HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Nashville Predators
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Nick Spaling avoids arbitration (1 year, $1.5 mil)

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-11-2013, 12:46 AM
  #26
predfan24
Registered User
 
predfan24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,261
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Duke View Post
Alec Martinez, a decent young puck-moving d-man for the Kings also filed for arbitration, which tends to sour Lombardi. Wonder if he would be interested in swapping him for Spaling, though I'm not sure how much cap space the Kings are working with.
This seems like a good idea but I'm not sure how much Martinez wants.


Sucks to lose Spaling but I always thought 5 on 5 he was overrated defensively as a center. He was good but he wasn't the shut down guy I think some made him out to be.

He is a good PK'er though and has decent hands and shot for a bottom sixer and is good for 10 goals 10 assists a year. If we can't keep him I hope nothing but the best for him.

predfan24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 01:02 AM
  #27
WartracePred
Registered User
 
WartracePred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,084
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
Problem is Spaling is not equivalent to Gaustad or Poile wouldnt have given Goose the fat contract
Goose is a bigger body, more physical, better PKer, better face off specialist and stands up for his teammates.. The only thing Spaling does better is the one thing most on these boards have tunnel vision over -- scoring goals. NOTHING ELSE MATTERS!! Goose is AWFUL because he doesn't score goals. Face offs, killing penalties, defending his teammates, especially Rinne... Not important. Nope, he doesn't score goals. But hey, Spaling does so Trotz and Poile are idiots.

WartracePred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 01:17 AM
  #28
AdmiralsFan24
Registered User
 
AdmiralsFan24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Wisconsin
Country: United States
Posts: 5,335
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to AdmiralsFan24
Quote:
Originally Posted by WartracePred View Post
Goose is a bigger body, more physical, better PKer, better face off specialist and stands up for his teammates.. The only thing Spaling does better is the one thing most on these boards have tunnel vision over -- scoring goals. NOTHING ELSE MATTERS!! Goose is AWFUL because he doesn't score goals. Face offs, killing penalties, defending his teammates, especially Rinne... Not important. Nope, he doesn't score goals. But hey, Spaling does so Trotz and Poile are idiots.
If we're comparing goal scoring, Spaling has averaged about 9.5 per 82 games in his career and Gaustad has averaged 11.5 (though that has fallen off to about 8 in the last couple of years. So even if this 8 goals per 82 games is the new Gaustad, it's still only 1.5 less goals per year than Spaling.

AdmiralsFan24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 03:22 AM
  #29
maplepred
Registered User
 
maplepred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,658
vCash: 500
Gaustad is replacing spaling?? Weak.

Spaling, IMO, is more valuable than goose, has a lower contract, and isn't injured as often.

If poile didn't sign damn nystrom and Hendricks this would not even be an issue.

It's very sad if we lose spals for nothing, will be a sad day
in predator nation when spaling is let go, and we elect to go with goose, Hendricks and nystrom. Who all are more expensive than spaling and not as good. As I said, weak.

maplepred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 04:45 AM
  #30
oreilly22
Registered User
 
oreilly22's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Oahu
Country: United States
Posts: 335
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by maplepred View Post
Gaustad is replacing spaling?? Weak.

Spaling, IMO, is more valuable than goose, has a lower contract, and isn't injured as often.

If poile didn't sign damn nystrom and Hendricks this would not even be an issue.

It's very sad if we lose spals for nothing, will be a sad day
in predator nation when spaling is let go, and we elect to go with goose, Hendricks and nystrom. Who all are more expensive than spaling and not as good. As I said, weak.
Players like Spaling are a dime a dozen. He is a decent penalty killer, but that is about it. Gaustad is bigger, more physical, and wins a lot of face offs. As much as some people seem to be willing to put him in trades and scoff at his price tag, he fits the new Preds better than Spaling, who is a guy that every team has 3 or 4 players just like him.

oreilly22 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 05:57 AM
  #31
Infinite Jest
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 613
vCash: 500
SK filed for arbitration, but Poile signed him before the hearing...

Infinite Jest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 07:12 AM
  #32
AtlantaWhaler
Moderator
Thrash/Preds/Sabres
 
AtlantaWhaler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 12,077
vCash: 500
Out of the 21 players who filed for arbitration, almost half came from either the Kings (Trevor Lewis, Alec Martinez, Jake Muzzin, Jordan Nolan) or the Jets (Zach Bogosian, Bryan Little, Paul Postma, Eric Tangradi, Blake Wheeler). Bogo, Little, and Wheeler? I'd be slightly nervous if I were a Jets fan.

