HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Calgary Flames
Notices

Fire Playfair!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-02-2006, 03:47 PM
  #1
Johnny Hoxville
Moderator
Formerly MVW
 
Johnny Hoxville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,887
vCash: 50
Fire Playfair!

I know I'm gonna get alot flack on this one but the Flames need to fire Playfair and fire him today! Don't get me wrong I think Jim is a great guy and knows a ton about hockey but he is the wrong coach for this team. The Flames are a veteran team and do not need a rookie head coach who needs time to find his grove as a head coach. They need a headcoach (like Sutter) who knows how to motivate this team and get the most out of his players. If the Flames wait too long to fire Playfair not only their division be out of their reach but so will the playoffs!

Johnny Hoxville is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-02-2006, 04:16 PM
  #2
Harry
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Victoria BC
Posts: 206
vCash: 500
Well. Before you do that..Get the Flames a first line big center that they have needed for years. You would then see a big difference in that team. Langkow is not the answer.

Also get Regehr away from Dion. He is standing around watching Dion do his thing. You move Regehr in with a offensive d man where Regehr has to be the hitter and his play will become much more effective.

Dumping Playfair after a month is not the answer. Sutter is the Gm and he has to get that Center.

Harry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-02-2006, 04:24 PM
  #3
TOML
Registered User
 
TOML's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Walnut Grove
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,607
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MVW View Post
I know I'm gonna get alot flack on this one but the Flames need to fire Playfair and fire him today! Don't get me wrong I think Jim is a great guy and knows a ton about hockey but he is the wrong coach for this team. The Flames are a veteran team and do not need a rookie head coach who needs time to find his grove as a head coach. They need a headcoach (like Sutter) who knows how to motivate this team and get the most out of his players. If the Flames wait too long to fire Playfair not only their division be out of their reach but so will the playoffs!
While coaches are hired to be fired, isn't it more the fault of the GM (Sutter) for assembling the wrong group of players together?

After the cinderella cup run, what moves has Sutter done to improve the team?

Lose Conroy to free agency. Not good.
Sign Amonte. Not good.
Lose Gelinas to free agency. Not good to par.
Lose Chris Clark (who was 10pts in 11 games) to the Capitals. Not Good.
Trade Saprykin and Gauthier for Langkow. Not good to par.
Trade Montador and Johner for Huselius. Good.
Trade Leopold and 2 picks for Tanguay. Good.
Trade Reinprecht and Sauve for Boucher and LeClerc. Not good.
Sign McCarty. Insignificant.
Sign Friesen. Not good.
Sign Hamrlik. Okay.
Sign Zyuzin. Whatever.
Bring up Phaneuf. No-brainer.

So beyond the flukey Kiprusoff aquisition, Sutter has a pretty low batting average with trades. Savard lights it up in Atlanta. Stillman wins back-to-back cups. Drury. etc. etc. etc.

TOML is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-02-2006, 04:45 PM
  #4
Flamesfan 26
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 668
vCash: 500
You don't need to fire Playfair. Just send him to the minors. LOL

Flamesfan 26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-02-2006, 05:10 PM
  #5
DL44
Registered User
 
DL44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Left Coast
Posts: 5,391
vCash: 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOMapleLaughs View Post
While coaches are hired to be fired, isn't it more the fault of the GM (Sutter) for assembling the wrong group of players together?

After the cinderella cup run, what moves has Sutter done to improve the team?
Beat me to it...
SUTTER is far more responisble for the Flames woes than anyone else....
Playfair is playing the cards he's been delt.... and i think he'll be given the benefit of the doubt for awhile yet...

Personel is biggest problem on this team.... they just don't have the adequate talent.

what have been the contributions of Freisen, Amonte, McCarthy, Nilison, Huselius, Lundmark, Zyuzin....?

remember how 2 years ago Calgary was considered the fastest team in league??
he stripped that team of all its speed... Gelinas, Clarke, Saprykin, Nimminen gone the first yr, and then this yr, he fails to re-sign arguablely their fastest player in Dono.... stone hands... yes. solid forechecker... definitely.

its no wonder the flames forecheck has been way less than adequate and they've been taking so many penalties chasing the play.

