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Old
07-13-2013, 08:38 PM
  #251
Calderone
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Originally Posted by Akanon View Post
Thank you for the video. Exciting to see Hagg and Morin, I thought they both looked good.

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07-13-2013, 08:45 PM
  #252
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a sizeable point that hasn't been mentioned is how well Hagg keeps his head up with puck possession (opposed to Morin anyways). I think they both look great though. You can definitely see the difference in poise at this stage of development.

It'll be nice to have an interesting WJC tournament again.

**chuckles that Laughton wasnt invited to Canadian camp last season...**


Last edited by tymed: 07-13-2013 at 08:51 PM.
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07-13-2013, 08:53 PM
  #253
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Originally Posted by PALE PWNR View Post
Morins wrist shot looked atrocious in that video. Just simply skating up and ripping a wrist shot at the top of the circle is not an awkward position to shoot. But its not on target at all and looks like it has no power. The only redeeming quality is he kept it low which I'm not sure was intentional.
The last thing I would worry about with Morin is his shot. Even if you say it's weak now (which it isn't), with his leverage, and added strength, it will be a weapon. How many tall defenseman don't have big shots? Coburn? There's a reason Chara wins the hardest shot every year. He's got leverage that no one else does. Accuracy is another thing, but he seems like a good enough athlete, with enough coordination to be good in that department with time.

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07-13-2013, 10:15 PM
  #254
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Originally Posted by tymed View Post
It'll be nice to have an interesting WJC tournament again.

**chuckles that Laughton wasnt invited to Canadian camp last season...**
Hindsight is 20/20, but when the final selection camp roster was announced, his accomplishments didn't merit him being selected. 21 points in 22 games isn't getting you picked to the Canadian WJC squad, no matter how good your intangibles are.

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07-13-2013, 10:31 PM
  #255
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Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
Hindsight is 20/20, but when the final selection camp roster was announced, his accomplishments didn't merit him being selected. 21 points in 22 games isn't getting you picked to the Canadian WJC squad, no matter how good your intangibles are.
The suspension leading up didn't help either.

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07-13-2013, 10:44 PM
  #256
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Cool video.......music please? Ain't Napalm Death or Opeth.......;-)))

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07-14-2013, 05:52 PM
  #257
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Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
Hindsight is 20/20, but when the final selection camp roster was announced, his accomplishments didn't merit him being selected. 21 points in 22 games isn't getting you picked to the Canadian WJC squad, no matter how good your intangibles are.
Back when we were winning golds it was actually because we were picking the team based on roles as opposed to now trying to jam 9-12 point scorers onto a roster... im not sure why Canadian selection took that turn. I thought he should have been invited to camp at the time so the hindsight doesnt much apply here to me. There used to be spots on the 4th for 2-way, energy ,lead by example type players. 21 in 22 isn't too great but you're wrong, intangibles are what make up a bottom 9 or 12 role. Atleast history makes that suggestion.

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07-14-2013, 06:44 PM
  #258
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Habs fan here with 2 things:

Big QMJHL fan that sees A LOT of Q games live, on TV and Web. And let me say a couple of things about 2 players you've mentioned.

Petr Straka: I remember that I didn't want the Habs to pick him. Not because he wasn't offensively talented but just because I didn't felt he never was that committed to play an overall game or even go as far as understanding the part of the game where you don't have the puck. I have to be honest though and say that since then, he improved. A LOT. But to suggest that despite what you see in a dev. camp where the main thing you see is his insane offensive skills, he has a shot at a starting NHL lineup is not wise. You have to give him a full year in the AHL. It won't hurt him, WILL clearly helped him and your organization down the road.

