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Who is the ideal linemate for Datsyuk and Zetterberg?

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Old
07-20-2013, 07:36 PM
  #51
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Really, no, he's not terrible. Is he misused? Probably. Is he that terrible that he shouldn't be in the NHL? No. He's a serviceable bottom six player.
But he's also been pretty mediocre in the bottom six.
I think he;s OK for a checking line winger, PK guy. But that's about it,

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07-20-2013, 07:37 PM
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Justin Garbagekader!

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07-20-2013, 07:37 PM
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I honestly think i'd rather have any player on the roster there than Abdelkader

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07-20-2013, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
A name I think would work very well and should be available come the deadline is Vanek. He also fixes our what to do about the net-front guy question on the PP, where he might be the best at it these days. Buffalo wants wingers and we have those in spades at the prospect level. Interesting to see how that evolves and what our cap situation looks like, but we could and probably should be big time involved in that trade as long as Buffalo is willing to ship him in division and not scared to death that he will extend, which of course I would hope for.

Be nice to add a known Bruins killer heading into the playoffs and one that fits exceptionally well on our roster.
I would love to add Tomas Vanek to our roster but is Buffalo willing to trade within the division like that? If they are, I'm willing than I've ever been to any up for a guy like Vanek.

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07-20-2013, 07:39 PM
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I honestly think i'd rather have any player on the roster there than Abdelkader
Me too. This guy has been getting such a free pass since he started playing for the Wings full time.

Being a bottom six player does not make it OK to be complete garbage.

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07-20-2013, 07:42 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
Me too. This guy has been getting such a free pass since he started playing for the Wings full time.

Being a bottom six player does not make it OK to be complete garbage.
Getting a free pass where? Abdelkader has always been **** on.

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07-20-2013, 07:44 PM
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Getting a free pass where? Abdelkader has always been **** on.
Before he got gifted a top six spot?

You heard some minor grumblings, but the go to excuse was, "He is a bottom six player."

Who cares if it takes a total lunar eclipse and the blood of a virgin for Gator to score an empty net goal? He is a bottom six player!!!!!!!!!!!!

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07-20-2013, 07:46 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
Whatever. The guy is going to continue to play like total garbage and Babcock is going to keep trotting him out there and feed us sound bite after sound bite extolling the virtues of Justin Garbagekader and his ability to dig for pucks.

I love how Babcock likes to handicap the top line. Why not make it harder to play against Z and D? That's CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Instead he trots out the missing link to dig for those pucks. I checked Gator's stats in NHL 13 and noticed his dig for pucks stats was infinity.
I think this is a bit of a cop out. The 3rd member of a line with players the caliber of Datsyuk and Zetterberg doesn't necessarily need to be great since they most likely don't need someone like that since they're the ones who should have the puck the majority of the time.

While the Sedins suck in the post season, they could have anyone on their line and make it extremely effective during the regular season. There's definitely better options than Abdelkader and considering the changes made to this team, I don't think Abdelkader is getting 82 games + playoffs in the top 6 if he isn't producing.

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07-20-2013, 07:47 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
Before he got gifted a top six spot?

You heard some minor grumblings, but the go to excuse was, "He is a bottom six player."

Who cares if it takes a total lunar eclipse and the blood of a virgin for Gator to score an empty net goal? He is a bottom six player!!!!!!!!!!!!
I thought he was an AHL player or worse than a Chimp, hard to follow. The blinding hate with which a few people have on Abdelkader is pretty amusing. He isn't garbage, but he does need to get better.

He will have to put up numbers or do his role to a T, to continue getting run out up in the top 6 this year.

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07-20-2013, 07:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WingedWheel1987 View Post
Before he got gifted a top six spot?

You heard some minor grumblings, but the go to excuse was, "He is a bottom six player."

Who cares if it takes a total lunar eclipse and the blood of a virgin for Gator to score an empty net goal? He is a bottom six player!!!!!!!!!!!!
No, not really. I said for years that Abdelkader brought nothing to the team and could be replaced by any number of UFAs. I think he got better during the later parts of the season and playoffs. I don't think the people who violently hate Abdelakder and Cleary are being objective enough. Are they pretty average players? Yep. Are they AHL caliber? Not at all. Still doesn't mean we don't or shouldn't have other, better options.

