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Old
07-06-2013, 09:53 AM
  #51
FlyingKostitsyn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
How can I be positive when our management group watched Desharnais and said "This guy is good, let's extend him 4 years at 4 per!!"

And then they went "Wow, Desharnais is so good in the play-offs.. let's get him Briere next year!"
Bergevin should be fired, he didnt respect Wethreekings directives...

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Old
07-06-2013, 09:54 AM
  #52
WeThreeKings
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
Bergevin should be fired, he didnt respect Wethreekings directives...
Too soon to say Fire the guy but someone has to make him accountable for the moves he makes and the moves he hasn't made.

It's still unfathomable to me how he extended DD.. and more unfathomable that he saw this dreadful PK all season yet doesn't think it needs to be addressed. No mention of it anywhere by him at any time.

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Old
07-06-2013, 09:59 AM
  #53
SOLR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
How can I be positive when our management group watched Desharnais and said "This guy is good, let's extend him 4 years at 4 per!!"

And then they went "Wow, Desharnais is so good in the play-offs.. let's get him Briere next year!"
I'm not a fan of Desharnais either, at all in fact. He's a part of any last place team. A very one way center.

However, I understand the move: he's the best alternative outside of the draft. You let him go, he's not going to give you a return anyway. Sign him, then have a kid replace him later. OR hope for the Lecavalier style player to fall on your lap at some point + this style of asset management will give you more trade options as you bank assets over time. Gauthier left this ship with not much to trade when he didn't milk the few assets he wanted to sell. Bergevin is rebuilding 2 teams.

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07-06-2013, 10:02 AM
  #54
Estimated_Prophet
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Originally Posted by Sorinth View Post
And the biggest reason why is that we didn't crash the net. Briere is not going to help in that regard.



It's not just last year, in the past 4 seasons he's had one good year, one bad year and 2 average ones. He's also been sheltered a lot in Philly and I'm not sure we will be able to do that here since we have a bunch of other players that need sheltering as well.
Briere does go to the dirty areas of the ice, especially in the post season.

As for the last 4 seasons.....52 points combined in 45 playoff games. He has been consistently great. Bergevin signed him to score in the playoffs and there isn't any evidence that he won't do exactly that.

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07-06-2013, 10:03 AM
  #55
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I'll try to be negative but in a positive way. By keeping my comments short. Short like so many of our players

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07-06-2013, 10:07 AM
  #56
Vsevolod Bobrov
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Nice pep talk OP. I for one like our team. Everybody has given up on Desharnais so quickly. Poor little man will never have it easy.

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07-06-2013, 10:08 AM
  #57
Sorinth
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Originally Posted by SOLR View Post
I'm not a fan of Desharnais either, at all in fact. He's a part of any last place team. A very one way center.

However, I understand the move: he's the best alternative outside of the draft. You let him go, he's not going to give you a return anyway. Sign him, then have a kid replace him later. OR hope for the Lecavalier style player to fall on your lap at some point + this style of asset management will give you more trade options as you bank assets over time. Gauthier left this ship with not much to trade when he didn't milk the few assets he wanted to sell. Bergevin is rebuilding 2 teams.
Why couldn't we have given him a 2 year deal instead of a 4 year one. Doesn't that maximize our flexibility. Also since Eller was in the middle of a breakout season and DD was struggling why not wait until the offseason to give yourself more time to evaluate. He was going to be an RFA so it's not like it was this or lose him for nothing.

Gauthier sold off everything he could and gave Bergevin a huge advantage going forward with all those picks/prospects. Go back and look at what other GMs left the next guy (Not just Habs GMs) and tell me again how Bergevin has to rebuild 2 teams. I mean he basically hired a new coach, and signed some grinders and we finished 2nd in the East.

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Old
07-06-2013, 10:09 AM
  #58
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Apparently for most people here, regular season starts next week. Lol

I did enjoy the overreaction from yesterday though. Priceless.

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07-06-2013, 10:18 AM
  #59
Sorinth
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Briere does go to the dirty areas of the ice, especially in the post season.