Samuel Morin: As far as Morin is concerned, was clearly amongst the ones who improved the most as the season progresses. And frankly, as a scout (I'm not one...just a guy who thinks he could do the job...), progression is one of the most important thing. But then people started to talk about his offensive game? Don't think that he'll ever has one in the higher level. At best, don't know if you see what Tinordi is doing with us when he played, you will see him sometimes pinch and have a shot on net. Will most definately have a great first pass and all....but he's not going to lead your PP. And yes, his wrister has to be worked on such as his overall agility. But I have no dbout that you've got a good one on your hands. Only thing needed for him to know is where is his ceiling.

That's all. P.S. On another note...you guys got 2 of my favorite prospects. Scott Laughton who I think will be a stud and top 6 player. And Robert Hagg.

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07-14-2013, 08:35 PM
  #259
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Habs fan here with 2 things:

Big QMJHL fan that sees A LOT of Q games live, on TV and Web. And let me say a couple of things about 2 players you've mentioned.

Petr Straka: I remember that I didn't want the Habs to pick him. Not because he wasn't offensively talented but just because I didn't felt he never was that committed to play an overall game or even go as far as understanding the part of the game where you don't have the puck. I have to be honest though and say that since then, he improved. A LOT. But to suggest that despite what you see in a dev. camp where the main thing you see is his insane offensive skills, he has a shot at a starting NHL lineup is not wise. You have to give him a full year in the AHL. It won't hurt him, WILL clearly helped him and your organization down the road.

Samuel Morin: As far as Morin is concerned, was clearly amongst the ones who improved the most as the season progresses. And frankly, as a scout (I'm not one...just a guy who thinks he could do the job...), progression is one of the most important thing. But then people started to talk about his offensive game? Don't think that he'll ever has one in the higher level. At best, don't know if you see what Tinordi is doing with us when he played, you will see him sometimes pinch and have a shot on net. Will most definately have a great first pass and all....but he's not going to lead your PP. And yes, his wrister has to be worked on such as his overall agility. But I have no dbout that you've got a good one on your hands. Only thing needed for him to know is where is his ceiling.

That's all. P.S. On another note...you guys got 2 of my favorite prospects. Scott Laughton who I think will be a stud and top 6 player. And Robert Hagg.
Thanks for sharing, much appreciated.

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07-14-2013, 10:12 PM
  #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Habs fan here with 2 things:

Big QMJHL fan that sees A LOT of Q games live, on TV and Web. And let me say a couple of things about 2 players you've mentioned.

Petr Straka: I remember that I didn't want the Habs to pick him. Not because he wasn't offensively talented but just because I didn't felt he never was that committed to play an overall game or even go as far as understanding the part of the game where you don't have the puck. I have to be honest though and say that since then, he improved. A LOT. But to suggest that despite what you see in a dev. camp where the main thing you see is his insane offensive skills, he has a shot at a starting NHL lineup is not wise. You have to give him a full year in the AHL. It won't hurt him, WILL clearly helped him and your organization down the road.

Samuel Morin: As far as Morin is concerned, was clearly amongst the ones who improved the most as the season progresses. And frankly, as a scout (I'm not one...just a guy who thinks he could do the job...), progression is one of the most important thing. But then people started to talk about his offensive game? Don't think that he'll ever has one in the higher level. At best, don't know if you see what Tinordi is doing with us when he played, you will see him sometimes pinch and have a shot on net. Will most definately have a great first pass and all....but he's not going to lead your PP. And yes, his wrister has to be worked on such as his overall agility. But I have no dbout that you've got a good one on your hands. Only thing needed for him to know is where is his ceiling.

That's all. P.S. On another note...you guys got 2 of my favorite prospects. Scott Laughton who I think will be a stud and top 6 player. And Robert Hagg.
Thanks!

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Old
07-15-2013, 08:57 AM
  #261
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I don't think i've heard a single encouraging thing about Morin

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07-15-2013, 09:11 AM
  #262
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Originally Posted by kevindank View Post
I don't think i've heard a single encouraging thing about Morin
Morin is going to be a work in progress for while but no need to be concerned. Chara's offensive game didn't really develop until he was 25 years old. If he can come in a play great defense in 4 years, he will be worth the pick.