AtlantaWhaler is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 08:07 AM
  #33
triggrman
HFBoards Sponsor
 
triggrman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 17,951
vCash: 500
I think it's funny we get upset with smith's contract but want Spaling to get the same type contract.

Also, Gaustad is one of the top defensive specialist in the NHL and he's huge. Spaling might learn to be a great defensive player but he can't learn to be 6'5" 220lbs.

I also know that Gaustad will get hurt, and we will need the depth of a Spaling type player, eventually.

I want to keep Spaling, I like Spaling.

triggrman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 08:51 AM
  #34
PFL615
Registered User
 
PFL615's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Smashville, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 1,578
vCash: 500
Yes it was just business with Weber. We are talking two completely different levels of players. Like metioned before people on this board have complained for a week now on what we are paying are 4th line but then turn around and complain that they are not giving Spaling a raise in the millions. Talk about confusing and head scratching.
I guess people do not understand what getting bigger and more physical means. Goose is better than Spaling and brings leadership this young team needs.
With all of that said i like Spaling but he doesn't fit in with the direction this team wants to go.

PFL615 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 09:10 AM
  #35
glenngineer
Registered User
 
glenngineer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Spring Hill, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 4,174
vCash: 500
To address a few thoughts that people are saying that I don't recall seeing in any of these posts.

1. Who said we wanted to pay Spaling more money? I never did. All I said was I think it's silly to pay Goose the money he's making when Spaling is a younger more well rounded player than Goose. If he gets more money from arbitration great but I doubt he's going to get a raise after his performance last season. If he does, the Preds stand to let him go because they don't want to pay his salary and they lose him for nothing. Poor asset management. And no one around here thinks he's going to get $2 million from the Preds. I'm not advocating it and I don't think he's deserving of it. Let's see what the Preds have offered and what he wants in arbitration and go from there before worrying about his salary.

2. When did anyone mention goals and his production other than the teams winning % when he scores. The game isn't always about scoring but having well rounded role players is important too. Spaling is a good all around player. Is he spectacular at anything, nope but he's a solid PK'er, he has stayed relatively healthy, chips in goals here and there. You don't notice him on the ice and while I'd love to see him lay big hits it's not his game and we have some other guys to do that now. If we want to compare him to Gaustad, everyone says he's not as good at faceoffs. While that's very true, every time I recall seeing Goose out to win a big faceoff he either got tossed or lost it. Also, for all the physical comments made about Goose, how many of those guys do we need on a roster? Adding Hendricks and Nystrom seem to be a lot of redundant parts, much like Hali, Yip and Spaling. It's like going from one extreme to another. So all that said, not sure where the "goals" comparison came from but if anyone thinks I only want Spaling because of his goal production is silly considering he brings a lot more to the table than just that. We also say we have a team full of Spaling's. If he's gone, we have none at that point since the similar players to him have all been jettisoned.

3. Business is business, regardless of the player. Just because it's Weber doesn't make it any more or less of a business attitude when it's in regards to player contracts. Yes, Weber is more valuable but it shouldn't effect how we view a player, even if it's just Spaling.

4. As far as Goose standing up for his teammates, really? The one time I recall him doing anything was hugging Peckham to the ground last year. If he's sticking up for his teammates, what good is his faceoff skills? I'm being facetious of course when saying this but he's not as physical as some think. For the money and impact on the game, Smithson was a better fit at a third the price and while I loathed Smithson, I'd rather have him than Goose.

5. And maybe I have a serious problem as I can't stand Goose and have always liked what Spaling brought to the team. As I said in another post, we reward guys with big contracts from other teams in free agency and let our home grown talent walk for possibly nothing. So we have to overpay to get so so talent yet good talents that are home grown are chastised for wanting to get paid?

I still think Poile has some moves up his sleeve because he's got too many players on the roster and I haven't heard anything in the press that has the team disillusioned with Spaling. Sure, the signings state something but I just can't see the team putting this much time in to him to let him walk for nothing if the arbitration numbers come back in Spaling's favor.

glenngineer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 09:25 AM
  #36
Cashville
RIP Lindback
 
Cashville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 3,353
vCash: 500
I loved Spaling for what he was. Had a way of scoring clutch goals at needed times and solid on the PK. We obviously have too much 3/4 depth at this point and AHLers needing some NHL time. Best of luck if he does get moved.

