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Cgy/Phi

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Old
07-21-2013, 10:18 PM
  #26
Hockey Ninja
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I'd say no.

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07-21-2013, 10:19 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfreak7 View Post
I should have clarified, I'm comparing Couturier and Baertschi's draft year points. Otherwise it would be unfair considering Couturier didn't get to go back and dominate juniors as a 19 year old like Baerstchi did. That was unclear, my mistake.

But my point is just that people clamor about Baerstchi's offensive ability, but fail to recognize that Couturier has essentially proven just as much in the way of offensive potential. But Couturier's gets written off just because he's been stuck in the 3C shutdown role for the Flyers and unable to produce.
Can't compare them as they are different leagues not to mention Sven was on the 2nd line behind Nino and I think we can all agree that Sven has passed Nino.

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07-21-2013, 10:20 PM
  #28
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No thanks, keeping Couturier and I'm not a fan of moving our 1st (especially in a year the draft is held in Philly) when we're having to rebuild our prospect pool pretty damn badly. And Giordano isn't really that much better than the other boatload of 2-4 defenders we have on our team. Coburn, Schenn, Grossmann, Timonen, Streit. And then there is Meszaros. We really don't need/want another defender like that bunch in Giordano, the difference from him and Coburn, Grossmann, Schenn isn't worth Couts and our 1st, even if we're getting Sven back too.

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07-21-2013, 10:26 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfreak7 View Post
I should have clarified, I'm comparing Couturier and Baertschi's draft year points. Otherwise it would be unfair considering Couturier didn't get to go back and dominate juniors as a 19 year old like Baerstchi did. That was unclear, my mistake.

But my point is just that people clamor about Baerstchi's offensive ability, but fail to recognize that Couturier has essentially proven just as much in the way of offensive potential. But Couturier's gets written off just because he's been stuck in the 3C shutdown role for the Flyers and unable to produce.
Hahaha I get it, I was more talking to the guy who said couturier was worth more than sven and a 3rd. I showed the stats not to show that Sven was the better player but that he was comparable to Couturier in value. Excuses and cases can be made on either side of course yes Couturier was a 3rd line C but Baertschi played on the 3rd and 4th line last year in the NHL. He didn't get much of a chance. He played 2 / 3games on the 2nd line and then was dropped down to the 3rd / 4th line faster than the oilers in the standings after they realized they had a chance at a top 3 pick again. He was misused by the flames this year when they thought they had a chance to contend. And yes Baertschi is known for his offensive prowness but like couturier not getting credit for his offensive game Baertschi is actually pretty decent in his own end. He is usually one of the first players back and can read plays well and gets his stick in the way quite a bit. I don't think that anyone at this point can say which player is better especially as they are so young yet and they both have different roles.

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07-21-2013, 10:27 PM
  #30
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lol Couturier continues to be criminally underrated on this website, it's honestly getting to the point where it's funny how ignorant you all are. This isn't a bad deal though, Sven is going to be a good one.

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Old
07-21-2013, 10:31 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHudlinator View Post
Can't compare them as they are different leagues not to mention Sven was on the 2nd line behind Nino and I think we can all agree that Sven has passed Nino.
You certainly can compare them. Maybe not in order to conclusively prove one to be better than the other, but you can definitely compare those stats to prove that the two are at the very least comparable offensively.

And that's ultimately my main point. I'm not detracting from Baertschi at all. He's got extremely high offensive potential, and basically what I am saying is that Couturier's potential is right there with him considering that the two have been relatively equal each step of the way so far.

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07-21-2013, 10:33 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfreak7 View Post
You certainly can compare them. Maybe not in order to conclusively prove one to be better than the other, but you can definitely compare those stats to prove that the two are at the very least comparable offensively.

And that's ultimately my main point. I'm not detracting from Baertschi at all. He's got extremely high offensive potential, and basically what I am saying is that Couturier's potential is right there with him considering that the two have been relatively equal each step of the way so far.
You can infer from them that both are offensively talented but I was saying that comparing them is a poor choice. I think Couts is underused in Philly and may never be able to reach his real potential if he gets stuck as 3rd line center for a long period of time (Looks like it could be a while with Giroux and Vinny both a head of him).

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Old
07-21-2013, 10:38 PM
  #33
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as a flames fan i pass.

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Old
07-21-2013, 10:42 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHudlinator View Post
You can infer from them that both are offensively talented but I was saying that comparing them is a poor choice. I think Couts is underused in Philly and may never be able to reach his real potential if he gets stuck as 3rd line center for a long period of time (Looks like it could be a while with Giroux and Vinny both a head of him).
That's definitely a fair point to make. As you can see, Flyers fans get defensive when people imply that Couturier's offensive potential is limited.

