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07-01-2013, 04:38 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by AngelDuck View Post
You have to be 20 to play in the AHL. He'll be playing in the CHL for at least 2 more years.
Thanks

And i guess 2 years in the WHL will be enough before going to AHL

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07-01-2013, 06:14 AM
  #83
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What? Hampus is still only 19.

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07-01-2013, 06:28 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Lord Flashheart View Post
What? Hampus is still only 19.
Doesn't apply to players drafted out of Europe IIRC

Pretty sure it only applies if you were drafted out of North America

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07-01-2013, 06:32 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by mightyquack View Post
Doesn't apply to players drafted out of Europe IIRC
Pretty sure it only applies if you were drafted out of North America
It applies only to players out of Major Junior, that's the reason why Kyle Palmeri was there earlier.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JabbaJabba View Post
Last year the Ducks seemed to have a theme they drafted by, getting all kinds of defencemen, most with good size. This year they went with boom or bust - type of players IMO.
Boom or bust is a great strategy for the position we drafted right now.

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07-01-2013, 07:37 AM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KEEROLE Vatanen View Post
Sounds like Theodore was drafted to replace Schultz
It would be pretty short-sighted of them to draft Theodore to replace Schultz. Shea is probably a good two years away, at the minimum, and team needs change. They would have picked Theodore because they felt he was the BPA, and this is certainly consistent with what they've done in the first two rounds in recent years. It's also a big reason our drafting has been so deserving of praise.

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07-01-2013, 07:41 AM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mightyquack View Post
Doesn't apply to players drafted out of Europe IIRC

Pretty sure it only applies if you were drafted out of North America
Quote:
Originally Posted by Markus078 View Post
It applies only to players out of Major Junior, that's the reason why Kyle Palmeri was there earlier.
My mistake, forgot about that.

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07-01-2013, 07:51 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
I'll accept the pick because we have a pretty good track record with our scouting team. But I don't really understand the logic of looking for any D who might get you 50-60 points and be bad defensively (even with improvement) vs a D who will be very good on the blueline and still score 25-30 points. Or put another way, I like what Lindholm projects to be better than what Shea projects to be.
That isn't really fair to Shea. Even as a 1st round pick, the difference between 6th overall and 26th overall is expected to be pretty significant.

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07-01-2013, 08:01 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by muckbin15 View Post
as sad as it seems maybe the ducks are moulding fowler to be a more consistent 2-way dman and hope that one of vatanen/theodore can pull the powerplay.

It seems like fowler has been given the chance to be the man on the pp the last year or two but hasn't yet lived up to it. His shot obviously isnt a bomb so maybe Murray sees an opportunity to take a pp unit feauturing theo-vats and have fowler play with either beauch or a beauch replacement (lindholm,warg,etc) in the future
It's more likely the PP would have one of Theodore or Vatanen as well as Fowler.

As for Anaheim molding Fowler into a two-way defenseman, there is nothing sad about that. Cam's value to the team as a good two-way defenseman would be quite a bit higher than if he was a one-dimensional offensive defenseman. Case in point: the Olympics. Fowler probably wouldn't even be an honorable mention for Team USA as a pure offensive defenseman. As the two-way defenseman he is showing himself to be, he actually has a legitimate chance to make the team.

We -want- Fowler to be a two-way guy.

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07-01-2013, 09:36 AM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sojourn View Post
It's more likely the PP would have one of Theodore or Vatanen as well as Fowler.

As for Anaheim molding Fowler into a two-way defenseman, there is nothing sad about that. Cam's value to the team as a good two-way defenseman would be quite a bit higher than if he was a one-dimensional offensive defenseman. Case in point: the Olympics. Fowler probably wouldn't even be an honorable mention for Team USA as a pure offensive defenseman. As the two-way defenseman he is showing himself to be, he actually has a legitimate chance to make the team.

We -want- Fowler to be a two-way guy.
That is key. I think the team is pushing him towards being a Niedermayer type defensemen.

In fact, the style they play is very very similar, minus you know the Hall of Fame skill set.

But you see the similarities, both roam the ice. Look to pass pass pass first. Rarely take a slap shot, etc. Fowler just needs to see the ice a bit better and obviously learn to play the defensive side of the ice better.

But you do see how they hope to mold him into the type of two way dman Scotty was.

I honestly think everyone should look at Theodore as a project. Look at him as someone you wont see until 2016 at the earliest. This is one of those kids who will truly benefit from patience. And who knows what the Ducks defense will look like then. Could be both Fowler and Vatanen aren't on the team by then.

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07-01-2013, 10:02 AM
  #91
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I like this pick but then again none of us really know much about any kid outside of the first few. Even then that's based mainly on what everyone else says about them. I like that he has big time skating and passing. Those are two things you can't teach a d-man at this level. Moving the puck out of the zone and into the hands of attacking players is the most important aspect to a d-man in my opinion. Defense in your own zone relies on all five guys more than just the two d-men, where they're needed most is moving the puck. That's what Scotty was best at and what Fowler is best at. This kid will get stronger and get sharper in his own end. That's totally teachable.

He's probably 2.5-3 years away. No rush on him but then again if you have a need to rush a player picked at 26 you have some issues as a club.