As for the last 4 seasons.....52 points combined in 45 playoff games. He has been consistently great. Bergevin signed him to score in the playoffs and there isn't any evidence that he won't do exactly that.
You can say the same thing for Gionta, Gallagher, even Desharnais goes to the front of the net. The problem is that when you are going up against a 6'4 defenceman and the refs let anything go it's going to be a struggle. Briere had the advantage of having guys like Hartnall, Simmonds to go the net with him. I suspect he'll have a harder time doing that with us. Not too mention he's also been a net negative in +/- in the playoffs and his PP stats haven't exactly made up for it either. If he scores 10 goals but costs the team 15 then has it really helped us?

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07-06-2013, 10:19 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by habsroom View Post
We have a good young roster that includes a norris trophy winner,an all star goalie and an future elite #1 centre not to mention some young skilled wingers and some young defensemen with top pairing talent.

We have a great group of prospects from a top goalie to a group of defensemen that should play in the nhl to a forward group that has skill and size. Plus we have all our draft picks for next years draft.

This team will have success this year and for many years to follow. The roster looks good to me plus we have about 4 million if we want to pick up another player now or maybe 2 players at the trade deadline.we have added toughness to the team in parros/prust/tinordi/moen/white.yes we have some small forwards but maybe we trade 1 or 2 of them this year who knows.

No team is perfect in the nhl but this team is on the right track and has talent in the nhl and more to come in the minors so why not cheer for them instead of ripping every move they make and ripping every player that has a bad game or 2. If you just want to be a negative person go cheer for the leafs they have been losers since colored tv!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Go habs go


CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Rene Bourque ($3.333m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Danny Briere ($4.000m)
Max Pacioretty ($4.500m) / David Desharnais ($3.500m) / Brendan Gallagher ($0.870m)
Alex Galchenyuk ($3.225m) / Lars Eller ($1.325m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Travis Moen ($1.850m) / Ryan White ($0.722m) / Brandon Prust ($2.500m)
George Parros ($0.938m)
DEFENSEMEN
Josh Gorges ($3.900m) / P.K. Subban ($2.875m)
Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Alexei Emelin ($2.000m)
Jarred Tinordi ($1.083m) / Raphael Diaz ($1.225m)
Francis Bouillon ($1.500m) / Davis Drewiske ($0.638m)
GOALTENDERS
Carey Price ($6.500m)
Peter Budaj ($1.400m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,632,708; BONUSES: $2,697,500
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $3,364,792
I quoted the whole post for a reason...

First of all, posts like this are even worse than the "negative" one you're talking about. For many reasons :

-You listed the whole line-up + cap hits. Thanks, there's about 1000 posts with it on the habs forum.

-You posted your line combos and defense pairing... we don't care, there's a thread for that and the lines change many times during the year + there are injuries too. Those freaking line combos are just ... irrevelant to be kind with you.

-People are *****ing against the recent moves the management has done. We already had Price and Subban before MB joined. We drafted Galchenyuk because we sucked and to be honest, this pick was a no-brainer, the mangement should have no merit over that move.

-Also, there's nothing that prevents anyone from questionning what the management is doing. I'll put it this way because I'm freaking tired of this : the guys running this team have no education for the most part. They're mostly well-connected within the hockey circle and there's absolutely nothing that points that they're any smarter than us. I don't feel these guys are smarter than me at all, I wouldn't even do their job because, to me, what I do for a living is a much better career than being a hockey scout, manager or wtv they do.

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Old
07-06-2013, 10:20 AM
  #61
sheed36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
Not hating the players, the management, the coach and the identity of a team is a good start. I mean it. Why is it even allowed to show pure hatred towards our own team? I get infractions and whatnot of i post "marchand is a ******" on bostons board yet here you have people insulting guys on the team all day all night. Awesome fans, these guys. Great support.
It's allowed because this is a hockey discussion board where everyone as a right to voice their own opinions whether we agree with them or not. Some here like the direction Habs management is taking this team while others not so much and they should have a right to criticize.. I will respect others opinions here even if I don't agree with them and that's what this place is all about.

Do I hate the players, coaches and management? No I don't but if the Habs make a move that I don't like I'm gonna voice my displeasure over it.. If however they make a good move I'll show my support and applaud the move..

If not criticizing or being negative at times toward some players, the coaches or management is what makes someone a "real fan" then I guess I'll never be considered a "real fan".

