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110% Trade scenarios to get Lecavalier

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Old
11-06-2006, 11:55 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by raketheleaves View Post

Would have been nice to have overpaid for Jerome Iginla when Calgary was shopping him around a couple years ago. We might have won a Cup by now.

What I'm saying is, if we're gonna spend $7 mil on a player, he better damned well have heart.
Iginla's contract is just as bad as Vinny's. Terrible, terrible moves by the GMs.

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11-06-2006, 11:55 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Jaded and Agrestic View Post
I like Ryder's game, he's a hard worker with a nice nose for the net. He's improved during the summer as well, but Lecavalier is a significantly better player in every facet of the game.
$5 million better?

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11-06-2006, 11:56 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by habsfan89 View Post
Just a question without any relation on 110% hockey expert if we were going to trade for exemple souray + ryder to phyladelphia for their first round choice and jeff carter (remember that this is only an exemple and i know thats a bad one) so if we have flyers's first round choice and they finnish 30 in the league will it be the first overall pick ? or the draft ranking will be considered by our team standing

just wanted to know
It will be their standing, not ours. Sam pollock did that a couple of times, trading for the first round pick of a poor team before the season started.

But given the position they're in, I doubt they'd trade their first round pick. Maybe the second (or two if they have that many), as a tribute to clarkie.

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11-06-2006, 11:58 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by GSK View Post
You're right...

But 6.8m$ isn't sooo bad at all...

Honestly I would like to see Lecavalier in Montreal...

But I think a first round pick + Ryder or Samsonov and a prospect would be a big big payment for him...

He's really good, can play a decent 2-way game but he's a 30 to 40 goals scorer and 70 to 85 center... (90+ its not out of question)

But no way we will deal Andrei Markov + Michael Ryder + Carey Price...

Ryder + Markov + ??? May be but our D will be screwed up
I thought he made 7,2 M$, which is not a huge gap from 6,8M$ anyway.

Even if the cap was 50M$ his salary would still be 1/7th of the total cap. (Right now, it counts for 1/6th of the total cap)

Tampa are in such a mess right now because they gave those huge contracts, let's not repeat their stupid mistakes.

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11-07-2006, 12:02 AM
  #30
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Now that was funny Bergeron should be shot for even thinking that.

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11-07-2006, 12:02 AM
  #31
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In a salary cap system, the last thing you want is a guy with a huge salary.

It screws your team and you are forced to have a team with only one good line and a bunch of nobodies on the 3rd and 4th line. You can't go far with a team with no depth.

So I wouldn't do any of those proposals.
Agreed, but IMO you have to think about the future. Take the first option less the pick. So there's about a 1.5 million difference to the cap hit (though I've heard his hit after this season is less than what TSN is showing me right now so it could only be a 1 million difference). Do we have that much room? I don't know. Let's say we do, but we'll talk about the players first. So we're giving up a backup goaltender (for all intents and purposes) while we've got at least one in the pipeline and realistically two. Then you're giving up a second line winger who thus far has been up and down and who also got pissed when he was demoted because he wasn't performing. You're also losing a winger who we have in abundance. Everybody's always having a wet dream about Kostitsyn, so call him up. Or bring up Chipchura or Lapierre. We've got enough depth. So what are we getting in return? We're getting a "2nd line center". Well let's be realistic here. Lecavalier is still quite young in hockey terms. He's also more than a 2nd line center. He'd be a 1st line center on more teams than he wouldn't. He's also really coming into his own and IMO will only get better as he's not even near his prime. He's even adding other dimensions to his game that have been missing in the past. I wonder how many points he'd put on the board if he was 1st line center all these years. He's on a helluva pace this season. IMO on players alone it's a no brainer.

The cap hit is a consideration though and a valid point. IMO that's the only problem here. But how much of a problem is it? Didn't they just raise the cap this past season? Don't you think it'll go up again? If it does continue to rise then I'm all for him coming as we'll get more room over the years. This is the rub though, IMO for it to work we'd need the cap to continue to rise (even it's only slightly).

The thing for me is that we'd be getting a what would most likely be a franchise center that otherwise would be near impossible to get. We'd also be getting a local lad (from Quebec). I'm all for more guys on the team from Quebec or who came up through the youth ranks. Either way, I just think he could be a player that we'd really appreciate for years.

