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Old
07-09-2013, 10:26 PM
  #851
Riseonfire
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformTheMasses View Post
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=677363

Regarding Strome playing wing or center: I have long compared Strome to Logan Couture and think he should be treated similarly. Like Couture, Strome has gone back and completed his third and 4th seasons in CHL. Then played a handfull of games for his teams AHL affiliate. The following season Couture started the season in the AHL and played about half the season and just dominated. I expect Strome to do the same (start in Bridgeport this year and dominate). Once Couture came up, he got his feet wet playing his first few season on the wing of an established NHL Superstar Joe Thornton. Strome will have an opportunity to do the same. Once PMB gets hospitalized (by December/January) Strome will step in and become JT's winger for a couple of seasons. Then when he's established will go to the 2nd line Center behind JT as a 22 or 23 year old and form a two headed monster up the middle. Ryan Strome is a true center through and through, he will perform best there (eventually), but for his development, the best thing for him is to skate along side #91 for a little while until he can dominate on his own.
I believe Seguin did the same, starting on the wing. He's going to be Dallas' 1st line center this season. I like Strome as a center eventually too. I just think with Nelson hanging around it will be better to have him playing with JT.

EDIT: http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1466119

Strome also is ranked the 7th overall best prospect by HF for what it's worth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester9881 View Post
Since I'm getting hammered on two fronts from multiple people....

I will say, right now

1. Griffin Reinhart will be at least the second or third best defenseman in camp. Whether or not he makes it is anyones guess, but he's ready.... right now.

2. Ryan Strome will be moved to wing

If I'm wrong, I'll change my name to BeiberFan7 forever. Does anyone here have the stones to bet against me?
I agree with you about 2. And I also think Griff is ready, but IDK about being the 2nd best Dman we have.

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07-09-2013, 10:28 PM
  #852
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformTheMasses View Post
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=677363

Regarding Strome playing wing or center: I have long compared Strome to Logan Couture and think he should be treated similarly. Like Couture, Strome has gone back and completed his third and 4th seasons in CHL. Then played a handfull of games for his teams AHL affiliate. The following season Couture started the season in the AHL and played about half the season and just dominated. I expect Strome to do the same (start in Bridgeport this year and dominate). Once Couture came up, he got his feet wet playing his first few season on the wing of an established NHL Superstar Joe Thornton. Strome will have an opportunity to do the same. Once PMB gets hospitalized (by December/January) Strome will step in and become JT's winger for a couple of seasons. Then when he's established will go to the 2nd line Center behind JT as a 22 or 23 year old and form a two headed monster up the middle. Ryan Strome is a true center through and through, he will perform best there (eventually), but for his development, the best thing for him is to skate along side #91 for a little while until he can dominate on his own.

As for the chatter about Reinhart being ready. Not a snowballs chance that he makes the Islanders this season. I love that the kid is confident though, that's what you want.
1000% agree on all fronts. I believe that is exactly the plan for Strome. I really dont care if he dominates camp...I want to see him play at least 20 games in the AHL. I want to see him deal with adversity. I want to see how he handles being checked by big dudes. I want to see him work in the corner and excel. I want to see him penalty kill and on the PowerPlay. No reason not to start him in the AHL. To me, those few games last year dont prove anything. I need to see more.

As for Griff. No. He needs to go back to juniors and play top minutes and learn more of the offensive side of the game. Then he'll probably get a year in the AHL before he's ready imo. No need to rush him. In two years we could have 3 or 4 guys knocking on the defense door. Griff, Pulock, Pelech, and mayfield. Outside shot of Pedan. Crazy.

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07-09-2013, 10:33 PM
  #853
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Originally Posted by Riseonfire View Post
I agree with you about 2. And I also think Griff is ready, but IDK about being the 2nd best Dman we have.
Defensively, I easily put him above everyone we have other then Hamonic and Viz.

Keep in mind, I'm not one to push the idea that we should rush prospects. But I do think it's silly to overcook them in certain instances.