He makes a great trade in landing Tanguay by taking advantage of an Avs team up against the cap.... but he fails to supplement the roster with anyone that can be considered a #1 center...

there is zero offensive creativity being displayed by anyone on the top 6.... Huselius maybe... Tanguay can't do it all himself.
Ignila, offensively, is just a pure sniper... a great sniper, but limited playmaking ability.

another major factor... Sutter failed to upgrade the defense. Leopold has not been replaced.... Zyuzin hasn't been the upgrade fans had hoped. remember how dominate Leopold was playing defensively last yr even tho he wasn't scoring offensively? he was playing a sizable 22 mins/gm as a plus player vs Zyuzin's 17:40/gm as a minus player (actually who isn't on the flames so far)

Kipper hasn't been playing like Kipper-vezina-winner of last yr... he's been probably the best Flames player on the ice, but he's already let in a lot of un-kipper-like goals. even last night he let in what i would consider a weak goal...
mind you he isn't getting the defensive support he's used to which has made him look very human. even tho many loved his burst of emotion during with the whole kicking-the-stick incident, its just another sign that the ever so cool and calm Kipper is not himself....

Sutter calling out so many players in the media was a ballzy but risky manuver...
he's really got to know the personalities of the players to know whether it would motivate em... if the Det game was any indication, it's backfiring - but i'll wait to see how they respond in columbus and st. louis before making that judgment. they could still generate some momentum with a couple of wins and everything could be just fine... but as it stands right now...........

anyways.... Moving Sutter behind the bench will not solve the problems being displayed by this team... its a lot deeper than simiply motivating the players....
they need to change the formula a bit and make some sort of personel moves.... and if they go 0-3 on this road trip.... i'll be expecting some changes....

but hey, i'm a bias nucks fan and my observations are based on watching just a few games (5ish) and reading up on the rest - recaps/forums/boxscores/highlights...
i'm sure i'm not being as astute as a hardcore flames fan thats seen every game, so please correct me if i'm wrong in any area of my observations....


Last edited by DL44: 11-02-2006 at 05:24 PM.
DL44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-02-2006, 06:04 PM
  #6
JiriHrdina
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 504
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOMapleLaughs View Post
While coaches are hired to be fired, isn't it more the fault of the GM (Sutter) for assembling the wrong group of players together?

After the cinderella cup run, what moves has Sutter done to improve the team?

Lose Conroy to free agency. Not good.
Sign Amonte. Not good.
Lose Gelinas to free agency. Not good to par.
Lose Chris Clark (who was 10pts in 11 games) to the Capitals. Not Good.
Trade Saprykin and Gauthier for Langkow. Not good to par.
Trade Montador and Johner for Huselius. Good.
Trade Leopold and 2 picks for Tanguay. Good.
Trade Reinprecht and Sauve for Boucher and LeClerc. Not good.
Sign McCarty. Insignificant.
Sign Friesen. Not good.
Sign Hamrlik. Okay.
Sign Zyuzin. Whatever.
Bring up Phaneuf. No-brainer.

So beyond the flukey Kiprusoff aquisition, Sutter has a pretty low batting average with trades. Savard lights it up in Atlanta. Stillman wins back-to-back cups. Drury. etc. etc. etc.
Lots of stuff to disagree with there

Conroy - is proving to be the correct decision not to grant him that contract that included a NTC. 3 points this year I think? Yeah - he's doin' greeeeeat.

Trade Saprykin and Gauthier for Langkow. Not good to par. - How is this not good to par? Saprykin is still the Sappy that frustrated us around here. Great occasionally, junk the rest of the time. Gauthier is part of the gong show that is the Philly defense. Langkow meanwhile has been one of Calgary's most consistent forwards.

Trade Reinprecht and Sauve for Boucher and LeClerc. Not good. - all players involved were pending ufas. Insignificant at worst.

Sign Friesen. Not good. - too early to tell.

Sutter has a pretty low batting average with trades. Savard lights it up in Atlanta. Stillman wins back-to-back cups. Drury. etc. etc. etc - Sutter did not trade Stillman nor Savard so not sure where you're going with that.