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07-20-2013, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
I thought he was an AHL player or worse than a Chimp, hard to follow. The blinding hate with which a few people have on Abdelkader is pretty amusing. He isn't garbage, but he does need to get better.
I never liked Gator because he was so mediocre and thought you could sign a random bottom six player from FA that was better than Gator, but i only occasionally hated on him before he was given a top six spot. I resigned myself to stop talking about him after that ridiculous four year contract, but once he was promoted, i couldn't not talk about how bad he was. He just made it so easy.

We have a coach who continued to put out Dan Cleary in key offensive zone draws. I don't have much faith in Babcock to demote Gator if he keeps on being worthless. Only player that Babcock stopped coddling was Franzen. Babs kept Gator in the top six for 23 games where Gator scored ONE POINT. It pro rates to two points over 48 games. A two point top six winger. Welcome to Hell.


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07-20-2013, 08:18 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
I thought he was an AHL player or worse than a Chimp, hard to follow. The blinding hate with which a few people have on Abdelkader is pretty amusing. He isn't garbage, but he does need to get better.

He will have to put up numbers or do his role to a T, to continue getting run out up in the top 6 this year.
He got his chance to produce, he didn't all. And with Babcock I doubt he'll get moved from the first line based on his production (E.G. Danny Cleary).

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07-20-2013, 08:36 PM
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We've had maybe three guys in ten years who appeared to have any idea what Datsyuk was doing out there. Two are retired, and the third is expected to be on his line next year. After that, everyone on the roster is an iffy fit at best, while Gator showed some promise at the end of last year and is being sold a bit short. edit: Also, I don't think having someone who fits all of what you list is on our roster. Franzen has probably the closest skill set, but I've never liked him as a fit next Datsyuk, and he'd be taking our only other significant goal scorer off on of our complimentary lines.

Also, if it doesn't work out and Abdelkader doesn't carry his game over, we switch him out and move someone else in.
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Originally Posted by The Zetterberg Era View Post
It amazes me how often this is overlooked. Datsyuk is actually a pretty tough guy to play with. There aren't a whole lot of players in the World that would have half our fan-base happy with their output next to Datsyuk. Datsyuk is an exceptional talent we all know that, but it doesn't mean he is an easy guy to play with, we in point of fact know more have struggled playing with him than thrived at least in terms of our fan-bases expectations.

Zetterberg has pretty much instant chemistry with everyone, Datsyuk is much tougher to crack. I thought Bobby Ryan was ideal but he got snatched up. Kovy plays brilliantly with him but he went home. Parise would have been a good fit in my opinion. He likes north south guys that are ready and willing to shoot and drive portions of the ice freeing him up in the zone. Tatar might get there eventually and maybe if Abdelkader there fails that is the first place they should turn. Hopefully at that point Tatar has the confidence up and isn't flustered by 1st pairing D-men at the NHL level. But I am fine with giving Abdelkader the first crack.

A name I think would work very well and should be available come the deadline is Vanek. He also fixes our what to do about the net-front guy question on the PP, where he might be the best at it these days. Buffalo wants wingers and we have those in spades at the prospect level. Interesting to see how that evolves and what our cap situation looks like, but we could and probably should be big time involved in that trade as long as Buffalo is willing to ship him in division and not scared to death that he will extend, which of course I would hope for.

Be nice to add a known Bruins killer heading into the playoffs and one that fits exceptionally well on our roster.
I honestly don't mind Abdelkader if he is playing with Datsyuk AND Zetterberg, but this seems like a little too much love.

Understanding the way Datsyuk likes to play, and having the skill to contribue on a line with him are two very different things.

His numbers dont really support the notion that he "understands" Datsyuk's game or that the two have "chemistry together." When you spend the majority of the season on Datsyuk's wing, and your job is to win battles and keep the puck in the zone and get it to Datsyuk, and you only muster 3 assists in the entire regular season, that is pretty concerning.

He's getting a break because he will have both Datsyuk and Z next year, but he's going to have to do much better if he's going to fill the role of "the next Homer".