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Old
07-06-2013, 10:25 AM
  #62
habsroom
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Originally Posted by artpeur View Post
i used to be really positive while everyone was so negative years ago. But when they hired therrien last year, i had some doubts. Sure they played great this year but i still doubt they will be able to have a great season next year. That slump in april was about to last a long long time. It's not just briere's signing and parros' trade that's making me negative about next year, it's the whole thing.

1. I've never been a fan of therrien's coaching, the first 2 months were great but then he couldn't make the team wins
2. The defence sucks, we still need a big physical stay-at-home d that could play a lot of min
3. Our offence is just too small and we have a lot of players with big question marks.

- will pacioretty be able to score more goals? To me, he may have finished 1st in points this year but he was way too much invisible on most games and his shot has been so bad all year long. He should be our best forward...
- will desharnais bounce back?
- how will gionta play after all those injuries? And bourque?
- briere is 0.5ppg, we need more than that.

The only forwards that i think they would have a great year are plekanec, eller, galchenyuk and gallagher. I would be also happy to hear that halpern is coming back, i really hope that bergevin will sign him. He's a character guy after all. Lol

wow the defense sucks........... How can you say that ? We have the norris trophy winner plus the top offensive pp qb in the nhl. I know the defense is small but if tinordi can make this team and emelin can come back at 100% that will help a lot then add gorges and daiz . Sure amother big tough dman would look good but the habs defense is far from sucking.

How could the parros' trade make you negative about next year? He is exactly the type of player we need. He will be great in the room and will not complain when he is in the press box,he has won a cup and have stood up to every nhl tough guy and will not let his teammates get pushed around by lucic/thorton/neil and guys like that. Who else would you have wanted mb to sign? Please name someone


Last edited by ThirdManIn: 07-06-2013 at 11:30 AM. Reason: caps
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Old
07-06-2013, 10:30 AM
  #63
habtastic
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Totally agree. I really feel like all the moaning threads will be the ones we look back on and laugh at 2 years from now cuz MB refused to give up valuable assets and when those other teams that were sooooo great don't look so good and don't have a cup to show for it.

I'm so on board with MB's philosophy of building through the draft. In a cap world, it's all about getting solid players on the cheap and developing them. Of course, you have to assume we've drafted well, but I think we have. I can't believe people are *****ing cuz we don't have david freaking clarkson. There's a time and place for everything and we all know that our D is the big issue first. There was no obvious fix in the FA market for that except waiting for our multiple D prospects to create an excellent blueline. It will be far more satisfying to have an organizationally sound (internally) team than this process of trading laterally or just making bad trades and losing solid players. How people haven't remembered that as they complain about midgets in the same breath is amazing.

2-3 years, then come back and tell me MB screwed up THIS year.

I guess we'll suck again this year and come 2nd in the conference. Damn.

(And FTR, it was the injuries in the playoffs + some lucky bounces + some shiiiite refs, I am not at all worried/rattled by what happened in the 1st rd)

Tor will be good, Boston too, as will the others, but I really don't see us not competing with them. Can't wait for those predictions though. Please have us as last!

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07-06-2013, 10:31 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by chemisebleuhonnete View Post
i quoted the whole post for a reason...

First of all, posts like this are even worse than the "negative" one you're talking about. For many reasons :

-you listed the whole line-up + cap hits. Thanks, there's about 1000 posts with it on the habs forum.

-you posted your line combos and defense pairing... We don't care, there's a thread for that and the lines change many times during the year + there are injuries too. Those freaking line combos are just ... Irrevelant to be kind with you.

-people are *****ing against the recent moves the management has done. We already had price and subban before mb joined. We drafted galchenyuk because we sucked and to be honest, this pick was a no-brainer, the mangement should have no merit over that move.

-also, there's nothing that prevents anyone from questionning what the management is doing. I'll put it this way because i'm freaking tired of this : The guys running this team have no education for the most part. They're mostly well-connected within the hockey circle and there's absolutely nothing that points that they're any smarter than us. I don't feel these guys are smarter than me at all, i wouldn't even do their job because, to me, what i do for a living is a much better career than being a hockey scout, manager or wtv they do.
ok if you don't like this team or the way they run it or my post i have a great idea for you, stop reading my post! Don't cheer for the team and trying doing something worthy of your intelligence since you are so educated.