JiriHrdina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-02-2006, 06:52 PM
  #7
ArizonaGreenTea
Registered User
 
ArizonaGreenTea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,185
vCash: 500
Considering that Stillman went for Conroy, I would consider that a good move, even if Sutter wasn't involved. I imagine the OP considers that a good move too, otherwise he would consider not resigning Conroy for 3+ million with a long term NTC contract a bad decision.

ArizonaGreenTea is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-02-2006, 07:33 PM
  #8
Danny__K
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,143
vCash: 50
One thing i do agree with DL44, is that kipper is playing well enough but not kipperesque. INfact i don't think it would be a stretch to blame him for the loses in both Montreal and TO. He leftin a couple stinkers in both of those games. sundins 499th and 500th come to mind.

Danny__K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-02-2006, 09:40 PM
  #9
ThEd85
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Country: Sweden
Posts: 15
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOMapleLaughs View Post

So beyond the flukey Kiprusoff aquisition, Sutter has a pretty low batting average with trades. Savard lights it up in Atlanta. Stillman wins back-to-back cups. Drury. etc. etc. etc.
Craig Button..yes no yes?

ThEd85 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-03-2006, 01:29 AM
  #10
Lunatik*
 
Lunatik*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Lethbridge
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,918
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOMapleLaughs View Post
While coaches are hired to be fired, isn't it more the fault of the GM (Sutter) for assembling the wrong group of players together?

After the cinderella cup run, what moves has Sutter done to improve the team?

Lose Conroy to free agency. Not good.
Sign Amonte. Not good.
Lose Gelinas to free agency. Not good to par.
Lose Chris Clark (who was 10pts in 11 games) to the Capitals. Not Good.
Trade Saprykin and Gauthier for Langkow. Not good to par.
Trade Montador and Johner for Huselius. Good.
Trade Leopold and 2 picks for Tanguay. Good.
Trade Reinprecht and Sauve for Boucher and LeClerc. Not good.
Sign McCarty. Insignificant.
Sign Friesen. Not good.
Sign Hamrlik. Okay.
Sign Zyuzin. Whatever.
Bring up Phaneuf. No-brainer.

So beyond the flukey Kiprusoff aquisition, Sutter has a pretty low batting average with trades. Savard lights it up in Atlanta. Stillman wins back-to-back cups. Drury. etc. etc. etc.
while i agree it's sutter's fault... at least get your facts right... those players you mentioned that I bolded... were moved before Sutter took over... and even if they were his moves... still brought in conroy and drury brought in warrener and reinprecht

and explain how moving Gauthier and Saprykin for Langkow was not a good move?? Langkow was near his career highs in goals and points... and finished 2nd in team scoring... and is second in team scoring now... Saprykin has done basically nothing... and Gauthier was traded before he played a full season in phoenix

Lunatik* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-03-2006, 02:20 AM
  #11
boarderex
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 141
vCash: 500
I'm not agreeing with much of this......

Lose Conroy to free agency. Not good. - LA paid too much... I think that makes this a good
Sign Amonte. Not good. - Did anyone really think Amonte would struggle this much?
Lose Gelinas to free agency. Not good to par. - Agreed, not good
Lose Chris Clark (who was 10pts in 11 games) to the Capitals. Not Good. - I bet you weren't complaining at the time!
Trade Saprykin and Gauthier for Langkow. Not good to par. - Saprykin can hardly stay on his feet... enough said
Trade Reinprecht and Sauve for Boucher and LeClerc. Not good. - Maybe the most insignificant trade Sutter has made
Sign Friesen. Not good. - nothing like basing a trade on 11 games
Sign Hamrlik. Okay. - Sutter paid WAY too much for Hamrlik... okay is being generous

boarderex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-03-2006, 10:57 AM
  #12
flamingmoe
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 23
vCash: 500
you know I'd love it if people waited till the ship set sail before jumping off without a lifejacket.



It's 11 games in and instead of being a pissed off postal worker with 10 Timmies in him...RELAX.

Sure it's frustrating to see our Flames skate like they have anchors attached to their a$$es but we have a bunch of new blood that come from diverse playing style teams, a new coach and a bunch of blowin in the wind "fans" that are convicting before the trial of the "missed playoffs of 06-07" has even begun.

