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2013-2014 Rangers Prospects Thread (Player Stats in Post #1; Updated 12/17)

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Old
07-31-2013, 04:44 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Oh, you're not a fan of the pick? What news!

He's developing fine.
not disagreeing with that. he seems to be ok given his nagging injury. the term "developing" is subjective however. if by developing you mean into a 5/6 defensive dman on an nhl roster, we have the framework for an agreement.

just making a point that the article builds a decent case for avoiding players like dylan with a top 10 pick. given other options/players and overall organizational needs, my position continues to be that it was an unwise choice to take that player in that spot.

and 5/6 defensive dmen are usually available on the market for usually just cash, top 6 scoring forwards, not so much.

moving on......

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07-31-2013, 04:50 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
not disagreeing with that. he seems to be ok given his nagging injury. the term "developing" is subjective however. if by developing you mean into a 5/6 defensive dman on an nhl roster, we have the framework for an agreement.

just making a point that the article builds a decent case for avoiding players like dylan with a top 10 pick. given other options/players and overall organizational needs, my position continues to be that it was an unwise choice to take that player in that spot.

and 5/6 defensive dmen are usually available on the market for usually just cash, top 6 scoring forwards, not so much.

moving on......
You're making the same point you've made dozens of times before. ODC disagrees with taking a player like that so high in the draft--noted. Again.

I just found an awesome story about why Jessiman was possibly the wrong choice. Wanna read it?

Anyone else bummed about Spelling going back to Denmark?

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07-31-2013, 05:02 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
not disagreeing with that. he seems to be ok given his nagging injury. the term "developing" is subjective however. if by developing you mean into a 5/6 defensive dman on an nhl roster, we have the framework for an agreement.

just making a point that the article builds a decent case for avoiding players like dylan with a top 10 pick. given other options/players and overall organizational needs, my position continues to be that it was an unwise choice to take that player in that spot.

and 5/6 defensive dmen are usually available on the market for usually just cash, top 6 scoring forwards, not so much.

moving on......
Am I missing something? Why is McIlrath being penciled in as a 5/6 d-man?

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07-31-2013, 05:03 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
You're making the same point you've made dozens of times before. ODC disagrees with taking a player like that so high in the draft--noted. Again.

I just found an awesome story about why Jessiman was possibly the wrong choice. Wanna read it?

Anyone else bummed about Spelling going back to Denmark?
YES!! Hopefully he'll be alright in his chances to be a Ranger and his development, but that's in serious doubt now.

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07-31-2013, 08:33 PM
  #55
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Really no other way to take Spelling's move than disappointed.

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08-01-2013, 07:52 AM
  #56
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Originally Posted by TheRightWay View Post
Am I missing something? Why is McIlrath being penciled in as a 5/6 d-man?
I was going to make the same point. It's because he doesn't like him.

But Tarasenko will be a #1 winger.

No mention of Johansen who hasn't really contributed or Burmistrov who is out of the league who ODC loved and wanted at 10. Nope.

Brett Connolly? Not in the NHL last year. Nazem Kadri just made the NHL this past season.

Fowler? Sucks defensively and has yet to be able to add any strength whatsoever.

Maybe it wasn't a good draft?

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08-01-2013, 12:25 PM
  #57
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McIlrath will slot into the top 4 eventually, no questions asked IMO. He's such an imposing figure on the ice that you always are aware of. Defensively solid, skates well, hits hard, imposing size, clears the crease, stands up for his teammates and can do so against heavies. When's the last time the Rangers have had that type of Defensemen?

His offensive game is meh, I will give you that, but with the right partner that can be easily corrected.

I really think we got lucky with this pick and after seeing him play live and how standoutish he was, I've become a huge Mc supporter.

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08-01-2013, 12:40 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by TheRightWay View Post
Am I missing something? Why is McIlrath being penciled in as a 5/6 d-man?
He's a 5/6 D-man right now because we kind of have a log-jam on defense when everyone is healthy.

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Old
08-01-2013, 12:48 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
I was going to make the same point. It's because he doesn't like him.

But Tarasenko will be a #1 winger.

No mention of Johansen who hasn't really contributed or Burmistrov who is out of the league who ODC loved and wanted at 10. Nope.

Brett Connolly? Not in the NHL last year. Nazem Kadri just made the NHL this past season.