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Old
07-06-2013, 10:36 AM
  #65
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It would have been a great Friday if the Habs had the assets or spare cap room to trade for Bobby Ryan. Unfortunately they didn't have what other teams wanted in return for the big trades. Is it a downer that that they didn't get a big name centre, winger, or dman yesterday? Yeah, but with what teams were forking over in salary and contract length it would have handcuffed ther Habs over the next few seasons. They still need to be able to afford a Subban contract next year. Paying $7 million/7 years for David Clarkson like the Leafs did would have been foolish. A lot of these moves are for the short term good and not to rebuild a team which they are doing in Montreal.

As for David Desharnais...I get it. People do not like him. They want him traded or released. Who is willing to trade for him? What quality player can be had for him if he sucks so badly? Unfortunately there isn't a Bob Gainey out there willing to make a Gomez type of trade for DD and return a young stud centre for his services. As much as I'd like to see that Simmonds guy from Philly I wouldn't want to throw away a young dman like Nathan Beaulieu in return as MTL needs to develop their prospects instead of using them for trade bait. Just wait...give Beaulieu, Tinordi, and even Pateryn a chance to get more NHL exposure and playing time. All three a well over 6' tall with some bulk- after yesterday one would think that being over 6' tall is all that makes a winning team. Briere has always been a thorn in the Habs side and I think he will be a good one on the anemic PP as well as mentoring the younger guys. His 2 year deal seems like a voice of reason in week of reaching and overpaying for free agents.

The team will be fine. If not they draft higher than they did this season but you don't know until the puck drops in October. They have until then to add depth without breaking the bank on a foolish Clarksonesque contract or worse 5 year overpayment for a broken older player.

Oh yeah...if anyone here is a better center than DD please feel free to drop a resume and DVD highlight reel off at the Bell Centre. I am sure they will gladly give you a tryout to replace DD.

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Old
07-06-2013, 10:43 AM
  #66
ChemiseBleuHonnete
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Originally Posted by habsroom View Post
ok if you don't like this team or the way they run it or my post i have a great idea for you, stop reading my post! Don't cheer for the team and trying doing something worthy of your intelligence since you are so educated.
Over-reaction to what I said... I'm tired of people saying that we shouldn't question what the mangement does and which players are wearing this jersey. Of course, this is our team and we like it. And this is a discussion board, this is the place to say what we think about it. And just like everyone else, when I go see the games (like I did when I went to Ottawa to cheer for them) I make sure I get back home voiceless and I cheer for every single player wearing the jersey and hate every other player who don't wear it. I'm a habs fan, as hardcore as any other one. But I'm not blind and I don't like what the management is doing and it's my right to say it.

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Old
07-06-2013, 10:43 AM
  #67
The Russian General
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Building a team needs time... We'll have to be patient. We're only one season removed from a last place finish (even though our team wasn't that bad).

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07-06-2013, 10:44 AM
  #68
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yes mom, ill go clean my room. i guess youre the kind of guy who votes liberal no matter what, for 50 years.

people are adults, let them decide what they should think, even if 90% of the time it doesnt make sense. this post is your opinion only. a very biased perspective.

sick and tired of hf these days: cannot have a point of view; youre negative, not a ''real fan'', etc

ps who the **** gave gorges 3.9mil...DAMN

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07-06-2013, 10:49 AM
  #69
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Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
Totally agree. I really feel like all the moaning threads will be the ones we look back on and laugh at 2 years from now cuz MB refused to give up valuable assets and when those other teams that were sooooo great don't look so good and don't have a cup to show for it.

I'm so on board with MB's philosophy of building through the draft. In a cap world, it's all about getting solid players on the cheap and developing them. Of course, you have to assume we've drafted well, but I think we have. I can't believe people are *****ing cuz we don't have david freaking clarkson. There's a time and place for everything and we all know that our D is the big issue first. There was no obvious fix in the FA market for that except waiting for our multiple D prospects to create an excellent blueline. It will be far more satisfying to have an organizationally sound (internally) team than this process of trading laterally or just making bad trades and losing solid players. How people haven't remembered that as they complain about midgets in the same breath is amazing.