I'll be cheering my team on tonight good or bad...what about you?

flamingmoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-03-2006, 12:04 PM
  #13
boarderex
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 141
vCash: 500
I think as fans it is natural to overeact to on-ice problems but I think it is different to complain about a new coach just as he's getting into the job. Darryl couldnt get this team going in October either. It certainly wont help the players buy in to the system when they hear fans calling for a coaching change. And lets face it... committing to a system is more important than the system itself.

boarderex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-04-2006, 12:07 PM
  #14
Johnny Hoxville
Moderator
Formerly MVW
 
Johnny Hoxville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,887
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry View Post
Well. Before you do that..Get the Flames a first line big center that they have needed for years. You would then see a big difference in that team. Langkow is not the answer.

Also get Regehr away from Dion. He is standing around watching Dion do his thing. You move Regehr in with a offensive d man where Regehr has to be the hitter and his play will become much more effective.

Dumping Playfair after a month is not the answer. Sutter is the Gm and he has to get that Center.

Wouldn't you classify Phanuef as offensive D man?

Johnny Hoxville is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-04-2006, 12:47 PM
  #15
Johnny Hoxville
Moderator
Formerly MVW
 
Johnny Hoxville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,887
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by DL44 View Post
Beat me to it...
SUTTER is far more responisble for the Flames woes than anyone else....
Playfair is playing the cards he's been delt.... and i think he'll be given the benefit of the doubt for awhile yet...

Personel is biggest problem on this team.... they just don't have the adequate talent.

what have been the contributions of Freisen, Amonte, McCarthy, Nilison, Huselius, Lundmark, Zyuzin....?

remember how 2 years ago Calgary was considered the fastest team in league??
he stripped that team of all its speed... Gelinas, Clarke, Saprykin, Nimminen gone the first yr, and then this yr, he fails to re-sign arguablely their fastest player in Dono.... stone hands... yes. solid forechecker... definitely.

its no wonder the flames forecheck has been way less than adequate and they've been taking so many penalties chasing the play.

He makes a great trade in landing Tanguay by taking advantage of an Avs team up against the cap.... but he fails to supplement the roster with anyone that can be considered a #1 center...

there is zero offensive creativity being displayed by anyone on the top 6.... Huselius maybe... Tanguay can't do it all himself.
Ignila, offensively, is just a pure sniper... a great sniper, but limited playmaking ability.

another major factor... Sutter failed to upgrade the defense. Leopold has not been replaced.... Zyuzin hasn't been the upgrade fans had hoped. remember how dominate Leopold was playing defensively last yr even tho he wasn't scoring offensively? he was playing a sizable 22 mins/gm as a plus player vs Zyuzin's 17:40/gm as a minus player (actually who isn't on the flames so far)

Kipper hasn't been playing like Kipper-vezina-winner of last yr... he's been probably the best Flames player on the ice, but he's already let in a lot of un-kipper-like goals. even last night he let in what i would consider a weak goal...
mind you he isn't getting the defensive support he's used to which has made him look very human. even tho many loved his burst of emotion during with the whole kicking-the-stick incident, its just another sign that the ever so cool and calm Kipper is not himself....

Sutter calling out so many players in the media was a ballzy but risky manuver...
he's really got to know the personalities of the players to know whether it would motivate em... if the Det game was any indication, it's backfiring - but i'll wait to see how they respond in columbus and st. louis before making that judgment. they could still generate some momentum with a couple of wins and everything could be just fine... but as it stands right now...........

anyways.... Moving Sutter behind the bench will not solve the problems being displayed by this team... its a lot deeper than simiply motivating the players....
they need to change the formula a bit and make some sort of personel moves.... and if they go 0-3 on this road trip.... i'll be expecting some changes....

but hey, i'm a bias nucks fan and my observations are based on watching just a few games (5ish) and reading up on the rest - recaps/forums/boxscores/highlights...
i'm sure i'm not being as astute as a hardcore flames fan thats seen every game, so please correct me if i'm wrong in any area of my observations....