I kind of enjoyed his blog entries in the Tennessean; dude was obsessed with chicken parm.

Cashville is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 09:47 AM
  #37
PFL615
Registered User
 
PFL615's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Smashville, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 1,578
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
To address a few thoughts that people are saying that I don't recall seeing in any of these posts.

1. Who said we wanted to pay Spaling more money? I never did. All I said was I think it's silly to pay Goose the money he's making when Spaling is a younger more well rounded player than Goose. If he gets more money from arbitration great but I doubt he's going to get a raise after his performance last season. If he does, the Preds stand to let him go because they don't want to pay his salary and they lose him for nothing. Poor asset management. And no one around here thinks he's going to get $2 million from the Preds. I'm not advocating it and I don't think he's deserving of it. Let's see what the Preds have offered and what he wants in arbitration and go from there before worrying about his salary.

2. When did anyone mention goals and his production other than the teams winning % when he scores. The game isn't always about scoring but having well rounded role players is important too. Spaling is a good all around player. Is he spectacular at anything, nope but he's a solid PK'er, he has stayed relatively healthy, chips in goals here and there. You don't notice him on the ice and while I'd love to see him lay big hits it's not his game and we have some other guys to do that now. If we want to compare him to Gaustad, everyone says he's not as good at faceoffs. While that's very true, every time I recall seeing Goose out to win a big faceoff he either got tossed or lost it. Also, for all the physical comments made about Goose, how many of those guys do we need on a roster? Adding Hendricks and Nystrom seem to be a lot of redundant parts, much like Hali, Yip and Spaling. It's like going from one extreme to another. So all that said, not sure where the "goals" comparison came from but if anyone thinks I only want Spaling because of his goal production is silly considering he brings a lot more to the table than just that. We also say we have a team full of Spaling's. If he's gone, we have none at that point since the similar players to him have all been jettisoned.

3. Business is business, regardless of the player. Just because it's Weber doesn't make it any more or less of a business attitude when it's in regards to player contracts. Yes, Weber is more valuable but it shouldn't effect how we view a player, even if it's just Spaling.

4. As far as Goose standing up for his teammates, really? The one time I recall him doing anything was hugging Peckham to the ground last year. If he's sticking up for his teammates, what good is his faceoff skills? I'm being facetious of course when saying this but he's not as physical as some think. For the money and impact on the game, Smithson was a better fit at a third the price and while I loathed Smithson, I'd rather have him than Goose.

5. And maybe I have a serious problem as I can't stand Goose and have always liked what Spaling brought to the team. As I said in another post, we reward guys with big contracts from other teams in free agency and let our home grown talent walk for possibly nothing. So we have to overpay to get so so talent yet good talents that are home grown are chastised for wanting to get paid?

I still think Poile has some moves up his sleeve because he's got too many players on the roster and I haven't heard anything in the press that has the team disillusioned with Spaling. Sure, the signings state something but I just can't see the team putting this much time in to him to let him walk for nothing if the arbitration numbers come back in Spaling's favor.
Stopped reading when you mentioned Spaling is "more well rounded than Goose"

PFL615 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 10:24 AM
  #38
token grinder
formerly sirryan189
 
token grinder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Franklin
Country: United States
Posts: 4,193
vCash: 500
Spaling filed for arbitration...big deal. The problem doesn't come until there is actually a hearing and the player inflates his worth and the team crushes it...to his face. We have had 3 make it that far, and we know about Webers. Other two are Lambert and Koistinen and they were both dealt after the hearings. A few years ago, Klein filed....and he signed before the hearing. Many guys file and sign. I am guessing Spaling thinks he is worth 2-2.5 and the preds think he is worth roughly what they qualified him for, around a million. Arbitrator may give him 1.5.

token grinder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 10:25 AM
  #39
token grinder
formerly sirryan189
 
token grinder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Franklin
Country: United States
Posts: 4,193
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smashville615 View Post
Stopped reading when you mentioned Spaling is "more well rounded than Goose"
Spaling is more well-rounded....but mainly becasue he isn't constantly is some strange shape due to his casts and slings....

token grinder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 10:29 AM
  #40
Viqsi
carrying the flag
 
Viqsi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The Scary Internet
Country: United States
Posts: 21,117
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Viqsi
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmiralsFan24 View Post
If we're comparing goal scoring, Spaling has averaged about 9.5 per 82 games in his career and Gaustad has averaged 11.5 (though that has fallen off to about 8 in the last couple of years. So even if this 8 goals per 82 games is the new Gaustad, it's still only 1.5 less goals per year than Spaling.
Yeah, but did Gaustad ever score a playoff-series winning goal? I THOUGHT NOT.

