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Free Agent FRENZY! Part IV Trade and proposals

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08-02-2013, 04:34 PM
  #651
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I'm expecting we will only be able to keep 1 of Kulie and Bolland

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08-02-2013, 04:35 PM
  #652
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Originally Posted by JMcLeaf View Post
I'm expecting we will only be able to keep 1 of Kulie and Bolland
I don't want either if we have to pay 3+mill. Unless Bolland breaks out offensively or something.

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08-02-2013, 04:37 PM
  #653
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I don't want either if we have to pay 3+mill. Unless Bolland breaks out offensively or something.
If we could get them both long term around 3-3.5 I'd be very happy. That will look like a steal in a couple years

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08-02-2013, 04:41 PM
  #654
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Originally Posted by Duffman955 View Post
I don't want either if we have to pay 3+mill. Unless Bolland breaks out offensively or something.
Bolland is well worth 3M, a solid 40 pt centre who can anchor the 3rd line and brings great value in tough situations like the playoffs. The way he schooled Vancouver three years in a row as well as his performances against San Jose and Philadelphia in 2010 were a thing of beauty. Then the cherry on top this year, putting the dagger into the Bruins' hearts.

The only thing that I worry about with him is injuries...

Kulemin is also worth 3M imo, he would be scoring a lot more with any other team, but with how Carlyle uses him he will likely only put up 10-15 goals. Still, his defensive presence and board work is not to be undervalued.

It depends on how this year goes for them really..we have prospects who can replace them both soon enough though if worst comes to worst.

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08-02-2013, 04:41 PM
  #655
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Originally Posted by OptimusForever View Post
If we could get them both long term around 3-3.5 I'd be very happy. That will look like a steal in a couple years
Spending that much money on secondary players is unnecessary.

Most good teams lock up their core players for big money long term, and continuously rotate cheap role players.

Look at Chicago as an example.

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08-02-2013, 04:55 PM
  #656
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I dont think Bolland has offensive game as many people believe but he'll be a great player for us for sure.

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08-02-2013, 05:28 PM
  #657
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Originally Posted by Duffman955 View Post
Spending that much money on secondary players is unnecessary.

Most good teams lock up their core players for big money long term, and continuously rotate cheap role players.

Look at Chicago as an example.
Salary cap is gonna skyrocket in the next few years. One or two third liners at 3 mil isn't bad at all. Especially if they're some of the best in the game. And I think both bolland and kulemin can be good on the second line if need be, especially kulemin.

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08-02-2013, 05:51 PM
  #658
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Originally Posted by JMcLeaf View Post
I'm expecting we will only be able to keep 1 of Kulie and Bolland
I doubt Kulemin stays. There's no way the Leafs will pay what he'll want considering the top six is set.

Kulie could get 4 million in UFA, and there's no way he'll get close to that from Nonis.

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08-02-2013, 06:06 PM
  #659
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Originally Posted by OptimusForever View Post
Salary cap is gonna skyrocket in the next few years. One or two third liners at 3 mil isn't bad at all. Especially if they're some of the best in the game. And I think both bolland and kulemin can be good on the second line if need be, especially kulemin.
What makes you say that?

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08-02-2013, 06:09 PM
  #660
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i agree. he might even want more. i cant really get a sense with him if he is going to want to go for the jugular. it wouldnt shock me if he wanted $7.5 x 8 years. it really wouldnt. im prepared to $7 million x 5 or drop 1/2 million for every year added. he would be kind of scary though for 8 years at $6 million though.



i think you might be disappointed.

i dont see kessel signing for a penny under $7.5, i think closer to $8 million is more likely.

i dont see phaneuf signing for under $7 million. i hope he does but i dont see it.

why would gards sign a contract like that. it really sells himself short. if he picks up where he left off in the playoffs he isnt going to want to sign a deal like that longterm. you might get him at $3.5 on a bridge deal.

you might get mclemment at $1.75 million but it will probably take term. i think we might be able to keep bolland as well but it is going to take term. if clarkson took term over money to play in his hometown then maybe mclemment and bolland will follow suit but it will take 5 years or better for each which is kind of scary especially with bollands injury issues.

i think kulemins days are numbered and it will be a huge shame. if clarkson got $5.2 million x 7 years i dont see how kulemin doesnt at least get $4 million which is a little steep for a guy playing on the 3rd line. i suspect the leafs will only be able to keep 2 of kulemin, bolland, and mclemment baring some amazing cap moves by nonis (which i dont see happening)
I'm looking at other young dmen who took term for around 3.5 to 4 mil over 6-7 years, many of whom are better then Gards, plus he still hat 3-4 RFA years left so I think 3.5 to 4 is quite realistic. As for Phaneuf, I think him and his agent should take a look at Bowmeesters contract and have a hard time getting anything over 6.5.

