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Cody Hodgson

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Old
07-29-2013, 05:20 PM
  #151
Strangelove
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Originally Posted by leo2892 View Post
Excellent and well thought-out rebuttal.
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Originally Posted by Fly Boy View Post
Well at least now we know you don't have anything substantial or relevant to add in this conversation any more. Sounds about right based on your last few posts.
Lighten up guys, it was quite obviously a tit for tat joke.

I mean it was a joke right?

Folks aren't seriously suggesting Vanek rode Hodgson's coattails last season.

Are they?

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07-29-2013, 05:24 PM
  #152
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His Ozone deployment was 33%... in DEC. 1 month. Not 33% for the season. Behind the net and PassitToBulis have it at much higher through different points of the year, and BTN averages it out to be 52.3% overall, over 83 GP.

I don't understand the meaning of your second paragraph. They used him a certain way for 3 months. Then changed his usage for 1 month in order to showcase him. Is that what you are referring to?
December is especially relevant because those were his deployments the month he requested a trade. The 80% deployments in January onward don't matter in evaluating his role on the Canucks because they were setting him up for a trade from that point onward.

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Terrible possession numbers are never offset by unsustainable one ice EV shooting percentages. Nor is an inordinately high PDO.
His terrible possession numbers were equally unsustainable, you know, because they haven't been sustained.

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What is a "legitimate three center system"?
One that has a bigger role for a developing offensive forward than ~11 minutes at ES, a dwindling zone start ratio, mediocre linemates and less than two minutes of PP time on a second unit where he was its best forward.

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07-29-2013, 05:41 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by struckbyaparkedcar View Post
December is especially relevant because those were his deployments the month he requested a trade. The 80% deployments in January onward don't matter in evaluating his role on the Canucks because they were setting him up for a trade from that point onward.


His terrible possession numbers were equally unsustainable, you know, because they haven't been sustained.


One that has a bigger role for a developing offensive forward than ~11 minutes at ES, a dwindling zone start ratio, mediocre linemates and less than two minutes of PP time on a second unit where he was its best forward.
To be fair, no contending team would give Hodgson the type of first line minutes that he got on the Sabres. I'm not sure I'd call that a typical three center system.
The more usual situation is what you saw with Seguin in Boston. You need to earn the minutes.

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07-29-2013, 05:53 PM
  #154
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To be fair, no contending team would give Hodgson the type of first line minutes that he got on the Sabres. I'm not sure I'd call that a typical three center system.
I was referring to the end of the 11-12 season, when Buffalo rolled three lines with him, Roy and Ennis.

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The more usual situation is what you saw with Seguin in Boston. You need to earn the minutes.
11-12 was Hodgson's fourth season after being drafted. 10-11 was Seguin's first. Not a great comparison.

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07-29-2013, 05:58 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by struckbyaparkedcar View Post
I was referring to the end of the 11-12 season, when Buffalo rolled three lines with him, Roy and Ennis.


11-12 was Hodgson's fourth season after being drafted. 10-11 was Seguin's first. Not a great comparison.
Well, I watched those games down the stretch for the Sabres in2011-2012 and Hodgson was pretty dreadful for you guys. I thought you were referring to last year where I thought he looked better.

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07-29-2013, 06:01 PM
  #156
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Except possession wise, Vanek did better with Hogdson, and positively on the whole, supporting my assertion that Hodgson's incredibly bad corsi stats from January were as unsustainable as his shooting percentage. I was never talking about his overall game.

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07-29-2013, 07:25 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by struckbyaparkedcar View Post
One that has a bigger role for a developing offensive forward than ~11 minutes at ES, a dwindling zone start ratio, mediocre linemates and less than two minutes of PP time on a second unit where he was its best forward.
He was getting average third line minutes, playing with above average 3rd liners, and was also anchoring the 2nd unit PP (AV referred to it specifically as "Cody's Unit") and not good enough to bump anyone off the first. The only legitimate issue is whether or not he deserved better zone starts, and I personally have no issue with a coach making a developing rookie earn offensive opportunities with strong defensive efforts. What you are suggesting is that he should have been granted privileges above what he had earned on the team. Surely you can see why some fans wouldn't be in favour of that.

I'm glad he's flourished offensively in Buffalo, but I think your claims on how he should have been treated in Vancouver are off base. The only issue I have with the way he was treated is Gillis's comments after the season. Those were unnecessary, but everything else was standard practice, and good practice at that.