Fowler? Sucks defensively and has yet to be able to add any strength whatsoever.

Maybe it wasn't a good draft?
wait what ?

i wanted us to draft vlad tarasenko at 10.

im not real happy burmy bolted back to the k. not at all. not a good situation in the peg- tough place to play and live, he did in fact under perform last season offensively, he had issues with the coach who had issues with him and his maturity and most of all, burmy had options and he excercised them.

still, i dont like that hes not playing in the nhl next year. looks bad for him and for other russian kids looking to establish themselves in the league.

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08-01-2013, 12:52 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
wait what ?

i wanted us to draft vlad tarasenko at 10.

im not real happy burmy bolted back to the k. not at all. not a good situation in the peg- tough place to play and live, he did in fact under perform last season offensively, he had issues with the coach who had issues with him and his maturity and most of all, burmy had options and he excercised them.

still, i dont like that hes not playing in the nhl next year. looks bad for him and for other russian kids looking to establish themselves in the league.
ODC, I remember speaking about Burmistrov with you leading up to the draft. You liked both players. I should also state, I did as well. I think most of us were high on most of the forwards. Johansen, Niederiter, Burmistrov, Tarasenko, Granlund.

Here is an excerpt on Kuznetsov:


Quote:
“I think I will return to Russia from NHL when I am 30″. Evgeni Kuznetsov

It’s impossible not to think about the recent retirement of 30 year old superstar Ilya Kovalchuk, from the NHL. Kovalchuk walked away from a $100 million contract, leaving $77 million unpaid, to return home to Russia.
http://thehockeywriters.com/capitals...nt=buffer9de14

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08-01-2013, 12:55 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by The Undertaker View Post
McIlrath will slot into the top 4 eventually, no questions asked IMO. He's such an imposing figure on the ice that you always are aware of. Defensively solid, skates well, hits hard, imposing size, clears the crease, stands up for his teammates and can do so against heavies. When's the last time the Rangers have had that type of Defensemen?

His offensive game is meh, I will give you that, but with the right partner that can be easily corrected.

I really think we got lucky with this pick and after seeing him play live and how standoutish he was, I've become a huge Mc supporter.
More or less the way I see it. A d-man that big and mean who skates pretty well and has a clue about his position is going to play for somebody and probably for a long time. Another key is he's a right side guy and there's a hole for him to move into--both Girardi and Stralman are UFA's after this coming season and it wouldn't shock me at all if one of them or even both don't return. Apart from that there's a bottom pairing job. He also fits into the Jeff Beukeboom/Ulf Samuelsson school of snarl and by coincidence both our assistant coaches in our organization. Vigneault himself was a nasty defenseman so McIlrath seems to be in the right place at pretty much the right time.

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08-01-2013, 12:57 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by The Undertaker View Post
McIlrath will slot into the top 4 eventually, no questions asked IMO. He's such an imposing figure on the ice that you always are aware of. Defensively solid, skates well, hits hard, imposing size, clears the crease, stands up for his teammates and can do so against heavies. When's the last time the Rangers have had that type of Defensemen?

His offensive game is meh, I will give you that, but with the right partner that can be easily corrected.

I really think we got lucky with this pick and after seeing him play live and how standoutish he was, I've become a huge Mc supporter.
fair enough. he is alot of that. as to us getting "lucky", we shall see.

my only disagreement with you is his skating, defensive awareness and decision making. those all need to get better. we can all live without big/any offensive numbers- we sure are used to that recently with our dmen arent we.

he may be an imposing, freakish prospect( and like you say, if you've seen him up close and in person he is pretty imposing), but all that isnt enough to be a top 4 guy playing 20 minutes a night against top 6 forwards if you cannot think your way around the ice. his efficiency of play must improve.

once he improves his on ice awareness, his lateral movement and stiff hips, and learns when to pinch and/or throw the body, he will most likely get his chance to be the player you describe.

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08-01-2013, 01:01 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
ODC, I remember speaking about Burmistrov with you leading up to the draft. You liked both players. I should also state, I did as well. I think most of us were high on most of the forwards. Johansen, Niederiter, Burmistrov, Tarasenko, Granlund.

