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07-09-2013, 01:27 PM
  #1
bootscraper
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AV-System Thread

Haven't seen too much talk about AV's system. Ultimately, we're going to have to wait and see. But I wanted to get other opinions about what we will see. Also, I wanted to get an idea of what everyone else would like to see in the new system.

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07-09-2013, 01:32 PM
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Barbara Underhill
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Contrary to popular belief he's still a defensive minded coach. I expect to see more of the same, with a little more leeway offensively and better offensive zone time.

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07-09-2013, 01:34 PM
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KingWantsCup
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Rumor has it that he actually preaches real defense first (not shot blocking to oblivion) and that he's good with letting his offensive players do their thing.

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07-09-2013, 01:42 PM
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jacko23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingWantsCup View Post
Rumor has it that he actually preaches real defense first (not shot blocking to oblivion) and that he's good with letting his offensive players do their thing.
as long as "Torts hockey" isnt the fallback plan. cos when our last coach came in, "safe is death" was the mantra. then it became "Torts hockey"

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07-09-2013, 01:58 PM
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SupersonicMonkey*
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1- Emphasis on the defense as an offensive weapon. Using the points to reset in the offensive zone. Using the defense as a second wave on the attack. Players like McDonagh, Moore, and Stralman used to join and lead the attack because of their skating.

2- Quicker transitions and more effective breakouts.

3- Better man to man defensive zone coverage. Tortorella left the point exposed and the opposition and its defenders took advantage.

4- More consistent forecheck.

5- More emphasis on puck possession.

6- Zone starts. Offensive guys like Stepan, Brassard, Nash, Richards will start more shifts in the offensive zone. Whereas guys like Moore and Boyle (if he isn't traded) will start more of their shifts in the defensive zone.

7- More aggressive neutral zone play.

The nuances we will have to wait and see. But in a broad sense, I'd expect to see those things follow Vigneault.

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07-09-2013, 02:50 PM
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Blue Seat Spartan
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Key questions in determining AV's system of play for the New York Rangers:

1. Forecheck - Keep Tortorella's 2-1-2, adapt a flexible 1-1-3/1-2-2 (delayed forecheck/hybrid forecheck, respectively), or a full-blown 1-4 trap (see Julien's Bruins in the semis)? And will the defensemen be encouraged to pinch to sustain the forecheck?

2. Defensive zone coverage - Will there be more adaptations deviating away from the "Five-in-the-Picture"/"Five-Goalie-System" (Collapsing Box) such as man-to-man pressure of the points, or overloading towards the boards?

3. Breakouts and transition - Will we see more movement (Criss-cross and/or Regroup of skaters) exiting the zone instead of always stretch passing and then chip 'n chase in the offensive zone?

4. Establishing puck possession - Who gets the majority of the important faceoff draws (Richards & Brassard in the offensive zone, Stepan & Moore in the defensive zone)

(I stumbled upon this site recently, and this provides a chock-full of common hockey strategies while shining a light on the coaching arcana that the fans tend to overlook: http://www.blueseatblogs.com/hockey-systems/)

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07-09-2013, 03:01 PM
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stan the caddy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Seat Spartan View Post
Key questions in determining AV's system of play for the New York Rangers:

1. Forecheck - Keep Tortorella's 2-1-2, adapt a flexible 1-1-3/1-2-2 (delayed forecheck/hybrid forecheck, respectively), or a full-blown 1-4 trap (see Julien's Bruins in the semis)? And will the defensemen be encouraged to pinch to sustain the forecheck?

2. Defensive zone coverage - Will there be more adaptations deviating away from the "Five-in-the-Picture"/"Five-Goalie-System" (Collapsing Box) such as man-to-man pressure of the points, or overloading towards the boards?

3. Breakouts and transition - Will we see more movement (Criss-cross and/or Regroup of skaters) exiting the zone instead of always stretch passing and then chip 'n chase in the offensive zone?

4. Establishing puck possession - Who gets the majority of the important faceoff draws (Richards & Brassard in the offensive zone, Stepan & Moore in the defensive zone)

(I stumbled upon this site recently, and this provides a chock-full of common hockey strategies while shining a light on the coaching arcana that the fans tend to overlook: http://www.blueseatblogs.com/hockey-systems/)
That's a good blog. I like this part:

Quote:
The defensive zone is where things get a little muddled when it comes to labeling a team. Up until a few year years ago, trapping teams were really the only teams who collapsed in front of their net and blocked shots. More aggressive teams sent two forwards towards the blueline, playing man-on-man coverage, or would let one forward cherry-pick in the neutral zone.

Times have changed and defensive zone play has gotten more sophisticated. In today’s NHL, more and more teams are collapsing to the net and blocking shots regardless of their overall forechecking strategy. Point in case, during the 2001-02 season 10 teams blocked over a 1,000 shots. Last season all but two teams blocked over 1,000 shots.

The media likes to use this strategy and blame it for stifling offensive ability, but the reality is a number of high scoring teams play the low zone collapse. The Capitals, Blackhawks, Bruins, and Penguins have all used this strategy in recent seasons and they have no problems scoring goals.

There are other defensive zone strategies, such as the overload, man-on-man, etc., but the low zone collapse is probably one of the more employed strategies in the NHL. The Rangers mostly use the low zone collapse, but will overload on occasion depending on certain game situations.