I think it's realistic to see Kessel signing for 7.5 longterm, he has grown on the fans and seems to be more then capable of thriving on the pressure that T.O offers, sure he's a little awkward, but I think he loves it here with Bozie.

McClemment would be great here longterm, give him 1.75 for 4-5 years and I think he takes it. As for Kule and Bolland, I see more value in dealing them at the deadline for likely 1sts (great time to sell high) and I believe their roles can be filled from within quite easily.

Post deadline I see us around the 7 spot in the conference and 3 in the division at which point I believe Bollands role could be taken by Colborne and Kules role by Ashton and D'Amigo.

Bottom 6 of

D'Amigo - Mcclement - Ashton
McLaren - Colborne - Orr

While young, both players are more then capable of playing the defensive minutes because of Eakins strict defensive play. Smith would likely be the extra forward.

Apologies for any spelling mistakes, I'm on my phone.

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08-02-2013, 09:33 PM
  #661
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I'm looking at other young dmen who took term for around 3.5 to 4 mil over 6-7 years, many of whom are better then Gards, plus he still hat 3-4 RFA years left so I think 3.5 to 4 is quite realistic. As for Phaneuf, I think him and his agent should take a look at Bowmeesters contract and have a hard time getting anything over 6.5.

I think it's realistic to see Kessel signing for 7.5 longterm, he has grown on the fans and seems to be more then capable of thriving on the pressure that T.O offers, sure he's a little awkward, but I think he loves it here with Bozie.

McClemment would be great here longterm, give him 1.75 for 4-5 years and I think he takes it. As for Kule and Bolland, I see more value in dealing them at the deadline for likely 1sts (great time to sell high) and I believe their roles can be filled from within quite easily.

Post deadline I see us around the 7 spot in the conference and 3 in the division at which point I believe Bollands role could be taken by Colborne and Kules role by Ashton and D'Amigo.

Bottom 6 of

D'Amigo - Mcclement - Ashton
McLaren - Colborne - Orr

While young, both players are more then capable of playing the defensive minutes because of Eakins strict defensive play. Smith would likely be the extra forward.

Apologies for any spelling mistakes, I'm on my phone.
That would literally be the worst bottom 6 in the league.

I get that Randy likes to have gritty defensive players in his bottom six, but I'm sure he would also like more than a combined 60 points from this group in a season.

Edit: if you believe the Leafs will be in a playoff spot, why the hell would you want them to trade a guy like Bolland? Two Cups, including a Cup winning goal! People really have to stop obsessing over shiny first round picks. You get late 1st's at the deadline, which generally turn into a player that can help in 5 years, or most of the time simply a bust. Guys like Bolland should be part of the Leafs future, he's done nothing but win at every level. To think mid tier prospects like D'Amigo and Ashton can seamlessly replace players like Bolland and Kulemin is pretty ridiculous.


Last edited by Drew311: 08-02-2013 at 09:41 PM.
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08-02-2013, 09:42 PM
  #662
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If franson couldn't be signed, would you guys be ok with a franson-Tanev swap. Tanev is a right shot and also a more defensive responsible player then Franson. I think he would be a great fit with Gardiner and would really be a solid pairing in a couple of years.

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08-02-2013, 10:15 PM
  #663
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If franson couldn't be signed, would you guys be ok with a franson-Tanev swap. Tanev is a right shot and also a more defensive responsible player then Franson. I think he would be a great fit with Gardiner and would really be a solid pairing in a couple of years.
If Franson is traded I would hope Nonis moves him for the best forward prospect possible. This is the real weakness of the organization, especially high ceiling centres. Considering Nashville got Filip Forsberg for Erat, I would hope Nonis could get a similar type of prospect for Franson.

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08-02-2013, 10:26 PM
  #664
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If Franson is traded I would hope Nonis moves him for the best forward prospect possible. This is the real weakness of the organization, especially high ceiling centres. Considering Nashville got Filip Forsberg for Erat, I would hope Nonis could get a similar type of prospect for Franson.
I think the real weakness of the team is a shutdown dman preferably a right shoot one. The leafs don't need to trade for prospects, prospects can be had in the draft. We need a young defensemen with similar potential in any Franson move.

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08-02-2013, 10:28 PM
  #665
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If Franson is traded I would hope Nonis moves him for the best forward prospect possible. This is the real weakness of the organization, especially high ceiling centres. Considering Nashville got Filip Forsberg for Erat, I would hope Nonis could get a similar type of prospect for Franson.
Agreed.

Unless he's a solid top 4 young d, who has potential. A Filip Forsberg is the kind of return I'd want for Franson.

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08-02-2013, 11:09 PM
  #666
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I hope we keep Franson, but for discussion purposes who are some teams that 1)need defense 2)can afford to pay him what he wants 3)have a good pool of forward prospects

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08-02-2013, 11:25 PM
  #667
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I think the real weakness of the team is a shutdown dman preferably a right shoot one. The leafs don't need to trade for prospects, prospects can be had in the draft. We need a young defensemen with similar potential in any Franson move.
A shutdown defenseman may currently be a weakness of the team, but organizationally speaking the Leafs have a boatload of solid defensive prospects who are not far off from cracking the line up.

