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J.M Liles to? For a 3rd

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Old
07-30-2013, 12:00 PM
  #76
Sheva7
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Nobody wants him. That contract is too ugly. He's gonna be bought out very soon.

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07-30-2013, 12:01 PM
  #77
Ricky Bobby
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
Better than paying a 1st to move him. The cap will increase each of those 6 years making that hit minimal.
Nonis should deal Franson long before considering buying out Liles.

If you buy out Liles instead of trading Franson you're essentially adding on extra cap space to the Franson contract + losing out on wheatever assets you could have acquired by trading Franson.

Franson played well last season but he's by no means a good enough player to justify buying out Liles.

6 years of dead cap space at .875, .875, 2.375, 1.25, 1.25, 1.25 will limit this team long after Franson is made expendable because Gardiner, Rielly take away his role on the PP.

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Old
07-30-2013, 12:05 PM
  #78
WTFMAN99
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Originally Posted by Benedict Kovalchuk View Post
Already got Visnovsky, no thanks. Not even for a 5th, not with the length of his contract and our plethora of D prospects (thank Garth Snow for using a draft to take only defense).
You guys were going to sign streit for more money and about the same term. Lubo is probably good for one year and might retire. Plus your defense prospects are exactly that, prospects. Success is not guaranteed but a guy like liles could help really help them transition. You guys have ness, donovan, de hann and reinhart (just going by memory). It's worth a chance if you're the islanders believe me

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07-30-2013, 12:07 PM
  #79
Liferleafer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricky Bobby View Post
Nonis should deal Franson long before considering buying out Liles.

If you buy out Liles instead of trading Franson you're essentially adding on extra cap space to the Franson contract + losing out on wheatever assets you could have acquired by trading Franson.

Franson played well last season but he's by no means a good enough player to justify buying out Liles.

6 years of dead cap space at .875, .875, 2.375, 1.25, 1.25, 1.25 will limit this team long after Franson is made expendable because Gardiner, Rielly take away his role on the PP.
Well, my hope is we sign Franson AND deal Liles. If that can't happen....i won't condone losing a young 6'5 RH PMD just to save 7.5 cap over 6 years in a world where the cap will go up each year more than what you posted.

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07-30-2013, 12:08 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
Depends on whether he wants to play....or be scratched/bought out i guess.
I'm guessing he wants to be bought out and then cash in on another contract. Win/win for Liles.

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07-30-2013, 12:10 PM
  #81
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Does salary need to be retained equally year to year or can the amount retained vary from season to season?

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07-30-2013, 12:11 PM
  #82
MeestaDeteta
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I'm guessing he wants to be bought out and then cash in on another contract. Win/win for Liles.
Not sure he gets another big contract if he's bought out.

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07-30-2013, 12:11 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
We have the option of buying him out, so a deal like this is laughable.
No you don't, at least not without a cap hit. TORONTO already used two amnesty buyouts.

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07-30-2013, 12:12 PM
  #84
Liferleafer
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Originally Posted by Jani8 View Post
I'm guessing he wants to be bought out and then cash in on another contract. Win/win for Liles.
I'm guessing he is going to be dissapointed.

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07-30-2013, 12:13 PM
  #85
Liferleafer
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No you don't, at least not without a cap hit. TORONTO already used two amnesty buyouts.
I know, 7.5 in total cap over 6 years. Not worth giving away a 1st round pick just to trade a guy.

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07-30-2013, 12:15 PM
  #86
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Not sure he gets another big contract if he's bought out.
No, but he'd get more control over his destination, and I am sure with the buyout $$ he'd at least get close to what his last contract was.

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07-30-2013, 12:16 PM
  #87
Ricky Bobby
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Liles has minimal value at the moment because he lost his role on the top PP to Franson last season.

That doesn't mean he can't still run a powerplay though.

Liles has 3 years left on a backdiving contract (4.25, 4.25, 2.75) with a cap hit of 3.875 cap hit per year. As it gets closer to the last year of his contract and the cap continue to rise around the league he could actually have decent value.

The Toronto Defence had trouble keeping the puck out of the net not scoring. Neither Franson or Liles are good defensively. Both are PP specialist who don't kill penalties and # 5 dmen 5 on 5. We only have room for 1 of them in the lineup.

The team would continue to be just fine by dealing Franson for picks/prospects to restock what we lost in deals for O'bryne, Bolland, Bernier.

Then we can deal Liles next off-season or into the season for an actual decent return because Gardiner/Rielly will be needing PP time to maximize their skillsets.

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07-30-2013, 12:17 PM
  #88
Reacher Gilt
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
Such as? Liles is a very good PMD. Who else is available for cheap that is equal to Liles?
Ryan Whitney

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07-30-2013, 12:18 PM
  #89
Pierce Hawthorne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A1LeafNation View Post
If he were a UFA today, he would sign a 4M per 3 year deal.