The thing is, does Tampa do it? IMO no as they'd rather offload St. Louis and Richards first.

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11-07-2006, 12:03 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waffledave View Post
$5 million better?
Maybe not, but Ryder will most likely be making more then 2M at the start of the next year. The deal in question would also put Montreal over the cap, under the old rules, the Canadiens would've made out like bandits. In the NHL as it stands, as much as I appreciate his game, I don't think Koivu is worth his pricetag, Lecavalier's even horrible contract would completly handcuff the team, preventing them from resigning any good young players currently on the roster.

But on a strict player comparison, I don't see a lot of player on the current squad that are better, Markov namely, but no one else.

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11-07-2006, 12:08 AM
  #33
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Agreed, but IMO you have to think about the future. Take the first option less the pick. So there's about a 1.5 million difference to the cap hit (though I've heard his hit after this season is less than what TSN is showing me right now so it could only be a 1 million difference). Do we have that much room? I don't know. Let's say we do, but we'll talk about the players first. So we're giving up a backup goaltender (for all intents and purposes) while we've got at least one in the pipeline and realistically two. Then you're giving up a second line winger who thus far has been up and down and who also got pissed when he was demoted because he wasn't performing. You're also losing a winger who we have in abundance. Everybody's always having a wet dream about Kostitsyn, so call him up. Or bring up Chipchura or Lapierre. We've got enough depth. So what are we getting in return? We're getting a "2nd line center". Well let's be realistic here. Lecavalier is still quite young in hockey terms. He's also more than a 2nd line center. He'd be a 1st line center on more teams than he wouldn't. He's also really coming into his own and IMO will only get better as he's not even near his prime. He's even adding other dimensions to his game that have been missing in the past. I wonder how many points he'd put on the board if he was 1st line center all these years. He's on a helluva pace this season. IMO on players alone it's a no brainer.

The cap hit is a consideration though and a valid point. IMO that's the only problem here. But how much of a problem is it? Didn't they just raise the cap this past season? Don't you think it'll go up again? If it does continue to rise then I'm all for him coming as we'll get more room over the years. This is the rub though, IMO for it to work we'd need the cap to continue to rise (even it's only slightly).

The thing for me is that we'd be getting a what would most likely be a franchise center that otherwise would be near impossible to get. We'd also be getting a local lad (from Quebec). I'm all for more guys on the team from Quebec or who came up through the youth ranks. Either way, I just think he could be a player that we'd really appreciate for years.

The thing is, does Tampa do it? IMO no as they'd rather offload St. Louis and Richards first.
I understand your point. I would love to have a guy like Lecavalier on our team, but he's too damn expensive.

Anyway, Jacques Demers (a close friend of Jay Feaster) has stated that Feaster said Lecavalier was not going to be traded so we are pretty much wasting our time debating the subject. Like you said, Richards and St-Louis are the two that could more likely be traded, but can anyone afford them?

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Old
11-07-2006, 12:11 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by fredez View Post
I understand your point. I would love to have a guy like Lecavalier on our team, but he's too damn expensive.

Anyway, Jacques Demers (a close friend of Jay Feaster) has stated that Feaster said Lecavalier was not going to be traded so we are pretty much wasting our time debating the subject.
Well that's the thing. It's the cap that keeps us from making the trade, yet it's the cap that makes it possible.

Yeah, that's what I was saying. IMO St. Louis would go first and then Richards. St. Louis 'cause he's older and Richards 'cause he's paid the most.

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11-07-2006, 12:17 AM
  #35
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Wche wche, if we want Lecavalier, we'll have to sign him as a UFA.

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11-07-2006, 12:18 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by les Habs View Post
IMO St. Louis would go first and then Richards. St. Louis 'cause he's older and Richards 'cause he's paid the most.
The thing is, St-Louis has a no trade clause which can make it hard to trade him and Richards is basically impossible to trade with his HUGE contract.

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11-07-2006, 12:18 AM
  #37
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And btw, when is Lecavalier a UFA ?

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11-07-2006, 12:21 AM
  #38
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And btw, when is Lecavalier a UFA ?
After the 2008-09 season.