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08-03-2013, 02:23 AM
  #668
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A shutdown defenseman may currently be a weakness of the team, but organizationally speaking the Leafs have a boatload of solid defensive prospects who are not far off from cracking the line up.
Percy,Finn, and Rielly are all left handed dman and not exactly the shutdown type were looking for.

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08-03-2013, 02:35 AM
  #669
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Percy,Finn, and Rielly are all left handed dman and not exactly the shutdown type were looking for.
What about Granberg

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08-03-2013, 02:54 AM
  #670
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Percy,Finn, and Rielly are all left handed dman and not exactly the shutdown type were looking for.
Actually Finn and Percy are very solid in their own end, and Rielly is no slouch. Granberg is also a very good defensive defenseman that has done quite well in International tournaments.

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08-03-2013, 04:08 AM
  #671
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Actually Finn and Percy are very solid in their own end, and Rielly is no slouch. Granberg is also a very good defensive defenseman that has done quite well in International tournaments.
All of them are more two way dman then shutdown. It would be great if we can acquire somone in the same mood as Schenn. Big strong tough right handed dman, that would thrive in Carlyle's system.

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08-03-2013, 04:30 AM
  #672
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Originally Posted by JMcLeaf View Post
I hope we keep Franson, but for discussion purposes who are some teams that 1)need defense 2)can afford to pay him what he wants 3)have a good pool of forward prospects
1(I'm looking specifically at a team that could use a 2nd pairing D man):
Anaheim
Calgary
Avs
Panthers
Wild
Islanders
Rangers
Flyers

Those are the teams that can use a top 4 D man, IMO. However, I'd instantly want my GM fired if he wasn't asking about Franson, as a GM should ALWAYS be trying to improve his team.

2)
Ducks if they move a small amount of salary.
Flames, easily.
Avs, easily.
Panthers, easily.
Wild, no.
Islanders, easily.
Rangers, no.
Flyers, no.

However, I see the Flames with mild to little interest. The Avalanche and Ducks could be interested, depending on the faith each team has in their prospects. The Avs have Barrie ready, and the Ducks have Sbisa. Panthers and Islanders are both wild cards, they have players like Weaver and Street in their top 4 (to my regard), both would be replaced by Franson.

3) Ducks have good forward prospects. Avalanche have some nice ones.

In my hypothetical deal, if I were Nonis and the Avs were looking, I'd want Hishon+, I wouldn't expect the + to be big.

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08-03-2013, 08:33 AM
  #673
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In my hypothetal deal, if I were Nonis and the Avs were looking, I'd want Hishon+, I wouldn't expect the + to be big.
You want a guy who just missed almost 2 years with a concussion, then played 9 games before getting another concussion and missing the rest of the year?

Despite his talent, at this point Hishon has next to no value due to his injury problems.

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08-03-2013, 12:28 PM
  #674
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All of them are more two way dman then shutdown. It would be great if we can acquire somone in the same mood as Schenn. Big strong tough right handed dman, that would thrive in Carlyle's system.
Percy is more of an intelligent defensive player like Gunnarsson. I don't think you have to be like Foote, Stevens or Schenn to be categorized as a 'shut-down' type. As long as your game is tailored more to a defensive nature, then you can be used in a shut down role.

Granberg and Percy should add some better overall defensive stability to our line up, while being able to play top 4 minutes. Frasor plays that intelligent yet rugged shut down role, but is athletically limited to playing against lesser competition.

Having a line up with 3 or 4 defense first style players would ease the load on a player like Dion.

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08-03-2013, 12:44 PM
  #675
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Percy is more of an intelligent defensive player like Gunnarsson. I don't think you have to be like Foote, Stevens or Schenn to be categorized as a 'shut-down' type. As long as your game is tailored more to a defensive nature, then you can be used in a shut down role.

Granberg and Percy should add some better overall defensive stability to our line up, while being able to play top 4 minutes. Frasor plays that intelligent yet rugged shut down role, but is athletically limited to playing against lesser competition.

Having a line up with 3 or 4 defense first style players would ease the load on a player like Dion.
The Adam Foote style of defensive defenseman doesnt have the same value it held before all the rule changes. Interference calls for picks, no more waterskiing and one-arm holds, 2-line pass, even the goalie being restricted in where he can play the puck. All this means that mobility is far more important because players have so many more ways to get behind you. You don't need big lumbering defenseman who rarely cross centre-ice to be "defensive defensemen." You need guys that wont get beaten by speed on the rush who also possess the good board-work and intelligent stickwork.

Schenn would have been twice the defenseman before all that changed.

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