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07-01-2013, 10:54 AM
  #92
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With Cam, Hampus, Sami, Shea and Luca we may have the best skating group of young D. Damn, with some of our forwards the D will enter the blue line before them.

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07-01-2013, 11:15 AM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sojourn View Post
That isn't really fair to Shea. Even as a 1st round pick, the difference between 6th overall and 26th overall is expected to be pretty significant.
It was not my intent to demean Shea with my comment. I certainly agree that in general a 6th pick would be viewed with more expectation than a 26th pick. On the other hand a 26th pick doesn't have to be only a boom or bust prospect. What were our expectations for Perry when we drafted him? Was he boom or bust? How about Getzlaf? In hindsight both of those guys would go a lot higher.

I guess I just thought that with all the "this is a deep draft" comments that our pick wouldn't be so one dimensional with a boom or bust label. A deep draft implies to me lots of guys who are going to have NHL careers. Not that anybody truly knows.

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07-01-2013, 11:26 AM
  #94
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I like this pick but then again none of us really know much about any kid outside of the first few. Even then that's based mainly on what everyone else says about them. I like that he has big time skating and passing. Those are two things you can't teach a d-man at this level. Moving the puck out of the zone and into the hands of attacking players is the most important aspect to a d-man in my opinion. Defense in your own zone relies on all five guys more than just the two d-men, where they're needed most is moving the puck. That's what Scotty was best at and what Fowler is best at. This kid will get stronger and get sharper in his own end. That's totally teachable.

He's probably 2.5-3 years away. No rush on him but then again if you have a need to rush a player picked at 26 you have some issues as a club.
the 19 goals is what really stands out most to me. you have to be insanely talented to be a kid who just turned 18, and do that in the league he was in

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07-01-2013, 11:44 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
It was not my intent to demean Shea with my comment. I certainly agree that in general a 6th pick would be viewed with more expectation than a 26th pick. On the other hand a 26th pick doesn't have to be only a boom or bust prospect. What were our expectations for Perry when we drafted him? Was he boom or bust? How about Getzlaf? In hindsight both of those guys would go a lot higher.

I guess I just thought that with all the "this is a deep draft" comments that our pick wouldn't be so one dimensional with a boom or bust label. A deep draft implies to me lots of guys who are going to have NHL careers. Not that anybody truly knows.
I think there's far too much of a "boom or bust" label applied to him, anyway. His offensive skills are relatively safe to project to the NHL, so even if his defensive game doesn't make great strides, that doesn't mean he'll really bust. It would limit him to becoming a PP specialist or bottom pairing puckmover - which can be pretty valuable by themselves. That isn't really a full "boom or bust" type. His defensive game obviously is a project. If he was to develop there, his ceiling will just be a lot higher (as the Green/Shattenkirk comparisions, although quite diverging, indicate). His one dimension is quite safe to project. If his defensive game was as safe, he'd be Jones-type, so it's just natural that there's a part of his game that's more of a project.

I really don't see why he's any more of a boom/bust prospect than most other picks. Maybe it's the one dimension being so far ahead of the other that leads to that label being applied, but I don't think that makes it sensible.

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07-01-2013, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KEEROLE Vatanen View Post
the 19 goals is what really stands out most to me. you have to be insanely talented to be a kid who just turned 18, and do that in the league he was in
He won't even turn 18 until another month from now.

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07-01-2013, 11:58 AM
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People just get bent out of shape or deem someone a "boom or bust" prospect if they fall into two categories.

1) They are drafted earlier than the media projects them to go.

2) They are huge or have a ton of skill in one area and lack in another.

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07-01-2013, 03:09 PM
  #98
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I think he's more than 2-3 years away. I think we're looking at probably 4 years away from the NHL, but you never know.

Btw, in 4 years he'll only be 21 so that sounds about right.
A pure offensive defenseman still learning and earning the right to play in the NHL at age 21/22... is Sami Vatanen. If you like Sami, then you can't really hate on Shea. Plus, Shea's got a lot more height than Sami: 6'2" vs 5'7"-8"-9"-10" depending on where you read Sami's stats.

And as others mentioned, #1 overall is significantly a better product than those drafted at #20 and on. It's a jumble in the late first round to early third. But if you wait for it to come to fruition, then maybe years down the line it pays dividends like Sami and probably Karlsson in the future.

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07-01-2013, 03:20 PM
  #99
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Watching the highlights of this kid, and I like this pick a lot more than my initial reaction. This kid knows how to get his shot through traffic. He walks the blueline to create a lane to the net. We need defenseman who can do that. He picks up most of his points on hard slapshots along the ice that either go in the net, or the goalie spits out a rebound to his teammates. That's the kind of thing that will translate to the NHL. That's how Karlsson gets most of his assists. (hard slap shots on goal)

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07-01-2013, 03:34 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by mightyquack View Post
Doesn't apply to players drafted out of Europe IIRC

Pretty sure it only applies if you were drafted out of North America
It's if you were drafted by the CHL. Foreign players are exempt, unless they have decided to play in the CHL at some earlier point. You can technically go to college for one year and go straight into the AHL if you want. Trouba for instance was eligible to play in the minors the moment his college season ended this year.

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