Overall, there’s a lot of misinformation out there about Torts’ systems. Some of it is because the media just doesn’t get a lot of this stuff. Some of it is because the media has such a bad relationship with John, they make no effort to understand and defend his tactics. That’s what we’re here for folks.

For more on hockey systems, be sure to check out my entire series here.
In contrast to the notion that Tortorella was so behind the times.

Major difference is going to be the offensive zone faceoffs. Top 6 will thrive, bottom six will struggle to score.

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07-09-2013, 03:09 PM
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Really looking forward to watching the team play real defense rather than relying of 6 feet of human mass laying on the ice to stop the opposition from scoring

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07-09-2013, 04:25 PM
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as long as the PP improves, and we win.......all is good!

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07-11-2013, 02:35 PM
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Blue Seat Spartan
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In bumping this thread, let's consider what the Rangers' strengths are regarding personnel in regards to formulating a system tailored to their strengths:
  1. Goaltending - Lundqvist, Vezina-winner, all-world talent, 'nuff said
  2. Defense - not physical, except possibly for McIlrath. Quite mobile, though.
  3. Forwards - speed on the flanks with Hagelin & Kreider, crafty centers with Richards, Brassard, Stepan. Goal-scorer in Nash. Grit, leadership, and versatility in Callahan.

Certainly the Rangers have the horses to run a 2-1-2 forecheck we saw under John Tortorella. Of course, the big question is: what do they do once they regain possession of the puck? Cycling behind the net until the end of time? Will the Rangers trap (1-2-2/1-3-1/1-4) if they have the lead? Where and when do the Rangers apply pressure against the opposition? Can the Rangers create offense on rushes off transition? You have to consider the listed factors beforehand.

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07-11-2013, 02:40 PM
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Kel Varnsen
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We'll have to wait to see some of the specifics, but you can bet we'll never see Nash enter the defensive zone ever again.

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07-11-2013, 02:46 PM
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We'll have to wait to see some of the specifics, but you can bet we'll never see Nash enter the defensive zone ever again.
that's a good thing

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07-11-2013, 02:52 PM
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bootscraper
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I definitely want to see better use of our defense in offensive situations. Hell, anything would be an improvement to skating backwards and sending 50 mph wrist shots towards net. Or the opposing forward blocking them sending it out of the zone. Or the wristers not even hitting the net...

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07-11-2013, 03:05 PM
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PurpleHayes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bootscraper View Post
I definitely want to see better use of our defense in offensive situations. Hell, anything would be an improvement to skating backwards and sending 50 mph wrist shots towards net. Or the opposing forward blocking them sending it out of the zone. Or the wristers not even hitting the net...
im hoping everytime a point man shoots I wont have to hear sam say shot wide or blocked!

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07-11-2013, 03:10 PM
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bootscraper
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Can't tell you how many times I've wanted to throw something at the T.V. because of it.

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07-12-2013, 12:28 AM
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BwayBshirt
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I echo the sentiments regarding the D.

I think between AV & Ulf, I would think the competency level of our D-men handling the puck in the offensive zone can only go up.

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09-28-2013, 11:47 PM
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Blue Seat Spartan
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Decided to dredge up this thread after watching the recent slate of pre-season games...

I definitely see Alain Vigneault's system for the Rangers taking shape:

Forechecking & Offensive Zone - Whereas Torts emphasized a hard 2-1-2, AV is implementing an intermediate 1-2-2 scheme set up between the faceoff dots to the top of the circles, pressuring when the opportunity arises. More notable is the difference in the philosophy of defensemen pinching into the zone; it was a given in Torts' system that the D help to sustain offensive pressure (but God help you if you make a mistake while pinching at the point...). AV has promised to let his defensemen jump into the play, although this is predicated upon the forwards establishing puck possession on zone entries.

Neutral Zone - Torts' M.O.? Hard on the puck in the offensive zone, just as HARD on the backcheck when play transitions the other way. As for AV, it's all about positioning, Positioning, POSITIONING (Neutral zone trap, anyone? Something that hasn't been seen since the Renney era...). Why let your key forwards become gassed after shift upon shift of hustling back towards the play? Economy of energy, my friend. Prudence, patience, and did I mention positioning? I'm sure Hags & Cally - along with kids Hrivik and Lindberg - will have a field day herding opponent puck movers towards the boards or into the ever-loving clutches of Staal, McDonagh, J. Moore (...and Girardi).

Defensive zone coverage - Hallelujah! No more collapsing box + 1 ad nauseam and inadvertently creating a shooting gallery for opposing point men like Krug or Zdeno Chara! Then again, AV just might have the mental agility to have the Rangers adjust their zone coverage in relation to puck location and disrupt the foes' cycling and board play. I'm certainly hopeful that the Rangers forwards will be encouraged to pressure the points and defuse the booming howitzers before they are ever fully unleashed on Hank. And as a bonus, we fans in the Blue Seats might be treated to a few more transitional odd-man rushes on an improved MSG ice surface...

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09-29-2013, 10:09 AM
  #18
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Been on the boards, but not here so much lately. That blog is a wealth of information, thanks for posting it!

I'm heading over with coffee in hand.

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