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Joe McDonnell leaving for Dallas, Wings to promote Jeff Finley and David Kolb

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Old
07-12-2013, 12:12 AM
  #151
ChadS
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So they hired Wright as dir. of amateur scouting and promoted Finley to head scout as well as signed Andrew Dickson(ex-CBJ, lives in Ottawa), Sam Lites (College) and Kelly Harper (part-time, lives in Toronto).

http://www.freep.com/article/2013071...and-new-scouts

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07-12-2013, 08:23 AM
  #152
InjuredChoker
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Aaron Portzline ‏@Aportzline 26 min
As noted a year or so ago, Tyler Wright and #RedWings GM Ken Holland have cottages on the same lake, have had many late-night discussions.

Aaron Portzline ‏@Aportzline 10. kesäkuuta 12
#RedWings GM Ken Holland, in turn, said this of Tyler Wright: "I consider Tyler one of my real good friends in the sport of hockey."

Aaron Portzline ‏@Aportzline 10. kesäkuuta 12
Wright credited #RedWings GM Ken Holland, his neighbor on Lake Kalamalka, with helping him early in his NHL post-playing career.


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07-12-2013, 09:14 AM
  #153
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Former Detroit Red Wings goaltender Chris Osgood lives next door, and he already had introduced Wright to a friend about a half-mile down the road — Red Wings general manager Ken Holland. The three had played golf together numerous times, Wright said, but that summer he started steering the conversation between strokes. “I picked (Holland’s) brain every time I was with him and I still do that,” Wright said. “We talked back then about his path, how he was a minor-league goaltender and worked his way up through the scouting ranks. “I’ve asked him many, many times how he would handle a certain situation because I know he’s been through it. His franchise is one of the most successful in the history of sport, so I’d be foolish not to take advantage of that. “We speak in generalities sometimes — I mean, c’mon, our teams are in the same division, right? — but he’s been very helpful.”
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From mid-July to mid-August, Holland said, it’s not uncommon to find him, Wright and Osgood gathered on one of their back decks, talking hockey and looking out across the lake.
“Tyler’s a sponge,” Holland said. “He’s young. He’s learning. I always thought he’d be a tremendous addition to somebody’s staff.
“To me, he’s sort of like Pat Verbeek (former Red Wing, now assistant general manager in Tampa Bay). Very similar kind of players. They had to work for everything they’ve gotten, and that carries over after they’re done playing, too.”
From last year, before the draft.

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07-13-2013, 10:07 PM
  #154
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uhg really not comfortable with anyone from the cbj organization.

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07-14-2013, 02:20 AM
  #155
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Columbus is historically abysmal at drafting. Very apprehensive about this. The Blue Jackets didn't even want him anymore.

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07-14-2013, 08:55 AM
  #156
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CBJ has been awful at drafting. Scary move.

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07-14-2013, 09:29 AM
  #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChadS View Post
Sam Lites (College)
Son of Jim Lites... trojan horse for Dallas organization ?

...or is Denice Ilitch Sam's mother?

When did they divorce (Jim Lites and Denise Ilich) ?

Sam is 22-years old, so he was born 1991, made 1990... Jim Lites jumped to Dallas at 1993 at first time from Red Wings management.

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Originally Posted by The Nose View Post
CBJ has been awful at drafting. Scary move.
Tyler Wright has operated in three latest drafts... we really don't have any clue yet are those good or bad drafts.

Didn't Holland say that 50% of great drafting comes from player development? That's what been sucking for the Blue Jackets.

Also different draft tactics will effect in drafting results. If Wings plan is to draft pure potential and develop it, Columbus could have had different plan. Getting players that are more mature, because they have had that kind of need. That could lead to bad results, like we have seen. Guys brought up too early, that stalls development.


Last edited by Henkka: 07-14-2013 at 09:38 AM.
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07-14-2013, 09:49 AM
  #158
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It's not that Columbus players are rushed... (Brule is the probably the one guy it hurt, and a guy like him was going to get hurt either way) ... it's that they play for crappy teams with no stability and, usually, no system"

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07-14-2013, 10:05 AM
  #159
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Originally Posted by InjuredChoker View Post
I worry that he got hired more because he's buddy-buddy with osgood, than because he is a good scout. His resume doesn't seem that impressive and he was stripped of his duties, or about to be, from CBJ. Most fans on that board think he was doing a less than stellar job.