Here is an excerpt on Kuznetsov:




http://thehockeywriters.com/capitals...nt=buffer9de14
tarasenko was head and shoulders above other forwards in my mind.

as for kuznetsov, i absolutely love his game and think will be a certified stud. and i read that same article.

kuz will be here immediately after his k contract is up. bank on it. he is going to make washington much tougher to play agianst. he is an elite offensive player.

im certain caps fans would take 7 years of kuznetsov no problem. after 30, let him go back to russia.

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08-01-2013, 01:01 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by The Undertaker View Post
McIlrath will slot into the top 4 eventually, no questions asked IMO. He's such an imposing figure on the ice that you always are aware of. Defensively solid, skates well, hits hard, imposing size, clears the crease, stands up for his teammates and can do so against heavies. When's the last time the Rangers have had that type of Defensemen?

His offensive game is meh, I will give you that, but with the right partner that can be easily corrected.

I really think we got lucky with this pick and after seeing him play live and how standoutish he was, I've become a huge Mc supporter.
His main downside last year was being a rookie. He looked like a rookie, someone who was clearly assisting to the pro game. God, I really hope he is working hard now.

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08-01-2013, 01:02 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
fair enough. he is alot of that. as to us getting "lucky", we shall see.

my only disagreement with you is his skating, defensive awareness and decision making. those all need to get better. we can all live without big/any offensive numbers- we sure are used to that recently with our dmen arent we.

he may be an imposing, freakish prospect( and like you say, if you've seen him up close and in person he is pretty imposing), but all that isnt enough to be a top 4 guy playing 20 minutes a night against top 6 forwards if you cannot think your way around the ice. his efficiency of play must improve.

once he improves his on ice awareness, his lateral movement and stiff hips, and learns when to pinch and/or throw the body, he will most likely get his chance to be the player you describe.
He skates well and pivots well already. Not just for a guy his size either. He has good feet as well.

He hits well and he has gotten much better at picking his spots but he will always be a very physical player.

The Rangers have their Milan Lucic, he just happens to play defense instead of forward. I am 100% okay with that.

Do they need skill? Of course. I think it would have been nice to possibly go a bit riskier with some of the later 1st rounders that have followed instead of Miller or Skjei but they have a mold. They are going to a big team that skates well and is physical. He fits.

He also processes the game well. I'm not sure why you portray him as John Erskine of the AHL. The kid was playing top-pairing after missing half a season with a busted knee cap where he couldn't train or skate at all.

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08-01-2013, 01:03 PM
  #66
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His main downside last year was being a rookie. He looked like a rookie, someone who was clearly assisting to the pro game. God, I really hope he is working hard now.
His downside last year was the fact that he missed 4-5 months of training and had to jump into the season half way onto a team that lacked an identity or any sort of physical presence.

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08-01-2013, 01:22 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
He skates well and pivots well already. Not just for a guy his size either. He has good feet as well.

He hits well and he has gotten much better at picking his spots but he will always be a very physical player.

The Rangers have their Milan Lucic, he just happens to play defense instead of forward. I am 100% okay with that.

Do they need skill? Of course. I think it would have been nice to possibly go a bit riskier with some of the later 1st rounders that have followed instead of Miller or Skjei but they have a mold. They are going to a big team that skates well and is physical. He fits.

He also processes the game well. I'm not sure why you portray him as John Erskine of the AHL. The kid was playing top-pairing after missing half a season with a busted knee cap where he couldn't train or skate at all.
erskine maybe. komisarek probably more likely.

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08-01-2013, 01:52 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
erskine maybe. komisarek probably more likely.
And this is why I have a hard time believing you have seen him play, ODC.

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08-01-2013, 01:56 PM
  #69
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erskine maybe. komisarek probably more likely.
We get it, dude. You know better than Gordie Clark and Jeff Gorton. Despite the fact that defensemen are incredibly hard to project, much less 21-year-old defensemen who have played only one professional season, you are the great oracle of truthiness and can pinpoint exactly what he will become. My only question is, why are you wasting your time sharing your objective realities on a message board instead of helping to create the next great NHL dynasty?

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08-01-2013, 02:03 PM
  #70
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At least we don't have to hear about Fowler anymore, considering he's a train-wreck.

ODC knows more than most people who post here, myself included, but I think the vendetta against McIlrath will be one of lifes unsolved mysteries.

