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2013 Philadelphia Phillies (MLB): Charlie Manuel has been fired (Aug. 16)

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Old
07-30-2013, 10:05 AM
  #451
FLYguy3911
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Originally Posted by Protest View Post
I was thinking it would be because of Jimmy for a couple years, and then because of Crawford. The thing is they talk about acquiring these infielders yet they'll have Utley and Rollins blocking them.
Yeah I agree I was just singling out Crawford because he came up in a previous post. And anytime a guy moves to another position, he very rarely moves back. I think you should always go after the BPA (especially on a team like this that needs a total shot in the arm) and put the pieces together after that. I don't think you should just trade for an OF'er because you need one when the infielder is clearly the better player. Trying not to get ahead of myself, because its still a longshot Bogaerts comes here, but it will be interesting to see how the pieces fall into place if the trade does go through.

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07-30-2013, 10:10 AM
  #452
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I thought I had heard something about Crawford being able to fast track to the pros. Did anyone else see/hear that somewhere?
It's too early to tell. His glove has always been there, but there were questions about his bat. So far he's doing well in the GCL, but that isn't exactly against the best competition. Ideally you project 1 year at each level Lakewood- 2014, Clearwater- 2015, Reading- 2016, Lehigh Valley- 2017 (at least a stop). Could he fast track? Of course, but he could just as easily fall on his face. That's why 4 years is a safe projection.

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07-30-2013, 10:14 AM
  #453
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Dude, that is CRAZY old man way of thinking. How many players do that anymore? Harper played less than a year in the minors. Did Trout ever play in the minors? Stanton never played about AA ball.

Teams can't wait around for a half decade until a player may be ready, Franco should be playing MLB next year if he finishes in AA crushing, AAA will prove nothing

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07-30-2013, 10:24 AM
  #454
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Dude, that is CRAZY old man way of thinking. How many players do that anymore? Harper played less than a year in the minors. Did Trout ever play in the minors? Stanton never played about AA ball.

Teams can't wait around for a half decade until a player may be ready, Franco should be playing MLB next year if he finishes in AA crushing, AAA will prove nothing
Well those are some crazy examples right there. Trout and Harper are looking like they may be the two best positional players from their generation. Of course they're not going to spend much time in the minor leagues. And even then, both spent a full year in the minors, I believe. I agree that a lot of high end prospects are spending less and less time in the minors developing, but let's not get carried away. A and AA are still great leagues for guys to develop in.

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07-30-2013, 10:26 AM
  #455
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Dude, that is CRAZY old man way of thinking. How many players do that anymore? Harper played less than a year in the minors. Did Trout ever play in the minors? Stanton never played about AA ball.

Teams can't wait around for a half decade until a player may be ready, Franco should be playing MLB next year if he finishes in AA crushing, AAA will prove nothing
Good job naming the 3 most talented players in all of baseball in your argument. Crawford is a solid player but he has no where near the tools of those players. Each one of those guys you named has/had an 80 tool. Crawford has maybe one 60 tool (his glove).

And you bring up Franco, next year will be his 5th year in the system, FYI, so not sure how you can complain about a 4 year path to the bigs. Honestly that's best case scenario to me. I would be ecstatic if it only takes him 4 years to get here.

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07-30-2013, 10:34 AM
  #456
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Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
Good job naming the 3 most talented players in all of baseball in your argument. Crawford is a solid player but he has no where near the tools of those players. Each one of those guys you named has/had an 80 tool. Crawford has maybe one 60 tool (his glove).

And you bring up Franco, next year will be his 5th year in the system, FYI, so not sure how you can complain about a 4 year path to the bigs. Honestly that's best case scenario to me. I would be ecstatic if it only takes him 4 years to get here.
This is exactly what I was gonna say. You can't compare Crawford to these guys. They are more like the exception not the rule and yes 4 years is the best you could hope for with realistic expectations IMO. It may even take him longer.

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07-30-2013, 10:36 AM
  #457
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Sorry I don't have all day to name the tons of players that have been called up before 4 full years.

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07-30-2013, 10:39 AM
  #458
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Sorry I don't have all day to name the tons of players that have been called up before 4 full years.
Yeah called up if there's a hole to fill and the kid could just learn at the MLB level. If Rollins is still here, which he is and doesn't seem to be going anywhere then he won't be up before the 4 years.

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07-30-2013, 10:41 AM
  #459
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Sorry I don't have all day to name the tons of players that have been called up before 4 full years.
Well then you certainly don't have enough time in the day to name all the players that were ruined because they were rushed to the big leagues.

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07-30-2013, 10:45 AM
  #460
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BTW, Wasn't Trout drafted like 25?

Sure fire stud there that 24 teams bypassed.

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07-30-2013, 10:52 AM
  #461
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Dude, that is CRAZY old man way of thinking. How many players do that anymore? Harper played less than a year in the minors. Did Trout ever play in the minors? Stanton never played about AA ball.

Teams can't wait around for a half decade until a player may be ready, Franco should be playing MLB next year if he finishes in AA crushing, AAA will prove nothing
Trout spent three years in the minors with a quick stop at AAA before coming up at 20.