That 1.5 goals could be the difference between CONTINUED FUTILITY and the SECOND ROUND.



really, it's like the folks who wanted to keep Ward instead placed all their hope in Spaling or something.

__________________
Remember - when you're a hockey fan, it's not "reckless driving", it's "good forechecking".
"Viqsi, you are our sweet humanist..." --mt-svk on the CBJ boards

Thanks, Howson, for cleaning up MacLean's toxic waste. Welcome, Kekalainen; let's get good things built!
Viqsi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 10:34 AM
  #41
PredsV82
Puckaroni and cheese
 
PredsV82's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Outside
Country: Scotland
Posts: 14,338
vCash: 400
Quote:
Originally Posted by maplepred View Post
Gaustad is replacing spaling?? Weak.

Spaling, IMO, is more valuable than goose, has a lower contract, and isn't injured as often.

If poile didn't sign damn nystrom and Hendricks this would not even be an issue.

It's very sad if we lose spals for nothing, will be a sad day
in predator nation when spaling is let go, and we elect to go with goose, Hendricks and nystrom. Who all are more expensive than spaling and not as good. As I said, weak.
You're arguing it backwards. Its not that Goose reaplaces Spals. They shouldn't even be compared. Spalings problem is he isn't gritty enough to forge a career as a grinder but hes nor a good enough scorer to get paid like a scorer. He haa value but to have continued to warrant an increasing salary and a roster spot he needed to score more than he was.... he really needed to become a Top 6 player if he was going to stay here

PredsV82 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 10:38 AM
  #42
AtlantaWhaler
Moderator
Thrash/Preds/Sabres
 
AtlantaWhaler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 12,077
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
You're arguing it backwards. Its not that Goose reaplaces Spals. They shouldn't even be compared. Apalings problem is he isn't gritty enough to forge a career as a grinder but hes nor a good enough scorer to get paid like a scorer
Yeah, I don't get the Goose vs. Spaling comparison. If he goes, Spaling is being replaced by Hendricks and Nystrom. Not Goose.

AtlantaWhaler is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 10:53 AM
  #43
PredsV82
Puckaroni and cheese
 
PredsV82's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Outside
Country: Scotland
Posts: 14,338
vCash: 400
Quote:
Originally Posted by AtlantaWhaler View Post
Yeah, I don't get the Goose vs. Spaling comparison. If he goes, Spaling is being replaced by Hendricks and Nystrom. Not Goose.
Its not even that.

Thed truth is Spaling, if he leaves, will be replaced by Beck or Bourque... 3rd line players with more scoring upside than Spaling who eventually could end up in the top 6.

Everyone pining for Spaling needs to accept this... every team needs grinders, which is what Gosse, Hendricks, and Nystrom are.... problem is, Spaling isn't a grinder... he was supposed to eventually become a scorer. Poiles "top 6" comment that made us all groan wasn't bullspit... that's what he was supposed to turn into... and so he scores enough for a couple of years to warrant bumping his contract up over 1 million, but with the expectation that he will continue to progress. And yet he hasn't become enough of a scorer to warrant more money and so now he is probably be traded to another team where he can try to carve out a spot for himself

PredsV82 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 11:13 AM
  #44
maplepred
Registered User
 
maplepred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,658
vCash: 500
Spaling has a big body and I think he is less shy of the rough stuff than goose. And way less injury prone. And way less money.

I know we aren't replacing spaling with goose, but it's even worse if you compare spaling to nystrom or Hendricks.

Spaling is hands down a better hockey player than either of those two, and for a fraction of the cost, poile is crazy to want one of nystrom or Hendricks in lineup over spaling.


But....