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07-29-2013, 07:54 PM
  #158
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What does Buffalo want from Tampa for him? Would Connelly do it ?

sure takes myers too

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07-29-2013, 08:54 PM
  #159
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Its pretty solid, he showed this year he can be a true top 6 forward. He does have some weaknesses though, and some teams may worry about the perceived character issues.

Either way I think Buffalo could get a young player of similar potential & ability back for him.

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07-29-2013, 11:28 PM
  #160
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Its pretty solid, he showed this year he can be a true top 6 forward. He does have some weaknesses though, and some teams may worry about the perceived character issues.

Either way I think Buffalo could get a young player of similar potential & ability back for him.
The only people who perceive him to have character issues are Canuck fans with like 3 cups of Koolade in each hand and 5 more gallons in the fridge. Because IIRC 90% of Vancouver fans considered him untouchable and future captain material until he wasn't a Nuck anymore.

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07-29-2013, 11:36 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
The only people who perceive him to have character issues are Canuck fans with like 3 cups of Koolade in each hand and 5 more gallons in the fridge. Because IIRC 90% of Vancouver fans considered him untouchable and future captain material until he wasn't a Nuck anymore.
Thats before we learned about his selfish "me me me" attitude.

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07-29-2013, 11:51 PM
  #162
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Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
The only people who perceive him to have character issues are Canuck fans with like 3 cups of Koolade in each hand and 5 more gallons in the fridge. Because IIRC 90% of Vancouver fans considered him untouchable and future captain material until he wasn't a Nuck anymore.
If a player leaves with integrity and professionalism than yes his legacy will be felt see Cory Schneider. Hodgson was a rookie demanding top 6 minutes on a team that made it to game 7 of the finals the year before, a team that employed a hart trophy winner and 40 goal Selke winner in the same position. No one is refuting Hodgson's playing ability, it's his character which is being questioned.

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07-30-2013, 12:25 AM
  #163
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We're really still talkin about character issues? Does it affect his play on the ice? No. Lets move on.

Wanna talk about character issues? See: Kassian, Zach.

I'll take the one with the non destructive tendencies.

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07-30-2013, 12:39 AM
  #164
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Canuck fan here who loved Hodgson, was bitter that he left, and is even more bitter that Kassian looks like he might be a bit of a project...

But , c'mon Canuck fans...we seem like sore losers here with all of this talk about his supposed bad attitude, sheltered minutes etc...

Right now, plain and simple it looks like a bad trade. Thats it.

I think Kassian will turn it around and in the future give us something to cram down the throats of all those saying we got hosed in the deal...but, for now, we are the ones that got hosed.

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07-30-2013, 03:34 AM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Kesler2Burrows View Post
Hodgson was a rookie demanding top 6 minutes on a team that made it to game 7 of the finals the year before, a team that employed a hart trophy winner and 40 goal Selke winner in the same position. No one is refuting Hodgson's playing ability, it's his character which is being questioned.
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Thats before we learned about his selfish "me me me" attitude.
Maybe it's just me, but I don't even see any character issues here. If it furthers his development and makes him a better player down the road, why not do whatever it takes to find the best place to succeed.

In case someone accuses me of double standard ("What if it happened to your team?"): I think it's a similar thing with Vanek right now. Everyone applauds Pegula if he says "I want to win a cup." But if Vanek says the same thing, yet it doesn't coincide with the teams development, people are pissed off and insinuate him to be a traitor. To me it's all just sentimental BS.

Which, by the way, also applies to this whole "who won the trade" discussion.
I like the Nucks, I'd like to see them succeed. I'd like to see Kassian succeed, cause if he ever puts it all together he could be such an exciting player (preferably not against the Sabres, though). And even if it wasn't so, it wouldn't give me any pleasure to know they "lost a trade" against my team.

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07-30-2013, 03:46 AM
  #166
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Maybe it's just me, but I don't even see any character issues here. If it furthers his development and makes him a better player down the road, why not do whatever it takes to find the best place to succeed.

In case someone accuses me of double standard ("What if it happened to your team?"): I think it's a similar thing with Vanek right now. Everyone applauds Pegula if he says "I want to win a cup." But if Vanek says the same thing, yet it doesn't coincide with the teams development, people are pissed off and insinuate him to be a traitor. To me it's all just sentimental BS.