I watch Griffin Reinhart, and I see a big body kid with good reach, good anticipation, good positioning and strength. The kid is a really good *defenseman* right now.

I don't see how giving this kid a promotion to the NHL would stunt any offensive upside the kid has in any way shape or form. We have a serious need for a defenseman like Griffin, and we've already got him. It would be silly not to see what we've got in camp, and if he proves good enough defensively.... he should make the team.

JMHO

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07-09-2013, 10:35 PM
  #854
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I was a big advocate for sending Nino back to junior. I was a big advocate for bringing Cizikas up before he was on many peoples radar, and I was a big advocate for bringing up Hamonic when everyone said he wasn't ready.

When they're ready, they will let you know.... and you shouldn't hold them back just because they're a certain age. Not if they're showing they are ready.

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07-09-2013, 10:41 PM
  #855
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Originally Posted by Jester9881 View Post
I was a big advocate for sending Nino back to junior. I was a big advocate for bringing Cizikas up before he was on many peoples radar, and I was a big advocate for bringing up Hamonic when everyone said he wasn't ready.

When they're ready, they will let you know.... and you shouldn't hold them back just because they're a certain age. Not if they're showing they are ready.


Is Donovan ready?

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07-09-2013, 10:42 PM
  #856
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Originally Posted by Jester9881 View Post
Defensively, I easily put him above everyone we have other then Hamonic and Viz.

Keep in mind, I'm not one to push the idea that we should rush prospects. But I do think it's silly to overcook them in certain instances.

I watch Griffin Reinhart, and I see a big body kid with good reach, good anticipation, good positioning and strength. The kid is a really good *defenseman* right now.

I don't see how giving this kid a promotion to the NHL would stunt any offensive upside the kid has in any way shape or form. We have a serious need for a defenseman like Griffin, and we've already got him. It would be silly not to see what we've got in camp, and if he proves good enough defensively.... he should make the team.

JMHO
you dont think he might be a bit of a pylon in the NHL? I mean he's not slow, but hes not fast and the reaction times are sooo drastically shorter in the NHL...i worry it's too big of a jump...and might stunt his growth because i dont want him to be just a defensive defenseman....and he certainly wont get to work on his offense here.

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07-09-2013, 11:18 PM
  #857
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Originally Posted by Mavericknyc1980 View Post
Is Donovan ready?
He's ready for the next step, but it'll be a careful and close transition. He's ready to be worked in, but not necessarily to excel.

But it is time for the next step.

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07-09-2013, 11:25 PM
  #858
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Originally Posted by Mavericknyc1980 View Post
Is Donovan ready?
Donovan was ready when the lockout ended.

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07-09-2013, 11:37 PM
  #859
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Originally Posted by Jester9881 View Post
I was a big advocate for sending Nino back to junior. I was a big advocate for bringing Cizikas up before he was on many peoples radar, and I was a big advocate for bringing up Hamonic when everyone said he wasn't ready.

When they're ready, they will let you know.... and you shouldn't hold them back just because they're a certain age. Not if they're showing they are ready.
I can't argue that logic since I fully agree with the concept.

Here is my dilemma with Reinhart. He is a smart, crease clearing defenceman that is very good defensively in the whl at age 19.

To be a successful defensive defenseman in the NHL as a teenager or twenty year old you need to have filled out, have above average to great mobility and foot speed. excelling at either the physical aspect and/or the offensive part of the game wouldnt hurt either.

Unfortunately for Griff he is a work in progress in all of these areas, he's improving in some of these areas but not passable in NHL level for a 19 year old to get by. To me that is NOT ready for the role he would be needed to fill if he were to make it.

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07-10-2013, 12:08 AM
  #860
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Any chance the bolded quote below means we might actually have another deal coming for a top line winger? Or is it just lip service from the coach? Seems a little strange for Jack to say that so I wonder what theyre thinking.


