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Cody Franson Trade Talk "Will Heat Up"

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Old
07-26-2013, 12:25 PM
  #101
JS19
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Originally Posted by HockeyGuruPitka View Post
I wouldnt be devastated if we lost Franson. As long as its a first and a good prospect.
Do you really even think that you'll get that package for an unsigned defenseman?

Base it on stats all you want, but GMs are going to see "unsigned" and laugh at that proposal.

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07-26-2013, 12:26 PM
  #102
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noooooooo! Gardiner and Franson were supposed to be Kaberle and McCabe 2.0 on the powerplay, we can't let him go

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07-26-2013, 12:26 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by JS19 View Post
Do you really even think that you'll get that package for an unsigned defenseman?

Base it on stats all you want, but GMs are going to see "unsigned" and laugh at that proposal.
Obviously any trade involving Franson will be a sign+trade.

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07-26-2013, 12:27 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Roo View Post
And that's exactly it. He played 3rd pairing even strength minutes during the season with Fraser, and got lots of PP time. So, he put up a good point total, but he still has more to prove. He is not worth $4M+, and should be in the $3M like Gunnarsson. Some will argue that, but Gunnarsson plays tougher minutes on the top pairing with Dion, and has been around longer.

This speaks to the Subban scenario with MTL a year ago. Not saying he's on his level but he (and Kadri) should be getting bridge contracts.
Spoilers

Fraser-Franson was our 2nd pairing not our 3rd. The 3rd pairing saw a lot of time with Kostka, Liles, Gardiner, Holzer, etc. after Gunnarson was re-united with Phanuef.

He wasn't very sheltered either let's put that Myth to rest already he and Fraser logged a lot of minutes this season, there was disscusion on the leafs board this year about how they were cutting Phanuefs ice time down so he didn't have to kill himself playing 25-30 minutes a night.

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07-26-2013, 12:29 PM
  #105
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Said it a million times over but we would trade Liles before anything else related to Franson.

Even if we get to the start of the season we can put Liles in the minors to save an extra 900k on the cap. I wouldn't do something stupid like trade a good young player in Franson because of short term cap concerns when we all know it should be rising quite significantly next year.

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07-26-2013, 12:30 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by JS19 View Post
Florida fans may not see it the same way is what I was trying to say. It's too easy to see this as "disgruntled." I mean, Subban didn't sign until the beginning of the season, does that mean he's disgruntled? Or does he just want to be paid what he's worth? Bergevin still seems to like him too.
The situation with Subban was mostly monetary. The problems between Florida and Gudbranson are largely personal (and when signing his elc, financial). All I'm saying is, we have seen good young players moved too late in their development to a)save the player and b)benefit the team value wise. Trade Filatov in year two you get a haul, and now he is largely worthless. Tyler Seguin gets moved for an all star forward now, if Boston holds on and he maintains his well documented ways and lower production you get scraps. Maybe Florida thinks this is as far as he will come IN Florida. Just saying, crazier deals have happened than a Franson for Gudbranson swap.

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07-26-2013, 12:30 PM
  #107
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Franson has succeeded in every role he's been in. Voynov not so much, although I realize he's a bit younger.

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07-26-2013, 12:31 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
That's the thing, Nonis has already overpaid and has already handcuffed the Leafs.
I definitely think "tough decisions" have to be made soon. If not this year, then within the next 2 years. Two main reasons:

1) Money tied up on the wing. Lupul (5.25) + Clarkson (5.25) + JvR (4.25) + Kessel (?7.5?) = 22.25M. Say the cap is 70M two years from now (that's generous), that's 32% of the capspace tied up in four wingers, which is largely considered the least important position in hockey.

2) Too many offensive Dmen. Not enough legitimate high-end defensive ones. People are projecting a future top 4 of Phaneuf/Rielly/Franson/Gardiner... You DON'T need that much offence from the blueline. And while some of them are (Phaneuf) are could be decent defensively, none of them are the guys you'd really want out there with 1 minute remaining in the 3rd period with Crosby/Stamkos/etc on the ice in a playoff game.

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Old
07-26-2013, 12:31 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by getyourselfsomerest View Post
Franson is the most overrated player on the Leafs. He's good offensively. Defensively he's been getting better but he's still horrible.(see: game 7) With Gardiner and Rielly in the system, Franson will be gone soon enough, whether it's this season or two seasons from now. Leafs fans once again attracted to what's flashy. Playing a good half-season is apparently worth over $4 mil.
Cody 2 goals in game 7 Franson?

He made one bad mistake in game 7 early on but didn't let it affect him the rest of the game. That series as a whole he was great, he didn't panic, made quick smart plays in all 3 zones, and was able to start breakouts from our own zone.

Calling him the most overated player on the Leafs is laughably misguided.

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07-26-2013, 12:31 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Badger Mayhew View Post
???

They're both offensive defensemen. What are you basing this on?

Franson was in fact the better defenseman last year, with a 5.1 Corsi Relative compared to Voynov's -6.1
Relative Corsi doesn't really mean anything when comparing players from different teams. It's just their Corsi relative to the rest of their team. The Leafs' pretty bad Corsi as a team skews the numbers.

Franson's Corsi On = -10.41
Voynov's Corsi On = +8.97

Voynov also did that against tougher competition.

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07-26-2013, 12:31 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
That's the thing, Nonis has already overpaid and has already handcuffed the Leafs.
He bought out Komi and Grabo, that was good cap Mgt.

Clarkson at 5.25 (Edmonton offered him more)
Bozak at 4.2 (Less than Weiss and Gagner)
Bernier at 2.9

I am not sure where he handcuffed the Leafs?

