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Old
08-14-2013, 09:51 AM
  #776
Bleed Ranger Blue
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Originally Posted by puckrush View Post
What was the point of having two wild cards, opposed to simply having the top four in each division?
Why should a division that is potentially terrible be rewarded?

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08-14-2013, 10:00 AM
  #777
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Why should a division that is potentially terrible be rewarded?
Even without the wildcards a division that is terrible can be rewarded. There is no guarantee that the top 8 teams points wise will make the playoffs.

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08-14-2013, 10:10 AM
  #778
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Originally Posted by DudMan28 View Post
Even without the wildcards a division that is terrible can be rewarded. There is no guarantee that the top 8 teams points wise will make the playoffs.
Exactly. My point is the wildcards mitigate that a bit.

Much more so than just handing playoff spots to the top 4 in each division. Some people are so quick to knock the NHL brass, they don't even know what they're arguing.

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08-14-2013, 10:16 AM
  #779
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Exactly. My point is the wildcards mitigate that a bit.

Much more so than just handing playoff spots to the top 4 in each division. Some people are so quick to knock the NHL brass, they don't even know what they're arguing.
I'm against wild cards and for divisonal playoffs as I do not believe teams should compete for the same spot with different schedules. The previous 2 conference 6 division format was IMO a travesty.

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08-14-2013, 10:26 AM
  #780
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I don't mind the playoff format. But I sure mind playing Western teams more at the expense of past divisional foes. A lot. And I'm not even a STH...would be livid.

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Old
08-14-2013, 10:46 AM
  #781
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Before opening this up to the big board, I wanted some feedback here. All comments welcome, but am hoping for some with particular insight.

Justin Schultz has 1 year left, then is RFA. Would be a coup for us as 1st pair 1D w/McDonagh. Obviously, Edmonton will not trade at almost any price.

If memory serves, Schultz was Anaheim pick, they couldn't sign him, he got to go where he wanted after waiting.

Rangers were supposedly on a short list, but, well, came up short.
Does any one know for certain why?

Correct me if I'm remembering this wrong, but
We thought we had an inside shot because he was buds with Mich alumns McD and Stepan.

Did it seem like he was saying 'you go your way and I'll go mine'?
Was it like he was coming from 'you grabbed the east, so I'll take the west'?
In which case maybe he doesn't wanna be here!

Could it have been some other x factor I'm not remembering, family, etc, there?

OR was it based on some issue with NYR?
Presumably Sather would have told him we'll hook you up, no/minimum AHL requirement, express bypass to opportunity for 1D.

Could it have been that the main reason JSchultz did not sign here was because of the one largest difference since then, Torts?

Is it possible that JS asked around and was told [not important as to by who] that Torts is a ballbuster like no other, look at what he's doing to _______________ (fill in the blank, Kreider, etc.) I can't give you any guarantees that Dolan/Slats will back you over Tortorella, so why take the risk and the likely aggravation?
And such reasoning played a huge role in his decision.

So, question 1:
Since the Rangers are a much improved club AND more importantly, Torts is buh-bye, is there any real hope that could = JS to NYR if we can pay his price?

and Q2:
assuming that Q1 is a yes, what would JS cost?
As a RFA, I guess it is the size of his deal. Which would have to be substantial to avoid Oil to match, which they would want to do even with big $$ raises necessary for their top Fs.

Or, even though this is nowhere near the same type of thing where Nash said to CBJ, thanks but I gotta go, and put his foot down, does such a factor, if real, push Edmonton to say, ok, he's only got a year on his deal.... at what point is he worth more to me playing as opposed to trade assets acquired.

So realistically bypassing a straight contract signing which we can't prevent Oil from matching, what trade assets would be demanded, and what would we give for Justin Schultz?

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08-14-2013, 10:50 AM
  #782
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Didn't Edmonton have Gretzky talk Schultz into choosing them?

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Old
08-14-2013, 10:54 AM
  #783
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Before opening this up to the big board, I wanted some feedback here. All comments welcome, but am hoping for some with particular insight.

Justin Schultz has 1 year left, then is RFA. Would be a coup for us as 1st pair 1D w/McDonagh. Obviously, Edmonton will not trade at almost any price.

If memory serves, Schultz was Anaheim pick, they couldn't sign him, he got to go where he wanted after waiting.

Rangers were supposedly on a short list, but, well, came up short.
Does any one know for certain why?