Quote:
"I think it's up for grabs," Capuano said. "Obviously with Bouchard now coming in, a very skilled guy, a little different than [PA] Parenteau and Brad Boyes was there, but there's still a lot of options. I think Garth is still thinking of a few different things, so it's tough for me to say that right now. But I like the depth of our team and the way that we're moving forward. We've got good, young guys, good character guys. We want to be a team that plays fast, so I don't mind the youth part of it. We're looking forward to training camp in September, for sure."

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07-10-2013, 01:03 AM
  #861
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Any chance the bolded quote below means we might actually have another deal coming for a top line winger? Or is it just lip service from the coach? Seems a little strange for Jack to say that so I wonder what theyre thinking.
That also jumped out at me, but I wouldn't be surprised if Snow plays his poker game internally.

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07-10-2013, 07:33 AM
  #862
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Originally Posted by Jester9881 View Post
Defensively, I easily put him above everyone we have other then Hamonic and Viz.
Considering that Viz isn't exactly known for his defensive prowess, is that really high praise for Reinhart? You talk about not wanting to rush prospects, but if Reinhart who is known at the moment as a defensive defenseman isn't better defensively than Visnovsky, then won't having him make the NHL this year be just that?


Last edited by Strummergas: 07-10-2013 at 08:06 AM.
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Old
07-10-2013, 07:39 AM
  #863
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good for Snow for not divulging his intentions. once you do, the vultures attack.

we cannot say for sure with respect to Reinhart (even Pulock IMO), making the team.

they have the big bodies, for sure. it's more than that. there are lots of attributes that are important, but to me, hockey sense, is the MOST important. it's what keeps little guys from getting their heads ripped off (see M. St. Louis). it's what makes us go "ooooo and aaahhh". saucer passes, clearing attempts, smart little defensive plays. these things will only appear on the ice. we have to wait and see...

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07-10-2013, 07:50 AM
  #864
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Originally Posted by InformTheMasses View Post
I can't argue that logic since I fully agree with the concept.

Here is my dilemma with Reinhart. He is a smart, crease clearing defenceman that is very good defensively in the whl at age 19.

To be a successful defensive defenseman in the NHL as a teenager or twenty year old you need to have filled out, have above average to great mobility and foot speed. excelling at either the physical aspect and/or the offensive part of the game wouldnt hurt either.

Unfortunately for Griff he is a work in progress in all of these areas, he's improving in some of these areas but not passable in NHL level for a 19 year old to get by. To me that is NOT ready for the role he would be needed to fill if he were to make it.
Maybe some good news is unless Griff shocks us with improvement in skating as you point out, the D looks fairly set for this fall. As ITM points out, Donovan is ready and a big if-should deHaan finally stay healthy he could come on fast.

Edmonton GM Bob Green said on radio station CHED that if Reinhart comes back the Oil Kings are going to have him run the powerplay and do more offensively. Unless Griff shocks us he might be better off going back to polish up his game.

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07-10-2013, 08:35 AM
  #865
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I can see Snow with his hand on Cappys shoulder saying"you will love your team come September" then giving him a wink and a 2009 de Hann head nod before walking away....


IMO Reinhart injury will hold him back a bit this summer....

Last year he was great in the camp the isles had. At the game aganst the pros he was so cool,calm and composed....I expect really good things from the Big Griff aka the Big Cat

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07-10-2013, 09:14 AM
  #866
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I think everyone is forgetting about the 8-game tryout(or is it 9-games? I can never remember). IF Snow doesn't bring in another UFA/waiver defenseman, and IF Reinhart looks the part in training camp, I'd be willing to bet my taint that Reinhart at least gets the 8-games. On paper, he fits the biggest hole we have on our blue-line. A big, talented, reliable defensive defenseman. Apparently, those who watch Edmonton and the WHL in general seem to think there is no doubt that he's ready(including RenegadeStylings, who I've seen mentioned around here recently).

I'm not going to say it's a guarantee, since he could obviously **** the bed in TC, but I don't see it being this automatic "we're going to send you back to Edmonton regardless of how well you play" type situation.

Same for Strome. If he looks like he belongs, he'll stick. The upside, especially the upside of him with Tavares, is too great to ignore.