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07-26-2013, 12:32 PM
  #112
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guys like JFJ got paid millions of dollars and history would say that he is deserving of a significant amount of criticism. Just because they're paid to do their job doesn't mean that the can't make some horrendous mistakes that 90% of decent posters on this site would NEVER do in a million years. I never got this theory, because it means that as fans, we're never smart enough to have a valid opinion.


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07-26-2013, 12:32 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
He is arbitration eligible as he has 4 seasons of pro hockey under his belt, but he decided not to file for some reason. He might be waiting for an offer sheet.
If the arbiter values him at greater than $3.5M (solid chance), the Leafs can just walk away. By not filing, he's playing hardball with management. From his standpoint, it was a smart move.

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Old
07-26-2013, 12:35 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Lobstertainment View Post
Cody 2 goals in game 7 Franson?

He made one bad mistake in game 7 early on but didn't let it affect him the rest of the game. That series as a whole he was great, he didn't panic, made quick smart plays in all 3 zones, and was able to start breakouts from our own zone.

Calling him the most overated player on the Leafs is laughably misguided.
Yep, he's a great 4th forward on the ice. Gave the puck away on the 1st Boston goal, screened Reimer on the Horton goal, doing absolutely nothing on the game winner. Fact is, the Leafs are going to have to pick two of Gardiner, Rielly and Franson. Can't have all 3 if they intend on actually defending.

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07-26-2013, 12:36 PM
  #115
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A whole lot of overreaction in this thread… Nonis is getting ridiculed for a move he hasn't even done yet. Furthermore, The fact that Dreger is reporting this leads me to believe that Nonis is using the media to try and lower Franson's value. Dreger is a Nonis lobbyist, And Nonis is probably hoping that the threat of trade might be enough to lower Franson's asking price. Nothing to get upset about yet, folks.

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07-26-2013, 12:36 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger Mayhew View Post




Franson has succeeded in every role he's been in. Voynov not so much, although I realize he's a bit younger.
So tired of the corsi arguments.

Corsi was simply a statistic that measures shot attempts. A player receives a plus for any shot attempt (on net, missed, or blocked) that his team directs at the opponent's net, and a minus for any shot attempt against his own net.

Advanced stats have gotten totally out of hand from this simple premise IMO.

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07-26-2013, 12:37 PM
  #117
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Subban sat out until he settled for 2.8m. If Franson thinks he deserves more than Gunnarsson he can sit out for the whole season for all I care. Really easy player to replace.

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07-26-2013, 12:37 PM
  #118
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This is all just talk anyway. Nonis is just using his puppet Dreger as a negotiation tactic...as usual.

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07-26-2013, 12:38 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Roo View Post
This speaks to the Subban scenario with MTL a year ago. Not saying he's on his level but he (and Kadri) should be getting bridge contracts.
Franson and his agent would argue that he has already signed a bridge contract - in fact, he's signed 2 of them already. He's NOT coming out of his ELC like Subban was and Kadri is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lobstertainment View Post
love that Mirtle immediatly tweeted Dregger saying "And the blueline improves how?" and Dregs just says leave me alone I'm on vacation.
Honestly, it just annoyed me even more at the TSN insiders. As if covering hockey is so tough that you need to take a vacation from the day after UFA opens all the way to training camp and act like the sport barely exists during that time.

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07-26-2013, 12:38 PM
  #120
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2nd line?
Probably Kadri between Lupul and Clarkson on our 2nd line.

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07-26-2013, 12:39 PM
  #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger Mayhew View Post




Franson has succeeded in every role he's been in. Voynov not so much, although I realize he's a bit younger.
Should I make a poll to see what people think about Franson vs Voynov debate? Who is the better player?

And thank you Dknicks for the stats.

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07-26-2013, 12:41 PM
  #122
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Should I make a poll to see what people think about Franson vs Voynov debate? Who is the better player?

And thank you Dknicks for the stats.
Only a diehard Leafs homer would favor Franson over Voynov.

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07-26-2013, 12:42 PM
  #123
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I wonder if he'll sign an offer sheet.

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07-26-2013, 12:44 PM
  #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by getyourselfsomerest View Post
Yep, he's a great 4th forward on the ice. Gave the puck away on the 1st Boston goal, screened Reimer on the Horton goal, doing absolutely nothing on the game winner. Fact is, the Leafs are going to have to pick two of Gardiner, Rielly and Franson. Can't have all 3 if they intend on actually defending.
Fun fact it was Gardiner who threw the puck into Bergeron on the game winner. Imagine blaming Franson for that. I guess I should blame Bobby Orr if he was paired with a pylon and they got scored on.

Fact is when we got Franson we were told we'd get a big but soft offensive bottom pairing guy who could play on the 2nd PP unit.

We got a top 4 two way defender who has been an anchor on our top PP unit and was a big reason it became so deadly this past season with his accurate and hard shot, and crisp passes, his breakout from our own zone helped our transition game, and under Caryle he began using his size and strength and hitting people.

But forget all those facts lets lose him for next to nothing because of cap mismanagment that makes it all better.

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07-26-2013, 12:44 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
He bought out Komi and Grabo, that was good cap Mgt.

Clarkson at 5.25 (Edmonton offered him more)
Bozak at 4.2 (Less than Weiss and Gagner)
Bernier at 2.9

I am not sure where he handcuffed the Leafs?
Clarkson has never had a single season in which you could say he played like a $5.3M player. Hard to see him doing it next year let alone at 37.

Bozak is not as good as Weiss or Gagner. Probably worth closer to $3.5M or so.

Bernier is a young backup, with potential sure, but has done nothing to prove he's worth $2.9M. Jakob Markstrom got $1.2M this summer. Lindback got $1.8M last summer. How in the world does Bernier get $2.9M? And we retained salary in that trade.

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