Correct me if I'm remembering this wrong, but
We thought we had an inside shot because he was buds with Mich alumns McD and Stepan.

Did it seem like he was saying 'you go your way and I'll go mine'?
Was it like he was coming from 'you grabbed the east, so I'll take the west'?
In which case maybe he doesn't wanna be here!

Could it have been some other x factor I'm not remembering, family, etc, there?

OR was it based on some issue with NYR?
Presumably Sather would have told him we'll hook you up, no/minimum AHL requirement, express bypass to opportunity for 1D.

Could it have been that the main reason JSchultz did not sign here was because of the one largest difference since then, Torts?

Is it possible that JS asked around and was told [not important as to by who] that Torts is a ballbuster like no other, look at what he's doing to _______________ (fill in the blank, Kreider, etc.) I can't give you any guarantees that Dolan/Slats will back you over Tortorella, so why take the risk and the likely aggravation?
And such reasoning played a huge role in his decision.

So, question 1:
Since the Rangers are a much improved club AND more importantly, Torts is buh-bye, is there any real hope that could = JS to NYR if we can pay his price?

and Q2:
assuming that Q1 is a yes, what would JS cost?
As a RFA, I guess it is the size of his deal. Which would have to be substantial to avoid Oil to match, which they would want to do even with big $$ raises necessary for their top Fs.

Or, even though this is nowhere near the same type of thing where Nash said to CBJ, thanks but I gotta go, and put his foot down, does such a factor, if real, push Edmonton to say, ok, he's only got a year on his deal.... at what point is he worth more to me playing as opposed to trade assets acquired.

So realistically bypassing a straight contract signing which we can't prevent Oil from matching, what trade assets would be demanded, and what would we give for Justin Schultz?
I can answer all your questions very easily:

We aren't getting Justin Schultz.

The only speculation that I recall was from NYR fans based on his ties to McD and Step. He chose edmonton for a reason. He isn't going to want out after 1 or 2 years. Edmonton isn't going to trade him.

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Old
08-14-2013, 10:55 AM
  #784
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Edmonton wouldn't move Schultz for anything short of a gross overpayment. There's really no deal to be made there unless you want to gut the team. He chose Edmonton because their lousy defensive group and "rebuilding" mentality all but guaranteed him a spot on their NHL roster. It's also a 60 minute flight from his hometown to Edmonton. Whereas the Rangers already had Richards and Del Zotto on the points on the PP. Despite that, from what I heard, the Rangers were right in there until the end.

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Old
08-14-2013, 10:56 AM
  #785
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Well, that scenario we don't like is the only scenario in which there's more than 1 non-divisional matchup. I'd say going from a setup where you could have 0 divisional matchups to a setup were you usually will have 3 or 4, and rarely 2 as a minimum, is a big change in the chance you'll meet a rival in the playoffs.
Well, the divisions are bigger. The chances of divisional matchups are higher. The chances of playing ANY ONE SPECIFIC TEAM, i.e. the Rangers and Flyers matching up, is only slightly more likely to happen. That's what I was looking for.

I'm agreeing. If the playoff split from the divisions is 4/4... keep it in the division. The divide between the 7th and 8th best team in each conference is usually minimal at best.

I'm just annoyed that they didn't emphasize the ONE good thing about the realignment by ensuring divisional playoffs when they could happen.

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Old
08-14-2013, 11:00 AM
  #786
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Originally Posted by JohnC View Post
Didn't Edmonton have Gretzky talk Schultz into choosing them?
I guess Schultz didn't ask why Gretzky didn't consider finishing his career in Edmonton.

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Old
08-14-2013, 12:12 PM
  #787
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
Before opening this up to the big board, I wanted some feedback here. All comments welcome, but am hoping for some with particular insight.

Justin Schultz has 1 year left, then is RFA. Would be a coup for us as 1st pair 1D w/McDonagh. Obviously, Edmonton will not trade at almost any price.

If memory serves, Schultz was Anaheim pick, they couldn't sign him, he got to go where he wanted after waiting.

Rangers were supposedly on a short list, but, well, came up short.
Does any one know for certain why?

Correct me if I'm remembering this wrong, but
We thought we had an inside shot because he was buds with Mich alumns McD and Stepan.

Did it seem like he was saying 'you go your way and I'll go mine'?
Was it like he was coming from 'you grabbed the east, so I'll take the west'?
In which case maybe he doesn't wanna be here!