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07-14-2013, 10:05 AM
  #160
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If you look at CBJs latest 3 drafts, and exclude first rounders before pick #20, there's a few good picks IMO.

2013: 27th overall Marko Dano (great pick imo, will be in the Tatar, Jurco, Panik mold when it's all said and done IMO)

2012: 31st overall Oscar Dansk (Even though i'm not a fan of picking goalies this early, Dansk has the potential to become a no.1 goalie or a very good back-up, will be sweden's goalie at the World junior tournament)

2011: 37th overall Boone Jenner (great 200ft player that is tough to play against and that all teams' need in their lineup)


It's hard to tell about their later rounds because those are hard to judge, although there's isn't a sleeper in the later rounds like Detroit when they got Pulkkinen and Tvrdon in the 4th rounds (in large parts because they were injured a lot during their draft years), they could also turn out solid, who knows.

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07-14-2013, 10:42 AM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mindfly View Post
If you look at CBJs latest 3 drafts, and exclude first rounders before pick #20, there's a few good picks IMO.

2013: 27th overall Marko Dano (great pick imo, will be in the Tatar, Jurco, Panik mold when it's all said and done IMO)

2012: 31st overall Oscar Dansk (Even though i'm not a fan of picking goalies this early, Dansk has the potential to become a no.1 goalie or a very good back-up, will be sweden's goalie at the World junior tournament)

2011: 37th overall Boone Jenner (great 200ft player that is tough to play against and that all teams' need in their lineup)


It's hard to tell about their later rounds because those are hard to judge, although there's isn't a sleeper in the later rounds like Detroit when they got Pulkkinen and Tvrdon in the 4th rounds (in large parts because they were injured a lot during their draft years), they could also turn out solid, who knows.
Anderson (4th rnd 12) and Curcuruto (7th rnd 11) are looking pretty good as of now.

Jenner could make the Jackets team next year, was one of the best two way C's in OHL the past year. 4th rounder was on USA gold medal winning WJC team. Forsberg, 7th rounder in 11, is looking good too.

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07-14-2013, 10:55 AM
  #162
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Not every player drafted by a team has a direct line to the scout that said "pick this guy". So an organizations draft as a whole cannot be put on just one scout.

I would wait a few years before getting upset at these additions, lets see how they do at an actual draft for the Wings first. Who knows, they might get in Hollands ear and tell him to make some better moves(or moves in general).

One thing I don't like is the fact that Wright and Holland are buddy-buddy in the offseason at their little lake. Kinda hard to fire your neighbor.

One other note; I wish they would have moved Holland up in the org. and promoted Nill.

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07-14-2013, 11:09 AM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Vatican Roulette View Post
One thing I don't like is the fact that Wright and Holland are buddy-buddy in the offseason at their little lake. Kinda hard to fire your neighbor.

One other note; I wish they would have moved Holland up in the org. and promoted Nill.
Yeah, on the one hand it is good the organization is as tight as it's been. I think that really can be a big positive when it comes to drafting and player development. On the other I couldn't agree more about Holland moving up in Jimmy Devellano fashion and promoting Nill to GM. Things could get a little too buddy-buddy and if things turn south you are more likely to dig in your heels and commit as a group to turning it around. That could simply dig you further into a hole.

I am not going to freak out about any of the scouting additions as it will be tough to judge their drafts for a good 3-5 years. With that being said Nill has more than proven himself and I would have liked to see how he would have done as GM in Detroit.

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07-14-2013, 09:14 PM
  #164
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Maybe it's not their drafting, maybe it's their development.

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07-14-2013, 11:31 PM
  #165
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Maybe it's not their drafting, maybe it's their development.
Aside from that, too, I think it's worthwhile to point out that a director of scouting still uses his scouts. So we're looking more at a situation where Wright is working with the existing scouting infrastructure and listening to the scouts already here. I don't think we're looking at a scenario where Detroit scouts say "we should take player X!" and Wright says "Hell no! We're taking player Y."

The other thing too is it's difficult to see exactly how his performance was. It's probably reasonable to say that Wright wasn't great at player development when he was at that job, but that's not his job anymore. By my lights, Columbus has 3 pretty decent drafts when he was there. But that could be because of their other scouts.