Stanton spent four years in the minors, he made the jump from AA to the MLB at 20.

Harper spent a year in the minors with a quick stop at AAA before coming up at 19.

All these guys were considered blue-chip prospects & were rated in the top 10's of a lot of baseball prospects lists (in Trout & Harper's cases they were #1). Franco wasn't even ranked in the latest top 50 mid season rankings by Baseball America he's progressing fine there's no need to rush him & in Crawford's case for every Mike Trout there's 10x more Anthony Hewitt's who can't even get out of the lower leagues in 4+ years, 4 years is a good projection for him for now, hell it may even be too generous.

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07-30-2013, 10:52 AM
  #462
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BTW, Wasn't Trout drafted like 25?

Sure fire stud there that 24 teams bypassed.
Ryan Howard was drafted in the 6th round, so what? Draft position means almost nothing in baseball.

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07-30-2013, 10:52 AM
  #463
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BTW, Wasn't Trout drafted like 25?

Sure fire stud there that 24 teams bypassed.
Kimmo was taken 250th overall. It's the same in every sport. Lots of guys get over looked and they end up being if not the best then one of the best of the draft class. I don't get what this is supposed to prove.

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07-30-2013, 10:57 AM
  #464
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Originally Posted by Hiesenberg View Post
BTW, Wasn't Trout drafted like 25?

Sure fire stud there that 24 teams bypassed.
I saw him play when I was 12 or 13. He was good but had no clue he was going to turn into the best player in baseball .

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07-30-2013, 11:08 AM
  #465
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Originally Posted by FlyersFan61290 View Post
Kimmo was taken 250th overall. It's the same in every sport. Lots of guys get over looked and they end up being if not the best then one of the best of the draft class. I don't get what this is supposed to prove.
Trout was still at least a first round pick though. So it's not like it was a shot in the dark pick.

Stanton was a second rounder (but there was some sign-ability issues with him leading up to the draft, he had PAC-12 offers in both baseball & football).

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07-30-2013, 11:09 AM
  #466
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Trout spent three years in the minors with a quick stop at AAA before coming up at 20.

Stanton spent four years in the minors, he made the jump from AA to the MLB at 20.

Harper spent a year in the minors with a quick stop at AAA before coming up at 19.

All these guys were considered blue-chip prospects & were rated in the top 10's of a lot of baseball prospects lists (in Trout & Harper's cases they were #1). Franco wasn't even ranked in the latest top 50 mid season rankings by Baseball America he's progressing fine there's no need to rush him & in Crawford's case for every Mike Trout there's 10x more Anthony Hewitt's who can't even get out of the lower leagues in 4+ years, 4 years is a good projection for him for now, hell it may even be too generous.
Anthony Hewitt might be the worst player in the entire minors. And Larry Green seems to be following in his footsteps.

Can't wait to watch the 2017 Phillies, in the mean time the 2014, 2015, 2016 will be giant bores.

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07-30-2013, 11:12 AM
  #467
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BTW, this was the statement...


Quote:
Ideally you project 1 year at each level Lakewood- 2014, Clearwater- 2015, Reading- 2016, Lehigh Valley- 2017 (at least a stop).
How many players that are in the MLB, do not follow this track. Some of you are saying yea, this guy has been in the minors for 5 years, but that means he'll be there longer if he has to play every level for 1 year.

Also, the Phils squashed some of this thought process with Franco and Asche, neither one of them played an entire year at A (I think)

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07-30-2013, 11:16 AM
  #468
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Lets get back on topic, Nick Cafardo (Sox writer) says the Phils want Bogaerts in any package for Lee. So if Lee moves to Boston, Bogaerts will probably be coming back it sounds like. And good for Amaro, hold out for a ton because its not like Lee is walking in the offseason.

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07-30-2013, 11:17 AM
  #469
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The great thing about Trout is that he is in love with the Phillies. Given a chance he'd probably jump back to the east coast in a heartbeat. We'll have to wait until 2017 free agency for that though :/

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07-30-2013, 11:19 AM
  #470
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@nickcarfado (Boston globe)
From every indication Phillies won't settle for anything less than Bogaerts at the head of any package for Lee
12:10pm - 30 Jul 13

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07-30-2013, 11:20 AM
  #471
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The great thing about Trout is that he is in love with the Phillies. Given a chance he'd probably jump back to the east coast in a heartbeat. We'll have to wait until 2017 free agency for that though :/
Bobby Ryan syndrome

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07-30-2013, 11:20 AM
  #472
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Jeff Passan ‏@JeffPassan 2m
Source: Phillies plan on calling up 3B Cody Asche. Points to Michael Young being traded today.

https://twitter.com/JeffPassan

great news.

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07-30-2013, 11:22 AM
  #473
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Bobby Ryan syndrome
The Ducks arent paying a 33 year $25 million a year though for the next 8 years though .

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07-30-2013, 11:24 AM
  #474
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Awesome, Asche was arguably better than Young in Spring Training, but of course you give the job to the 35 year old making 10M, not the 23 yr old.

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07-30-2013, 11:25 AM
  #475
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I hope Asche hits a homer or something in his first game.

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