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11-07-2006, 12:25 AM
  #39
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The thing is, St-Louis has a no trade clause which can make it hard to trade him and Richards is basically impossible to trade with his HUGE contract.
He does? I thought I read that St. Louis has no such clause. Either way, great counterpoints. Imagine if you were a **** team way under the cap. Just give them a #1 pick for all three.

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11-07-2006, 12:25 AM
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I think we are missing the big picture here...
How the hell are we going to fit $7.8 million in our cap? We have what, $1.3 million to spare? We need to shed a looot of salary before sneaking in Vince.

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11-07-2006, 12:26 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by FF de Mars View Post
Wche wche, if we want Lecavalier, we'll have to sign him as a UFA.
1 I'd rather have him now than wait.

2 He could potentially cost as much if not more by then.

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11-07-2006, 12:28 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by les Habs View Post
2 He could potentially cost as much if not more by then.
Unless he puts up a 100 point season this year, I doubt it.

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11-07-2006, 12:28 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Strazzobosco View Post
I think we are missing the big picture here...
How the hell are we going to fit $7.8 million in our cap? We have what, $1.3 million to spare? We need to shed a looot of salary before sneaking in Vince.
Where did you get 7.8? I'm not taking the piss, I'm asking. TSN has 7.18 and somebody else mentioned 6. something. Samsonov and Abby would be a wash for most of that. Of course that doesn't cover it all and his salary would still hurt us in the future in terms of resigning current guys (unless as I mentioned the cap kept rising).

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11-07-2006, 12:29 AM
  #44
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I agree that the team needs a good centre but Lecavalier is not it. Not at those prices anyway. He'll be UFA again in a couple of years and he'll have the option choosing Tampa over Montreal yet again. Give me Richards any day over Vinnie.

Perhaps Bergeron and co. forgot that he chose not to play for the Habs.

As someone else pointed out, for $7 million, the player better have heart and be the cornerstone of the franchise. Chara, Neidermayer, Pronger etc...come to mind.

Save the money and re-sign the defense. Markov and Souray add more to your team than Lecavalier.

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11-07-2006, 12:29 AM
  #45
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Unless he puts up a 100 point season this year, I doubt it.
Well he is currently on pace.

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11-07-2006, 12:31 AM
  #46
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A lot of people are on pace to do a lot of things this season...we'll just wait and see

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11-07-2006, 12:34 AM
  #47
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A lot of people are on pace to do a lot of things this season...we'll just wait and see
Koivu was on pace for 164 goals, 82 assists after the 1st game.

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11-07-2006, 12:37 AM
  #48
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Please everybody stop saying he's got 7.8...


The cap hit of his contract his 6,875,000 !


At that price, its not so bad, its not like we have St. Louis, Richard and Lecavalier higher then 6...


St 6.8 we can afford him, but we need to give big salary in return... For exemple (not real) Ryder 2.2 + Bonk 2.3 + Janne Niinimaa 2.5 + 1st OV Would fit (This is not a proposal but exemple)

If you ask me Kovalev or Lecavalier.. I would take Lecavalier at 6.8

But its may be just me, I like the kind of play of Vinny

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11-07-2006, 12:39 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by les Habs View Post
1 I'd rather have him now than wait.

2 He could potentially cost as much if not more by then.
1 In that case, say goodbye to 2 of Souray, Markov, Rivet...Say goodbye to Ryder as well...Aebi too. If Gainey is lucky he could maybe keep Johnson.

2 His next contract will be about what Kovalev gets.

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11-07-2006, 12:40 AM
  #50
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Please everybody stop saying he's got 7.8...


The cap hit of his contract his 6,875,000 !


At that price, its not so bad, its not like we have St. Louis, Richard and Lecavalier higher then 6...


St 6.8 we can afford him, but we need to give big salary in return... For exemple (not real) Ryder 2.2 + Bonk 2.3 + Janne Niinimaa 2.5 + 1st OV Would fit (This is not a proposal but exemple)

If you ask me Kovalev or Lecavalier.. I would take Lecavalier at 6.8

But its may be just me, I like the kind of play of Vinny
Kovalev and Vinny are quite similar.

Inconsistent as hell.

Except with Kovalev it's game to game. Vinny is season to season.

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