Could it have been some other x factor I'm not remembering, family, etc, there?

OR was it based on some issue with NYR?
Presumably Sather would have told him we'll hook you up, no/minimum AHL requirement, express bypass to opportunity for 1D.

Could it have been that the main reason JSchultz did not sign here was because of the one largest difference since then, Torts?

Is it possible that JS asked around and was told [not important as to by who] that Torts is a ballbuster like no other, look at what he's doing to _______________ (fill in the blank, Kreider, etc.) I can't give you any guarantees that Dolan/Slats will back you over Tortorella, so why take the risk and the likely aggravation?
And such reasoning played a huge role in his decision.

So, question 1:
Since the Rangers are a much improved club AND more importantly, Torts is buh-bye, is there any real hope that could = JS to NYR if we can pay his price?

and Q2:
assuming that Q1 is a yes, what would JS cost?
As a RFA, I guess it is the size of his deal. Which would have to be substantial to avoid Oil to match, which they would want to do even with big $$ raises necessary for their top Fs.

Or, even though this is nowhere near the same type of thing where Nash said to CBJ, thanks but I gotta go, and put his foot down, does such a factor, if real, push Edmonton to say, ok, he's only got a year on his deal.... at what point is he worth more to me playing as opposed to trade assets acquired.

So realistically bypassing a straight contract signing which we can't prevent Oil from matching, what trade assets would be demanded, and what would we give for Justin Schultz?

I think that allure of playing a 1st pairing role with the likes of RNH, Hall, Ebs and Yakupov all made Edmonton a much more attractive option than NY where he would not have gotten the top pairing spot (rightfully so) and the thought or growing as a team with Stepan, McD and a few other guys here is not nearly as appealing as the guys he's playing with now.

Edmonton was and is a better fit for that player. They will re-sign him. He will not become a RFA

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Old
08-14-2013, 12:16 PM
  #788
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
I don't mind the playoff format. But I sure mind playing Western teams more at the expense of past divisional foes. A lot. And I'm not even a STH...would be livid.
Depends on how you look at it. As a hockey fan, I'd be excited to get to see all the Western stars for a change. Perry, Getzlaf, Sedins, Duchene, Hall, Benn, etc.

On the other hand, I used to go to the annual Presidents Day weekend game against a Western foe and they could be really bad. I particularly remember a game against the Avs that was very boring. Of course, that was in the late 90s early 00s. The Rangers were terrrrrrible then.

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Old
08-14-2013, 12:22 PM
  #789
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Depends on how you look at it. As a hockey fan, I'd be excited to get to see all the Western stars for a change. Perry, Getzlaf, Sedins, Duchene, Hall, Benn, etc.

On the other hand, I used to go to the annual Presidents Day weekend game against a Western foe and they could be really bad. I particularly remember a game against the Avs that was very boring.
Yeah, as an out of market fan, I'm very happy to have them visit every city at least once. If that means they play the Islanders 5 instead of 6 times, so be it.

16 teams in the East vs. 14 in the West is ridiculous, though.

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Old
08-14-2013, 12:26 PM
  #790
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In no way shape or form could Philly's D be considered a "Strength" for them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Philly's D is passable at best. Streit can move the puck well, but he's certainly not a defensive stalwart. Schenn is mediocre and Coburn is inconsistent as hell. That D in front of a couple of headcase goalies is going to require the Flyers to score a ton of goals.
I get what you mean, but at the same time, they are a high flying offensive team, and is there 5 better offensive duos in the NHL than Streit and Timmonen?

Offensively, they have a good blueline.

Defensively? They have guys that can be exposed. But at the same time, Grossman is good defensively for sure and Gustafsson is really coming into his own. Luke Schenn is what he is. Braydon Coburn can play. What is Mezaros status?

I remember seing a game with them last season when they iced:
L Schenn 23 min
Gustavsson 22 min
Konan 19
Lilja (!) 19
Mannin 17
Lauridsen 15


Those bluelines made them miss the PO's. The below blueline look pretty good in perspective TBH.
Timmon
Streit
Schenn
Grossman
Gustavsson
Coburn

With Mezaros joining during the year (?)...

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08-14-2013, 12:30 PM
  #791
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Originally Posted by -31- View Post
Yeah, as an out of market fan, I'm very happy to have them visit every city at least once. If that means they play the Islanders 5 instead of 6 times, so be it.