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07-20-2013, 08:41 PM
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Getting a free pass where? Abdelkader has always been **** on.
Not a chance.
Abs gets some heat from fans, but overall, he gets a free pass.
Like last year, when after his glorious hat trick, the Detroit media came out with the "See? I told you so. This will finally shut up all the doubters" stories.
Meanwhile, the media never had the balls to report the doubts in the first place -- despite amazingly bad stats.
Not once did anyone in the media question this. In fact, they defended it.

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07-20-2013, 08:49 PM
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Not a chance.
Abs gets some heat from fans, but overall, he gets a free pass.
Like last year, when after his glorious hat trick, the Detroit media came out with the "See? I told you so. This will finally shut up all the doubters" stories.
Meanwhile, the media never had the balls to report the doubts in the first place -- despite amazingly bad stats.
Not once did anyone in the media question this. In fact, they defended it.
Abdelkader is taking Holmstrom's spot. Was Holmstrom a true top-six forward? I don't think so. By the way, you do realize what country Ann Arbor is in, right?

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07-20-2013, 08:55 PM
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Abdelkader is taking Holmstrom's spot. Was Holmstrom a true top-six forward? I don't think so. By the way, you do realize what country Ann Arbor is in, right?
Homer was most importantly a way smarter player than Abby, better passer, better net-front guy with better hand-eye and much better around the boards. Sure he was slow as hell and less physical but he did just about everything else better.

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07-20-2013, 08:58 PM
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Abdelkader is taking Holmstrom's spot. Was Holmstrom a true top-six forward? I don't think so. By the way, you do realize what country Ann Arbor is in, right?
Tomas Holmstrom scored more points in one season than Gator has his entire career. 257 games.

Homer was 100000x the player Garbagekader will ever be.

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07-20-2013, 09:04 PM
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Homer was most importantly a way smarter player than Abby, better passer, better net-front guy with better hand-eye and much better around the boards. Sure he was slow as hell and less physical but he did just about everything else better.
You don't have to be fast to play with Datsyuk. You have to be smart and skilled enough to make those smarts mean anything. Homer was both of those things. Abby? Not so much.

Maybe one day, but not now.

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07-20-2013, 09:05 PM
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Tomas Holmstrom scored more points in one season than Gator has his entire career. 257 games.

Homer was 100000x the player Garbagekader will ever be.
Not to mention Homer is 13th in Detroit Red Wings scoring all-time.

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07-20-2013, 09:11 PM
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By the way, you do realize what country Ann Arbor is in, right?
Canada, of course.

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07-20-2013, 09:33 PM
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Not a chance.
Abs gets some heat from fans, but overall, he gets a free pass.
Like last year, when after his glorious hat trick, the Detroit media came out with the "See? I told you so. This will finally shut up all the doubters" stories.
Meanwhile, the media never had the balls to report the doubts in the first place -- despite amazingly bad stats.
Not once did anyone in the media question this. In fact, they defended it.
What players get heat from the media? Hudler maybe?

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07-20-2013, 09:48 PM
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What players get heat from the media? Hudler maybe?
Hudler. Filppula. White. Fedorov. Kozlov.
Even Ozzie got heat from the media back in the day.

And I'm not even talking about full on criticism. I'm talking about acknowledging limitations or a few flaws.

I gave up on expecting honesty out of the Detroit media.

But we watched the Cleary-Datsyuk-Abdelkader line absolutely suck. Then Cleary left and Abdelakder still sucked.

Then, without ever even questioning Abdelkader on the top line, we started hearing the media talk about how Datsyuk liked Abdelkader.

And then when Abs got hot for a week, the media went into a frenzy "And that's why Babcock likes them together"

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07-20-2013, 09:52 PM
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It amazes me how often this is overlooked. Datsyuk is actually a pretty tough guy to play with. There aren't a whole lot of players in the World that would have half our fan-base happy with their output next to Datsyuk. Datsyuk is an exceptional talent we all know that, but it doesn't mean he is an easy guy to play with, we in point of fact know more have struggled playing with him than thrived at least in terms of our fan-bases expectations.