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07-15-2013, 09:18 AM
  #263
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Originally Posted by kevindank View Post
I don't think i've heard a single encouraging thing about Morin
He's one of the least NHL ready players from the first round, but he has some excellent physical tools. People need to relax because he's probably not going to be in the NHL for at least 3 years. If he can keep progressing though, he could be a potential steal at 11.

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07-15-2013, 09:40 AM
  #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Habs fan here with 2 things:

Big QMJHL fan that sees A LOT of Q games live, on TV and Web. And let me say a couple of things about 2 players you've mentioned.

Petr Straka: I remember that I didn't want the Habs to pick him. Not because he wasn't offensively talented but just because I didn't felt he never was that committed to play an overall game or even go as far as understanding the part of the game where you don't have the puck. I have to be honest though and say that since then, he improved. A LOT. But to suggest that despite what you see in a dev. camp where the main thing you see is his insane offensive skills, he has a shot at a starting NHL lineup is not wise. You have to give him a full year in the AHL. It won't hurt him, WILL clearly helped him and your organization down the road.

Samuel Morin: As far as Morin is concerned, was clearly amongst the ones who improved the most as the season progresses. And frankly, as a scout (I'm not one...just a guy who thinks he could do the job...), progression is one of the most important thing. But then people started to talk about his offensive game? Don't think that he'll ever has one in the higher level. At best, don't know if you see what Tinordi is doing with us when he played, you will see him sometimes pinch and have a shot on net. Will most definately have a great first pass and all....but he's not going to lead your PP. And yes, his wrister has to be worked on such as his overall agility. But I have no dbout that you've got a good one on your hands. Only thing needed for him to know is where is his ceiling.

That's all. P.S. On another note...you guys got 2 of my favorite prospects. Scott Laughton who I think will be a stud and top 6 player. And Robert Hagg.

Thanks, I may break balls about your team being small. But I have to admit I always was a fan of the Habs. Still have my Flower jersey from Doug Lauries shop in Toronto back in the day.

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07-15-2013, 09:41 AM
  #265
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Originally Posted by kevindank View Post
I don't think i've heard a single encouraging thing about Morin

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07-15-2013, 10:01 AM
  #266
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Originally Posted by kevindank View Post
I don't think i've heard a single encouraging thing about Morin
The encouraging things is that he has the size that he has, he has the qualities that he has and he can only improve. Honestly, the kid WILL play in the NHL. What remains to be seen is in what role. Big shutodwn d-men top 4. Or bottom 2 with some PK work. I would go with top 4, yet, closer to #4 than #1, that's for sure.

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07-15-2013, 10:03 AM
  #267
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Originally Posted by Hockeypete49 View Post
Thanks, I may break balls about your team being small. But I have to admit I always was a fan of the Habs. Still have my Flower jersey from Doug Lauries shop in Toronto back in the day.
Yep, well we are small. We have a lot of guts though, like Gallagher, Bouillon, Dumont or even Gionta. I do wish we'd be bigger and grittier, I guess it will come with time. While we did add Brière...and did trade for Christian Thomas, and do still have in our prospect pool smaller guys, it will be a work in progress in that department. I understand that concept of becoming bigger as a team. I do. But 1 on 1....I'd take Talbot WAY AHEAD of Moen right now.

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07-15-2013, 10:48 AM
  #268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevindank View Post
I don't think i've heard a single encouraging thing about Morin
I've read quite a few encouraging things about Morin. Big guy who can skate, has a mean streak and has great hockey smarts/IQ. Sees the game well, plays within his limits, but is also getting more and more confident in his size and ability. Once he puts on more weight and really gets comfortable playing at his size, his confidence should go through the roof. He's also very receptive to coaching and always wants to get better. Another thing that should be mentioned - work ethic is off the chart and is always watching videos with regards to his game.