Maybe spaling will have to go, because he is probably looking at how much better he is than nystrom, gaustad, and Hendricks, is seeing what poile paid them boys, and now spals is probably ok arbitration asking for $5.5 million a season.

maplepred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 11:19 AM
  #45
101st_fan
I taught Yoda
 
101st_fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Some Army fort
Country: United States
Posts: 5,865
vCash: 500
Let's be honest about Spaling's current role on the team. 3rd line center with significant PK responsibilities and a need to win faceoffs ... some expectation of secondary scoring. The hope was/is that he develops into a guy who can fill a role on the 2nd line if needed. Now let's look at the current reality. Spaling is a redundant piece after our signings. Cullen is a better scorer and just as capable on the kill. Goose is a much more physical player and better at the dot.

If he stays, wonderful. If he gets traded, so be it. Spaling is a role player who really hasn't differentiated himself from the rest of our depth type players in a way to make himself irreplaceable and his performance last year makes crushing his hopes rather simple if this goes to a hearing. The main reason I'd like to see him stay around is to maintain roster flexibility as injuries and illnesses occur during the season, but without him we have Fisher, Legwand, Cullen, Wilson, Gaustad and to a degree Smith who can play down the middle.

101st_fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 11:36 AM
  #46
triggrman
HFBoards Sponsor
 
triggrman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 17,951
vCash: 500
Spaling is not a physical player, I don't know why someone would claim that. And size isn't close either, Goose has 4" and 25lbs on Spaling.

Guastad doesn't do much right but he is physical, and does stick up for his teammates. Specifically Hornqvist and Rinne, and it stood out to me because rarely does anyone scrum it up when those too take abuse, but Gaustad did.

Still don't like the contract and he's only an average ES player. But what he does, pk and faceoffs he does as well as anyone in the NHL.

Spaling is still growing as a player. I like him. I think he has a knack at times for being in the right place at the right time. He's a good pker and I think has more offensive upside than he's shown so far. He is 25 though, how much more growing is debateable.

triggrman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 11:55 AM
  #47
maplepred
Registered User
 
maplepred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,658
vCash: 500
I just think the main fact of what is annoying to me is that spaling may get pushed out of town for at least two guys (Hendricks and nystrom) that he is a better player than both and will get less money for us against the cap. And then when goose gets hurt again, than what?
We have no spaling or goose, but we have Hendricks and nystrom?! Lol.

Someone said spaling type is a dime a dozen in this thread, well if that's the case then nystrom and Hendricks are a nickel a dozen, we just overpaid for some weird reason.

Point being, spaling has more value for less money, fans like him, I would prefer him to stay here rather than older less talented guys that make more money.

maplepred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 02:11 PM
  #48
Preddownsouth
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 273
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by maplepred View Post
fans like him
This is known as the Jon Blum Syndrome. "He is popular! I don't care if he is a role-playing bottom line guy! He had a good stretch that one time! Poile is obviously the worst GM in the league!"

Preddownsouth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 02:33 PM
  #49
maplepred
Registered User
 
maplepred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,658
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Preddownsouth View Post
This is known as the Jon Blum Syndrome. "He is popular! I don't care if he is a role-playing bottom line guy! He had a good stretch that one time! Poile is obviously the worst GM in the league!"
I just think he is a better option to have in bottom six and is also cheaper than nystrom and Hendricks, and is also younger

I guess I'm just having a very hard time understanding these moves.

Like why bring in older and inferior players that are also more expensive to replace a guy like spaling??

maplepred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-11-2013, 02:35 PM
  #50
triggrman
HFBoards Sponsor
 
triggrman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 17,951
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by maplepred View Post
I just think the main fact of what is annoying to me is that spaling may get pushed out of town for at least two guys (Hendricks and nystrom) that he is a better player than both and will get less money for us against the cap. And then when goose gets hurt again, than what?
We have no spaling or goose, but we have Hendricks and nystrom?! Lol.

Someone said spaling type is a dime a dozen in this thread, well if that's the case then nystrom and Hendricks are a nickel a dozen, we just overpaid for some weird reason.

Point being, spaling has more value for less money, fans like him, I would prefer him to stay here rather than older less talented guys that make more money.
You keep throwing that out there. Nystrom and Hendricsk are 4th light weight fighters, agitating checking line forwards, Hendricks is also a shoot-out specialist as well. 14 fights between the 2.

They were brought in to physically pound on the opponents and bring energy to the team. Spaling does not do any of that.

triggrman is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:44 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.