Like you said, it's possible he never reaches his potential because of other factors, but the kid still has a very high offensive ceiling just the same as players like Baertschi do, and that's all I wanted to imply.

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Old
07-21-2013, 10:44 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfreak7 View Post
That's definitely a fair point to make. As you can see, Flyers fans get defensive when people imply that Couturier's offensive potential is limited.

Like you said, it's possible he never reaches his potential because of other factors, but the kid still has a very high offensive ceiling just the same as players like Baertschi do, and that's all I wanted to imply.
I would agree on the potential (I think Sven has slightly more offensive potential but we can't prove either way) I think Couts has the same potential that Monahan do either solid #1 center or elite #2, I think his offensive game will be stalled in Philly, and because we have Monahan I think I would keep the player that is already here and the one I feel will have a little more success offensively.

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Old
07-21-2013, 10:46 PM
  #36
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Good value,but No from me

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Old
07-21-2013, 10:47 PM
  #37
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Easy no from Flyers fans , Akeson have definitly the potential top be a 2d line Winger + 1st pick next year which will be held in philly and let's not mention couturier, i don't think the deal is bad, but the Flyers needs would be a Top 3 D since kimmo will be gone next year


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Old
07-21-2013, 11:16 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Flyerss View Post
Easy no from Flyers fans , Akeson have definitly the potential top be a 2d line Winger + 1st pick next year which will be held in philly and let's not mention couturier, i don't think the deal is bad, but the Flyers needs would be a Top 3 D since kimmo will be gone next year
Giordano is a top 3 D-man.

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Old
07-21-2013, 11:23 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyerss View Post
Easy no from Flyers fans , Akeson have definitly the potential top be a 2d line Winger + 1st pick next year which will be held in philly and let's not mention couturier, i don't think the deal is bad, but the Flyers needs would be a Top 3 D since kimmo will be gone next year
Akeson has potential to play a few games in the NHL and then never be heard from again. He's basically a throw-in in this deal.

The value is good, but I would pass.

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Old
07-21-2013, 11:26 PM
  #40
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With Monahan being drafted, we don't need Couturier, especially at the cost of Sven.

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Old
07-21-2013, 11:39 PM
  #41
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By the sounds of it the value is close, but neither side likely does it.

Happy to have a good first proposal, lol.

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Old
07-22-2013, 12:06 AM
  #42
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I like Couturier and this proposal is actually pretty good, value wise is pretty even. For Calgary, we have an abundance of LW prospects as well but I think both fanbases would still pass. I'd rather keep Baertschi, he's a symbol for Calgary rebuilding and we need to start getting our own homegrown talent in the lineup, Sven will be at the core of that.

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07-22-2013, 12:16 AM
  #43
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The value is good, but I'd pass from a Flames perspective.

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Old
07-22-2013, 12:48 AM
  #44
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I don't hate it. But Mez/Coburn has to be included to make this work. So drop the 1st, plug in one of the two. Otherwise Philly is in a logjam. This trade could work for both sides, but some tinkering definitely needs to be done.

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Old
07-22-2013, 12:53 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by seanerixon View Post
I don't hate it. But Mez/Coburn has to be included to make this work. So drop the 1st, plug in one of the two. Otherwise Philly is in a logjam. This trade could work for both sides, but some tinkering definitely needs to be done.
Without out the first there isn't a ton of reason for us to do this. If you want us to take Mez we will add a depth forward or pick but we wouldn't give up the 1st.

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Old
07-22-2013, 01:15 AM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHudlinator View Post
Without out the first there isn't a ton of reason for us to do this. If you want us to take Mez we will add a depth forward or pick but we wouldn't give up the 1st.
I could work with that instead of Gio, but who did you have in mind? Just for kicks & giggles.

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Old
07-22-2013, 01:56 AM
  #47
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Not interested in giving up Sven, nor Gio for that package. Couts is good, but redundant with Monahan, Jankowski and Backlund up the middle.

Philly holds on to their future top-six center. Calgary holds on to their future top-line winger, their best defenseman and future captain. Seems like a win for both sides to me.

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Old
07-22-2013, 02:55 AM
  #48
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Dont do it from the Flames perspective. Couturier is not needed with Monahan now a Flame. They both have the same potential to become a top line center in my opinion and I wouldnt give up Sven to get Couts. Gio for a 1st plus a defenseman cap dump from the Flyers is something that would be interesting.

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Old
07-22-2013, 03:08 AM
  #49
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Coutourier is worth more than that, common
Get real man sven has more talent by far

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Old
07-22-2013, 08:49 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by jsylvestre View Post
Also, Couturier seems more like a winger IMO.
LOL, what? You've clearly never seen Couts play.

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