I'm starting to notice a trend in all the Flyers picks that they've been making as of late. Every one of the kids they've drafted all seem to have great work ethics along with great hockey IQ. This is a hockey smart group of prospects that they've drafted and are developing. I have to admit, I like it. It's a great way to build a prospect base.

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07-15-2013, 11:28 AM
  #269
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Habs fan here with 2 things:

Big QMJHL fan that sees A LOT of Q games live, on TV and Web. And let me say a couple of things about 2 players you've mentioned.

Petr Straka: I remember that I didn't want the Habs to pick him. Not because he wasn't offensively talented but just because I didn't felt he never was that committed to play an overall game or even go as far as understanding the part of the game where you don't have the puck. I have to be honest though and say that since then, he improved. A LOT. But to suggest that despite what you see in a dev. camp where the main thing you see is his insane offensive skills, he has a shot at a starting NHL lineup is not wise. You have to give him a full year in the AHL. It won't hurt him, WILL clearly helped him and your organization down the road.

Samuel Morin: As far as Morin is concerned, was clearly amongst the ones who improved the most as the season progresses. And frankly, as a scout (I'm not one...just a guy who thinks he could do the job...), progression is one of the most important thing. But then people started to talk about his offensive game? Don't think that he'll ever has one in the higher level. At best, don't know if you see what Tinordi is doing with us when he played, you will see him sometimes pinch and have a shot on net. Will most definately have a great first pass and all....but he's not going to lead your PP. And yes, his wrister has to be worked on such as his overall agility. But I have no dbout that you've got a good one on your hands. Only thing needed for him to know is where is his ceiling.

That's all. P.S. On another note...you guys got 2 of my favorite prospects. Scott Laughton who I think will be a stud and top 6 player. And Robert Hagg.
Thanks.

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07-15-2013, 11:32 AM
  #270
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Originally Posted by kevindank View Post
I don't think i've heard a single encouraging thing about Morin
Besides, size of course, he has a pretty good hockey IQ. Hence the comparisons to Pronger.

Two things you can't teach.

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07-15-2013, 11:35 AM
  #271
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I'm not a big fan of the Morin pick, but there is plenty to like. First, size. Second, skating ability to pair with that size. Three, nasty. You cannot teach mean and nasty. You have it or you don't. Four, meteoric positive trend.... Outside the top 100 to start the season... in almost everyone's top 20 to end it.

I don't expect the offensive development he showed over the course of the season to sustain itself at its current pace, but even if he doesn't, he still has just about every attribute you'd want in a top tier shutdown defenseman prospect. To me, he has plenty of bust potential, but also is a very reasonable projection as a top 4 defender. Whether he becomes a top 2 will depend on the development of at least some offensive skills to a more refined level (first pass, shot, net front presence, etc).

I'm fine with Morin the player, but was just hoping for a bit better/safer player at 11. Please let me eat some crow Sam.

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07-15-2013, 11:57 AM
  #272
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
I've read quite a few encouraging things about Morin. Big guy who can skate, has a mean streak and has great hockey smarts/IQ. Sees the game well, plays within his limits, but is also getting more and more confident in his size and ability. Once he puts on more weight and really gets comfortable playing at his size, his confidence should go through the roof. He's also very receptive to coaching and always wants to get better. Another thing that should be mentioned - work ethic is off the chart and is always watching videos with regards to his game.

I'm starting to notice a trend in all the Flyers picks that they've been making as of late. Every one of the kids they've drafted all seem to have great work ethics along with great hockey IQ. This is a hockey smart group of prospects that they've drafted and are developing. I have to admit, I like it. It's a great way to build a prospect base.
I have also noticed the Flyers are swinging for the fences so to speak with higher ceiling players. You look at the drafts before and at the beginning of Holmgren's era: you had guys like Sbisa, Marshall, And Nodl; guys with limited tools and less question marks at their draft time. The last couple of drafts, it looks like the Flyers are going with potential. Stolarz and Morin are both boom or bust types and the guys they are picking later are athletic but raw players from lower competition leagues like Larsson, Willcox, and Amorosa. Yes you will have busts like Placek, but if one hits, it could hit big.