16 teams in the East vs. 14 in the West is ridiculous, though.
I don't think the imbalance is really that big of a deal. 7 percentage points different in odds isn't really something I worry about. I also don't think the imbalance will last more than 5 years. Expansion is coming.

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08-14-2013, 12:40 PM
  #792
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I don't think the imbalance is really that big of a deal. 7 percentage points different in odds isn't really something I worry about. I also don't think the imbalance will last more than 5 years. Expansion is coming.
I think 7 percentage points is a little misleading. It's 14% easier to make the playoffs in the West than the East. While that may not be the end of the world for a season or two, I think they should have just left it as is until expansion smooths out the numbers to an even 32.

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Old
08-14-2013, 12:45 PM
  #793
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I think 7 percentage points is a little misleading. It's 14% easier to make the playoffs in the West than the East. While that may not be the end of the world for a season or two, I think they should have just left it as is until expansion smooths out the numbers to an even 32.
Talking about these numbers at all is misleading. It's not easier to make the playoffs in the West if there are better teams in the West. I'm not saying there are, I'm just saying that you can't really quantify it.

Imbalance isn't ideal, but it isn't really a big deal either.

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Old
08-14-2013, 01:18 PM
  #794
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
I get what you mean, but at the same time, they are a high flying offensive team, and is there 5 better offensive duos in the NHL than Streit and Timmonen?

Offensively, they have a good blueline.

Defensively? They have guys that can be exposed. But at the same time, Grossman is good defensively for sure and Gustafsson is really coming into his own. Luke Schenn is what he is. Braydon Coburn can play. What is Mezaros status?

I remember seing a game with them last season when they iced:
L Schenn 23 min
Gustavsson 22 min
Konan 19
Lilja (!) 19
Mannin 17
Lauridsen 15


Those bluelines made them miss the PO's. The below blueline look pretty good in perspective TBH.
Timmon
Streit
Schenn
Grossman
Gustavsson
Coburn

With Mezaros joining during the year (?)...
High flying offensive teams mean nothing. They've been a high flying offensive team for years.

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Old
08-14-2013, 01:44 PM
  #795
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High flying offensive teams mean nothing. They've been a high flying offensive team for years.
Yeah, and they have had some success to. Made the SCF two years ago. Several +100 pts seasons the last years.

Look, if you guys are confident that Philly will suck ballz and miss the PO's this season, nobody would be happier than me. I am -- afraid -- that they will a pretty good year.

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08-14-2013, 01:45 PM
  #796
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brn- No.

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Old
08-14-2013, 01:46 PM
  #797
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High flying offensive teams mean nothing. They've been a high flying offensive team for years.
I think Ola's point is that their D limited their offence as well as defence and that with a healthy set of defenceman, the Flyers will improve offensively as well as defensively.

I agree with the general point although I don't believe they will be #1 in the East.

Boston and NYR are my division winners, and I really believe the Rangers have a shot at #1 in the conference. We had pretty bad luck last year, especially at the most inopportune times. Then Tortorella's playoff system left us all with a bitter taste in our mouths.

Even though the general system was the same, it was obvious that while John allowed the players to deviate from the system from time to time in the RS, while even the slightest deviation was forbidden in the POs. The Rangers went from a top possession team to an abysmal one with a snap of the fingers. I was a big Torts supporter until the 2012-13 playoffs, where it was made clear to me that once again (just like 2011-12) we are playing scared and predictable in the playoffs, and it seems to be on the coach.

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08-14-2013, 01:49 PM
  #798
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Yeah, and they have had some success to. Made the SCF two years ago. Several +100 pts seasons the last years.

Look, if you guys are confident that Philly will suck ballz and miss the PO's this season, nobody would be happier than me. I am -- afraid -- that they will a pretty good year.
Yeah, it's amazing what kind of difference someone like Pronger makes though. They haven't even remotely been the same since he got hurt.

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08-14-2013, 03:37 PM
  #799
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
Yeah, and they have had some success to. Made the SCF two years ago. Several +100 pts seasons the last years.

Look, if you guys are confident that Philly will suck ballz and miss the PO's this season, nobody would be happier than me. I am -- afraid -- that they will a pretty good year.
Zero championships too. They've done absolutely nothing to address thereof pertinent issues.

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08-14-2013, 04:47 PM
  #800
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September 11. Four weeks from today. 20 day training camp. Regular season begins October 1. Rangers begin October 3 in Phoenix. 10 PM start. Lousy time.
Thank you!

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