He is still worth his contract



No he wouldn't. Liles did not look good at all last year for the Leafs. He's had some concussion issues the last couple of years and really hasn't looked the same since leaving Colorado.


He would probably get a 2-2.5M deal if he were a UFA, even that is pushing it.


He's not a Top 4 Dman anymore, and he's almost to small to play a bottom pairing role.


The Leafs wont be able to move him without adding another asset to the deal. Nothing crazy like the 1st suggested in Page 1, but something like Liles + 3rd for a 4th to get him off the books.


Very few teams have the cap space to take on that contract, even fewer have the need for a small, declining Dman.

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07-30-2013, 12:20 PM
  #90
Benedict Kovalchuk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WTFMAN99 View Post
You guys were going to sign streit for more money and about the same term. Lubo is probably good for one year and might retire. Plus your defense prospects are exactly that, prospects. Success is not guaranteed but a guy like liles could help really help them transition. You guys have ness, donovan, de hann and reinhart (just going by memory). It's worth a chance if you're the islanders believe me
True we would have signed Streit for more money and the same term, but he is a better player, already meshes well on this team, and is a leader in the locker room. I doubt Visnovsky would retire and leave another $4.5mil on the table, but even if he did I'd look for a replacement elsewhere, maybe sign one in FA. Why give up assets, any at all, for a player we don't really need or want? Whatever mentoring Liles can do, I'd prefer Visnovsky, who we've already seen do quite a bit for Hickey.

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Old
07-30-2013, 12:23 PM
  #91
Ricky Bobby
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
Well, my hope is we sign Franson AND deal Liles. If that can't happen....i won't condone losing a young 6'5 RH PMD just to save 7.5 cap over 6 years in a world where the cap will go up each year more than what you posted.
You're forgetting that Franson would actually bring us back assets. You're also forgetting that Liles down the road could actually bring us back assets.

If Phaneuf reinks we've got him Gardiner/Rielly developing who will all make Franson expendable because Franson is only a valuable player if he's getting 1st PP time.

That cap space doesn't sound like much but it most definitely is. Consider that if one of the Tucker/Armstrong buyouts weren't on our books we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

In 2 off-seasons we'd be banging our heads against the wall saying I hate that Liles has a 2.375 counting against are cap.

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07-30-2013, 12:24 PM
  #92
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Remember when Lombardi had negative value 6 months ago

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07-30-2013, 12:25 PM
  #93
Reacher Gilt
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Which team would sign him for that? Before the lockout i'd be inclined to agree with you, but not when the cap is at 64 mil.
toronto maple leafs

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07-30-2013, 12:29 PM
  #94
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Ryan Whitney
I'd add Tom Gilbert as well.

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07-30-2013, 12:31 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by A1LeafNation View Post
No one wants those guys at their current deal because its not worth it.

Liles at age 32 for 3 years, 3.875 per is what he would be signed for this offseason.

ie. tradeable
Than why hasn't he been traded??? It'd be huge for the leafs to get Liles off the books and get an asset in return. If by tradable you mean you might be able to us him as a throw in piece in a bigger deal or get a 7th for him, then yeah, he's tradable.

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07-30-2013, 12:34 PM
  #96
A1LeafNation
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Than why hasn't he been traded??? It'd be huge for the leafs to get Liles off the books and get an asset in return. If by tradable you mean you might be able to us him as a throw in piece in a bigger deal or get a 7th for him, then yeah, he's tradable.
Why trade him now so that Fanson. Kadri, and before Fraser signed, can ask for more money with the cap space the Leafs have.

Makes more sense to squeeze the best deals out of them, then trade Liles.

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07-30-2013, 12:36 PM
  #97
tucker3434
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Originally Posted by A1LeafNation View Post
Why trade him now so that Fanson. Kadri, and before Fraser signed, can ask for more money with the cap space the Leafs have.

Makes more sense to squeeze the best deals out of them, then trade Liles.
Agents don't give a crap about cap space. Neither to arbitrators. Cap space will not be a factor in the deals those guys get.

Further, if the leafs use that as a bargaining chip: We need you to take less, so we can fit under the cap.
Then they turn around as soon as they're signed and move salary, how do you think that will sit with the players that just signed at a discount?

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Old
07-30-2013, 12:39 PM
  #98
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How about moving kulimen,for cap space. What can we get for him?

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07-30-2013, 12:43 PM
  #99
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How about moving kulimen,for cap space. What can we get for him?
At this point, a second and fourth round pick? Maybe a second and third.

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07-30-2013, 12:44 PM
  #100
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How about moving kulimen,for cap space. What can we get for him?
That would be a mistake

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