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07-10-2013, 12:21 PM
  #867
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I don't see how we can fit Strome and Nelson on. I honestly don't see it. The ideal role for both would be third line center. Anybody putting Nelson/Strome ahead of Neilsen is crazy. They haven't proved anything yet.
Bailey-Tavares-PMB
Moulson-Neilsen-Okposo
Grabner-Nelson-Clutterbuck
Martin-Cizikas-Mcdonalad
I just don't see how we fit both of them in.

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07-10-2013, 12:33 PM
  #868
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Originally Posted by YearlyLottery View Post
I don't see how we can fit Strome and Nelson on. I honestly don't see it. The ideal role for both would be third line center. Anybody putting Nelson/Strome ahead of Neilsen is crazy. They haven't proved anything yet.
Bailey-Tavares-PMB
Moulson-Neilsen-Okposo
Grabner-Nelson-Clutterbuck
Martin-Cizikas-Mcdonalad
I just don't see how we fit both of them in.
The only way Strome can stick at this point is if he has a big camp, and if PMB doesn't. Even that might not be enough, considering the Isles invested $2M into him, which probably equates to $5M for any other team.

As long as he gets a fair shot, I'll be happy. At this point, I doubt that will be the case.

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07-10-2013, 12:44 PM
  #869
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I think everyone is forgetting about the 8-game tryout(or is it 9-games? I can never remember). IF Snow doesn't bring in another UFA/waiver defenseman, and IF Reinhart looks the part in training camp, I'd be willing to bet my taint that Reinhart at least gets the 8-games. On paper, he fits the biggest hole we have on our blue-line. A big, talented, reliable defensive defenseman. Apparently, those who watch Edmonton and the WHL in general seem to think there is no doubt that he's ready(including RenegadeStylings, who I've seen mentioned around here recently).

I'm not going to say it's a guarantee, since he could obviously **** the bed in TC, but I don't see it being this automatic "we're going to send you back to Edmonton regardless of how well you play" type situation.

Same for Strome. If he looks like he belongs, he'll stick. The upside, especially the upside of him with Tavares, is too great to ignore.
The only problem with your reasoning is we have 8 D-men now, if Hickey signs his QO, and that would mean someone would have to be waived to keep Reinhart up with the big club. That's highly unlikely. Unless we get rid of a D-man between now and camp Reinhart will be going back to juniors.

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07-10-2013, 12:51 PM
  #870
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Maybe some good news is unless Griff shocks us with improvement in skating as you point out, the D looks fairly set for this fall. As ITM points out, Donovan is ready and a big if-should deHaan finally stay healthy he could come on fast.

Edmonton GM Bob Green said on radio station CHED that if Reinhart comes back the Oil Kings are going to have him run the powerplay and do more offensively. Unless Griff shocks us he might be better off going back to polish up his game.
exactly. Correct me if I am wrong someone, but I dont think Griffin even played top 2 min in jr this year. If that is a role the isles expect him to take on, then maybe he should be going back to jr to help him develop and evolve into that player. It doeant really make sense to push him into the lineup on a bottom pair when you have guys like dehaan and donovan who are knocking on the door.

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07-10-2013, 12:58 PM
  #871
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Originally Posted by YearlyLottery View Post
I don't see how we can fit Strome and Nelson on. I honestly don't see it. The ideal role for both would be third line center. Anybody putting Nelson/Strome ahead of Neilsen is crazy. They haven't proved anything yet.
Bailey-Tavares-PMB
Moulson-Neilsen-Okposo
Grabner-Nelson-Clutterbuck
Martin-Cizikas-Mcdonalad
I just don't see how we fit both of them in.
thats how i see it shake out to. Without an injury I dont see Strome on the island to start. I think those vottom 2 lines will play similar minutes...might see a change woth bailey and moulson