You seriously think the flames do not have adequate talent? Iginla, Tanguay, Phanuef, Lombardi, Langkow, Kobasew, Huselius and yah I'll say Amonte and Friesen those guys don't have adequate talent? Yah, right! The problem is, when Sutter was the coached the team, the flames were considered the hardest working team in the league. They sure aren't playing like that right now and falls on the shoulders of Playfair. I like Jim, I think he is a good hockey man but a "head coach" almost needs to be like a psychologist and know how to pull the necessary strings to get his players to take it to the next level. Playfair is rookie headcoach has not developed this skill yet. And lets face it, the time for the Flames to win the cup is now! We don't have the luxury of waiting for Playfair to find his legs as headcoach.
He not getting the job done plain and simple, Sutter needs to chalk this up as a mistake and fire Playfair now!

Johnny Hoxville is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-04-2006, 03:04 PM
  #16
kruezer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Toronto
Posts: 6,273
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MVW View Post
Wouldn't you classify Phanuef as offensive D man?
Your point is valid, but I don't mind the idea of putting Hamrlik-Phaneuf back together and playing Zyuzin with Regehr. It might work. Maybe even try Ference with Regehr and Zoo with Warrener.

kruezer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-04-2006, 03:30 PM
  #17
Johnny Hoxville
Moderator
Formerly MVW
 
Johnny Hoxville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,887
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by flamingmoe View Post
you know I'd love it if people waited till the ship set sail before jumping off without a lifejacket.



It's 11 games in and instead of being a pissed off postal worker with 10 Timmies in him...RELAX.

Sure it's frustrating to see our Flames skate like they have anchors attached to their a$$es but we have a bunch of new blood that come from diverse playing style teams, a new coach and a bunch of blowin in the wind "fans" that are convicting before the trial of the "missed playoffs of 06-07" has even begun.

I'll be cheering my team on tonight good or bad...what about you?
Hey Fair enough, I do partially agree. The only thing is the Flames can't afford to wait to let this team and coach gel together. Last season the Flames started off poor and finished great so everyone is using that as an excuse to relax for this seasons poor start. Our chances to take a run at the cup are limited, so this season is huge for this team. They way they are playing we won't even make the playoffs, Calgary is 3rd last in the NHL!

Johnny Hoxville is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-04-2006, 03:32 PM
  #18
Johnny Hoxville
Moderator
Formerly MVW
 
Johnny Hoxville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,887
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by kruezer View Post
Your point is valid, but I don't mind the idea of putting Hamrlik-Phaneuf back together and playing Zyuzin with Regehr. It might work. Maybe even try Ference with Regehr and Zoo with Warrener.
I'd like to see Regehr with Ference, he plays more like a Leopold than anyone else on that team. I think it would be a good fit.

Johnny Hoxville is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-04-2006, 06:45 PM
  #19
puckdad
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 9
vCash: 500
Playfair

The only mistake Darryl has made is hiring Playfair. I think that the other moves were good ones but we need an experienced coach; not a rookey!

puckdad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-06-2006, 06:41 PM
  #20
Phaneuf333
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Brooks Alberta
Country: Canada
Posts: 694
vCash: 500
Give Playfair some time and the Flames will starting win

Phaneuf333 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2006, 09:44 AM
  #21
chriss_co
Registered User
 
chriss_co's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: CALGARY
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,769
vCash: 500
how did this thread go from fire playfair to fire sutter?

what ever happened to the 'in sutter we trust?'

i want one of 2 things to happen this year w/ the flames:

-lose as many games as possible and get a high pick in the draft
-turn it around NOW and win the division

whatever possible, please don't be a mediocre team that just misses the playoffs.. its all or nothing (dont strip the team apart tho - just minor tinkering..) the core is solid here and we do have the right parts... we just need to fix the periphery

chriss_co is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-07-2006, 11:20 AM
  #22
Badger Bob
Registered User
 
Badger Bob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: in my happy place
Country: Germany
Posts: 5,286
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TOMapleLaughs View Post
So beyond the flukey Kiprusoff aquisition, Sutter has a pretty low batting average with trades. Savard lights it up in Atlanta. Stillman wins back-to-back cups. Drury. etc. etc. etc.
The team was better without Savard. Addition by subtraction, and, as was already pointed out, it was a Craig Button move, as was Stillman. Stillman brought Conroy, which was totally in the Flames favor. It's not as if he won those back-to-back Cups with the team he was traded to, St. Louis. Drury? Yeah, he's done great with the Sabres, but Rhett Waranner, alone, was worth the effort. Warrener was a critical component to the '04 run.

Badger Bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:08 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.