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Who have been our top 2 DMEN so far?? (Vote 2)

View Poll Results: Top 2 Dmen so far? (VOTE 2)
ROZSIVAL 10 9.52%
WARD 71 67.62%
KASPARAITIS 8 7.62%
POCK 32 30.48%
TYUTIN 72 68.57%
RACHUNEK 6 5.71%
MALIK 2 1.90%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 105. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
10-26-2006, 01:28 PM
  #26
Fletch
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Mugerya...

here's my case for Malik and Rozsival playing over Pock: it's simple - I personally wouldn't want to see Pock out there more than 13-15 minutes per night, and I personally would not want to see Pock out there against top 6 forwards. The few times he was out there, it was ugly. He can be on a third pair, but if you play him over Rozsival over Malik, then you have someone else out of position and wonder why someone isn't playing over them. Point is, nobody on this team should be going against top lines, but somebody has to. Malik and Rozsival would look excellent going against bottom six forwards - I'd guarantee they'd look leagues better than Pock doing the same. That is what I believe to be one of this team's biggest problems - lacking guys who should be going against top lines (forwards and defensemen).

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Old
10-26-2006, 06:37 PM
  #27
DutchShamrock
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Originally Posted by HockeyBasedNYC View Post
and Renney Sitting Ozolinsh in fear of the Ranger fans getting to him is precisely whats wrong with this tema right now, instead of facing adversity they run away from it.

Instead of hitting back they let it go, instead of sticking up for their teammates they skate away.

I dont care if Renney wanted to "Assess" the defensman before the trip. Ozolinsh shouldve been in regardless of what boos wouldve came down. And Pock better be put out there instead of Rachunek now. Cmon.
And what a brilliant move to sit Ozolinsh, because right now Malik isn't being showered with the boo-birds.

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Old
10-26-2006, 06:44 PM
  #28
DutchShamrock
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
here's my case for Malik and Rozsival playing over Pock: it's simple - I personally wouldn't want to see Pock out there more than 13-15 minutes per night, and I personally would not want to see Pock out there against top 6 forwards. The few times he was out there, it was ugly. He can be on a third pair, but if you play him over Rozsival over Malik, then you have someone else out of position and wonder why someone isn't playing over them. Point is, nobody on this team should be going against top lines, but somebody has to. Malik and Rozsival would look excellent going against bottom six forwards - I'd guarantee they'd look leagues better than Pock doing the same. That is what I believe to be one of this team's biggest problems - lacking guys who should be going against top lines (forwards and defensemen).
You're not wrong, but Pock does not deserve to sit right now. Malik certainly does. Roszival is building a case to sit as well. And it wouldn't be Pock on the 1st pairing. Maybe Toots and Ward?

I'll fall back on my philosophy which I know many don't agree with: The kids won't get any better unless you play them. If you protect them from the possibility of failure they will never have a chance to succeed. The thing that killed this team during the run of 7 was the fact that management would go with the Karpas and Ulanovs and Messier for 20 minutes a night because they had no one else to go to. Of course they would never even try the kids, but they just knew that the kids couldn't do it. If a guy should sit, sit him. Period. Forget about his status on the team or who will take his place. Sit him.

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Old
10-26-2006, 07:07 PM
  #29
Edge
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Went with Tyutin and Ward, though I nearly went with Tyutin and Roszival.

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Old
10-26-2006, 07:09 PM
  #30
Plato
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tyutin and ward

no1 else vote for tyutin cuz ittl be so cool if he has 51 votes

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Old
10-26-2006, 08:09 PM
  #31
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Not much of a choice. Where's the "They've all stunk up the joint" option. Thats my choice.

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Old
10-26-2006, 08:48 PM
  #32
Finest
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Toots and A.Ward no question.

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Old
10-26-2006, 09:28 PM
  #33
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Tyutin has been better the last week or so but he was just as terrible as anyone until then. It's amazing how Tyutin gets a free ride around here compared to the other players. If there was a vote for all terrible I would have voted that way, but since there isn't i'm not voting at all.

Ward I am disapointed with also. Maybe it was just ignorance on my part, but I really thought he had way more of a physical game than what he has shown so far. He is also another player who has been making plenty of mistakes. I don't see how anyone can vote for any of these guys at this point.

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Old
10-26-2006, 09:37 PM
  #34
Edge
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I do think a lot of people had the wrong idea about Ward.

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Old
10-27-2006, 09:25 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Edge View Post
I do think a lot of people had the wrong idea about Ward.
It's not that they had the wrong idea, it's that it is the same thing as the dark 7 years. Putting a player into a position that he should not be put into. On a good team, with lots of support and an good #3 defenseman, Ward (like Rozsival) could be a #4 defenseman. The problem is that when your defensive corp consists of nothing but #4-7 defensemen, he is going to be more exposed.

People watched the playoffs and the Cup and presumed that he is coming here to be the "shut-down" defenseman, which he is not. He is a good core and support guy, but not the one upon whom you rely to go out and shut down top offensive players. I guess looking at it that way, people did have the wrong idea.

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Old
10-27-2006, 12:15 PM
  #36
McRanger
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Originally Posted by Edge View Post
I do think a lot of people had the wrong idea about Ward.
Most casual fans I talked to didnt even know who Ward was when we signed him. Most of the bigger fans, as well as most of us on the board, recognized the move for what it was: adding a small piece to the puzzle while avoiding the big names and the big contracts.

I think Wards situation is light years away from, for example, Kasparitis, who was not only a "name" but was incorrectly labeled as a top defensive defenseman before he got here.

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Old
10-27-2006, 12:53 PM
  #37
Edge
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I disagree.

Looking at the board when it was signing and even many of the comments made since. People thought Ward was a shut down defenseman and more physical.

While the more knowledgeable fans knew otherwise, I think the surprising majority really thought they were getting something else (and to a lesser extent with Cullen).

The reality is that Ward is a steady #4 guy and that Cullen is ideally a #3 center playing behind two better centers.

But instead we got projections of 30-35 goals for Cullen and that Ward was that shutdown guy we needed. And not just from one or two people but a snowball.

Obviously there are people who didn't, but (as has happened a million times before) when something doesn't work to the extrordinary levels people project they magically start to disappear and pipe down and it starts getting spun into something else where "Well that's not really what I said", etc.

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Old
10-27-2006, 09:02 PM
  #38
Fletch
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Edge..

I think people got trapped because of the way he was billed. He had a very good playoffs, and perhaps was the 'Canes' best defensive defenseman, and he averaged the most minutes. So often you see guys go out and sign role players from Championship teams because of a good series. Ward was one of those guys. As with so many Rangers defensemen, he is a 2/3 pair defenseman. He's not a top shut-down guy by any means and playing that role is misplaying him. [I think we're in agreement, but I thought I'd bring another angle that bothered me when he was signed - bothered me in the sense of expectation vs. reality (reality not being bad by any means)]

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Old
10-27-2006, 09:16 PM
  #39
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Ward was a no question in my mind, the other I debated between Kasparaitis and Tyutin... I wound up going with Kasparaitis.

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