I also don't put a ton of stock in the fact that Jarmo fired him, because GMs often want to put their own spin on something so important as the draft (if you think about it, Nill did the same thing), and also because Jarmo is such a draft nut himself. I think it's possible that he was a pretty good scouting director and still got fired.

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07-16-2013, 07:04 AM
  #166
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Bruins fired their head scout too.

Wouldn't mind to see him here, with Wright.

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07-16-2013, 07:20 AM
  #167
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Originally Posted by InjuredChoker View Post
Anderson (4th rnd 12) and Curcuruto (7th rnd 11) are looking pretty good as of now.

Jenner could make the Jackets team next year, was one of the best two way C's in OHL the past year. 4th rounder was on USA gold medal winning WJC team. Forsberg, 7th rounder in 11, is looking good too.
Round 3 #39 Oliver Bjorkstrand

that guy too might be a surprise in the draft !

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07-16-2013, 07:22 AM
  #168
Henkka
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Originally Posted by InjuredChoker View Post
Bruins fired their head scout too.

Wouldn't mind to see him here, with Wright.
Looks like Wayne Smith is a great scout but not the best director.

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Changes such as this one are rarely made unless there is a good reason, though. Word among people in the scouting community is that Smith, who has a long history of scouting both in the Ontario League and the NHL, is a very good evaluator of talent and a hard worker, but is more suited to be a regional scout than someone running a scouting department with a multi-million dollar budget and scouts all over the world. (A phone call and email to Smith were not immediately returned.
Would be a good recruitment as a normal scout.

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07-16-2013, 10:29 AM
  #169
InjuredChoker
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Looks like Wayne Smith is a great scout but not the best director.


Would be a good recruitment as a normal scout.
Which is why he could work well as combo with Wright.

Or as a regular scout.

As he became head scout in 2007 it seems. And the only player they have gotten in NHL since is Tyler Sequin. And it's kind of hard to fail at #2.

Hamill was big bust at #8.

Colborne has some potential but he is with Leafs now.

Caron has had some up and downs, 1st rounder in '09. I though he played solid in 12 for them down the stretch in games I saw but haven't followed him closely. But I think Bruins fans won't have big hopes on him.

Knight and Spooner from 10' drafts, potential there. Maybe in Cunningham, numbers aren't bad but not really good either.

Koko seems like good pick, 11' second rounder. As well as AA2's teammate Camara, 3rd rounder from same year.

Last year's 5th rounder, Seth Griffith has had some solid numbers but he was drafted as an overager.

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07-16-2013, 10:51 AM
  #170
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Originally Posted by InjuredChoker View Post
Which is why he could work well as combo with Wright.

Or as a regular scout.

As he became head scout in 2007 it seems. And the only player they have gotten in NHL since is Tyler Sequin. .
How many Red Wings have established themselves since then?

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07-16-2013, 11:01 AM
  #171
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Originally Posted by RedWingsNow View Post
How many Red Wings have established themselves since then?
Established in the NHL? Not sure, depends on your definition. But there's 4 that look like NHL players.

Nyquist
Andersson
Smith
Tatar

And a couple more that look like sure fire NHL guys.

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07-16-2013, 11:16 AM
  #172
InjuredChoker
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How many Red Wings have established themselves since then?
Well, that depends on definition.

Smith, Andy, Nyquist, Tatar. Imo Tatar is about as close as one can get but he's still had such a small number of games that he doesn't count. And as one season, esp. shortened, can count as an outlier to one direction or an other, guess Smith, Andy and Nyquist aren't either though they are all more than likely with the big club in fall.

But Bruins got higher picks during that time period, #8 and #16 in 07 and 08, respectively.

If Wings were at 16 in 08, I think Andersson would have want to go hard after Karlsson. Though he was taken at 15 by Sens but maybe Häkan could have persuaded Holland to move up a bit to take him for sure (lol, yeah right).

And I think even without bias, Wings cup board is better than Bruins on prospect department.

I wasn't really pointing that out as a negative against Smith, it was just mentioned as one of the reason he was canned, maybe the main reason.

But drafting isn't exact science, lot of luck is involved, for good and bad. As having seen Nucks draft board, I think they had Mrazek, Järnkrok and Pulks and Marchenko higher than were Wings picked them (though they might have been even higher on Wings list, who knows).

But Smith comes from good organization and wouldn't mind a guy like him at all.

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