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07-10-2013, 01:03 PM
  #872
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The only problem with your reasoning is we have 8 D-men now, if Hickey signs his QO, and that would mean someone would have to be waived to keep Reinhart up with the big club. That's highly unlikely. Unless we get rid of a D-man between now and camp Reinhart will be going back to juniors.
Finley could easily be waived. I think the only reason he was here last year because we were in desperate need of bodies, and because of the uncertainty around Hickey and even Strait to a degree. All were coming off waivers, and it seemed the Isles were playing the odds(bring in 3, chances are at least one will pan out). If you waive Finley/send him down to BP, you're looking at:

1. Hamonic
2. MacDonald
3. Visnovsky
4. Strait
5. Carkner
6. Hickey
7. one of deHaan/Donovan
8. Reinhart

If Reinhart impresses in camp and Finley looks like Finley, I really don't think the Isles will care about the risk of losing him. After all, they have a big body in Reinhart replacing him, and another two big bodies down in Bridgeport with Mayfield and Pedan. I guess you could say that neither Mayfield/Pedan could be relied upon to provide depth this year, but they are both in the same year Hamonic was in when he got the call(permanently). Finley is nothing more than depth at this point... not a missing piece. He should determine nothing when it comes to Griff.

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07-10-2013, 01:25 PM
  #873
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Nabby and goalie situation??

I'm watching game 3 of Pitt series on NHL channel....the announcers are talking about the puck to the head Nabby took in game 1. They basically said he hasn't been the same since that point on in game 1. It got me thinking and concerned for the up coming season...
1-sign a NHL worthy back- up
2-Snow and company should be real sure about either Poulin or Nillson being the back-up!
3-have confidence in said back-up

I am not saying we win that series but I do feel Nabby was effected by that shot to the head. Maybe there is a game 7 and who knows??

I'm sure this gets moved because I never put these threads where they belong so sorry in advance

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07-10-2013, 01:37 PM
  #874
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Finley could easily be waived. I think the only reason he was here last year because we were in desperate need of bodies, and because of the uncertainty around Hickey and even Strait to a degree. All were coming off waivers, and it seemed the Isles were playing the odds(bring in 3, chances are at least one will pan out). If you waive Finley/send him down to BP, you're looking at:

1. Hamonic
2. MacDonald
3. Visnovsky
4. Strait
5. Carkner
6. Hickey
7. one of deHaan/Donovan
8. Reinhart

If Reinhart impresses in camp and Finley looks like Finley, I really don't think the Isles will care about the risk of losing him. After all, they have a big body in Reinhart replacing him, and another two big bodies down in Bridgeport with Mayfield and Pedan. I guess you could say that neither Mayfield/Pedan could be relied upon to provide depth this year, but they are both in the same year Hamonic was in when he got the call(permanently). Finley is nothing more than depth at this point... not a missing piece. He should determine nothing when it comes to Griff.
I agree that Finley could get waived at some point. It's likely, I think. But it's because Mayfield may be better, NOW. Also, Mayfield has options. Reinhart does not.

Finley's speed is a defensive liability. Mayfield doesn't have that issue.

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07-10-2013, 02:10 PM
  #875
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Originally Posted by Jester9881 View Post
Defensively, I easily put him above everyone we have other then Hamonic and Viz.

Keep in mind, I'm not one to push the idea that we should rush prospects. But I do think it's silly to overcook them in certain instances.

I watch Griffin Reinhart, and I see a big body kid with good reach, good anticipation, good positioning and strength. The kid is a really good *defenseman* right now.

I don't see how giving this kid a promotion to the NHL would stunt any offensive upside the kid has in any way shape or form. We have a serious need for a defenseman like Griffin, and we've already got him. It would be silly not to see what we've got in camp, and if he proves good enough defensively.... he should make the team.

JMHO
I think Reinhart has to improve his skating before we talk about him in the NHL. At this point he'd be beaten regularly by good to great skaters in the NHL. Let him work on his skating and offense in junior for another season. BUT, IF he has a great camp, the coaches may feel he's ready, but I've watched enough highlights to see junior aged kids skate right by him on defense, including Pulock, who's not even a great skater (he's above average).

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