2-3 years, then come back and tell me MB screwed up THIS year.

I guess we'll suck again this year and come 2nd in the conference. Damn.

(And FTR, it was the injuries in the playoffs + some lucky bounces + some shiiiite refs, I am not at all worried/rattled by what happened in the 1st rd)

Tor will be good, Boston too, as will the others, but I really don't see us not competing with them. Can't wait for those predictions though. Please have us as last!
Serious question, what has MB done that makes you think that he has what it takes to build a contender? We have a lot of good pieces but MB has made numerous mis-steps that are making me worry he doesn't have what it takes to build a contender.

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07-06-2013, 10:51 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by marchabsfan View Post
yes mom, ill go clean my room. i guess youre the kind of guy who votes liberal no matter what, for 50 years.

people are adults, let them decide what they should think, even if 90% of the time it doesnt make sense. this post is your opinion only. a very biased perspective.

sick and tired of hf these days: cannot have a point of view; youre negative, not a ''real fan'', etc

ps who the **** gave gorges 3.9mil...DAMN
Really? From reading the forum in the last few days, I was under the impression that the majority of posters here are teenagers that were spoon fed for their entire life.

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07-06-2013, 10:52 AM
  #71
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Really? From reading the forum in the last few days, I was under the impression that the majority of posters here are teenagers that were spoon fed for their entire life.
I knew somebody would like that one

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07-06-2013, 10:54 AM
  #72
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I'd be positive if I think our team can win the CUP even before the season starts but now I can even say we are a team that has a sure place in the playoffs. Seriously guys, just watch our line-up, you really think we have a shot at the cup this year, or next year, or next next year?

We've been losers for 20 years and most of these years, especially in the last 10 years, we've been building the team in the same offensive mold, small offensive forwards and it clearly doesn't work yet MB who I had faith with, still does the same thing.. and it got even worst.

Maybe you guys can be positive if your objective is to win the regular season. I'm just sick tired to see our team have an early exit in the playoffs.

If you guys can cheer me up by saying we have a chance of winning the cup by showing facts, then I'd be positive like you guys. Facts like comparing each line with recents cup finalists line and say ours are better. Like Bourque-Plekanec-Briere>Bolland-Toews-Kane or Lucic-Krejci-Horton or Carter-Kopitar-Brown. Or show our defensive squad is a defensive squad build for the playoffs, with size, grit and playoffs experience. Not a wash up 1st defenseman who tends to disappear in the playoffs and it leave us with Subban and the rest of unexperienced, small and soft D. Then there's the goalie, show me we can have faith in him, show me he's clutch in the playoffs like Thomas, Rask, Quick, Crawford.. not a goalie that has 4 wins in his last 4 playoffs (17 games).

Since most of you guys think UFA are "overrated" and happy we don't pay the price to find those big players that we need to complement our smaller players, then tell me how our team will become a cup contender. Oh right? By drafting right? How long will our prospect will be ready? McCarron is coming right? Like in 3-4 years? We don't even know if he's gonna be NHL material, or top 6 material.

I just feel that the people got so used to losing that they don't even aim for the cup anymore. We hear to much stuff like, we were division winners last year! We can't be that bad. We also got only 1 win in the playoffs against the 7 seed last season, but let's not talk about that.. its so negative! Let's just ignore our playoffs problem and lets concentrate in our regular season success! We so happy!


Last edited by Rosso Scuderia: 07-06-2013 at 10:59 AM.
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Old
07-06-2013, 10:55 AM
  #73
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bobby ryan was the occasion we waited for for so long and the price was reasonable.

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07-06-2013, 10:56 AM
  #74
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Originally Posted by marchabsfan View Post
bobby ryan was the occasion we waited for for so long and the price was reasonable.
Who would you have given for him?

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07-06-2013, 10:56 AM
  #75
Monctonscout
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Originally Posted by Sorinth View Post
Overpaying for an average player is exactly what we did. The fact that it's a player that doesn't even address our needs just makes it worse.
I'm not a fan of the Briere signing, but what the Habs paid for him is a baragain compared to Horton, Clowe, Clarkson and co.

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