Zetterberg has pretty much instant chemistry with everyone, Datsyuk is much tougher to crack. I thought Bobby Ryan was ideal but he got snatched up. Kovy plays brilliantly with him but he went home. Parise would have been a good fit in my opinion. He likes north south guys that are ready and willing to shoot and drive portions of the ice freeing him up in the zone. Tatar might get there eventually and maybe if Abdelkader there fails that is the first place they should turn. Hopefully at that point Tatar has the confidence up and isn't flustered by 1st pairing D-men at the NHL level. But I am fine with giving Abdelkader the first crack.

A name I think would work very well and should be available come the deadline is Vanek. He also fixes our what to do about the net-front guy question on the PP, where he might be the best at it these days. Buffalo wants wingers and we have those in spades at the prospect level. Interesting to see how that evolves and what our cap situation looks like, but we could and probably should be big time involved in that trade as long as Buffalo is willing to ship him in division and not scared to death that he will extend, which of course I would hope for.

Be nice to add a known Bruins killer heading into the playoffs and one that fits exceptionally well on our roster.
I think Vanek would work well with them, too. That said, I'm not sure why anyone thinks Buffalo won't do everything they can to re-sign him. They should be well under the cap and their owner has shown he's willing to spend some serious money to ice a team. If he leaves Buffalo, I have to think it's because he wants to.

Just to throw out another name, though even more unlikely, Daniel Sedin strikes me as a guy who could fit well there.

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What players get heat from the media? Hudler maybe?
Fedorov took some heat off and on.

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I honestly don't mind Abdelkader if he is playing with Datsyuk AND Zetterberg, but this seems like a little too much love.

Understanding the way Datsyuk likes to play, and having the skill to contribue on a line with him are two very different things.

His numbers dont really support the notion that he "understands" Datsyuk's game or that the two have "chemistry together." When you spend the majority of the season on Datsyuk's wing, and your job is to win battles and keep the puck in the zone and get it to Datsyuk, and you only muster 3 assists in the entire regular season, that is pretty concerning.

He's getting a break because he will have both Datsyuk and Z next year, but he's going to have to do much better if he's going to fill the role of "the next Homer".
I don't know about Zetterberg Era, but I wasn't intending to say Abdelkader really understood Datsyuk, either. It's more that very few guys do, and trying to find a third linemate who does is pretty unlikely.

Abdelkader elevated his game late in the year, and he's looked better there than Franzen, Cleary, or Sammy. Better than Bert, too (hey, at least there were no more of those blind drop passes just over the blueline to nobody). So give him a shot, and if he doesn't continue to elevate his game, rotate someone else in there.

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07-20-2013, 09:53 PM
  #74
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Hudler. Filppula. White. Fedorov. Kozlov.
Even Ozzie got heat from the media back in the day.

And I'm not even talking about full on criticism. I'm talking about acknowledging limitations or a few flaws.

I gave up on expecting honesty out of the Detroit media.

But we watched the Cleary-Datsyuk-Abdelkader line absolutely suck. Then Cleary left and Abdelakder still sucked.

Then, without ever even questioning Abdelkader on the top line, we started hearing the media talk about how Datsyuk liked Abdelkader.

And then when Abs got hot for a week, the media went into a frenzy "And that's why Babcock likes them together"
Yeah, but I assume you see the pattern. The guys you listed got criticism from the team first, then the media followed. Franzen gets criticized too, when Babcock acknowledges it. I don't need to explain how Detroit media works to you, but everyone knows their 'opinions' are based on how the coach and GM perceives them.

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07-20-2013, 10:00 PM
  #75
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he's looked better there than Franzen, Cleary, or Sammy. Better than Bert, too (hey, at least there were no more of those blind drop passes just over the blueline to nobody). So give him a shot, and if he doesn't continue to elevate his game, rotate someone else in there.
That's just plain wrong.
Abdelkader looked like absolute **** on the line.
It wasn't until Cleary got replaced by Franzen that the line became somewhat effective again, because Franzen at least gives opposing teams someone to worry about.

Bertuzzi is so much better than Abdelkader it's not even funny. I honestly can't believe you hold this opinion.

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