Which, by the way, also applies to this whole "who won the trade" discussion.
I like the Nucks, I'd like to see them succeed. I'd like to see Kassian succeed, cause if he ever puts it all together he could be such an exciting player (preferably not against the Sabres, though). And even if it wasn't so, it wouldn't give me any pleasure to know they "lost a trade" against my team.
This is a very fair an intelligent response, kudos. I think the general consensus among Vancouver's fans is Hodgson's relationship with the Vanouver organization is tarnished Gillis himself said he had more issues with Cody than he did with any player on the team. Vancouver fans are used to players grateful to be in the organization(Most of core taking less to play in Vancouver) So seeing Hodgson "demand a trade" Is quite different for the organization and has has left a sour taste in most Canucks fans mouth.

Most Canucks fans like the Sabres(Expansion Cousins) and are glad for the most part to see Hodgson play well in Buffalo. Whats being missed in translation between the two fan bases is Vancouver fans think Hodgson's attitude in Vancouver was poor and think it was better for both parties to move on, I don't think anyone's suggesting his "poor attitude" Has transferred over to Buffalo.

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07-30-2013, 04:46 AM
  #167
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Hey Canuck fans...

MOVE THE **** ON!

It's embarrassing.

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07-30-2013, 09:22 AM
  #168
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I see math is not your strog suit. Or even your average suit. The difference between the rest of Vaneks career and this season was .27, and the difference from the last 3 years was .30.
lol I suck at math, it isnt even my horrible suit thanks for the correction bro

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07-30-2013, 09:35 AM
  #169
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This. I think he develops into a solid borderline 1-2 C. Could be a 1, or could be the solid #2 if/when Grigorenko develops
I see his upside as a little under Ribeiro's.

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07-30-2013, 10:50 AM
  #170
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I see his upside as a little under Ribeiro's.
I'd be ecstatic if that were the case, riberio was a ppg this year

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07-30-2013, 11:52 AM
  #171
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I love how a seemingly objective view into Cody's trade value has digressed into a conversation about what may or may not have gone on behind the scenes in Vancouver years ago

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07-30-2013, 04:22 PM
  #172
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Hated the Trade. Loved CH since the WJC where he was a stud.

My whole issue is if CH wanted out package him with a first and get a legit top 6 power forward. The Canucks totally dropped the ball on that whole fiasco.


About CH his game has not translated as completely as it was in junior. He was a force in all three zones. Now he looks more like a #2 center that is more offensive. Someone you do have to shelter a little.

Call him the polar opposite to kesler. His offence and positioning look effortless but his skating and defence look forced.

I think is attitude was mainly due to the fact he wanted a bigger role on team with better players in the position. I see him having a solid career in buffalo as a middle of the row #2c.

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07-30-2013, 04:50 PM
  #173
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LOL a seven page thread for a player who plays for a team, with a fan base that is not at all interested in trading him

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07-30-2013, 11:05 PM
  #174
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I'd be ecstatic if that were the case, riberio was a ppg this year
Upside, meaning potential. I see him as a ~70 point kind of player at his best, about 60 points on a typical year.

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07-30-2013, 11:10 PM
  #175
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Hated the Trade. Loved CH since the WJC where he was a stud.

My whole issue is if CH wanted out package him with a first and get a legit top 6 power forward. The Canucks totally dropped the ball on that whole fiasco.


About CH his game has not translated as completely as it was in junior. He was a force in all three zones. Now he looks more like a #2 center that is more offensive. Someone you do have to shelter a little.

Call him the polar opposite to kesler. His offence and positioning look effortless but his skating and defence look forced.

I think is attitude was mainly due to the fact he wanted a bigger role on team with better players in the position. I see him having a solid career in buffalo as a middle of the row #2c.
Completely agree I see him with Pominville like numbers that 55-75 point range based on career-years and linemates. he will never be a top-tier #1 and will never be a good 2way center who can get away with those kinds of numbers like a Bergeron could.

Hodgson will have a good career that will see him benefit from heavy PP time and O-Zone starts while hopefully a guy like Grigorenko develops into the team's true #1 center or Hodgson can benefit from the likes of a Girgensons and Larsson doing a TON of heavy lifting to overshadow his own weaknesses.

That being said I love CoHo I love his effort he puts in, in the off-season and he is a gifted offensive talent. But he will never be a top 15 center in the league...

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