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08-01-2013, 02:06 PM
  #71
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I can't help but shake my head when it comes to the 'analysis' of drafting certain players in different parts of the draft. The draft is a crapshoot. Period. There's no rhyme or reason as to why certain players develop and others do not. Sure, there are commonalities, but none of this stuff is tangible. I could make an argument that you should always trade out of the 10th spot in the first round because from 1999-2007, it produced nothing but flakes and busts, with Luc Bourdon possibly being the lone exception.

Drafts really only mean that player X was valued at Y on some random day in June of some random year. Scouting, draft tendencies, individual bias, injuries, freak accidents, and dozens of other factors come into it. If it was really a "science" the draft would be 3 rounds long, because every viable talent would be taken in the first 90 picks.

McIlrath, despite his injury, has shown improvement in many areas of his game. He's bulking up considerably. He's handling himself very well when he fights against grown men. There's literally nothing to justify pegging him as a 'just a bottom pairing guy' at this point.

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08-01-2013, 02:15 PM
  #72
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US WJC camp starts on Saturday

Quote:
Brady Skjei (Univ. of Minnesota) USA Blue Though his own head coach will be leading Team USA, Skjei cant be counted a lock just yet. He was in the mix for last years team, but was one of the late cuts. Skjei showed improvement over the course of his freshman season at Minnesota, which got off to a bit of a rocky start. If he took another step forward this year, I think hed be an easy pick for the team, but we wont know until he gets out there in Lake Placid. Skjei is one of the best skaters in camp and utilizes the bigger ice well. He has enough offense to contribute a few points here and there (even though it never really materialized at Minnesota last year), but is probably better in his own end. I think hell be watched very closely throughout the camp and the first half of the year. If he can play at his best, Skjei brings a skill set the team will need to try and defend the gold medal at the WJC. Hes the type of guy the USA staff will give every opportunity to make the team. As some added pressure, Skjei is the only defenseman to have been a first-round selection at the NHL Draft camping with the U.S. New York Rangers (2012, 1st Rd., 28th overall)
http://unitedstatesofhockey.com/2013...n-and-goalies/

Quote:
Christoval Boo Nieves (Univ. of Michigan) USA White With the way his freshman season went at Michigan, I think Nieves showed he made the right choice when he picked schools. Having split the previous season between prep school and the USHL, he really developed a ton over the course of the last season and I think hell seriously push for a spot in Malmo. He showed more of a willingness to pay the price for offense, put on a bunch of muscle to his 6-foot-3 frame and still has some really strong puck skills. Gone are the knocks that he was only a perimeter player and now hes looking like a quality prospect. He posted 21 assists in a tough season for Michigan and very well could be a top-six playmaking winger for this junior team. Nieves, who has Ivan Hlinka experience, has to show in camp what he did in the latter half of his freshman campaign. If he does that, hell quickly become a favorite to claim a spot on the squad. New York Rangers (2012, 2nd Rd., 59th overall)
http://unitedstatesofhockey.com/2013...view-forwards/

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08-01-2013, 02:41 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
And this is why I have a hard time believing you have seen him play, ODC.
come on.

i saw the whale play 5 times last season. in person. with mcilrath.

and i watched a ton of moose jaw games via internet after his draft year.

i see a guy whos big, mean, aggressive, and raw. i dont see a kid with alot of natural hockey ability however.

so, you were saying ?

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08-01-2013, 02:57 PM
  #74
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At least we don't have to hear about Fowler anymore, considering he's a train-wreck.

ODC knows more than most people who post here, myself included, but I think the vendetta against McIlrath will be one of lifes unsolved mysteries.
stop. hes perhaps the best skating dman in the league, if not, hes top 3 easy.

he averaged over 20 min ice time per game last season and was a -4 over all playing top 4 minutes. in the playoffs he was almost 23 min toi. 7 games/ 3 assists and a -3

pretty sure the ducks gave him 5/20m deal 2 yrs ago.

he didnt score nearly as much as was expected but trainwreck ?

ya no...

and i have no vendetta against big mac at all. none what so ever. imo, we made an error with that pick. could have chosen a better, more nhl ready offensive player at 10. some one who could be helping us score goals today. right now.

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08-01-2013, 03:05 PM
  #75
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The offensive potential he "oozed" has disappeared and his defense is still not good.

He's worse than MDZ and people here think MDZ is the anti-christ. If he wasn't as highly touted as he was, Anaheim fans wouldn't be making excuses for him suddenly turning into this "great two-way defenseman." It goes to show, again, how hard the draft can be to predict.

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