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07-15-2013, 12:13 PM
  #273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Habs fan here with 2 things:

Big QMJHL fan that sees A LOT of Q games live, on TV and Web. And let me say a couple of things about 2 players you've mentioned.

Petr Straka: I remember that I didn't want the Habs to pick him. Not because he wasn't offensively talented but just because I didn't felt he never was that committed to play an overall game or even go as far as understanding the part of the game where you don't have the puck. I have to be honest though and say that since then, he improved. A LOT. But to suggest that despite what you see in a dev. camp where the main thing you see is his insane offensive skills, he has a shot at a starting NHL lineup is not wise. You have to give him a full year in the AHL. It won't hurt him, WILL clearly helped him and your organization down the road.

Samuel Morin: As far as Morin is concerned, was clearly amongst the ones who improved the most as the season progresses. And frankly, as a scout (I'm not one...just a guy who thinks he could do the job...), progression is one of the most important thing. But then people started to talk about his offensive game? Don't think that he'll ever has one in the higher level. At best, don't know if you see what Tinordi is doing with us when he played, you will see him sometimes pinch and have a shot on net. Will most definately have a great first pass and all....but he's not going to lead your PP. And yes, his wrister has to be worked on such as his overall agility. But I have no dbout that you've got a good one on your hands. Only thing needed for him to know is where is his ceiling.

That's all. P.S. On another note...you guys got 2 of my favorite prospects. Scott Laughton who I think will be a stud and top 6 player. And Robert Hagg.
Thanks very much, Whitesnake. It's always great reading the perspective of someone who's had a chance to get some particular insight on a player or team.

Quote:
as a scout (I'm not one...just a guy who thinks he could do the job...)
I'm pretty confident that applies to about 90% of us on here.

On Morin, I've mellowed since my best impression of a 3-year-old when he was selected, since the guys I wanted were already taken. I want to stay realistic about his offensive potential, too: I'm hoping that he can routinely make a clean first pass, take a clear opportunity to skate the puck out of his zone without it looking like he's stickhandling a Mexican jumping bean, and fire a good hard shot from the point when he's on the ice during an offensive-zone foray. I don't see Morin being a PP option.

Plus, I get to see the Habs a lot, being a lifelong Montrealer. The size thing can get out of hand, especially with players like Gallagher and Bouillon, who play bigger than what the tape measure says. Tinordi will be an excellent addition to the blue line and he and Emelin should keep the opposition honest.

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07-15-2013, 01:17 PM
  #274
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Nice writeup, Whitesnake. Hopefully Morin won't have to QB the PP, because Hagg will already have the job.

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Originally Posted by kevindank View Post
I don't think i've heard a single encouraging thing about Morin
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Bill-...9#.UeQ5zFL6TlM
Quote:
In other words, I'd consider Morin a successful pick if he evolves into an intimidating shutdown defenseman. If he develops an offensive game at the NHL level, it would be a bonus. Predicting that he becomes a two-way force and NHL franchise player like Pronger is setting Morin up for failure.

Or is it? I asked a longtime NHL scout for a Western Conference team to give me his post-Draft thoughts on Morin. Was he a "reach" at the number 11 spot in the Draft? Who would be a good NHL comparison player at the same age -- is Luke Schenn a fair comparison?

Via email, I got this response: "Not a reach. The tools are all there to be a top guy. He needs to grow into his frame and gain experience. Schenn is a good comparison but Morin could surprise you with his offense someday. No guarantees in NHL but he's getting better and better in all aspects of the game, including offense."
Now you have.

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07-15-2013, 01:47 PM
  #275
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Originally Posted by Brayden Pattison View Post
Nice writeup, Whitesnake. Hopefully Morin won't have to QB the PP, because Hagg will already have the job.
Or Gostisbehere!

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